I'm so tired of this, is it time??

[veronese]

Here are the main details of my situation:

 

1. Married for 17, mainly happy years, two children, solid, stable marriage

 

2. Easter 2004 discovered husband's secret 'friendship' with his ex.

 

3. Soon after discovered he had two more 'friends'

 

4. No admission/proof of sex but admission of flirtation

 

5. Husband has consistently expressed love for me, regret for stupidity, remorse for deceit, desire to remain married

 

6. Husband hasn't, however, divulged details of affairs voluntarily. The details have come to light as a consequence of my continued investigations

 

7. Throughout the five months I have repeatedly requested the WHOLE truth, (duration of affairs, number of affairs etc.). From the first revelation he has not admitted to more than I have proof of.

 

8. He has been understanding and loving, but at times has been exasperated by my continued preoccupation with quest for more information

 

9. My continued obsession has been caused by finding further discrepancies and omissions.

 

10. Our relationship has always been loving and continues, bizarrely, to have been so during these past 5 months

 

Last week I discovered a second cell number for one of these women. I had scant information about the last two years, and no access to phone records for the last two years (although I had unearthed records relating to the 4 years previous to then, identifying proof to contradict what he had told me).

 

He had admitted to a year long contact with this bitch (as I had noted her number from his cell a year before) which meant any contact on the previous number would have been prior to this, which in turn would suggest their relationship had lasted longer than a year.

 

I asked him again, could this be possible, in both other cases he had experienced significant amnesia about the duration. He was positive it was no longer than a year.

 

I asked him to request reissues of his bills, he was irritated by this, apparently because I appear unable to let the subject go. I told him that seeing the bills would allay my doubts, prove his honesty, dispel my fears.

 

Was he REALLY sure it hadn't gone on longer? Oh yes, he said, definitely no longer than a year.

 

One bill arrived the next day, itemizing February 2003 - February 2004. Her old number showed up in the February, two months before they supposedly met. I'm still waiting for the year before that but fully expect to see her number on those bills too.

 

Predictably he has expressed surprise and disbelief at this revelation, he was convinced he met up with her in the April. But at every stage of this sorry mess he has only admitted to details I have proof of, so this is not out of character. He sounds so believable but when I've asked him each time if there is anything else I don't know, he has always said that there's nothing more. I even found out two or three months down the line that one friend had been on the scene not for the 2 years he first said, not for the 4 years he subsequently admitted, not the 6 years it then became, but for 10 or 11 years actually! This information was painstakingly dragged out of him, bit by bit as a result of my determined efforts to know the truth.

 

I'm so tired of it. I told him it was over yesterday morning. I'd had no sleep for two days - I was totally broken and defeated. I walked out of our home at six in the morning because I couldn't bear the thought of scaring our children with my distress. I was pathetic, destroyed, so so sad.

 

When I returned yesterday evening I reiterated what I had said in the morning. I can't take any more. I'm tired of the whole thing. I'm angry that he has watched me torture myself hunting for evidence, knowing deep down that he hadn't told me everything. I have felt ashamed at my behavior, constantly doubting his word, but it continued because I always found a detail that contradicted what I had been told.

 

Guys, I love him. I love my children more. I come from a family where divorce was unfamiliar and unusual. Marriages in my family have continued even when (IMO) they should have ended. Marriage has always been respected and valued. Having spent 17 years so happily with my husband the recent discoveries have shocked and confused me. I would love to be able to believe him and trust again, but he's making it so bloody difficult.

 

I fear I'm turning into a damned fool of a woman. I just wish separation wasn't the only option! I'm sinking fast here.

 

I'd love your advice and thoughts guys...

 

Go on Spock, I know you're dying to say something!

[Mr Spock]

Ha!! I didn't notice you made reference to me until the last line.

 

Your husband is a turd. BECAUSE of the simple fact that he only admits to things when you have proof, I would say Veronese that he's slept with at least one of these women, once. He's MET them clandestinely. He refuses to be honest with you about details. If he wants to remain in a relationship with you, he should be completely honest and forthright. What he's doing right now is damage control. He has admitted to "friendships" and since you seem to have bought that he isn't going to admit to anything further until you have rock solid proof. Rock Solid. He seems to think in his mind that you'll get over this faster if he clams up and keeps going with his story (that's my story, and I'm sticking to it syndrome)you may never catch him in the act (ref your earlier posts about the tracker thing)again-but I think for you the damage is done.

 

A man truly repentant for his actions and the hurt he's caused you I think would admit everything and lay the details on the table for you. This guy is not sorry he's maintained relationships with these women. Your anger at them is allowing your husband to continue on with this rediculous charade of him only admitting the truth when you force it out of him.

 

Veronese, he's sorry he got caught. He's exasperated because you keep hunting when he'd like it to go away. I really, really think you two should seek the advice of a professional. Or at least you, to help you deal with this.

 

Regardless of the level of activity in these relationships (and from what you've told me, I believe he's had intimate relations with at least one of these women, at one time)YOU feel betrayed, and he's not helping you deal with it.

 

 

What are you going to do? It will eat you alive from the inside out, the constant worrying if he's up to no good, the fact that he has not been honest about these relationships at ALL with you-what are you going to do about that?

 

It's one thing to rage and scream and label these other women bitches-but if you EVER want closure on this, they're your best bet, especially if your husband isn't going to admit to anything. If you want to get the truth, I'd advise appealing to their human side and stating you don't want to be married to a cheater rather than threatening them.

[veronese]

I know they're my only real source of knowing the truth Spock, but approaching them hasn't been something I'd wanted to do. I spoke to all three of them on the phone when I first found out, none of them were terribly nice and I got the distinct impression that the truth wouldn't flow from their mouths easily.

 

I've contemplated trying to make contact with them carefully and sensitively but when I've mulled it over I've always concluded that they're unlikely to be forthcoming, will probably be defensive, and almost certainly won't willingly spill the beans.

 

I've also considered the possibility of me getting nasty with them at the first hint of bad attitude from them. I KNOW i can remain calm if I had a civilized, adult, mature and honest conversation with them, but I also KNOW that I won't appreciate any crap and would be likely to react irrationally. I have felt that a negative communication was more probable so therefore wouldn't be beneficial for me.

 

Husband has always been opposed to contact too, and we all know why don't we?! Classic case of avoiding any more disclosures. He didn't want them to experience any hassle from his relationship with them, which I interpreted as wanting to protect them from grief and upset.

 

I'm at the point where I think I should let him go, which is something I have dreaded and hoped wouldn't happen.

 

What should I do Spock? How should I approach the women? I'm so confused I don't want to screw things up more than they are, but equally I'm fed up with the lies and deceit, and the women are my only hope of getting to the bottom of it all.

 

Do you think they'd be honest though? Why would they? Only one of them is married so there could be knock on effects there. I'm not too worried about causing them some discomfort truthfully, but I making contact with them would not be an act of revenge.

 

I don't like them, even though I don't know them, but I don't have huge anger for them anymore. I know my husband is the problem here, they were just the trimmings and could have been anyone.

 

Throw me a line please Spock..... thanks darling

[veronese]

I, like you, am of the belief that he had a sexual relationship with at lease one of these women at some point. Apart from the fact that he'd have to be a bloody monk to have resisted the temptation, ignoring the fact he is a gorgeous creature and so apparently are the women, overlooking his admission of mutual sexual attraction and sexually flirtatious/suggestive behaviour, he's made a number of freudian slips during these months.

 

Scene 1. In bed, a few days after I found out

Q. (me) Why didn't you tell these women about each other if they were just friends?

 

A. (him) Because they would have thought I was sleeping with the others.

 

Q. Why would they think that if they weren't sleeping with you?

 

A. Well you thought it

 

Q. But if they were your friends and not lovers, why wouldn't you tell them the truth?

 

A. They would have thought differently about me. They wouldn't have liked it.

 

Scene 2. ONe evening at home, a few weeks after discovery

Q. If you have had sex with them I'd prefer to know. What you have done has been bad enough in itself, but I still hope that you aren't lying about it. Did you have sexual contact with them

 

A. No. Would it make any difference if I had?

 

Scene 3. (sitting on bench at the park 6 weeks ago)

Me. I'm having a problem believing there was no sex, it just doesn't ring true to me. I know it's possible you didn't, but I think it's probable that you did. I feel that you could be lying about this and that worries me. I'd rather know the truth Jude. Whether you did or didn't isn't the issue, it's whether you're deceiving me about this. If you'd had sex with them it does make a difference in that it would have to be worked through, however it would be just one more thing. I suspect you and many others think I am staying with you because I'm fool enough to believe no sex occurred, that finding out would change everything. That is not the case, we may well split up over what I DO know already. We are more likely to split up though if you are lying to me about this. Tell me, did anything sexual occur at any time between you and them? I just want to know the truth.

 

Him. No, nothing happened. I didn't want anything to happen. But if I had had sex with them how would it change things?

 

Me - treading carefully here: Well, I'm not sure really. At least I'd know the truth so that would be nice. How it would change things between us I can't say. It would have to be discussed yes, but the important thing would be knowing the truth.

 

Him. I'm asking hypothetically here.

 

Me (in my mind): Why?????

 

 

I think there have been others and if I remember any I'll post them. I'm convinced he's lying about this but I've not really been giving it much thought recently, there didn't seem any point. Not knowing for sure is frustrating, it ensures ongoing doubts and suspicions. If he hasn't done anything I'm sorry he hasn't been able to convince me, but everything he's done til now has made this the case.

 

Spock, all I want to know is who I am married to, what he is like, what he has done. I think I'm being reasonable wanting to know this because giving my love and life to someone is quite a big thing! I want to be in the position to make the right decision about my future with him.

[veronese]

Just spoke to his royal highness, told him how tired I was never being told the facts by him willingly without presenting him with the evidence. That once again there was nothing else being hidden, no more details to reveal.

 

I told him that there had to be incidentals I didn't know. I asked him to tell me just onething I didn't already know, anything.

 

He's played badminton with one of them at lunch times a few times.

 

How many times?

 

Not many times, I don't know, three or four?

 

Think about it, are you sure it wasn't more times?

 

Yes, only four.

 

 

Three minutes after saying I knew all the details, another one comes to light.

 

Oh yawn, yawn, yawn.

[whichwayisup]

Sorry this is happening to you.

 

Seems he knows exactly what he is doing, but made it seem okay in his head. No guilt, no feeling, no pain. He is not thinking and you have called him on it over and over again...He has dropped afew weird things as he comments about well, would it make a difference if I had.... OFCOURSE it would! And he knows it.

 

I hope you hang in there, talk to someone professional because you need to think about youself and your children first. Must be really hard on you.

 

I wish he was being more open and honest with you. He's probably sh*tting himself inside and pushing it all away so he doesn't have to deal with the emotional fallout of this.

 

Hugs.

[veronese]

Thanks for those kind words.

 

You're so right in your perception of his mind - he didn't experience guilt at the time. He compartmentalized the whole thing and believed one life didn't hurt or affect the other. I don't think he's man enough to deal with long term pain because of it. He even said on the phone earlier that maybe I would be better off without him. I'm inclined to agree with him but surely he's supposed to be convincing me otherwise?

 

I think I'm genuinely disappointed with not only the existence of these affairs, but more with him as a person. My emotions have been so powerful I think he's overwhelmed and intimidated by the enormity of the situation. The whole nightmare of our situation has made me look at him in such a less flattering way. Not only do the years of lies hurt me, but his lack of depth in character has hurt me more.

 

I love so much about him, but see so many faults and negatives in our relationship. My fears have grown as to whether I can truly be fulfilled by this man. I'm so confused by the whole thing - I don't know if I can trust my instincts anymore or if I'm strong enough to make sensible decisions about the future. My children's welfare is my main concern. I am prepared to do whatever is genuinely best for them, but I can't for the life of me work out what that is!

[whichwayisup]

Like that old saying...You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make 'em drink it they ain't willing!!

 

It's a shame that he's being such a sh*t about all this. You've made the right choice V (I replied to your other post as well) and just put you and your child first.

 

Let him be a father, but cut all personal contact with him. Only things involving your child should involve the two of you speaking. Anything else he can shove up his bum! Ya know???

 

My thoughts are with you, hang in there and hug your little one close. It is gonna be a hard one for a while but love and communication can make your childs' hurt not as hard.

[Mr Spock]

Veronese-I don't think you should contact them when the rage bubbles so close to the surface. It's not going to help your cause. Try getting an email address or two and communicate that way.

 

Your husband doesn't think he has done anything wrong. At this point, if he had sex with all of them at the same time it's irrelevant, because his lying and deceitfulness he may as well have.

 

You cannot live with this, and it's obvious, and I'm sorry. I think that you may be able to get through this if your husband divulged all the sordid details. You want to know. Some women don't-but others need to know every detail in their minds, not so they can leave but so they can heal.

 

It's over

 

He came home from work bad tempered and cold. He thinks a trial separation is necessary. He didn't want to come home from work after our telephone conversation earlier. He didn't want to come home to more misery. He said I was aggressive during our talk, he felt completely drained afterwards.

 

During the call I said that I would eventually find out the whole truth, including whether he'd slept with them or not. I wonder if this has anything to do with him suddenly wanting to separate - he didn't want to this morning.

 

It confirms my fears that he's not worth it.

 

It's been me who has held on to this marriage. Now I am ready to let go he's more than happy to leave.

 

 

Why have you been the one doing all the work anyways Veronese? Has he made no effort in all of this?

 

I'll share something with you. As someone who's been on all sides of the infidelity triangle, I don't think he's ever going to fully tell you the truth. He's worked himself into a corner, and he'll hang onto it. Especially since you are so aggressive about your anger-he's protecting these OW, and you (at least in his own mind) and himself. It's hard to explain-the damage is done, so why not be honest? Because when you're in the **** you look for the path that does the least damage, and in his own mind that means sticking to the story he's told you. Somehow he feels telling you he only played tennis with them 4 times won't hurt you as much as if you found out he played tennis 500 times when the truth is 1 game is just as bad. Do you understand what I'm saying? It's hard to explain even when you've been there.

 

I'm not sure what to advise you. I really, really think you need to both get into see a therapist, and FAST. Don't expect bounds of honesty then either, if he can lie to you he'll lie to them too.

 

By suggesting a separation he MAY be trying to deflect, he may just be tired, or it may be both. Either way, please remember that you didn't do ANYTHING wrong.

 

Ok?

[harleygirl]

Here are the main details of my situation:

 

1. Married for 17, mainly happy years, two children, solid, stable marriage

 

2. Easter 2004 discovered husband's secret 'friendship' with his ex.

 

3. Soon after discovered he had two more 'friends'

 

4. No admission/proof of sex but admission of flirtation

 

5. Husband has consistently expressed love for me, regret for stupidity, remorse for deceit, desire to remain married

 

6. Husband hasn't, however, divulged details of affairs voluntarily. The details have come to light as a consequence of my continued investigations

 

7. Throughout the five months I have repeatedly requested the WHOLE truth, (duration of affairs, number of affairs etc.). From the first revelation he has not admitted to more than I have proof of.

 

8. He has been understanding and loving, but at times has been exasperated by my continued preoccupation with quest for more information

 

9. My continued obsession has been caused by finding further discrepancies and omissions.

 

10. Our relationship has always been loving and continues, bizarrely, to have been so during these past 5 months

 

Last week I discovered a second cell number for one of these women. I had scant information about the last two years, and no access to phone records for the last two years (although I had unearthed records relating to the 4 years previous to then, identifying proof to contradict what he had told me).

 

He had admitted to a year long contact with this bitch (as I had noted her number from his cell a year before) which meant any contact on the previous number would have been prior to this, which in turn would suggest their relationship had lasted longer than a year.

 

I asked him again, could this be possible, in both other cases he had experienced significant amnesia about the duration. He was positive it was no longer than a year.

 

I asked him to request reissues of his bills, he was irritated by this, apparently because I appear unable to let the subject go. I told him that seeing the bills would allay my doubts, prove his honesty, dispel my fears.

 

Was he REALLY sure it hadn't gone on longer? Oh yes, he said, definitely no longer than a year.

 

One bill arrived the next day, itemizing February 2003 - February 2004. Her old number showed up in the February, two months before they supposedly met. I'm still waiting for the year before that but fully expect to see her number on those bills too.

 

Predictably he has expressed surprise and disbelief at this revelation, he was convinced he met up with her in the April. But at every stage of this sorry mess he has only admitted to details I have proof of, so this is not out of character. He sounds so believable but when I've asked him each time if there is anything else I don't know, he has always said that there's nothing more. I even found out two or three months down the line that one friend had been on the scene not for the 2 years he first said, not for the 4 years he subsequently admitted, not the 6 years it then became, but for 10 or 11 years actually! This information was painstakingly dragged out of him, bit by bit as a result of my determined efforts to know the truth.

 

I'm so tired of it. I told him it was over yesterday morning. I'd had no sleep for two days - I was totally broken and defeated. I walked out of our home at six in the morning because I couldn't bear the thought of scaring our children with my distress. I was pathetic, destroyed, so so sad.

 

When I returned yesterday evening I reiterated what I had said in the morning. I can't take any more. I'm tired of the whole thing. I'm angry that he has watched me torture myself hunting for evidence, knowing deep down that he hadn't told me everything. I have felt ashamed at my behavior, constantly doubting his word, but it continued because I always found a detail that contradicted what I had been told.

 

Guys, I love him. I love my children more. I come from a family where divorce was unfamiliar and unusual. Marriages in my family have continued even when (IMO) they should have ended. Marriage has always been respected and valued. Having spent 17 years so happily with my husband the recent discoveries have shocked and confused me. I would love to be able to believe him and trust again, but he's making it so bloody difficult.

 

I fear I'm turning into a damned fool of a woman. I just wish separation wasn't the only option! I'm sinking fast here.

 

I'd love your advice and thoughts guys...

 

Go on Spock, I know you're dying to say something!

 

I know this is an old thread, but it freaked me out. It could have been written by me!!

Only difference is my husband is a recovering alcoholic and all his cheating happened during his drinking. No he wasn't always drunk, but atributes it to the "alcoholic dark days."

He is still holding back and admits there are things he isn't telling me, but only because he doesn't want to hurt me anymore.

I to seek our evidence and none of it has been good. It proved that even after he was sober he continued to lie.

The divorce papers lay on the counter in front of me, but I wonder if I should give him a chance to prove that sober he is a man that can be trusted. He has been totally honest about everything for the past 3 months EXCEPT his infidelity in the past during his drinking years.

It is crazy and I am crazy. The lies just eat at a persons soul.

[harleygirl92156]

Here are the main details of my situation:

 

1. Married for 17, mainly happy years, two children, solid, stable marriage

 

2. Easter 2004 discovered husband's secret 'friendship' with his ex.

 

3. Soon after discovered he had two more 'friends'

 

4. No admission/proof of sex but admission of flirtation

 

5. Husband has consistently expressed love for me, regret for stupidity, remorse for deceit, desire to remain married

 

6. Husband hasn't, however, divulged details of affairs voluntarily. The details have come to light as a consequence of my continued investigations

 

7. Throughout the five months I have repeatedly requested the WHOLE truth, (duration of affairs, number of affairs etc.). From the first revelation he has not admitted to more than I have proof of.

 

8. He has been understanding and loving, but at times has been exasperated by my continued preoccupation with quest for more information

 

9. My continued obsession has been caused by finding further discrepancies and omissions.

 

10. Our relationship has always been loving and continues, bizarrely, to have been so during these past 5 months

 

Last week I discovered a second cell number for one of these women. I had scant information about the last two years, and no access to phone records for the last two years (although I had unearthed records relating to the 4 years previous to then, identifying proof to contradict what he had told me).

 

He had admitted to a year long contact with this bitch (as I had noted her number from his cell a year before) which meant any contact on the previous number would have been prior to this, which in turn would suggest their relationship had lasted longer than a year.

 

I asked him again, could this be possible, in both other cases he had experienced significant amnesia about the duration. He was positive it was no longer than a year.

 

I asked him to request reissues of his bills, he was irritated by this, apparently because I appear unable to let the subject go. I told him that seeing the bills would allay my doubts, prove his honesty, dispel my fears.

 

Was he REALLY sure it hadn't gone on longer? Oh yes, he said, definitely no longer than a year.

 

One bill arrived the next day, itemizing February 2003 - February 2004. Her old number showed up in the February, two months before they supposedly met. I'm still waiting for the year before that but fully expect to see her number on those bills too.

 

Predictably he has expressed surprise and disbelief at this revelation, he was convinced he met up with her in the April. But at every stage of this sorry mess he has only admitted to details I have proof of, so this is not out of character. He sounds so believable but when I've asked him each time if there is anything else I don't know, he has always said that there's nothing more. I even found out two or three months down the line that one friend had been on the scene not for the 2 years he first said, not for the 4 years he subsequently admitted, not the 6 years it then became, but for 10 or 11 years actually! This information was painstakingly dragged out of him, bit by bit as a result of my determined efforts to know the truth.

 

I'm so tired of it. I told him it was over yesterday morning. I'd had no sleep for two days - I was totally broken and defeated. I walked out of our home at six in the morning because I couldn't bear the thought of scaring our children with my distress. I was pathetic, destroyed, so so sad.

 

When I returned yesterday evening I reiterated what I had said in the morning. I can't take any more. I'm tired of the whole thing. I'm angry that he has watched me torture myself hunting for evidence, knowing deep down that he hadn't told me everything. I have felt ashamed at my behavior, constantly doubting his word, but it continued because I always found a detail that contradicted what I had been told.

 

Guys, I love him. I love my children more. I come from a family where divorce was unfamiliar and unusual. Marriages in my family have continued even when (IMO) they should have ended. Marriage has always been respected and valued. Having spent 17 years so happily with my husband the recent discoveries have shocked and confused me. I would love to be able to believe him and trust again, but he's making it so bloody difficult.

 

I fear I'm turning into a damned fool of a woman. I just wish separation wasn't the only option! I'm sinking fast here.

 

I'd love your advice and thoughts guys...

 

Go on Spock, I know you're dying to say something!

I can't believe it, I could have written this post. My heart is with you. Mine is broken and I am tired. Been at this 9 months and ready to throw in the towel. What he doesn't understand is that I am ready to end the marriage because of the lies, not because of the cheating. Why can't they understand that?????

[dresden]

Veronese:

I haven't read your other thread. Apparently you are separating?

He has been lying to you for so long. I know how you are feeling. I suddenly find myself a single mother after a 14 year relationship.

My situation is complicated by child abuse. I just want to say that you

will find peace and even happiness again. You will be grateful to have

your life back. You will be glad that you are no longer listening to your

husband's lies.

All the best, dear.

[Art_Critic]

This Post is 1 year old .. Look at the post date

[sylviaguardian]

What he doesn't understand is that I am ready to end the marriage because of the lies, not because of the cheating. Why can't they understand that?????

 

I know this post is old but I had to say I feel the same way. Only yesterday I was thinking about this whole thing. After 13 months I don't feel that I've been told the truth 100%. I can understand why my husband doesn't want to do it. Whatever he tells me now will take us back to square one. What he doesn't understand is that telling the truth means the difference between me living with a liar or not living with a liar. I will have to know for the rest of my life that when he thinks that something will hurt, he will hide it. He has never shown me that he has it in him to be completely honest.

 

Living with a liar is hard. It means that everytime he tells me something in the future, I will make up my own mind on it. I will not take anything at face value. That is a sad place for me to be. I long for the days when everything was straightforward - when he went out and I never thought once about what he was doing, when I never dreamt of checking his pockets, statements etc, when I saw him talking to a woman and didn't feel the green-eyed monster rise up in me. So sad. It has changed everything forever. Or maybe I was too gullible and trusting to begin with. If I had been a bit suspicious to begin with maybe I could have changed something. It's the powerlessness of knowing all this was happening behind my back and that I had no chance at any point to say "Hay, what are you doing? Don't you know I love you more than I've loved anyone?"

 

Sylvia

[veronese]

It's twelve months since I posted this thread and things are gradually improving. We split up for only one night before he returned and I was too exhausted to force the issue.

 

Life continued to be emotionally draining through last year up until April this year really. I managed through hard work and ingenuity, to finally get satisfactory evidence that he was at least being honest about not having had sex with these friends.

 

Looking back I don't know how I survived that year, working as a freelance writer and with two children (one with special needs) it's a miracle food reached the table (most) nights and the bills somehow got paid.

 

I'm happier now, calmer, more stable. I'm not pretending things are perfect though....I still occassionally check his phone but am honestly becoming bored of the subject. I still don't trust him as before but what good came of that I ask you? 17 years without checking up on him didn't mean he wasn't lying!

 

Harleygirl, it will get better in time, just try to hold on to whatever sanity you are still in possession of! I frequently doubted my sanity after this happened.

 

Dresden... I printed out your thread to read in comfort and I can only express my deepest sympathy for the hell you have been through of late. I admire your strength of character and you and your children are in my thoughts and prayers.

 

Sylvia darling? Things getting any better? Nice to hear from you again. PM when you get a moment

 

Veron xx

[EndoftheRope]

What he doesn't understand is that I am ready to end the marriage because of the lies, not because of the cheating. Why can't they understand that?????

 

THIS. IS. SO. TRUE!

 

I tend to think my husband did NOT have a physical affair (although the more I read, the more astounded I am at men's determination to lie to the bitter end in the face of all evidence). But he has most definitely deceived me about his friendships with at least two women. Probably "just" a flirtation, but I know for a fact that he has not been honest, that he has admitted to ONLY what I already found on my own, and that he flat out lies to me. He has so many good qualities, and yet all I think when I look at him is, "Who is he really? What's the truth? When is it finally going to come out, and how bad will it be?"

[veronese]

Endoftherope, sounds like you, me, Harleygirl, Sylviaguardian and Dresden have all had a wake up call with regards our husbands.

 

Like you said, it's the not knowing who the hell they are that does your head in. I think the real bummer is trying to work out the full extent of their lies. I have found it really hard working through this because I never suspected a thing and believed him to be one of the special men in this world, honest, trustworthy, loyal, dependable.

 

Also since I had no idea he was lying to me all those years, I have no way of knowing if he's lying to me now. Short of having him tailed all day every day I can only guess if he's telling the truth.

 

The way I'm trying to cope is by thinking less about whether he's up to anything or not, and focusing more on how we actually are together. Does he make me happy? Do I like him even??!

 

Interestingly though I can now see the way he manipulated and controlled situations and still does to some extent. It's quite entertaining watching his confusion when I react more positively and confidently whereas before I always felt in the wrong and often felt like I'd annoyed him in some way. When he's stroppy without reason I no longer placate him, he often ends up looking bloody silly.

 

I haven't some of your stories so will take the time to do so as soon as I can

 

V x