Married Man in another country - any sense?

[sophie_bextor]

This could be the classic story of the affair with the married man ... maybe it is, I don't know.

 

(having said that, leave the judgamental cr*ap out please...)

 

I met him in October 2011. We live in different continents (it's a ten hour flight). He came on vacation (alone) and we ended up getting involved. I knew he was married, but I thought I would never see or talk to him again...after all, it was just a 8 day vacation. I was wrong.

 

So he returned to his country,and since then we've been talking everyday (we exchanged contacts but I NEVER thought he'd keep in touch). I was initially very cold and wouldn't reply his e-mails, because in addition to living so far away, he is married and it needed to stop because we wouldn't get anywhere and I would only end up getting hurt. But then I fell for it. He insisted and insisted that he loved me and would prove me wrong. (I got the feeling that he felt very alone and disconected in this marriage, as opposed to the caring and loving way I treated him).

 

The truth is that it's been a year and seven months and he continues to call almost daily (of course, when she's not around), e-mailing and has come to my country 5 times in a year just to see me.

 

Having said that, the excuse of "he's using you for sex, having his cake and eating it too" does not seem to fit this story. This is what makes me think there's something "different in this story" (some may think I believe what I want to believe, but it's not that at all). We're not talking average phone calls or journeys to see me, he actually has to spend often more that he can afford (the benefits and disadvantages of credit cards...) to keep in touch with me, to see me. I think he really loves me, but doesn't seem to be able to end a marriage of 17 years with a 16 year old son, because there are bonds, feelings, friendship, sense of security, etc. He has always told me he doesn't love her, but tells me he cares for her and they're friends.

 

When they married she was 16 and he married her because she was pregnant and felt it was the right thing to do. I'm not trying to make excuses for him, nor saying I completely believe that it's just out of pity that he's with her, but I get the feeling that she is emotionally dependent on him and he worries about her almost like a father would, but says he does not love her. I know he has cheated on her several times, he told me himself, and that once he almost left her for another woman, but then she begged for him to return home and he felt guilty so he did. He also says there are things that keep him with her, mainly financial issues (I know they all say so, but I have good reasons to believe it's true) and his son. Whenever he comes to see me, he has to pay the trip in 10 parcels and halfway through the days he's already out of money and I pay the expenses). Also seems to me that he feels very responsible for her and he is the kind of person who always wants to be on good terms with everyone, he cannot handle situations that might end up in confrontation. He avoids it and he feels responsible for everyone's happiness. He accompanies her everywhere, but when he goes somewhere, she doesn't care and he always goes alone (I know this for a fact). She seems not to care much as long as he comes home.

 

He's saying since the beggining he will separate and keeps saying so, but in such a convincing way - and I'm not an idiot to believe any crap) that, difficult as this may seem to believe, I truly do - I don't know if he'll go through, but I know he wants to.

 

So he decided he would leave by the end of August 2012. He left his job.

 

In August he came, but told me he hadn't been able to finish the marriage. She had a minor health probem and he couldn't end it (I know, it's not a good enough excuse, in spite of being true), also because of what his son would think of him and fears and insecurity. He came and stayed for a month, he only went back when she told him the date of the surgery, as he had promised he would be there. I went to the airport with him to arrange a flight to fit those dates.

 

I do not know what he said to his wife about leaving home for so long (a month) without a date to go back, but sure she didn't mind (or didn't show it) because one day I was sitting next to him and saw an e-mail from her saying "hi sweety, missing you! Love you a lot" that is not normal ... if your husband leaves for a month you sure will suspect something: he had his phone turned off ALL THE TIME he was here...she could only contact him by email.

 

The question is: will he ever leave her? He has travelled here twice since August, and I went there once. The calls and e-mails continue, keeps saying and insists on saying he's doing what he can to get finantially independent, that he wants to stay with me and will be with me. But he still lives there. Says he's trapped because since he left his job, he hasn't got up on his feet yet and depends on her financially. I know it's not just this, and I know it's not easy to leave your whole life behind, specially when you get along with your spouse (even in a superficial way), when you've built a life, and simply trade it for something so uncertain - even though we love each other.

 

Thing is, I torture him and pressure him so much (I really do) that he could have ended this thing already. He doesn't. We live 10.000 km apart. Who would go through such trouble for someone so far away if they didn't love them?

 

Sex...well, he can have plenty without having to cross an ocean.

 

Also: we are friends on facebook and he posts songs on my wall regardless of who may see it (note I'm also friends with his son and other family members on facebook. And sometimes when we're on the phone he will tell me to talk to his son just to say hi, I think he's trying to build a bridge between us, but still has failed to do what he should do).

[Wellington]

Do you know what "kind of surgery" BS is having? Is it serious? Is she dying? WHY on earth would he have you trying to build some sort of relationship with THEIR son?!? Unless she is dying and he is looking for a "fill in" or his brains have misfired.

 

I hate to say this, but this story just screamed "polygamist" at me. Either that or he is a VERY good liar to have his wife believe why he is out of town for months at a time with no contact other than email!

 

Im sorry, but I would have to say RUN, don't walk. Like I have said before, I wish hearts knew logic. Good luck.

[SoleMate]

alexandria pretty well laid it all out for you in her excellent and thorough analysis (completely void of judgmental cr*p too, great job!).

 

OP, I notice you provide lots of narrative, but only one tiny explicit question - "any sense?" To that I answer, it depends what you want. If you want a liar who's cheating on his wife, and strings you along while he lies to and has sex with numerous women globally, go for it. If you want an honest 1:1 relationship on your continent, then No, this makes no sense.

[Goodbye]

I'm scared this guy is a bit of a grifter. He left his job, overspends his money, must be funding the affair with marital assets...and this is NOT a cheap affair. And then he stays for long visits with you and you get stuck paying for stuff? I'm worried about you. Have you thought about what you would do if he actually DID leave his wife? Where would you guys live (visas not easy)? I think you should cut your losses before something really bad happens.

[Praying4Peace]

First of all, I do not doubt your emotional connection or his very strong feelings for you. He must feel like he can't live without you.

 

That said, he's NOT leaving. He sounds like he could be my exAP's twin brother when you describe his relationship with his wife. There is more drama and complexity there than you can imagine. With you, its simpler (right now) and feels good.

 

If he feels responsible for her, almost like a brother, must take care of her, still is friends with her though that deep connection isn't there right now HE WILL NOT leave her to suffer the consequences of his actions. He will take the pain of losing you before he leaves a woman who needs him and didn't do anything wrong to him (they both had A's it seems and that didn't cause a breakup).

 

He gave her some excuse as to why he was gone for a month that sounded legitimate. Her text shows you what their relationship is like.

 

He's going to end up in severe emotional pain and so are you. But it won't change things. The definition of 'cake eating' is to have two separate sets of needs with two different women. That's whats going on here. He needs to be there for her and his son. She is still his friend, but also the mother of his child and his wife. Those three things trump love in this situation. Even if he does it and comes to you, he will go back. The only way you guys could be together is if he leaves with you out of the picture and then comes to you after a suitable amount of time and you two start over. He doesn't seem like he can do something that risky.

 

As time goes by, your justifiable demands are going to just paint you into the bad guy who doesn't care about his W (yeah I know its dumb) and push him to break up with you anyways. It's no win. Just tell him you don't want to have an affair with him. That if he's single you can take it from there.

 

I'm so sorry, I feel your pain. I'm not being judgmental. Its just that men like him will not leave just to make themselves happy. He needs to be the 'good guy', remember? That sense of being the good guy is part of his happiness and it can't be with you at the expense of his wife and son.

[Minnie09]

That makes no sense that he would let you talk to his son!! What's your relationship with his family, and how do they know about you? Why are you connected to them on fb? Are you connected with his wife also? I don't get it. Other than that, he's definitely a lying scumbag, spending money he doesn't have, quitting his job, irresponsible as hell. Jeez.

[Mount]

Totally agree with Goodbye. I hope the OP does not intend to have a deadbeat in her life, that would drag her down.

 

I'm scared this guy is a bit of a grifter. He left his job, overspends his money, must be funding the affair with marital assets...and this is NOT a cheap affair. And then he stays for long visits with you and you get stuck paying for stuff? I'm worried about you. Have you thought about what you would do if he actually DID leave his wife? Where would you guys live (visas not easy)? I think you should cut your losses before something really bad happens.

[MissBee]

People do lots of outlandish things, other than for love. Love and sex aren't the only motivators.

 

When did he tell you he loved you? In the story it seemed like you spent a week together then he went back to his country then said he loved you shortly after. Is that the timeline?

 

I don't think every person is consciously lying about love...but having dated a few men briefly who were too quick to say it, I realize that what prompts people to feel strongly about you, especially before they even know you that well, is hardly ever "real love" even though they are saying they love you. Some get caught up in the fantasy of how things could be, or the current highs, or are looking for an escape from their own life, so latch on to another and start declaring love and really convince themselves in to it. Their own feelings and need to escape or be inlove even with the idea of a person can prompt them to visit, call, spend money etc. Loving someone for real, takes really knowing them, loving the idea of someone and loving to feel inlove aren't the same and I think majority of relationships confuse the two.

 

In any case: you've noted he has failed to do what he should do despite FB wall postings and other shenanigans. I have told other OW that for me, the point isn't to worry about if what they say they feel is true/real or not. They probably really do feel strongly...but why? And also, to what end? Anyone can feel any kind of way they want, but if it doesn't amount to real world actions or him doing what he needs to...then how do his feelings help you? Feeling like you love someone isn't what real relationships are about it. They are about feelings, actions, compatibility, complement, growing together and someone making sense in your everyday, real life. If you only have one component, the feelings, you have no leg to stand on...and even non-affair relationships don't work if they don't have several different pieces working together, versus just one piece - the feelings. So don't get caught up in his feelings if he still chooses to stay married.

 

Also: I have seen a billion A stories here and nothing about your story seems any different than the usual. Sorry. Just being honest. I have seen stories which I felt were a bit different, maybe 5 times, but yours isn't one of them.

Edited May 26, 2013 by MissBee

[sophie_bextor]

Thank you all for commenting and trying to help me.

 

I understand that, not knowing fully this person or the situation, two things can happen: misjudgement or the opposite, which is actually being able to see things in a more clear way that I do.

 

Some things that were said don't make sense at all (which is not your fault), others make sense and got me thinking (not that I haven't thought about everything before). Your views altogether will allow me to get a broader perspective of the whole thing.

 

Some of you questioned why I have some of his family members on facebook - we are distant cousins (and I mean very distant - my grandmother was cousin of his great grandfather - not sure if this how you spell it), so we keep in touch. I'm not friends with his wife on facebook though, I would never. Besides, she doesn't have a facebook account (thank Heaven for that, I wouldn't wanna torture myself more than I already do...).

 

This is not easy, never easy, and I presume you all know what I'm talking about. But I'm not in denial. Things may get worse before they get better...but someday, somehow, I'll get myself out of this...everyone has always told me I have such a rare intelligence. They still do. Lol. Gotta laugh.

 

[MissBee]

Thank you all for commenting and trying to help me.

 

I understand that, not knowing fully this person or the situation, two things can happen: misjudgement or the opposite, which is actually being able to see things in a more clear way that I do.

 

Some things that were said don't make sense at all (which is not your fault), others make sense and got me thinking (not that I haven't thought about everything before). Your views altogether will allow me to get a broader perspective of the whole thing.

 

Some of you questioned why I have some of his family members on facebook - we are distant cousins (and I mean very distant - my grandmother was cousin of his great grandfather - not sure if this how you spell it), so we keep in touch. I'm not friends with his wife on facebook though, I would never. Besides, she doesn't have a facebook account (thank Heaven for that, I wouldn't wanna torture myself more than I already do...).

This is not easy, never easy, and I presume you all know what I'm talking about. But I'm not in denial. Things may get worse before they get better...but someday, somehow, I'll get myself out of this...everyone has always told me I have such a rare intelligence. They still do. Lol. Gotta laugh.

 

 

I'll tell you...intelligence hardly helps anyone in matters of emotions/love/romance.

 

But I believe that you will indeed get out of it someway, some day.

[GettingOver]

Firs of all, hugs!

Second, I can relate cause I have been there... Had a MM from another country. Started EXACTLY same way. Just did not expect him to be back. He kept on coming and coming... also kids, also no calls to or from wife when we were together. Not months though. Not 10 hours flight, just 2, but anyways.

It's been quite a long time and still no action at all... I cornered my MM in one year, like seriously cornered him. Millions of exuces appearedright away. In your case it is an ill wife, in my - daughter.

What I am thinking at the end of the day: your guy doesn't seem completely honest... Like mine. I am not saying he has no feelings,he does. Otherwise he wouldn't travel 10 hours and spend that much. But I would say that he - if he had serious plans - should have rather save this money for divorce OR getting you there or himself to your place permanently. This is not so easy and not so cheap. I would say - think of all oportunities for you to be together asap and share with him. See the reaction. If he truly wants you - he will start working on things. If not... you will hear tons of excuses.

You also mentioned that the guy had similar experience in th epast. A huge red flag. Cause he's still there, with his wife. No matter how unhappy he is. It doesn't change anything for YOU. But I still wish you all the best!!!!! I know how it hurts!

[MissBee]

Firs of all, hugs!

Second, I can relate cause I have been there... Had a MM from another country. Started EXACTLY same way. Just did not expect him to be back. He kept on coming and coming... also kids, also no calls to or from wife when we were together. Not months though. Not 10 hours flight, just 2, but anyways.

 

Maybe there is something with MM in other countries, i.e. because they have the ULTIMATE tool of compartmentalizing, oceans/continents etc, they feel safer to throw caution to the wind and just turn up their declarations of love and they are relentless because they feel they can genuinely have two very separate lives/relationships and the whole idea of "no one will ever know" seems even more prominent and they just lose their minds

[sophie_bextor]

Exactly for that reason. He opened himself to me and didn't try to seem perfect. I would have never found out. Yet he chose to tell me those things, the affairs. They may make me feel insecure (and they do), but I feel it is unfair to hold that against him (and sometimes I do). And he never tried to throw his wife under the bus. I know these things don't make him a automatically a trustable or deeply honest guy, but I think it does mean something.

Edited May 26, 2013 by sophie_bextor

[MissBee]

Exactly for that reason. He opened himself to me and didn't try to seem perfect. I would have never found out. Yet he chose to tell me those things, the affairs. They may make me feel insecure (and they do), but I feel it is unfair to hold that against him (and sometimes I do). And he never tried to throw his wife under the bus. I know these things don't make him a automatically a trustable or deeply honest guy, but I think it does mean something.

 

It does mean something...but what? That's the question?

 

A thief being honest about all their thieving, rapists confessing all their rapes, serial cheater admitting all their affairs, what does that mean? It can mean a lot of things. Some people just like to be frank, some think that "honesty" gives them a free pass, some KNOW that some women will assume he "confessed" because he loves her deeply and shared this with her and no one else, and they know such a woman will overlook the actual bad thing and just focus on the idea of being special or him "trying to change" or it "meaning something." I wouldn't put much stock into it. It means something, but I think you're assuming it means the latter. You don't know what he's told his past OW.

 

It would be nice if you could track one of them down and hear her take. It may be eye opening.

[findingnemo]

This A is like most other As, IMO. Just because its LD doesn't really change things. All the distance does is prolong the mystery and therefore intensify the fun.

 

Will he leave his W? Maybe. Maybe not. No one can tell you for sure and there is no way to know until he does. For him, it may be an exit A. Since him and his BW hardly communicate when he is away, perhaps they are not in a good place in their M. The email she sent could indicate she still loves him. Did you read all her emails? There could have been more. If not, it may be something she sent on auto-pilot. M people may not be "in love" all the time but they sure love and miss each other. The email in itself can't be used to gauge the state of their M.

 

On your part, how about you figure out whether you really want him or not. Suppose he was not M, would he be the right person for you? Just because someone obviously loves you doesn't mean he is good for you. Is this man the kind of man you want to settle down with? There are some things that trouble me about his spending habits (credit card financed traveling with no job), his suspect ability to keep the BW in love and missing him while he is...where? for a month?

 

(One more thing...this may not be politically correct of me but hey...beware of foreign men seeking greener pastures. Maybe he just wants to move to the country you live in.)

[MissBee]

Did you know that many men who visit prostitutes will also confess their deepest darkest secrets to the prostitutes whom they are paying for sex?

 

Don't take that the wrong way. I'm not saying or implying that you're like a prostitute. It's just that many women make the mistake of believing that a man opening up to them must mean that their relationship is really valuable and meaningful. That is often not the case. Some men like to find someone they can confess their sins and secrets to because it's cathartic. It's a load off their chest and it makes them feel a little lighter. When someone is arrested for a crime the police will often plant an informant in the jail cell to befriend the suspect and gain his confidence. Because people just have a need to confess, to someone, to anyone. One of the twelve steps in AA encourages the alcoholic to find another person whom they trust (not an romantic flame) and confess everything they have ever done wrong or kept secret.

 

Men dont' run off to marry their prostitutes (usually) and the prostitutes are usually wise enough to know that hearing their clients air their dirty secrets is just part of the job. The fact that your MM has told you some of his dirty past may not mean anything other then he just had some stuff he wanted to unload. Often times the person the MM opens up to is not the one he loves and respects but rather the one he expects to have the least expectations of him. The one who doesn't set the bar very high and will accept less then average from people.

 

Great minds

 

I definitely posted before I saw your post...but yes and yes!

 

It also seems, from most of the OW's stories here, that many of these MM seek romance, coddling and therapy from their OW. My A wasn't this way personally, but it totally surprised me that almost every A story here, has an OW with a MM who "can't talk to anyone else" and whose life is so horrible or whose BS is so bad...and the OW is there as his lady knight in lace armor...I'm like wow...how...interesting.

 

I'm sorry but half the time I imagine some sob of a man, sitting on OW's couch with his head in her lap crying into the hem of her skirt, confessing his sins or complaining about his BS, as she pats him on his head and gives him the strength to live his life. It's just so unattractive to me. But I digress.

 

It's kinda like when you're on vacation, since you know it's not your home and no one knows you, you feel less inhibited and what happens in Vegas/Hawaii/Bali stays there. I think for some MM, especially in a cross-continental A, they also feel like they can confess any and everything as it it cathartic and is the "vacation" and will "stay there" and not impact their day to day life.

Edited May 26, 2013 by MissBee

[findingnemo]

I'm sorry but half the time I imagine some sob of a man, sitting on OW's couch with his head in her lap crying into the hem of her skirt, confessing his sins or complaining about his BS, as she pats him on his head and gives him the strength to live his life. It's just so unattractive to me. But I digress.

 

Oh MissBee, this surely can't be the case. Why in heavens name would anyone be attracted to a man like that?

[MissBee]

Oh MissBee, this surely can't be the case. Why in heavens name would anyone be attracted to a man like that?

 

Nemo...it baffles me as well.

 

But some stories I hear, while what I said was a bit hyperbolic, they sound just like that. Some man whose life is just horrible and he's so downtrodden and so on and so forth and the OW goes on and on about the horrible BS and I'm like well you guys have obviously spent a great deal of time talking about her and I'm just turned off...

 

But we each have our things. Some women do like that as it makes them feel helpful and special. I have one friend who only dates men whom she can fix and help with their sob stories. If you ask her, she will of course say it's not true but EVERY man she's dated, they seem to bond over the disaster which is his life.

 

Unavailable dudes were "my thing", so I'm not perfect either. They were unavailable in some way but per my own personality I just never could quite get excited by a man whose life sounded horrible and who complained a lot.

[SunsetRed]

During part of my relationship w my MM, he deployed to Iraq. I joked that the only way I could have a boyfriend was if he was legally married and lived 8000 miles away.

 

Well, there's a lot of truth in jest and in reality when one chooses to date a married man who lives on a differenct continent, it really says a lot about that person's intimacy issues.....just saying

[MissBee]

During part of my relationship w my MM, he deployed to Iraq. I joked that the only way I could have a boyfriend was if he was legally married and lived 8000 miles away.

 

Well, there's a lot of truth in jest and in reality when one chooses to date a married man who lives on a differenct continent, it really says a lot about that person's intimacy issues.....just saying

 

Yepp.

 

Lived it.