Ladies: Dating men who have had 'FWB'

[sillyanswer]

a monkey brancher.

 

What's a monkey brancher? Never heard of that (apart from, I think, you used the phrase earlier in this thread).

[phineas]

Just leave the OP alone. She knows what she wants and is her right to choose, it is her life. Don't gang up on her.

 

I don't agree with you.

Therefore you must be stupid.

 

 

 

I'm j/k but OP truly does believe she is the moral compass on sex & feels the need to judge others who view sex differently from her.

 

To call them names ect.

 

THAT is my problem.

I've already stated I can care less about her "standards" it's the fact she wants to judge others & acts as if she's better than those who have sex outside a relationship simply because she "doesn't do that" LOL!

[phineas]

Its not that. Its the talk about male bad behavior and that we are alll users

 

Yes. I've noticed every time i've pointed this out to her she ignored it.

Instead she deflects.

 

She knows she doesn't have a leg to stand on if she actually tried to defend this irrational thought process.

[RedRobin]

I agree with you.

 

Some people say the past doesn't matter, but it's not true. They might even call you "insecure, immature" and any other stupid.

 

In reality, a mature person knows what they want in a relationship, values their own wants, needs, and will find someone they're compatible, and comfortable with.

 

re-posted for relevance...

[William]

Good evening.

 

We expect that all community participants interact in a manner conducive to free-flowing, collaborative participation from all visitors, fostering an environment free of harassment, character attacks, and other forms of individual and group berating. We realize that all members may not share the same definitions on issues surrounding personal morality, appropriate behavior, and other sensitive topics of discussion that often appear on the site; we encourage all to voice their own opinions while refraining from criticizing other participants for the perspective they hold. Each person that posts on the forum is to be treated with the utmost respect and civility regardless of how absurd or ridiculous the opinion expressed might seem to you from your perspective.

 

I hope the italicized has meaning. If not, moderation has other tools at its disposal. Carry on.

 

Updated to add that some tools have been utilized. Please adhere to the topic and discuss it with respect to our guidelines, including those published above. Thanks. There has been some editing of the thread.

Edited May 30, 2013 by William
Update.

[RedRobin]

Sounds like advice you could follow, especially since your approach of distrust and assume the worst[1] isn't exactly working for you.

 

 

[1] Examples available on request, or you could trust but verify yourself since I'll only be referring to your posts in this thread.

 

Let's define what 'working for me' means...

 

I have not become involved with men who are not serious about pursuing a relationship with me.

 

I eliminate men who have a history, as evidenced by recent ONS and FWBs, that indicates they are not interested in or able to maintain a serious LTR.

 

My system is working for me JUST FINE.

[joystickd]

I get it that people REALLY REALLY have it deep down ingrained in their psyche that men are supposed to be let off the hook for their behavior... and it is women's job to overlook their little faux pas.

 

Rather than them learn to be decent men in the first place.

Sure I do. I hold them to higher standards because I know what they are capable of. They are capable of so much more...

 

The problem is not the fact that you ended things with a guy that had an FWB. The thing is these negative comments about men in general. If that is your preference then that is your preference fine but all the negativity about men is not needed. Then in the same breath say men are capable of much more. Why would a man show you they are capable of much more given your negativity? When you are called on your negative comments you avoid the issue and think you are being called on dumping a guy that has an FWB but the truth is if you look at it numerous guy clearly stated about your negative comments about men. Why don't you just address the negative comments and stop avoiding the issue at hand? None of the guys on here don't have a real issue about what the thread is about just the negativity towards men like we are all users.

[sillyanswer]

Let's define what 'working for me' means...

 

I have not become involved with men who are not serious about pursuing a relationship with me.

 

I eliminate men who have a history, as evidenced by recent ONS and FWBs, that indicates they are not interested in or able to maintain a serious LTR.

 

My system is working for me JUST FINE.

 

I disagree with your notion that having had recent ONS or FWB indicates that someone is not interested in or able to maintain a serious LTR. I think that's somewhat condescending.

 

Glad you feel your system is working, though, and obviously you shouldn't get involved with people with whom you have incompatible views about important things.

 

 

(edited to add: I wasn't sure that we were really talking about ONS... I thought this was all about FWB. Perhaps I missed or forgot where was was introduced.)

Edited May 30, 2013 by sillyanswer

[RedRobin]

The problem is not the fact that you ended things with a guy that had an FWB. The thing is these negative comments about men in general. If that is your preference then that is your preference fine but all the negativity about men is not needed. Then in the same breath say men are capable of much more. Why would a man show you they are capable of much more given your negativity? When you are called on your negative comments you avoid the issue and think you are being called on dumping a guy that has an FWB but the truth is if you look at it numerous guy clearly stated about your negative comments about men. Why don't you just address the negative comments and stop avoiding the issue at hand? None of the guys on here don't have a real issue about what the thread is about just the negativity towards men like we are all users.

 

We have a difference of opinion when it comes to FWB and men who pursue them or are in them.

 

My reasons why I don't like men who have FWB are personal to ME. You don't have to make it personal to you.

 

Anyway, my impression is that the attacks on me have less to do with me, and more to do with the fact that these guys don't like being judged by the same criteria they judge women...

 

....and they have been socialized to believe that when they get done with their messing around, that a woman who hasn't done the things he has done will be waiting with open arms to redeem him through her love and make everything ok. (cue cheesy music...)

 

I understand the fantasy... It is a nice one... but it isn't fair to the woman to expect her to take that risk... especially when these same guys wouldn't take that risk for a similar woman as him.

[RedRobin]

I disagree with your notion that having had recent ONS or FWB indicates that someone is not interested in or able to maintain a serious LTR. I think that's somewhat condescending.

 

Glad you feel your system is working, though, and obviously you shouldn't get involved with people with whom you have incompatible views about important things.

 

 

(edited to add: I wasn't sure that we were really talking about ONS... I thought this was all about FWB. Perhaps I missed or forgot where was was introduced.)

 

Thank you....

[RedRobin]

... on a personal note...

 

I'm at my alma mater with the intention of starting a business with a former professor of mine...

 

Talk about a breath of fresh air... but I digress...

 

... and this other thread kind of illustrates my point... http://www.loveshack.org/forums/romantic/dating/397618-i-want-his-girlfriend-will-ever-happen-how-do-you-know

 

It is possible even after establishing exclusivity and people are dating for a certain period of time that the guy will try to push for a FWB arrangement... I would find that thoroughly repulsive and insulting if a guy suggested that with me... I'd rather he broke up with me than even ask something like that or try and treat me like one.

 

....another reason I avoid men who have them.

Edited May 30, 2013 by RedRobin

[RedRobin]

Asking questions is attacks? I didn't read the entire thread but it seems it's just questions. It seems you're dodging the questions asked. Also you are trying to take the focus away from the questions asked.

 

If you have such a dislike for men why do you even bother dating? Maybe it's time to spend some time alone and reflect things.

 

I didn't know that having a FWB was synonymous with being a 'man'...

 

Although, I get it that some 'men' think that lots of f*cking around and having FWB is synonymous with manhood.

 

I don't happen to share that opinion.

[RedRobin]

That thread has nothing with topic in hand. Why are you trying to bring your own issues to another thread?

 

It wasn't my issue... It was our issue... She was concerned that the guy was telling her he was looking for a relationship but was really more interested in having a summer fling or a FWB....

 

basically, baiting her into getting attached to him by acting like he is looking for a relationship so he could spring the "Lets be FWB" thing after the fact and seeing if she'll go along with it.

 

Same concern as I had about the guy I was seeing.

 

So, my concern and hers are very similar. Except... the guy she is dating is showing her that he really DOES want to establish a relationship with her... and her BF doesn't have a history of casual sex...

 

Which was not the case with the guy I just dumped. The guy I just dumped probably was feeding me a line of BS. That's ok. Nice try... move on to the next sucker is my thought.

[BluEyeL]

... on a personal note...

 

I'm at my alma mater with the intention of starting a business with a former professor of mine...

 

Talk about a breath of fresh air... but I digress...

 

... and this other thread kind of illustrates my point... http://www.loveshack.org/forums/romantic/dating/397618-i-want-his-girlfriend-will-ever-happen-how-do-you-know

 

It is possible even after establishing exclusivity and people are dating for a certain period of time that the guy will try to push for a FWB arrangement... I would find that thoroughly repulsive and insulting if a guy suggested that with me... I'd rather he broke up with me than even ask something like that or try and treat me like one.

 

....another reason I avoid men who have them.

I'm not sure if Iamaga's boyfriend is pushing for FWB. Gosh, when I was young and dating my ex husband, never heard of these "labels". Today is so complicated.

[RedRobin]

I'm not sure if Iamaga's boyfriend is pushing for FWB. Gosh, when I was young and dating my ex husband, never heard of these "labels". Today is so complicated.

 

No, he's not at all... She was just concerned he might be. That is where she and I had similar concerns.

 

Her BF sounds like a sweet guy. Hope it works out for them...

 

Yea, and I hear you about dating back in the day... I never, ever had these things to worry about when I was dating my ex-H either.

[RedRobin]

Looks like you want to upset men that's your goal? Men have asked you questions but you ignore them.

 

Men are judged and take a lot of risk. Men are the ones expected to ask a woman out. Men are expected to court the woman. Even with that it doesn't guarantee he will end up relationship with her. A man will have several hundred rejections at least, that's before dating begins. Then he will be rejected during the dating processes. If a man does a few things a woman doesn't like all that effort is wasted.

 

Who said these guys that had casual sex wouldn't take the same risk? Majority of women had casual one time or another so I don't see how that is possible. If that was true men wouldn't marry women.

 

 

 

I took the same risks as the guy I'm talking about in this thread... I spent nearly two months trying to get to know him.. I wasn't seeing anyone else or sleeping with anyone during that period. I gave it my best shot... and demonstrated to him that I was interested in having a relationship with him.

 

He did not do the same for me... plus his history indicated his ability to commit was rather suspect... so I ended things.

 

My time is valuable too. Men here seem to forget that...

[sillyanswer]

My time is valuable too. Men here seem to forget that...

 

It didn't seem to be a key point under discussion, or even on topic based on the first post, so sorry if I overlooked it.

 

I'm sure your time is very valuable, and now that we know that men with previous experience of FWB are incompatible with what you seek I know you'll ask this early on next time so as to avoid wasting anybody's time. This thread hasn't been entirely positive, but knowing how to avoid wasting somebody's time (yours! as well as his) in the future is a great outcome.

[RedRobin]

It didn't seem to be a key point under discussion, or even on topic based on the first post, so sorry if I overlooked it.

 

I'm sure your time is very valuable, and now that we know that men with previous experience of FWB are incompatible with what you seek I know you'll ask this early on next time so as to avoid wasting anybody's time. This thread hasn't been entirely positive, but knowing how to avoid wasting somebody's time (yours! as well as his) in the future is a great outcome.

 

Yes, this was the first time I ever came across someone who had a FWB... and wasn't sure how to feel about it... but now I do.

 

Clarity was my goal in this thread so I can know what to do in the future. I agree that is a positive outcome. It is not my goal to waste anyone's time... his or mine.

[Mme. Chaucer]

and more to do with the fact that these guys don't like being judged by the same criteria they judge women…

 

Speaking for myself - though I would not hold a person's past sex life against them (unless it was abusive), I would NEVER take a guy seriously who judged women's past sex lives to a different standard than their own. Having a casual sexual relationship and having a double standard certainly do not go hand in hand!

 

....and they have been socialized to believe that when they get done with their messing around, that a woman who hasn't done the things he has done will be waiting with open arms to redeem him through her love and make everything ok. (cue cheesy music…)

 

I understand the fantasy... It is a nice one... but it isn't fair to the woman to expect her to take that risk... especially when these same guys wouldn't take that risk for a similar woman as him.

 

Again, a double standard and the choice to have fun sex when not in a committed relationship are not the same thing, if you're talking about fairly conscious and evolved people. Which are the only people I can really have closeness on any level.

 

As I said, I think adhering to your standards is right for you, as it is for all of us. But I don't understand your equating "holding out" sexually with being a generally better and more virtuous human being than someone who is more free sexually. Your posts (like the tone of the bolded above) clearly indicate that you do believe this, and that you actually have scorn for those who handle their own sexuality differently than you do. If they're men, anyway.

 

Why not just leave all that behind and look for someone who's conducted their sex lives all their lives the same way you have, since clearly it's a key criteria for you? There is nothing wrong with that. But why all the scornful, shaming language?

[RedRobin]

You're focus on men who had casual sex. That is what you will likely attract. Your standards are based on fear that a man will cheat on you. It's different that having a standard based on positive aspect.

 

You say you don't hate men who don't commit but your other posts, states otherwise.

 

I rather focus on the positive things I want in a woman not the negative. But then that's just me.

 

Interesting... hate is a pretty strong word.

 

Just because I don't want to have sex or have a relationship with a man who has a history of casual sex or FWB doesn't mean I 'hate' them. I just avoid them...

 

... and since we have ever more complicated methods and terms to describe relationships (or whatever) these days... it is tougher and tougher to sift out the ones who really are serious about finding a relationship. I'm not taking credit for creating this culture, dude.

 

Anyway, men who engage in casual sex don't need much encouragement to be attracted to much of anything... is my observation. I can hardly take it personally that I happen to fall into the cast net they are dragging. lol.

 

So there is one less fish in your net?? what's it to you?? lots of ladies out there who don't care... or so it appears.

[Treasa]

 

If I have a question, it is more to the ladies. Could you love or trust someone knowing he had used someone just for sex? And did so for an extended period?

 

 

I only read the OP. I could love someone if he was FWB with someone before.

 

He didn't "use" me for sex. We had sex. I don't have sex with someone unless it's for my own sexual pleasure.

 

All that being said, I don't want a "relationship." I think FWB is perfect for me. As long as I'm not dating anyone and he's not dating anyone (I wouldn't want anyone else to get hurt), then it's all fine with me.

[RedRobin]

I only read the OP. I could love someone if he was FWB with someone before.

 

He didn't "use" me for sex. We had sex. I don't have sex with someone unless it's for my own sexual pleasure.

 

All that being said, I don't want a "relationship." I think FWB is perfect for me. As long as I'm not dating anyone and he's not dating anyone (I wouldn't want anyone else to get hurt), then it's all fine with me.

 

Thank you for sharing your thoughts.

 

It is ok if that is what you are looking for and are ok with it. That would mean your relationship styles and goals are compatible.

 

I had doubts that the guy I was seeing truly did clear it with the woman he claimed to have this arrangement with (based on overlap he had with another woman). I also had doubts that our relationship styles were compatible... and that it was only a matter of time before things either slid into that more casual style or he'd try to talk me into it...

 

... but thank you. I am getting here and there that some women are ok with FWB and may even prefer it.

 

Still makes me cringe when a guy I'm interested in says he had one though. Not much I can do about that.

[Treasa]

Thank you for sharing your thoughts.

 

It is ok if that is what you are looking for and are ok with it. That would mean your relationship styles and goals are compatible.

 

I had doubts that the guy I was seeing truly did clear it with the woman he claimed to have this arrangement with (based on overlap he had with another woman). I also had doubts that our relationship styles were compatible... and that it was only a matter of time before things either slid into that more casual style or he'd try to talk me into it...

 

... but thank you. I am getting here and there that some women are ok with FWB and may even prefer it.

 

Still makes me cringe when a guy I'm interested in says he had one though. Not much I can do about that.

 

I agree that we all have our preferences. Thankfully, no one is SO unique in their preferences that they can't find someone compatible, though.

 

There are guys who want exactly what you want, and I'm sure they'd love to meet you.

[Mme. Chaucer]

I would just like to add that one of the most dispicable attitudes IMO is that of a man who believes he should "sow his wild oats" and then demands a mate with a "low number" and views other women as "damaged goods." These fora used to be full of such crap, and I'm grateful that most of those guys don't seem to be around any more or at least they've quit posting that garbage. It offends me a lot.

 

I have absolutely zero men like that in my life on any personal level and NEVER have since high school. Because I think they are losers. And I would never go on more than one date with any of them, so their lame attitudes would have no effect on me whatsoever. They are the same as racists in my book - rejects.

 

People (gender unimportant) who enjoy their own sexuality in ways that are not harmful to other people, whatever that may be, are fine by me and always have been.

 

Yes, there are certain ways a person can enjoy their own sexuality in an unharmful way that would cause me to not consider them as a mate; and I don't hold it against OP that a person who's style could EVER have included FWB is one of hers. But FWB havers are not "worse" than non-FWB havers!

 

My choices. Their choices. They need to merge. But it does not mean that my choices are "better."

[RedRobin]

I would just like to add that one of the most dispicable attitudes IMO is that of a man who believes he should "sow his wild oats" and then demands a mate with a "low number" and views other women as "damaged goods." These fora used to be full of such crap, and I'm grateful that most of those guys don't seem to be around any more or at least they've quit posting that garbage. It offends me a lot.

 

I have absolutely zero men like that in my life on any personal level and NEVER have since high school. Because I think they are losers. And I would never go on more than one date with any of them, so their lame attitudes would have no effect on me whatsoever. They are the same as racists in my book - rejects.

 

People (gender unimportant) who enjoy their own sexuality in ways that are not harmful to other people, whatever that may be, are fine by me and always have been.

 

Yes, there are certain ways a person can enjoy their own sexuality in an unharmful way that would cause me to not consider them as a mate; and I don't hold it against OP that a person who's style could EVER have included FWB is one of hers. But FWB havers are not "worse" than non-FWB havers!

 

My choices. Their choices. They need to merge. But it does not mean that my choices are "better."

 

Fair enough... and I agree...

 

I believe this thread got side-lined when a few vocal individuals seem to insist that I absolutely must be ok with dating men who had FWB... and if I didn't, then I must 'hate' men or something.