What Atheists wish Christians knew about them

[BetheButterfly]

The poor dear. He's probably been through quite the traumatic religious experience. I just don't know why he hates God so much?! I can tell that he has a lot of repressed anger. Well, hope one day he'll repent of his sin, as the bible says, "repent and be saved" (please see bible verses here).

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

For people who have lost their sarcasm radar, Pie (a sweet member who has been on this forum apparently since 2009) is using a form of writing that is actually appreciated in many circles. Sarcasm is a form of satire.

 

"sat·ire [sat-ahyuhr] Show IPA noun 1. the use of irony, sarcasm, ridicule, or the like, in exposing, denouncing, or deriding vice, folly, etc."

Satire | Define Satire at Dictionary.com

 

Not all writers place winky smiley faces or an exposed tongue smiley face at the end of their sarcastic "work of literary art", but Pie did. That helps literary people like myself to understand the fact that sattire/sarcasm is being used.

 

I love Sheldon Cooper's grasp on sarcasm...

The Big Bang Theory - Sarcasm? - YouTube

 

(For the topic, Sheldon is one of most adorable Atheist characters in this world today!!! ... the Bing Bang show has personally helped me understand many Atheists' thought processes. )

[xxoo]

"For from the least to the greatest of them, everyone is greedy for unjust gain; and from prophet to priest, everyone deals falsely. They have healed the wound of my people lightly, saying, "Peace, peace," when there is no peace. Thus says the Lord : "Stand by the roads, and look, and ask for the ancient paths, where the good way is; and walk in it, and find rest for your souls. But they said, "We will not walk in it." I set watchmen over you, saying, "Pay attention to the sound of the trumpet!" But they said, "We will not pay attention." Therefore hear, O nations, and know, O congregation, what will happen to them. Hear, O earth; behold, I am bringing disaster upon this people, the fruit of their devices, because they have not paid attention to my words; and as for my law, they have rejected it. (Jeremiah 6:13, 14, 16-19 ESV)

 

Also...

 

For these are rebellious people, deceitful children, children unwilling to listen to the Lord ’s instruction. They say to the seers, “See no more visions!” and to the prophets, “Give us no more visions of what is right! Tell us pleasant things, prophesy illusions. Leave this way, get off this path, and stop confronting us with the Holy One of Israel!”(Isaiah 30:9-11 NIV)

 

Is this meant to show me that I am wrong about the peace I've enjoyed in my life sans religion?

 

I left that path to find peace.

[M30USA]

Is this meant to show me that I am wrong about the peace I've enjoyed in my life sans religion?

 

I left that path to find peace.

 

I'm just stating what the Bible says. According to Proverbs, "There is a way which seems right to a person but in the end it leads to destruction."

 

We live in a culture that values comfort and peace, unfortunately, even more than truth. The Bible tells us it's better to suffer for the truth than live peacefully in a lie.

 

I can't judge your motives. Only God can. I just consider myself a teacher of the Bible. I hope that helps clarify.

[xxoo]

I'm just stating what the Bible says. According to Proverbs, "There is a way which seems right to a person but in the end it leads to destruction."

 

We live in a culture that values comfort and peace, unfortunately, even more than truth. The Bible tells us it's better to suffer for the truth than live peacefully in a lie.

 

I can't judge your motives. Only God can. I just consider myself a teacher of the Bible. I hope that helps clarify.

 

I don't value what the Bible says. And my path has not led to destruction. It's led to a strong marriage, a loving family, and wonderful friendships, and a fulfilling career.

 

If the "destruction" is eternal damnation, well, I simply don't believe in that concept. So it is irrelevant.

[M30USA]

I don't value what the Bible says. And my path has not led to destruction. It's led to a strong marriage, a loving family, and wonderful friendships, and a fulfilling career.

 

...He [God] causes his sun [blessings] to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain [troubles] on the righteous and the unrighteous. (Matthew 5:45 NIV)

 

If God has given you blessings, it's less about what you have done than it is about the goodness of God and his patience on the midst of disbelief.

 

I pray that one day you will seek him and are able to say:

 

I say to the Lord, "You are my Lord; I have no good apart from you." (Psalms 16:2 ESV)

Edited May 13, 2013 by M30USA

[xxoo]

...He [God] causes his sun [blessings] to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain [troubles] on the righteous and the unrighteous. (Matthew 5:45 NIV)

 

If God has given you blessings, it's less about what you have done than it is about the goodness of God and his patience on the midst of disbelief.

 

I pray that one day you will seek him and are able to say:

 

I say to the Lord, "You are my Lord; I have no good apart from you." (Psalms 16:2 ESV)

 

You are the target audience for the OP, but I don't think you are listening. It's ok, because I don't actually expect Christians to listen. I am pleasantly surprised when some do, but I don't expect it.

[BetheButterfly]

I was assuming that pie2 was joking because of the winks and sticking out of tongues.

 

Yep.

 

Either pie2 watched the video and is having a bit of fun or they didn't watch the video and could probably benefit from it.

Pie is cool.

 

One of the reasons why I liked and shared this video was because Carter was very calm, very reasonable and respectful.

Agreed. Thanks.

 

Personally, I have experienced some (not all) Atheists to be rude, bigoted, insulting, and disrespectful. However, it is sadly true that there are some (not all) Theists who are rude, bigoted, insulting, and disrespectful too. For Christians, being the negative adjectives in the previous sentence is disobeying Jesus commands accounted in Luke 6:27-37 NIV - Love for Enemies - ?But to you who - Bible Gateway

 

Anyways, I appreciate Carter taking the time to talk candidly and kindly with people who believe what he himself doesn't believe. Awesome man!!!

 

For anyone who doesn't have the patience to watch the video here are the 11 points Carter spoke about.

I watched it and really liked how he talked. He has very good points and is extremely articulate. His kindness is more polished than many Christians; Christians should learn from him.

 

I have a few comments below in your summary.

 

#1. We have morals too.

This would be a good thread on its own. It would be cool to see what morals are important to people, no matter their beliefs or lack of belief in God/gods.

 

Morals depend on the group of people who ascribe to them. Just like Christian groups are diverse in what they consider moral and immoral, so it seems Atheist groups are the same.

 

#2. You don't know us better than ourselves.

Agreed. This is something I have had to remind some Atheists who like to explain away my experiences with God. My experiences with God are supernatural/spiritual and I do know myself better than Atheists know me. I concede that Atheists know themselves better than I know them, and think this is a very good point. Peoples' experiences are diverse, including their experiences concerning God/gods.

 

#3. We don't deep down believe in your particular god.

100% agreed that Atheists do not believe in God... hence why they are not Theists or Agnostics.

#4. We don't hate your particular god.

Carter cannot speak for every Atheist with this point. I know some Atheists who do hate "my" God even though they don't believe He exists. They hate the idea of Him. Many of the reasons they give me are understandable. They always point to the pain, injustice and suffering in the world, as well as to the Old Testament.

 

I wish God had created the earth to always be WITHOUT pain and suffering. I also personally do not understand the atrocities accounted in the Old Testament...Sometimes it seems to me like the "God of the Old Testament" is different than the "God of the New Testament." However, Jesus is I believe the fulfillment of the promises and prophesies and Law accounted in the Old Testament.

 

So yeah I understand why some (not all) Atheists hate "my" God, but I always point out to them that Jesus Christ did not command violence but rather Love. That's one reason I'm a Christian. If Jesus had not commanded Love but rather was violence and led his followers to kill other people, I would 100% not be a Christian today.

#5. We don't all disbelieve because something bad happened to us.

Completely understood.

#6. Believing isn't a choice.

I understand his point.

#7. Most of us used to be Christians too.

I don't think the word "most" is accurate in this sentence. There are many Atheists who live in/are from countries where Christianity was/is not the "dominant" religion.

 

However, I can understand how Carter would think this concerning the Western world where "Christianity" was spread through the conquests of the Roman Empire and then the British and Spanish empires, becoming the "official" religion.

 

As for the term "Christian" not everyone who identifies himself/herself as one is truly one. Jesus Christ, the founder of Christianity, made it clear that to be truly his follower, one has to obey his commands: Matthew 7:21-23 NIV - True and False Disciples - ?Not - Bible Gateway, Matthew 28:18-20 NIV - Then Jesus came to them and said, - Bible Gateway, John 15 NIV - The Vine and the Branches - ?I am the - Bible Gateway.

 

 

So anyways, I disagree that most Atheists used to be Christians. Granted, some are, which fulfills Jesus' prophecy:

 

"10 At that time many will turn away from the faith and will betray and hate each other, 11 and many false prophets will appear and deceive many people. 12 Because of the increase of wickedness, the love of most will grow cold, "

Matthew 24 NIV - The Destruction of the Temple and Signs - Bible Gateway

 

In Jesus time, (John 6:64-69 NIV - Yet there are some of you who do not - Bible Gateway), some followers of Jesus abandoned him. Jesus however focused on his faithful followers' faith. This passage is very important to me because it shows how important it is to not persecute or kill former Christians/followers of Jesus Christ. which is in line with Jesus' teachings to love.

 

 

#8. Quoting the bible doesn't work like a Jedi mind trick.

Nope, but Christians quote the Bible to explain what we believe. (love the sarcasm in #8! )

 

#9. We don't worship the devil.

Understood. I wish other Christians wouldn't think that... it's one of my pet peeves.

 

#10. Hell doesn't scare us. To us it doesn't even make sense.

Hell doesn't scare me either. To me, hell (or punishment for evil) does make sense because not all people receive justice for the crimes they have committed while they are living on earth. However sure I understand how it doesn't make sense.

#11. Not all of us are anti-theists.

I LOVE LOVE LOVE this point!!! It's my favorite point of Carter's!!! I am so glad of that and to me it's so important that Theists, Atheists, and Agnostics live peaceably and respectfully on this planet!!! Freedom of religion or no religion is WONDERFUL and agreeing to disagree is beautiful thing!!!

 

This point reminds me of this:

 

 

(I LOVE the Big Bang Theory because it helps me understand how many Atheists think.) Theists, Agnostics, and Atheists can most definitely agree to disagree and live on this planet peaceably. I am grateful for my Atheist friends and respect them and appreciate their tolerance and respect for my beliefs even though we disagree with each other.

[Phoebe]

What I liked about this video and the purpose behind starting this thread was to get beyond the stereotypes. I liked how the pastor and Carter were able to come together and respectfully acknowledge a difference in their beliefs. At the end of the video the pastor says how appreciative he is that Carter did not try to ridicule his beliefs or try to convert him, to which Carter simply replied that there was no need to. I loved that.

 

Just because we hold different beliefs does not mean that we should draw a line in the ground and hurl insults at each other, or that we should concentrate only on the bad in others while ignoring the good. This thread wasn't supposed to be about arguing about different beliefs, it's about respecting our differences. I'd love to see a list of what Christians wish Atheists knew about them, address some of the stereotypes. Lets open it up to all beliefs.

[Keenly]

And I love how they will always quote the bible like its absolute fact. But the irony is using a source we just told you that you don't accept as your proof.

 

"I don't believe in god "

 

"Well the bible says blah blah blah" like that is actually a valid point. Its not.

[steveT95]

Not that I am emotionally invested in this topic - didn't watch the video much. Do you disagree with the video of the atheist guy or what Pie said, or both?

 

I don't get what you are saying completely.

 

Take care,

Eve x

 

I didn't watch anything. I just jumped straight in. Wasn't really concentrating.

Ah well. All I was saying is that there isn't any real difference between atheists and christians. We both have a belief system, it is just a matter of respecting each other's differences.

[xxoo]

I didn't watch anything. I just jumped straight in. Wasn't really concentrating.

Ah well. All I was saying is that there isn't any real difference between atheists and christians. We both have a belief system, it is just a matter of respecting each other's differences.

 

What is the atheist belief system?

[M30USA]

And I love how they will always quote the bible like its absolute fact. But the irony is using a source we just told you that you don't accept as your proof.

 

"I don't believe in god "

 

"Well the bible says blah blah blah" like that is actually a valid point. Its not.

 

Natural man demands natural proof.

 

Spiritual man has no concern for natural proof because he understands that he is seeking things which cannot be seen and therefore require a different kind of proof. That different kind of proof is the testimony of the Holy Spirit.

 

I pray that you will seek the kingdom with all your heart and hear the testimony of the Holy Spirit.

[M30USA]

What is the atheist belief system?

 

The atheist belief system is that man is the basis for all morality, all laws, and all meaning. This implies that all morality, laws, and meaning is subject to change depending on the culture or person in power. Atheism, in the end, serves the same functional purpose as the philosophies of Utilitarianism and/or Secular Humanism. The reason they can say there is no god in atheism is because man, himself, becomes god.

[xxoo]

The atheist belief system is that man is the basis for all morality, all laws, and all meaning. This implies that all morality, laws, and meaning is subject to change depending on the culture or person in power. Atheism, in the end, serves the same functional purpose as the philosophies of Utilitarianism and/or Secular Humanism. The reason they can say there is no god in atheism is because man, himself, becomes god.

 

But I'm an atheist, and I don't believe that.

[M30USA]

But I'm an atheist, and I don't believe that.

 

LOL

 

Then where do you get your big-picture views from? Yourself? Then you are, by definition, your own god.

[Phoebe]

LOL

 

Then where do you get your big-picture views from? Yourself? Then you are, by definition, your own god.

 

What definition of god are you using that you state that in an atheist belief system that man becomes god?

[Keenly]

Natural man demands natural proof.

 

Spiritual man has no concern for natural proof because he understands that he is seeking things which cannot be seen and therefore require a different kind of proof. That different kind of proof is the testimony of the Holy Spirit.

 

I pray that you will seek the kingdom with all your heart and hear the testimony of the Holy Spirit.

 

Here's that condescending look down your nose pity I was talking about. ,

[xxoo]

LOL

 

Then where do you get your big-picture views from? Yourself? Then you are, by definition, your own god.

 

You view my beliefs through the lens of theism.

 

I live with mystery. I don't understand it all, and I don't need to. I simply don't believe in a god that created everything. At least not a god as proposed in Christianity.

[M30USA]

Here's that condescending look down your nose pity I was talking about. ,

 

"The kingdom of heaven is like a treasure hidden in the field, which a man found and hid again; and from joy over it he goes and sells all that he has and buys that field." (Matthew 13:44 NASB)

 

If I found such a field...and told you about it...would you say I was condescending? Or that I had something great and was wondering why you didn't want it.

[M30USA]

You view my beliefs through the lens of theism.

 

I live with mystery. I don't understand it all, and I don't need to. I simply don't believe in a god that created everything. At least not a god as proposed in Christianity.

 

Oh boy, if you think there's no mystery in the Bible, you obviously haven't read it.

 

"But in the days when the seventh angel is about to sound his trumpet, the mystery of God will be accomplished, just as he announced to his servants the prophets.” (Revelation 10:7 NIV)

[xxoo]

Oh boy, if you think there's no mystery in the Bible, you obviously haven't read it.

 

"But in the days when the seventh angel is about to sound his trumpet, the mystery of God will be accomplished, just as he announced to his servants the prophets.” (Revelation 10:7 NIV)

 

I didn't say the is no mystery in the bible.

 

I said I don't believe the bible to be true. It's an interesting story to me, but a story, and the Christian ideas of god and heaven and hell are not something I believe.

 

It was actually a relief to me when, in me 20s, I learned different ideas about god and heaven and hell. It did two things. First, it showed me the range of beliefs about god. Second, it showed that everyone felt as strongly about their teachings as my church felt about its teachings. Someone is wrong. Most, if not all, must be wrong about things they believe strongly. My conclusion is that they are ALL human ideas, and the truth is something that no human knows.

 

There is no harm in holding any belief or not hiding any belief, as long as it inspires a person to live a mindful life.

[Keenly]

"The kingdom of heaven is like a treasure hidden in the field, which a man found and hid again; and from joy over it he goes and sells all that he has and buys that field." (Matthew 13:44 NASB)

 

If I found such a field...and told you about it...would you say I was condescending? Or that I had something great and was wondering why you didn't want it.

 

Well when I tell you that I'm not interested in a field full of treasure, and you continue to bother me about it , that's disrespectful.

 

But way to ignore your own rudeness. With your condescending 'I'll pray for you' pity.

 

 

You can't accept people that are different. You see, I stay out of your religious and spiritual section, even though I want to tell you how ridiculous you are, but I respect your right to believe what you want, so I keep to myself. However, you cant do the same thing with atheists, instead you have to come in here and tell us were all wrong, and how your SO Mich of a better person than us. You keep quoting the bible like we actually care. Anytime I see a bible quote you automatically lose any intellectual credibility your post MAY contain, because like I said, your using the very thing we don't believe as evidence , and you expect us to listen. Haha.

[TaraMaiden]

M30USA, I hate to say it, but you sound incredibly like the Pharisee in the Temple....

[soccerrprp]

The atheist belief system is that man is the basis for all morality, all laws, and all meaning. This implies that all morality, laws, and meaning is subject to change depending on the culture or person in power. Atheism, in the end, serves the same functional purpose as the philosophies of Utilitarianism and/or Secular Humanism. The reason they can say there is no god in atheism is because man, himself, becomes god.

 

M30USA,

 

I feel for you. As someone who is now struggling with faith, I would like to chime in to say that this "change depending on the culture or person in power" is quite evident in Christian mindset as well. Intolerance among the most conservative Christian is still evident, but boy is he/she shackled by the allure of this materialistic world. There is no doubt that the most Christian among us, or in this world, prides himself in equating his material wealth to Christian blessings. Christians often convey an attitude that makes it difficult to tell if their god is Jesus or Mammon.

 

Atheist have their own issues, but seeing themselves as gods isn't one that I've observed. I feel that they are more open to believing that their destiny is shaped by their own labors, attitudes instead of a deity that has shown to be inconsistent at best, if he (she) exists. Believers also tend to transfer responsibility to this guy Satan.

 

I have long listened to both sides on the issue of whether a god exists or not. One thing for certain, no one has shown that one does exist. And if he does, eeesh, how cruel of a world it is to be so neglected...

 

Eh, I'm still trying to figure it all out....waiting for Godot to answer some questions. I should be easy, but apparently he's (she's) not talking right now...

[M30USA]

M30USA, I hate to say it, but you sound incredibly like the Pharisee in the Temple....

 

Your usage of that verse is out of context and misapplied. It's about a person believing they are morally superior to another. I do not believe I am morally superior to anyone. I simply believe that I have received the truth through the Scripture. Jesus, himself, even said that all who know the truth hear his voice. This does not mean they are like the Pharisees. God WANTS us to hear the truth and share it. He DOES NOT want us to be like the Pharisees.

 

Additionally, the mistake of the Pharisees, if you study them, is that they believed God favored them ABOVE other people. I have given Scripture references to show that God blesses good and evil people, and he causes to suffer good and evil people. I do not believe I stand above other people in any fashion other than claiming I have recieved the truth from God. It's not exclusive. Anyone can have it. You or anyone.

 

The Pharisees, on the other hand, believed that they were special and God had particular favor on them. Where have I ever said such a thing?