Liar liar pants on fire

[canuckprincess]

As the ow do I have the right to be upset if I feel I've caught my mm of 7 plus years in a little white lie? I know he's an incredibly great liar but honestly didnt think he'd lie to me. Not because I'm better then his bs but he knows he doesn't have to lie to me. It's the kind of relationship we've had all along. I'm pretty sure the little white lie was to avoid getting me upset. So should I be angry if he's doing it to keep me from getting upset? Or is any lie bad?

[Owl]

That's really a threshold only you can decide for yourself.

 

You can look at it either way.

 

Either he was doing it to make you feel better, which you can view from the point of "he cares enough about me to go out of his way to make me feel better".

 

Or, he was doing it to avoid conflict, and did so at the expense of a lie on your behalf.

 

It's all on how YOU choose to view it.

[Poppy fields]

How would you react to this in a ''normal" relationship? Why would your reaction be any different in this relationship?

[SweetiePie12]

As the ow do I have the right to be upset if I feel I've caught my mm of 7 plus years in a little white lie? I know he's an incredibly great liar but honestly didnt think he'd lie to me. Not because I'm better then his bs but he knows he doesn't have to lie to me. It's the kind of relationship we've had all along. I'm pretty sure the little white lie was to avoid getting me upset.

 

What's the lie?

[skywriter]

Most mm are conflict avoiders which = liars. Lying to keep from rocking the boat is indicative of such. I also believe one lie begets many others, it's just the nature of it.

 

 

Aint that the truth!

[Turtles]

Most mm are conflict avoiders which = liars. Lying to keep from rocking the boat is indicative of such. I also believe one lie begets many others, it's just the nature of it.

 

This, 100%

[whichwayisup]

As the ow do I have the right to be upset if I feel I've caught my mm of 7 plus years in a little white lie? I know he's an incredibly great liar but honestly didnt think he'd lie to me. Not because I'm better then his bs but he knows he doesn't have to lie to me. It's the kind of relationship we've had all along. I'm pretty sure the little white lie was to avoid getting me upset. So should I be angry if he's doing it to keep me from getting upset? Or is any lie bad?

 

He isn't obligated to you and look at it this way, he lies to his wife every single day, (aka having the A with you for so many years) so why wouldn't he lie to you as well? He is skilled at it, otherwise he wouldn't be able to get away with having an A for 7+ years.

 

So he is omitting truths from you? What kind of white lies/omitting?

 

Any lie is not good, it does damage and makes one mistrust and wonder.

[Quiet Storm]

I would say it's OK to be angry, but not surprised.

 

Many liars don't need a valid reason to lie. Some lie because it's easier than telling the truth. Some lie because they want to preserve their privacy.

 

For example, lets say the MM is going out to dinner with his wife. Even though his OW may be accepting of this, and won't get mad at him, he may still say "I'm going to visit my parents" because it's just easier. He won't have to get into a long conversation about it. He won't be questioned afterwards. She'll still be in a good mood next time he sees her. Also, he might simply think it's not OWs business. Many men (not just cheaters) lie because they truly want to keep certain things private, and lying is just easier and less confrontational than saying "it's none of your business".

 

Many cheaters have low self esteem, which means that there are parts of themselves that they do not like. Even if others are accepting, they still feel insecure. They become so accustomed to hiding things about themselves, that it can become automatic.

[ThatJustHappened]

I would say it's OK to be angry, but not surprised.

 

Many liars don't need a valid reason to lie. Some lie because it's easier than telling the truth. Some lie because they want to preserve their privacy.

 

For example, lets say the MM is going out to dinner with his wife. Even though his OW may be accepting of this, and won't get mad at him, he may still say "I'm going to visit my parents" because it's just easier. He won't have to get into a long conversation about it. He won't be questioned afterwards. She'll still be in a good mood next time he sees her. Also, he might simply think it's not OWs business. Many men (not just cheaters) lie because they truly want to keep certain things private, and lying is just easier and less confrontational than saying "it's none of your business".

 

Many cheaters have low self esteem, which means that there are parts of themselves that they do not like. Even if others are accepting, they still feel insecure. They become so accustomed to hiding things about themselves, that it can become automatic.

 

I was literally about to post the same thing! Anger is understandable, but it shouldn't surprise you that a person you know as a liar has lied to you. I don't like lies either. I had a boyfriend who lied to me because he didn't want to hurt me (stupid lie too), but it ended up hurting me more in the end (he wasn't very good at it and I caught him almost immediately). I had the same dilemma. Am I angry at him for the lie, or am I glad he was trying to protect me? I ended up being angry, because in most cases, when they say they're trying to protect you, they really just mean they're protecting themselves from the consequences of telling the truth.

[waterwoman]

Funnily a little white lie wouldn't have been an issue before H's affair. Because I had no reason to beleive that 'a little white' lie would have been about anything serious. Strange how being involved in infidelity takes the trust out of a relationship....

[Decorative]

Liars dont lie to prevent other people from getting upset. Liars lie to protect themselves from the consequences of their actions.

 

This needs to be in 64 point, bold font.

[HonestNeurotic]

When you get beaten for the truth - you learn to lie really well. Took me a long time to learn - the Worst truth is better than the best lie. Each and every time.

 

Now - that said - one doesn't have to go outta their way to tell me that yes, my ass looks far too big in those pants - but if I ask you, well, don't LIE to me. And even if you do perceive that my ass looks far too big in those pants, it doesn't mean that it's TRUE. It just means that YOU think that is so. It's YOUR TRUTH. Not necessarily mine.

 

Lies about one's true opinions versus lies about facts are probably not the same amount of "wrong" in the universal scale of evil doings. HOWEVER. I just don't tolerate them at all when it comes to me. Can't fix a problem with a lie in the way.

 

The easiest way to solve a problem is to deny that it exists. Ergo - lying about something prevents me from having information to make an informed decision. Spare my feelings? PUHLEEZE!

[ladydesigner]

Many cheaters have low self esteem, which means that there are parts of themselves that they do not like. Even if others are accepting, they still feel insecure. They become so accustomed to hiding things about themselves, that it can become automatic.

 

Well this is my WH to a T. Has very low self-esteem because of his childhood issues and needs constant validation. He is also a master liar and he has figured out why he does it, but stopping it is a whole other can of worms. Lying can be something so ingrained that it may be impossible to break unless a lot of self work is done. My WH's lying came so easy to him. Lying was a means of protection for him that he learned at a young age having to deal with a very abusive mother. He is afraid of himself at times I think, it's very sad.

 

I have a quote that I use as my sig on another site, I love it:

 

It's simple...Never lie to someone who trusts you, and never trust someone who lies to you.

[herenow]

I'm sure he has that same deal with is wife. Actually, don't we all assume, in every relationship, we want the truth. Would you be having an affair with him if he told you: "Well I'm not big on the truth so I plan to lie to you now and then"?

 

He lies. He lies to his wife, he lies to you, he lies to himself. You know that to be fact.

 

He does not "need" to lie to his wife. He chooses to lie to his wife. Same goes with you. Just the nature of affairs.

[canuckprincess]

Thank you all for your responses, very helpful.

[SweetiePie12]

For example, lets say the MM is going out to dinner with his wife. Even though his OW may be accepting of this, and won't get mad at him, he may still say "I'm going to visit my parents" because it's just easier. He won't have to get into a long conversation

about it.

 

I try to avoid sending that message. He said something that turned me off, and he surmised: "I guess just don't bring up certain stuff." I make it a huge priority to communicate that he can talk to me about ANYTHING, but I guess there will be certain sensitivities we all pay attention to...

 

Many cheaters have low self esteem

 

Amen.

 

which means that there are parts of themselves that they do not like.

 

So sad, so true.

 

Even if others are accepting, they still feel insecure. They become so accustomed to hiding things about themselves, that it can become automatic.

 

And if, lo and behold, someone embraces aspects of themselves which they do not like, that's like white or brown on rice, two magnets compelled toward one another.

[skylarblue]

Only you can decided if and to what level you take offense.

 

As far as input, that's extremely difficult without knowing what the lie is. When I hear the words "little white lie" I interpret that as one that is harmless, polite, minor, and/or without malicious or deceitful content. Saying "the meal was delicious" when it wasn't or "there's no surprise party" when there was, is a little white lie IMO. I don't think people usually have to contemplate on little white lies.

 

If the lie seems minor, it sounds like what I classify as a "fib" - a minor, fairly harmless lie done without malice intent but in avoidance of something. "I have to get up early" when you want to end a bad date or the child saying he didn't eat the cookies when he has crumbs all over his face for example.

 

Anything past that I (personally) would find concern with, as I would consider it simply a lie - something done with conscious and/or malice intent to deceive and have the receiver misconstrue a situation in order to avoid consequence.

 

I used to say/think the same thing about xMM. Then I realized it's not that he wouldn't lie because he didn't have to, he would lie because he thinks he has to. Whether he HAS to or not is irrelevant if HE thinks he has too in a situation.

 

Again, what was the lie? (or did I miss it?)

[herenow]

IMO, the smaller the lie, the worse the liar. Meaning if he was willing to lie about something so small, he surely would have no problem lying about the big stuff.

[Quiet Storm]

Then I realized it's not that he wouldn't lie because he didn't have to, he would lie because he thinks he has to. Whether he HAS to or not is irrelevant if HE thinks he has too in a situation.

 

 

 

So true.

 

And it doesn't always have to be because he thinks he has to lie. It could just be laziness. They know they don't have to lie, but it's still easier than telling the truth. The truth may involve an explanation or a conversation that the MM just doesn't feel like having.

[Got it]

I think it would be wise to talk to him about it, ask him why and see what he says.

[underwater2010]

While anyone would feel upset about being lied to....little or big....you knew his true colors. After all you are involved with a man willing to lie to his wife in order to have a relationship with you.

 

So yes to being upset, but no to being surprised.

[georgia girl]

I have to agree with the poster who said lying over the little stuff is a red flag. Lying over something so little that it doesn't make a difference shows a force of habit that would make me very uncomfortable. I've got a good "acquaintence" friend - whenever she tells me a story, I believe that "something" happened, but I know that it has nothing to do with what she's saying. At this point, it's more fiction than fact. She honestly sees herself as a genuine and honest person. It would freak her out to think that pretty much no one believes her anymore. She doesn't even realize she's lying.

 

On the other hand, his lie could have been an avoidance tactic. The "ah shoot, this will tick her off if I tell her that" and he just backs off.

 

You need to talk to him and ask him what the truth is and why he lied. Then, you need to evaluate him honestly. Is he the male version of my friend? Or was it harmless?

 

In the end, however, my own instinct says that this guy is probably a fairly accomplished liar. He is managing to have an affair and potentially getting both women to think she the only - if not the most important - woman in his life. That takes skill.

[movingon45]

Aint that the truth!

 

I know that now!!!

[Mycatsnuggles]

This is a difficult subject for me. I have faced this very issue in the last year with OM. He told me 2 lies I know of, each was intended to spare my feelings but when I discovered the lies it caused me more hurt then the actual lying. I too thought OM was honest with me. What is the point of lying to the OW I always thought. I am not his w, he can leave me at any time, there would be no PURPOSE in telling me an untruth and the relationship is difficult enough without constantly worrying about him ending it suddenly without telling me it was over. The dreaded disappearance!!

 

We nearly ended after each lie came out. I chose to stay. The fact is I am not his W. I don't have to live with him, while his lies hurt me, they really have no relation to my life. What I had with him was a hidden relationship, a lie. Each time he was with me, for more then 2 years, he lied to his wife. How could I believe he would not lie to me. It was a hurtful realization. One I had to face and evaluate. Accept he will tell me lies and stay or chose to leave. Its your choice but there really only are these two choices. They lie, its the nature of an affair.