Mixed signals from a married man

[Wowifoundausername]

Please. I am not here for a lecture on infidelity. I would just like a lot of advice from as many people that care to share their opinion who have been or are in the same situation.

 

I am not sure is this is the right section to post this, but I am going to give it a try.

 

I am married. I have a male friend whom is married. We have been friends for many years, as mostly working acquaintances. However, we don't work in the same building.

 

We know each other through our kids and through work, etc.

 

Over the years we have communicated mostly by email and phone for work related issues.

 

As time went on, sometimes our conversations touched on personal topics.

 

Both of us love to laugh and crack a joke.

 

Sometimes we email funny emails with sexual undertones.

 

He claims he is shy. I am more the other way.

 

Lately, I have found myself thinking about him a lot and wanting to talk to him more and more.

Almost like an addiction, I find myself fighting the urge to email him or text.

 

it is mostly me, who seems to be doing the initiating for most of the conversations. But, he does usually always respond.

 

Because of our work, I mentioned to him the other day about taking our bantering to a different email, as to not be a target for unwanted eyes or gossip.

 

He didn't respond to that. I felt bad, like I was coming on too strong. So the next day I wrote him an email to explain that the reason I suggested a different means of communication was to keep our work environment strictly professional and also, so that coworkers would not gossip about our bantering, if they ever were to notice.

 

He wrote back explaining that he did have another email that his wife also had access too, and that he has no secrets with her. Also, that his work email, both himself and assistant have access too.

He said that contacting him at either email is fine and that he did not feel there was anything to worry about as there was nothing dangerous that the two of us had exchanged.

 

A tad alarming for me, as the assistant could easily blab.

 

I was hoping for a private means of conversation.

 

At this point, even though I really like this guy....I have no intentions of having an affair. I just enjoy his friendship and bantering and would appreciate doing so on a more personal, private location other then work.

 

What I am confused about it the mixed signals.

 

Is he trying to act coy to try and pretend he is a faithful saint OR is he trying to say in a nice way to take a hike??

 

If he was not interested at all, then why the constant reply to my messages and responses in a fun loving playful nature?

 

This man has me totally confused, and I would like to know how to communicate with him without causing a s*** storm at work.

 

If it is true what he says about being very shy, how do I ever know if he is interested in a friendship or not interested and just being nice??

 

My experience with men in the past, has been, when they are interested, they go in for the kill.

 

How do I find out what this guy's intent is?

 

Obviously, we are all being cautious because we are both married.

Which makes things even that much more complicated.

[subversive]

He wrote back explaining that he did have another email that his wife also had access too, and that he has no secrets with her. Also, that his work email, both himself and assistant have access too.

He said that contacting him at either email is fine and that he did not feel there was anything to worry about as there was nothing dangerous that the two of us had exchanged.

 

 

 

I was hoping for a private means of conversation.

 

....I have no intentions of having an affair.

 

1. Not a lecture, but a truth. You have every intention of having an affair. If you need a secret email to talk to this man, then you are already up to no good.

 

2. GOOD FOR HIM for telling you those were the only emails to use. Take the hint. This guy may enjoy flirting, but he does not want to jeopardize his marriage.

[Wowifoundausername]

Neither one of us is looking to jeopardize our marriages. Both of us are very well respected classy business professionals with a family.

Clearly, all that attracts me here is this mans friendship. I adore it. Wish I could have more of it. Is that so wrong?

Can't people be happily married and still enjoy friendship from the opposite sex without feeling guilty?

 

To be honest, I feel like an idiot right now for asking him to email in secret.

 

I don't know what to say or do now.

[Dragonfruit]

I realize you want assistance and support in your attempts to break up someone else's home behind their back. You want it. It's what you want. Right. But, what if we all stopped allowing people to believe that this was any more their personal right than stealing a car or beating someone up etc. since that is the truth? Then maybe they would learn that they are not really entitled to everything they want. Yuck. Really.

 

Go to marriage counseling. Talk to YOUR spouse honestly, not someone else's spouse dishonestly. Be honorable. Fix the mess you've helped create before trying to spread it to create a mess for an innocent person when you have no business in the world doing so. Try getting what you want without walking on someone else's back and paving your own way with untrue rationalizations. Sorry this isn't what you wanted to hear but it is the truth. Good luck to you.

Edited May 30, 2013 by Dragonfruit

[Wowifoundausername]

Yeah... Sorry. So far these answers don't help.

I'm not looking for validation to destroy someone's life.

I think some of you missed my point.

[CarrieT]

Clearly, all that attracts me here is this mans friendship. I adore it. Wish I could have more of it. Is that so wrong?

Here is the basic question: Could you share your emails with your husband? Could this guy share your emails with his wife?

 

If you can't than you are in an Emotional Affair.

 

The bottom line in all of this is why do you need a separate email account? If you can't be open and honest with what you guys are talking about, then it is wrong.

 

I have a LOT of heterosexual male friends and my fiance knows every single one of them. If he were to read any email or text from any guy I am communicating with, it would not jeopardize our relationship one bit. Can you say that about your correspondence with this guy? THAT is the benchmark of what is write and wrong -- how much you can share with your actual partner.

[kamani]

You are already in an emotional affair with him.

 

Many of us don't know we are there till we get trapped. If you don't break it now, it will be more difficult and painful later.Google 'emotional affair' and see the charasteristics. You will understand this seemingly 'innocent' friendship is really dangerous.

[aMguilts]

Neither one of us is looking to jeopardize our marriages. Both of us are very well respected classy business professionals with a family.

Clearly, all that attracts me here is this mans friendship. I adore it. Wish I could have more of it. Is that so wrong?

Can't people be happily married and still enjoy friendship from the opposite sex without feeling guilty?

 

To be honest, I feel like an idiot right now for asking him to email in secret.

 

I don't know what to say or do now.

 

errrr yeah... YOU are!

who you trying to kid ? us? or yourself?

 

he`s given you another email where you can respond to without the `office banter`

but his wife has access to it and now you are asking advice on here?

but your not looking for anything else than a platonic relationship with this guy??

oh please

stop kidding yourself

 

aM

[Gpc2013]

If he doesn't mind his wife reading your emails, but YOU mind her reading them, then you have your answer. He's not sending "mixed signals" at all. He obviously enjoys your back-and-forth banter, but doesn't view it the same way you do. You think it's something that could raise eyebrows at work and make the wife jealous. He doesn't think it's that big of a deal.

 

I've been in your shoes with an online male friend from years ago. He was married, and several states away. We never met IRL, but we IMed constantly, emailed, spoke on the phone a couple times, and even sent each other gifts. It went on for about a year. It was completely platonic with very few innocent flirtatious comments made in jest. One day I stopped kidding myself and owned up to the fact that I was in an emotional affair with him. I was "addicted" to his attention. I broke down and confessed that I thought I was falling in love with him, and he wisely stopped all contact with me.

 

My current male friend (subject of another thread), is close friends with a married woman. I think their relationship is bordering on "emotional affair" territory too. He's been separated from his wife for a year and is approaching a divorce. But her husband is quite aware of their friendship and as far as I know there are no secrets. At least I hope not.

 

Yes, you can be friends with this man, but if you feel it's necessary to conduct your friendship in private away from your respective spouses, that's a HUGE red flag. And it sounds like HE doesn't think that's necessary. That tells you clearly that you're misinterpreting his attention.

[imtooconfused]

If he doesn't mind his wife reading your emails, but YOU mind her reading them, then you have your answer. He's not sending "mixed signals" at all. He obviously enjoys your back-and-forth banter, but doesn't view it the same way you do. You think it's something that could raise eyebrows at work and make the wife jealous. He doesn't think it's that big of a deal.

 

Most of the posts miss the important point except Gpc2013 because they frankly focus on judging the OP. Wowifoundausername, while you most definitely are interested in an emotional affair with this person (and I am the last to judge), he doesn't feel your relationship is on that track since he is free to share with the PA and spouse. You are misreading his cues and unfortunately are barking up the wrong tree. For the sake of your friendship, and possibly your position at the company, you should lower your emotional connection.

[Adele0908]

Have you talked to your husband about an open marriage?

 

He may have some other women he is interested in, too.

 

Seriously, I'm not married but I can imagine that married people eventually want to experience other people.

 

There is this blog, jujumama.com that discusses the pros and cons of an open marriage.

[Adele0908]

Don't feel guilty for your desires. Perhaps a swinging lifestyle would benefit you?

[Robert]

Thread reopened as requested

[Wowifoundausername]

Thanks Robert.

 

I was away for a few days, but I had intentions on returning.

 

Since my first post, I've spoke to him via email to clarify my intentions.

I explained that I thought it would be ok " in my opinion" to go private because, clearly we both enjoy the fun banter. It would just be us being proactive.

This isn't an invitation to hook up and shag or something. I just have a problem with other people reading my email, period. To me that is an invasion of privacy.

I finished by explaining I valued our friendship and the fun banter.

He responded and said that he also values our friendship and the fun banter but he didn't realize we were flirting, and made a joke about it. Said " I don't think I want to set up a private account. That would seem wrong to me". He apologized for causing me any emotional stress.

I wrote a bit more back to put his mind at ease. Three days later he wrote back saying " sorry. I just don't feel comfortable setting up another account".

He now seems very uneasy. I sent him a one liner joke yesterday and got no response.

 

How do I patch this up so that the uneasiness goes away and our friendship can go back to normal?

 

I can't help but worry he misunderstood my intentions. Even though I've tried hard to clarify that.

 

Over the weekend, I took the time to reflect on this and what is going on with myself. I came to the conclusion that, I believe it's a mentor that I'm needing and he was someone whom I'd like to be that person.

He is older. Raised two very successful kids. Has a great wife and ideal marriage.

 

Myself and husband have a happy marriage and excellent life together. But are in a blended family situation and have had endless kid and ex issues.

 

I've looked up to him and his wife for how they raised their kids.

 

Most of our personal banter has been about kids and kid issues.

 

I guess the fun loving side in me came out later on and we started joking around. I found all this refreshing.

 

So I made a dumb move and blew it by suggesting things.

Silly silly me!

[GorillaTheater]

I can't speak to your intent, but major, major kudos to this guy for upholding his boundaries.

[Wowifoundausername]

Yes. He is a great man. There is no doubt about that!

 

Why do you think I'm feeling so bad right now??? Lol

[imtooconfused]

I can't speak to your intent, but major, major kudos to this guy for upholding his boundaries.

 

While I applaud the OM for upholding his boundaries of his marriage, what this thread really shows is that two people have to clearly articulate what their boundaries and agree to mutually respect those boundaries, regardless of what they are. This is true in any relationship. Wowifoundausername you were right to clarify your feelings and seek understanding of his feelings.

 

I am sorry that this misunderstanding has caused a lot of awkwardness with your friend. I don't want to be too pessimistic, but it sounds like he is not comfortable with anything but "professional" communication with you at this time. The more you try to "patch up your differences" may scare him even more.

[pteromom]

He responded and said that he also values our friendship and the fun banter but he didn't realize we were flirting, and made a joke about it. Said " I don't think I want to set up a private account. That would seem wrong to me". He apologized for causing me any emotional stress.

I wrote a bit more back to put his mind at ease. Three days later he wrote back saying " sorry. I just don't feel comfortable setting up another account".

He now seems very uneasy. I sent him a one liner joke yesterday and got no response.

 

Sounds to me like your comment about flirting and the suggestion to make a hidden account to communicate with you through made him REALLY uncomfortable and that he has backed off - with good reason!

 

No matter what your intentions were, it DID come across like you were trying to hook up with him or build a relationship with him, and he has a responsibility to his family to avoid even the appearance of infidelity.

 

I do not think it is wise of you to try to rebuild a friendship with him. I think you should keep it professional and forget about close friendship or having him as a mentor.

[TaraMaiden]

It's very very simple:

 

Whatever it is you think you want, or are insisting you want, or are trying to clarify you want, or are trying to explain you want, or are fooling yourself into believing you want, or are kidding us, and yourself you want -

 

HE DOESN'T.

 

Take the hint, accept his retreat, respect his boundaries and leave him alone.

[Gpc2013]

 

How do I patch this up so that the uneasiness goes away and our friendship can go back to normal?

 

I can't help but worry he misunderstood my intentions. Even though I've tried hard to clarify that.

 

First, he wasn't the one who misunderstood. You were. You thought the two of you were engaging in something that should be secret. You thought he was flirting with you, and you were keen to encourage that privately.

 

Second, there is no going back to a normal friendship with him. His friendly behavior was taken as flirtation and prompted you to suggest a private outlet for continuing. He sounds like a very decent guy, and he will not want to lead you on. You obviously got the wrong idea about his intentions, so he'll probably steer clear of you on any personal level.

 

Third, how would you feel if you discovered your husband had a female co-worker for whom he'd set up a separate email account just so they could communicate without you prying? Would that be okay with you?

 

Finally, the thread title says it all. If all you wanted was a "mentor" you wouldn't be asking about "mixed signals" here. This guy was friendly and polite to you. That's it. I work with and am friends with men who are very attentive, polite, and friendly. I would never even dream of suggesting to them what you suggested to this man, nor would I think they were sending "mixed signals" if they declined.

 

The signal is pretty clear and always was. You just misread it, probably because you wanted his attention to mean more.

 

Leave him alone.

[TaraMaiden]

Neither one of us is looking to jeopardize our marriages.

First of all you request 'No Lectures' and your thread title suggests you know you're straddling boundaries, inadvisably....

You may not precisely be 'looking to jeopardise your marriage' - but that's exactly what this is asking.

How to enter into a cooperative liaison with a married man, in secret.

 

 

Clearly, all that attracts me here is this mans friendship. I adore it. Wish I could have more of it. Is that so wrong?

I'm sorry, but it's utterly clear that this isn't all that attracts you.

There is absolutely no call or need for secrecy in innocent friendship.

And the moment you realised that he was backing off, feeling uncomfortable, and ceased to communicate, then yes - it became 'wrong'.

 

Can't people be happily married and still enjoy friendship from the opposite sex without feeling guilty?

Yes of course - providing both people are comfortable with that, and there is complete openness with the respective spouses.

 

To be honest, I feel like an idiot right now for asking him to email in secret.

Yes, that was extremely foolish. You've put him in an untenable position within his marriage, and it's obviously something he is completely uncomfortable with. What you were basically doing, was asking him to compromise his honesty and communication, with his wife.

He is extremely secure in his relationship.

It may be that he perceives your approaches to be an indication that you do not feel the same way in yours, and he's resisting getting involved with that.

 

I don't know what to say or do now.

Do nothing.

Say nothing.

Make no further approaches and let things ride.

You made a big mistake.

Accept it, and back off, and leave him be.

[KathyM]

You are obviously missing something in your marriage that you are trying to fill with this guy. The playful banter, the sexual innuendo, etc. This is a need that should be filled by your husband. You should instigate and encourage that kind of banter with your husband. When you feel like sending a playful or joking Email or text, send it to your husband, not this other guy. You'll be surprised how that will improve your marriage if you invest those desires/feelings into your husband instead of outside your marriage. Please show respect for this guy's marriage, and stop trying to make a play for his attention. This kind of attention is something you should be getting from your husband, not some other man.

[Wowifoundausername]

My b hind is beyond tender from all the lashings I'm getting.

 

Yes. It was wrong. I get it.

 

Thank you

[imtooconfused]

You are obviously missing something in your marriage that you are trying to fill with this guy.

 

I was going to post largely the same thing. There is a reason this man was attractive to you. Wowifoundausername, you should search inside yourself for what this trigger is. The fulfillment of this kind of thrill is why there are those who turn to alcohol, soft drugs, hard drugs, pornography and sadly affairs... meeting a need that is not being met elsewhere. Identifying what that need is can help you understand yourself and what is missing.

 

The playful banter, the sexual innuendo, etc. This is a need that should be filled by your husband. You should instigate and encourage that kind of banter with your husband. When you feel like sending a playful or joking Email or text, send it to your husband, not this other guy. You'll be surprised how that will improve your marriage if you invest those desires/feelings into your husband instead of outside your marriage. Please show respect for this guy's marriage, and stop trying to make a play for his attention. This kind of attention is something you should be getting from your husband, not some other man.

 

Unfortunately KathyM, this is an overly optimistic view of a spouse. A spouse does need to know about an unfulfilled need, but the spouse must also be willing to meet those needs. There is no certainty that a spouse would do that at all. My spouse gets bitter and defensive if I feel the need to step outside of her comfort zone. And I'm not talking about anything outrageous, just things like snuggling and kissing in the sunset on a beach. I sympathize with Wowifoundausername.

[KathyM]

I was going to post largely the same thing. There is a reason this man was attractive to you. Wowifoundausername, you should search inside yourself for what this trigger is. The fulfillment of this kind of thrill is why there are those who turn to alcohol, soft drugs, hard drugs, pornography and sadly affairs... meeting a need that is not being met elsewhere. Identifying what that need is can help you understand yourself and what is missing.

 

 

 

Unfortunately KathyM, this is an overly optimistic view of a spouse. A spouse does need to know about an unfulfilled need, but the spouse must also be willing to meet those needs. There is no certainty that a spouse would do that at all. My spouse gets bitter and defensive if I feel the need to step outside of her comfort zone. And I'm not talking about anything outrageous, just things like snuggling and kissing in the sunset on a beach. I sympathize with Wowifoundausername.

Yes, the spouse needs to be willing to meet those needs, but likely the OP has lost interest in or not cultivated that kind of attention from her husband (the playful banter, joking around, and sexual innuendo). Oftentimes in a marriage, those behaviors wane, and that makes a person susceptible to an affair when that need for that kind of interaction is being filled by someone other than your spouse. She needs to revive that kind of playfulness with her husband. If she makes a consistent effort with that, he will likely come around and provide that to her. If he is totally unwilling to engage in that, then there is a problem that needs to be resolved through marriage counseling, so that the husband is made aware of how important it is that he fulfill that need. Filling that need outside of her marriage is not an option if she wants to stay married.