Letting Wife Take Over Initiation of Sex

[Glowy sun]

My wife's sexual interest in me has been hovering around zero for quite a while and a couple days ago after I tried to get her going only to get stonewalled I asked her if she would like it if I just stopped trying and we'd only have sex if she initiated to at least save me from being rejection and from her having sex when she doesn't want to (which she says she's done In the past). This is after a year of marriage problems and six months of therapy. We're going to give it three months and reevaluate then. Has this worked for anyone else? I'm curious if anyone's had success in reviving a dead sex life.

[Dean13]

Well, I can tell you in my marriage, that wouldn't work. I have more of a sex drive than my wife, if I wait for her to initiate, we'd have sex once a month if I was lucky. Our sex life isn't "dead", like you're saying yours is, and I don't know the extent of your problems, but I'm not sure waiting for her to initiate is going to help.

 

How do you go about initiating? I find that the more time I put in doing things for her during the day(chores, texts while at work, offering to cook, hugging and touching for no reason), the greater the success rate later. If I come home, say hi, ignore her while I watch hockey and then expect sex, probably not going to happen.

[TaraMaiden]

My wife's sexual interest in me has been hovering around zero for quite a while and a couple days ago after I tried to get her going only to get stonewalled I asked her if she would like it if I just stopped trying and we'd only have sex if she initiated to at least save me from being rejection and from her having sex when she doesn't want to (which she says she's done In the past). This is after a year of marriage problems and six months of therapy. We're going to give it three months and reevaluate then. Has this worked for anyone else? I'm curious if anyone's had success in reviving a dead sex life.

 

It absolutely works, if you're banking on being celibate for the rest of your life.

 

I hate to say it, but you are simply not on the same page, and any amount of therapy, instructions, exercises, recommendations and possible causes are simply going to lead to contrived situations and even less commitment from her.

 

Fact: Nearly 50% of women go off sex.

 

Fact: It's a deal-breaker.

 

I hate to pour doom and gloom on it, but I honestly think you need to be discussing with her whether she would be amenable to you getting your rocks off elsewhere.

 

And she will baulk at the idea and be horrified - but you can then tell her that in that case, she is condemning you to a married life of celibacy - and why should you take that on the chin and accept it?

 

Where's the compromise?

What can she do for you, to stop you seeking sexual gratification elsewhere?

And under the circumstances, what reasons can she give you for not doing so, taking into account the fact that she is not meeting YOUR needs here?

What about your needs?

Are they irrelevant?

 

See, sadly, she can't have her cake and eat it.

And why should she?

 

The choices are:

 

• Stay married, and accept celibacy (InCel - involuntary celibacy. Look it up.)
  
• Stay married, but come to an agreement with regard to your 'needs'.
  
• Divorce.
  

 

Those are your three, stark and true choices.

[Mumbles]

Thats a great and very realistic post TaraMaiden.

 

For me, in the end, it caused my marriage to fail. I simply couldn't live in involuntary celibacy. During heated discussions on the matter, which didn't and couldn't help by the way, she'd throw out at me the option of seeking my needs elsewhere with the caveat that I didn't fall in love with them or "bring anything home" (STD) but unfortunately she didn't mean it, and when I started spending alone time at the end of our marriage she was certain I was spending that time with other women and became insanely jealous (even though I wasn't doing anything of the sort).

 

Your options for discussion are gold and well worth a serious talk with partners who are in this situation. Its simply unreasonable for any one partner to enforce celibacy on the other. At the same time, disinterested sex is really unfulfilling too (and I got my fair share of this near the end).

 

As a single guy now, I see escorts, something I'd never done before. I had no knowledge of the industry but I wish I did. I loved my wife and wanted the marriage to continue, I really did, and if I'd known then what I know now I feel absolutely certain I could have retained my marriage and the many good things about it whilst seeing escort girls, discreetly in the background. What my wife and I didn't have was the serious discussion around this.

 

Escort girls don't want to be your girlfriend and, by and large, Johns don't fall in love with their escorts (with some exceptions). I'm certain this is an perfectly legitimate resolution to many many problems.

[USMCHokie]

I know it doesn't help after the fact, but this conversation should have been had prior to getting married.

[xxoo]

There is more to this story. The last thread you started discussed her past affair, opening up your marriage, and you falling in love with another woman in the open marriage.

 

This is far more complex than the standard "just don't feel like it" situation. The two of you have done a lot of damage to the marriage. If you've been in therapy, and things are getting worse instead of better--it's probably time to stick a fork in this one. It's done.

[TaraMaiden]

TM Bangs her head against the wall because - YET AGAIN! - she failed to read the history!!!**

[Glowy sun]

Thanks for the responses everyone. Yeah, it's a bit more complicated than just a low sex drive. Just didn't feel like writing a novel again to start a thread. FWIW things are getting somewhat better in the marriage, just not in the sex department. Yeah, a life of celibacy is a deal breaker, so this three month trial is somewhat of an end of the rope situation. I'm curious if anyone who's done something like this has managed to get his/her groove back. Right now my wife is at a "once a month" level, but she says and our counselor says that if things keep improving in the marriage, that level will rise. Is that realistic?

[Eve]

I don't understand why people don't just go straight to a sex therapist for sexual problems? Talking therapies work for some but actual sexual exercises combined with talking therapy has to be the wisest move, no?

 

I have been told that sessions can really seriously bring back the sparkle or even just give people whose sex life is fine a new lease of life.

 

 

I could imagine my H feeling emasculated by talking therapies. He doesn't really believe in all that anyway and would want active solutions.

 

Take care,

Eve x

[Glowy sun]

I don't understand why people don't just go straight to a sex therapist for sexual problems? Talking therapies work for some but actual sexual exercises combined with talking therapy has to be the wisest move, no?

 

I have been told that sessions can really seriously bring back the sparkle or even just give people whose sex life is fine a new lease of life.

 

 

I could imagine my H feeling emasculated by talking therapies. He doesn't really believe in all that anyway and would want active solutions.

 

Take care,

Eve x

 

My wife says the mental aspect is what is holding her back right now, due to the past year of marriage issues. Sounds like an interesting idea though I doubt there are any in our area (small-mid sized Midwest city).

[TaraMaiden]

Thanks for the responses everyone. Yeah, it's a bit more complicated than just a low sex drive. Just didn't feel like writing a novel again to start a thread. FWIW things are getting somewhat better in the marriage, just not in the sex department. Yeah, a life of celibacy is a deal breaker, so this three month trial is somewhat of an end of the rope situation. I'm curious if anyone who's done something like this has managed to get his/her groove back. Right now my wife is at a "once a month" level, but she says and our counselor says that if things keep improving in the marriage, that level will rise. Is that realistic?

 

No.

And I speak from 12 years' worth of InCel experience.

 

It will NOT get better.

 

No.

 

look at the rate....

 

How long has it taken you to progress to 'once a month'....?

 

When will you (at this rate!) be up to 4 times a month?

 

See?

 

No.

 

It is far from realistic.

[Eve]

My wife says the mental aspect is what is holding her back right now, due to the past year of marriage issues. Sounds like an interesting idea though I doubt there are any in our area (small-mid sized Midwest city).

 

Tell us what you find. I would be interested to know. I don't think I have read from anyone on the site who has attended sex therapy sessions. Hey, maybe you could be the first?

 

I found this article. Maybe showing something like it to your wife would be a way of introducing the idea? I think it covers most concerns.

 

http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/married-and-still-doing-it/201211/should-we-see-sex-therapist

 

Hope it works out.

 

Take care,

Eve x

[Mr. Lucky]

The choices are:

 

• Stay married, and accept celibacy (InCel - involuntary celibacy. Look it up.)
  
• Stay married, but come to an agreement with regard to your 'needs'.
  
• Divorce.
  

 

Those are your three, stark and true choices.

Bolded #2 for emphasis, is that such a bad thing? Seems to me, on some level, that's how a healthy marriage functions and deals with almost everything ...

 

Mr. Lucky

[tbf]

There is more to this story.

A huge understatement!

 

The last thread you started discussed her past affair, opening up your marriage, and you falling in love with another woman in the open marriage.

Not only that but they had a slow build of attraction when they met. This points to more of a dependency/familiarity/friendship relationship, than one that's got a lot of sexual chemistry to start. That she suddenly decided that she wanted to get into BDSM, then decided she didn't want to engage with the OP in this manner, once again points to a safety zone relationship and a lack of physical chemistry.

 

Also, the therapist mentioned that she felt the reason why your wife cheated was for external validation. This points to a low self-esteem individual who subsequently flipped out when you fell in love/in infatuation with the OW. She feared loss and abandonment of her safety zone marriage.

 

This is far more complex than the standard "just don't feel like it" situation. The two of you have done a lot of damage to the marriage.

Oh yes, way more complex since not only is she an emotional mess, he's quite passive, not asserting his boundaries, letting her push him around in every direction. This then circles back to why his wife doesn't feel he's the one to engage with, in a BDSM situation. Is it because he's not dominant enough during the engagement or is it because she doesn't feel safe when he's being dominant since it might change the safe model of their relationship? With strange men she's not emotionally attached to (assuming she takes the submissive role), she can tap out permanently if they freak her out in any way.

 

If you've been in therapy, and things are getting worse instead of better--it's probably time to stick a fork in this one. It's done.

This is most likely with this marriage. But, they've only been doing IC where joint sessions are a relatively new occurrence.

 

From what's been read on LS about MC, things get worse when couples start to honestly discuss their pent up resentments and expectations. Once all the dirty laundry has been aired, that's when understanding, compromise and real resolution starts to happen or doesn't happen, so the marriage makes or breaks.

Edited May 18, 2013 by tbf

[Eve]

BDSM, open marriage.. ok, I had no idea about all of that.

 

Scrap my input to this thread. I did not know the background sufficiently and would not have made comment if I had.

 

Take care,

Eve x

[MrWindupBird]

My wife's sexual interest in me has been hovering around zero for quite a while and a couple days ago after I tried to get her going only to get stonewalled I asked her if she would like it if I just stopped trying and we'd only have sex if she initiated to at least save me from being rejection and from her having sex when she doesn't want to (which she says she's done In the past). This is after a year of marriage problems and six months of therapy. We're going to give it three months and reevaluate then. Has this worked for anyone else? I'm curious if anyone's had success in reviving a dead sex life.

 

My wife as soon as I stop pursuing her, and I stop actively participating in all her conversations about herself, and I don't build her up as the future of her job and the greatest parent in the world. The second I stop being the cheerleader, she becomes the world's greatest wife. Aggressive and charitable with sex. Wants to cook and clean all the time. Wants to watch boxing with me. Asks me about my projects. Asks me about books I'm reading. Whatever.

 

I would give up the chase for a while to see what happens. It might turn the tides a little bit. It might not, and at least you'll know 100% that you're the worker ant in the relationship and you deserve better. But no matter what, you owe it to yourself to stand up for yourself and stop letting her reject you. There are women out there who like sweetness and affection, and you don't have to let someone else belittle you. If you are always the chaser, then there's a solid chance that her life has grown around that fact like a plant grows around a fence. Take that ego superboost away, and she'll probably realize the floor's been pulled out from under her feet, and it will at least help for a little while.

[edgygirl]

I find that the more time I put in doing things for her during the day(chores, texts while at work, offering to cook, hugging and touching for no reason), the greater the success rate later. If I come home, say hi, ignore her while I watch hockey and then expect sex, probably not going to happen.

 

^ All men who would like women to think about them sexually and not simply be pissed off at them should start by doing what's stated in the brilliant post above.

 

Being married doesn't entitle anyone to get sex and love when they're not taking care of the emotional needs of their partner. And most women NEED the things stated above to feel emotionally fulfilled and happy in a relationship. A man who doesn't get this will never have a happy relationship (emotionally, sexually or otherwise) with their partner.

 

I don't agree with MrWindupBird advice, which would only work in an unhealthy relationship. We all like sweet men - doesn't mean they have to be doormats. I for one like men who are sweet and manly at the same time... Hard to find.

Edited May 20, 2013 by edgygirl

[Glowy sun]

A huge understatement!

 

Not only that but they had a slow build of attraction when they met. This points to more of a dependency/familiarity/friendship relationship, than one that's got a lot of sexual chemistry to start. That she suddenly decided that she wanted to get into BDSM, then decided she didn't want to engage with the OP in this manner, once again points to a safety zone relationship and a lack of physical chemistry.

 

Also, the therapist mentioned that she felt the reason why your wife cheated was for external validation. This points to a low self-esteem individual who subsequently flipped out when you fell in love/in infatuation with the OW. She feared loss and abandonment of her safety zone marriage.

 

Oh yes, way more complex since not only is she an emotional mess, he's quite passive, not asserting his boundaries, letting her push him around in every direction. This then circles back to why his wife doesn't feel he's the one to engage with, in a BDSM situation. Is it because he's not dominant enough during the engagement or is it because she doesn't feel safe when he's being dominant since it might change the safe model of their relationship? With strange men she's not emotionally attached to (assuming she takes the submissive role), she can tap out permanently if they freak her out in any way.

 

This is most likely with this marriage. But, they've only been doing IC where joint sessions are a relatively new occurrence.

 

From what's been read on LS about MC, things get worse when couples start to honestly discuss their pent up resentments and expectations. Once all the dirty laundry has been aired, that's when understanding, compromise and real resolution starts to happen or doesn't happen, so the marriage makes or breaks.

 

Oy sounds like a huge mess, no? hehe

 

Joint sessions have been going for almost three months now and it's been helping a lot, if only to get us back to a

 

I think you're pretty on the ball with the BDSM stuff, but I'll add that we were both fairly green to kinky sex when we started doing that, so of course my Dom skills were/are pretty lacking. She started seeing a much more experienced Dom online at about the same time, so my theory is once she started seeing him, she mentally shifted her perception of me to a much more "safe" sexual partner. Before then she said I was good at it.

 

Plus that was a much more emotional time. Our psychologies were swinging every which way (pardon the pun). Now we're much calmer. There has been very little fighting and depressive episodes.

 

I'd like to think I'm not a doormat, but I do admit I am a passive person. I do all the nice things you guys talk about. Cook, Clean, Flowers, Romantic Notes, Cuddling w/o Sex (although my wife says there's not nearly enough of that). And I've tried to be a more aggressive, take charge, dominating person. No response. The "let her initiate" initiative at least allows me to not feel the scalding rejection of rejection.

 

In any case. Yeah, pretty screwed-up non-screwing marriage. So HAS there been anyone who's revived a dead sex life? Does that couple even exist?

Edited May 20, 2013 by Glowy sun
typo

[annaballerina]

is she ok with you initiating because i wouldnt stop if she does start to show some interest. its better one initiate than no initiation at all. i do get its at the risk of rejection think of it as stoking your love life and keeping the fires burning.

[SoleMate]

Please read The Sex-Starved Marriage by Michele Weiner-Davis. Best ever advice on this complex and sensitive topic.

[Glowy sun]

Well, it's been almost a month and we haven't had sex once. It's fairly frustrating, but having an end date (labor day) in mind has helped me. Either it gets better by then, or well, I guess we'll have to re-evaluate. My wife went on anti-depressants this week (I've been on them for about six months now). I know that won't help her libido, but I really hope it makes her feel better because she has been very depressed and is only now admitting it

[Sparty97]

^ All men who would like women to think about them sexually and not simply be pissed off at them should start by doing what's stated in the brilliant post above.

 

Being married doesn't entitle anyone to get sex and love when they're not taking care of the emotional needs of their partner. And most women NEED the things stated above to feel emotionally fulfilled and happy in a relationship. A man who doesn't get this will never have a happy relationship (emotionally, sexually or otherwise) with their partner.

 

I don't agree with MrWindupBird advice, which would only work in an unhealthy relationship. We all like sweet men - doesn't mean they have to be doormats. I for one like men who are sweet and manly at the same time... Hard to find.

 

Some of us come home, say hi, and ignore our wives while watching hockey BECAUSE the sex dried up...

[Mumbles]

I'd like to think I'm not a doormat, but I do admit I am a passive person. I do all the nice things you guys talk about. Cook, Clean, Flowers, Romantic Notes, Cuddling w/o Sex (although my wife says there's not nearly enough of that). And I've tried to be a more aggressive, take charge, dominating person. No response. The "let her initiate" initiative at least allows me to not feel the scalding rejection of rejection.

 

I don't know mate. I can see some parallels with the above and the end of my marriage. I'm reasonably passive as well, particularly with friends and family, I just tend to go with the flow and don't always have to be driving my will into people. Like you say, I don't think anyone would describe me as a "doormat", not by a long shot, I'm just easy going.

 

Some ladies do certainly seem to like a much more aggressive guy, in an assertive sense, but equally, this is also a huge turn off for many ladies too. Its just personalities. You'd already know if your wife is like this. I suspect she wouldn't have married you at all if she was really into super alpha type guys ... so unless you think you've changed into a really passive man over the last few years I don't think this is the problem.

 

What I found at the end of my marriage is that by the time I was well enough aware that there _really_ was a serious ongoing problem the mould had been set. Trying then to "change" if you like to put it that way, just didn't work - she, and probably me, were over the relationship and small tokens of effort and love just bounced off the ever increasing armour plating that was building up.

 

What I can tell you is that all this started to become very apparent once the sex dropped off. I think sex is both an indicator and a actuator. Having regular sex with your love binds the relationship in my view, certainly from my male perspective.

 

Which leads me to:

 

In any case. Yeah, pretty screwed-up non-screwing marriage. So HAS there been anyone who's revived a dead sex life? Does that couple even exist?

 

I'm not sure in the short term.

 

I am divorced now and won't get the chance to see what else might have been tried. Now in my 4th year post separation, I have to wonder if a good solid break from each other, prior to actual divorce, might have then given us both a chance to re-evaluate things. There was a lot of good stuff about our marriage, but once both parties have their backs up, the sex is gone, and other loving gestures start to feel like more of a chore than real, then you're in a bad place and its hard to come up for air.

 

Neither my ex wife or me have found a good LTR since our divorce. As I say, I do ponder if we'd just taken a break, including perhaps engaging in some extra marital stuff, things might have naturally flowed back together once some of the initial hurt and pain had diminished so that real communication could begin again.

[Mumbles]

Well, it's been almost a month and we haven't had sex once. It's fairly frustrating, but having an end date (labor day) in mind has helped me. Either it gets better by then, or well, I guess we'll have to re-evaluate.

 

I went 9 months near the end.

 

Putting a date on things in your mind is just going to frustrate you would be my guess. If you've told your wife about this 'date' then that likely isn't going to work at all ... will just build a resentment I suspect.

 

What does re-evaluate, in this context, even mean? You will leave? See other women?

 

My wife at the time actually told me point blank to go and see an escort. She said she was perfectly happy, but didn't want sex. In fact both statements were completely untrue. She certainly wasn't happy (which was, of course, what led to the no sex), and she really _really_ didn't want me to see other women.

 

My wife went on anti-depressants this week (I've been on them for about six months now). I know that won't help her libido, but I really hope it makes her feel better because she has been very depressed and is only now admitting it

 

It may make her feel better, I hope so. I have no direct experience of anti-depressants, but I understand from reading around that many of these can completely kill your sex drive ... thus putting you, potentially, in an even worse position.

[Dean13]

Some of us come home, say hi, and ignore our wives while watching hockey BECAUSE the sex dried up...

 

Don't get me wrong, I still watch hockey. I just DVR it and watch it later.

 

Well, not now that the playoffs are on, playoffs are always live. Got to have priorities!