Acceptance: The Quest for Peace

[Clemenza]

Some of you may know, I'm the OM. After D-day in December, it looked like my MW and her H were headed for divorce. She and I went back and forth. I wanted to give her space, which she took offense to, but I also wanted to eventually be with her. Then I had some serious doubts about whether or not that was a good idea. That hurt her. When I went all in because my feelings were too strong, it appeared to be too late. She and her H had already started marriage counseling (she and I had sex after they started counseling, too. 3 weeks ago. Oops). She told me she's doing that with her daughter in mind. I know her well, and I believe her. Cliche line or not, that's what's going on.

 

So I'm just trying to move forward like it's over. Over the past few days, I've had moments of peace while trying to gain some perspective. I wrote down the reasons why I think I'm slowly coming to peace with the situation. These apply to me, but I think might be general enough that some of you can relate.

 

 

- I understand that my ego is causing my pain. I'm looking at this as her potentially choosing someone over me. It's more nuanced than that.

 

- There's something in me that thinks I'll never find love, and that I'll be lonely forever. This is based on my past. I'm recognizing that this is coming from within, and not necessarily this particular situation. I'm currently in counseling to explore this.

 

- I've never been married and I don't have kids. I don't understand those dynamics, and can't fully understand her situation. She's obviously conflicted. I really don't know what I would do in that situation.

 

- I love and care about her so much that I just want her to be happy. If she makes a choice that leads to her happiness, I support it. I'd rather her be happy without me than her getting with me and being conflicted and unhappy.

 

- There's a good chance our reality as a couple wouldn't have matched our fantasy. Maybe it was best to end on a high note, with passion still there?

 

- It wasn't even my place to be with her, in any romantic capacity, from the start. I could have never experienced anything, but I got to have some really great moments with her. Yes, I do realize those moments were rooted in poor choices. I'm still grateful to have experienced that type of connection.

 

- Sometimes love is not enough. Timing and circumstances play huge roles. That's just life. There was love there, but the obstacles may have been too much to overcome. They may have still been present, even if we were to get together.

 

 

I know I may come across as a doormat, but I'm not. I'm just not a spiteful person, and I have no reason to be mad at her. She has never said anything malicious to me, and I really do think I know what was in her heart. She's just in a confusing place, just like me. I'm an adult, and I chose to enter into this situation, so I need to take ownership of that. How I feel is because of me, not because of her. It may sound pathetic, but she'll always have a special place somewhere in my heart. I'll never forget her. It was just simply not in the cards for us, and I trust that I can move on with no regrets or anger. Just valuable experiences.

Edited May 31, 2013 by Clemenza

[zevahc]

Some of you may know, I'm the OM. After D-day in December, it looked like my MW and her H were headed for divorce. She and I went back and forth. I wanted to give her space, which she took offense to, but I also wanted to eventually be with her. Then I had some serious doubts about whether or not that was a good idea. That hurt her. When I went all in because my feelings were too strong, it appeared to be too late. She and her H had already started marriage counseling (she and I had sex after they started counseling, too. 3 weeks ago. Oops). She told me she's doing that with her daughter in mind. I know her well, and I believe her. Cliche line or not, that's what's going on.

 

So I'm just trying to move forward like it's over. Over the past few days, I've had moments of peace while trying to gain some perspective. I wrote down the reasons why I think I'm slowly coming to peace with the situation. These apply to me, but I think might be general enough that some of you can relate.

 

 

- I understand that my ego is causing my pain. I'm looking at this as her potentially choosing someone over me. It's more nuanced than that.

 

- There's something in me that thinks I'll never find love, and that I'll be lonely forever. This is based on my past. I'm recognizing that this is coming from within, and not necessarily this particular situation. I'm currently in counseling to explore this.

 

- I've never been married and I don't have kids. I don't understand those dynamics, and can't fully understand her situation. She's obviously conflicted. I really don't know what I would do in that situation.

 

- I love and care about her so much that I just want her to be happy. If she makes a choice that leads to her happiness, I support it. I'd rather her be happy without me than her getting with me and being conflicted and unhappy.

 

- There's a good chance our reality as a couple wouldn't have matched our fantasy. Maybe it was best to end on a high note, with passion still there?

 

- It wasn't even my place to be with her, in any romantic capacity, from the start. I could have never experienced anything, but I got to have some really great moments with her. Yes, I do realize those moments were rooted in poor choices. I'm still grateful to have experienced that type of connection.

 

- Sometimes love is not enough. Timing and circumstances play huge roles. That's just life. There was love there, but the obstacles may have been too much to overcome. They may have still been present, even if we were to get together.

 

 

I know I may come across as a doormat, but I'm not. I'm just not a spiteful person, and I have no reason to be mad at her. She has never said anything malicious to me, and I really do think I know what was in her heart. She's just in a confusing place, just like me. I'm an adult, and I chose to enter into this situation, so I need to take ownership of that. How I feel is because of me, not because of her. It may sound pathetic, but she'll always have a special place somewhere in my heart. I'll never forget her. It was just simply not in the cards for us, and I trust that I can move on with no regrets or anger. Just valuable experiences.

 

Wow...spot on how i feel...and honestly the same perspective I've tried to adopt...easier said than done.

[Clemenza]

A lot easier said than done, trust me. I have to keep reminding myself of this stuff. I also have to ramp up to it throughout the day. When I wake up, I still feel anxious and rejected. It's difficult when you love someone, and I can tell you do love your MW. But I think a big part of loving someone is being happy when they're happy. Even if that means they aren't with you. How much satisfaction would you have if she was with you, but not all in? Your ego might be satisfied, but that's fleeting. So, again, I'd rather she have happiness without me than uncertainty and unhappiness with me. What if she's unhappy without me, but stays in the situation? It sucks, but that's her choice and I have to respect it.

 

I just remind myself that her decision has little to do with how she feels about me. I know what she and I shared, and you know what you and your MW shared. Life, especially the situations we're in, is not black and white. People often make decisions that impact you, but rarely have to do with you.

 

It seems like you're thinking pretty logically about your situation, even though you're having your illogical down moments. You should be proud that you have even a little perspective. That will balloon into something healthy.

[zevahc]

A lot easier said than done, trust me. I have to keep reminding myself of this stuff. I also have to ramp up to it throughout the day. When I wake up, I still feel anxious and rejected. It's difficult when you love someone, and I can tell you do love your MW. But I think a big part of loving someone is being happy when they're happy. Even if that means they aren't with you. How much satisfaction would you have if she was with you, but not all in? Your ego might be satisfied, but that's fleeting. So, again, I'd rather she have happiness without me than uncertainty and unhappiness with me. What if she's unhappy without me, but stays in the situation? It sucks, but that's her choice and I have to respect it.

 

I just remind myself that her decision has little to do with how she feels about me. I know what she and I shared, and you know what you and your MW shared. Life, especially the situations we're in, is not black and white. People often make decisions that impact you, but rarely have to do with you.

 

It seems like you're thinking pretty logically about your situation, even though you're having your illogical down moments. You should be proud that you have even a little perspective. That will balloon into something healthy.

 

Thanks man. You likewise seem to have a good grasp on the big picture. Like you said...it's not black and white and loving someone means doing what's right by them...no matter what.

 

We haven't had a dday...so i was trying to spare us both that...it's why i tried to end things early. And its just too painful wanting more...

 

I fear my feelings of wanting more cause so much pressure....that it's driving a wedge and driving her away. I'd rather end this before she hates me.

[ScarlettKaren]

Zevach, much of your post resonates with me. I think to try to find peace for myself, I've found that the best gift I can give him is the best chance at R with his BW possible. If I ever felt anything for him (and I did, I loved him more than I ever cared to admit) I owe him that.

 

Yes, it sucks. Yes, it hurts. Yes, it is a blow to every possible part of my ego, my self esteem. And sometimes the loss of everything overwhelms me. But it is the best thing to do.

[zevahc]

Zevach, much of your post resonates with me. I think to try to find peace for myself, I've found that the best gift I can give him is the best chance at R with his BW possible. If I ever felt anything for him (and I did, I loved him more than I ever cared to admit) I owe him that.

 

Yes, it sucks. Yes, it hurts. Yes, it is a blow to every possible part of my ego, my self esteem. And sometimes the loss of everything overwhelms me. But it is the best thing to do.

 

I'm sure a lot of people feel this way...and then there are plenty on here that say it isn't real. Anyhow...after a week of NC, like I said in an earlier post...we broke NC yesterday...i answered her call. I said in my post here (http://www.loveshack.org/forums/romantic/other-man-woman/396017-vacations-providing-cake-5.html#post4930520 that I essentially told her a lot of what I felt (from reading posts - she is unaware of LS). She didn't say too much other than admitting that she felt comfortable...and then that was it....

 

Anyhow, today, she contacted me and let me have it...on many levels she was right. She told me that we have beat this topic into the ground..and I continue to bring it up. We've already established that we're moving on (though we keep going back to LC). She said she wants more than anything for us to be friends, and that more than anything she loves me....which is why she doesn't want us to be together anymore. She wants me to find someone and be happy because she can't make me happy. She said without a doubt I'm the person she should be with...but she would never forgive herself for walking out of her marriage to another man...and right now she can't even look her spouse in the eye because she considers herself a disgrace. She doesn't want us to start on those terms and she can't make promises to me either. She is in turmoil herself. She told me I'm pushing her away....and our friendship continues to get damaged because its become consumed with this situation. So...as we've said before...it's gotta be done...and we have to close our eyes to it if we want to be friends.

 

Thing is...these same things that keep her with her husband are the same things that make me respect her so much. I know without a doubt these are the right moves and steps...but yet it hurts so much thinking life deals these cards (or we walk into them...whatever people think is not important to me at this moment). She told me that I feel like she just dropped me...but she is trying not to continue to draw me in romantically...she has chosen to act more "cold" because she knows how selfish it is...we were honest and said we really don't know if a friendship will ever happen....but the problem is....neither of us is willing to say it can't yet.....everyone on LS is a doubter, and I'm sure for good reason...i'm a doubter myself....yet I want to say that it can happen. I realize this is blatant disrespect to the BS....truly I do. There was no dday...there is no longer a PA, and I guess I want to think that a friendship can be there...

 

Statistics, history etc...proves this is almost impossible...but I guess that's where I am...I want to move on and be healthy....learn how to find a boundary not just P, but also to an EA...and find a friendship. I know that part of me will always hurt this way...but i guess right now that's where I am. Unless she moves, I move, or she or I change jobs...it's gonna be so tough to walk 100% away.

 

I apologize this post was so all over the place..., and I realize, even in reading it that being healthy means I get to a place where I no longer care about this stuff...and perhaps even the friendship. But...I think I'll always care for her and in some way hurt over this feeling. I've given her a part of me...that I'll never get back.

[Clemenza]

Hang in there, man. Just know that you really do seem to be gaining some valuable perspective, and your heart does seem to be in the right place. Whenever you feel like you have some semblance of peace and clarity, latch on to those moments and recognize why you're feeling peaceful and clear. Realize that, even though you love her, you do deserve a better situation. We all do.

 

I had a down moment at work today after seeing my xMW walk past my office. I had to go outside to get some fresh air and try to have some positive self talk. When I was sitting on a bench by our building, I noticed that she had gone to her car to get something. She saw me sitting there, and she walked up to me and sat next to me. We talked for probably a good 45 minutes. I told her about some of the positive strides I've been making. I told her some of the stuff I wrote in the OP of this thread (though, I didn't tell her specifically about LS. Hah). I said that I just want her to be happy, no matter what path she takes. We both ended up expressing that, even though we've had very limited contact, we care about each other very much. She told me that she has to stop herself from texting me when she has a funny thought that only I would appreciate. I have to stop myself from doing the same. She told me how hard it is to just treat me like she treats everyone else in the office because I mean more to her than that. I echoed those sentiments. I updated her on things going on with my family, and how my new nephew is doing. We discussed what was going through our minds during various points in our A. She re-iterated that everything she felt about me over the past year+ has been 100% authentic. I didn't ask, but she volunteered that. She's had some pretty scary health problems over the past couple of months. I asked her if there's any way I could be updated on how she's doing when she has another episode. Even if it's through our mutual friend. Maybe I shouldn't have asked that, but I don't like being in the dark about serious health issues involving someone I care about so much. We touched on a lot that I probably can't even remember right now. She thanked me for talking to her, and thanked me for how I've been toward her for the past year. She said she's never met anyone like me.

 

I don't know if it's good or bad that we talked for so long today. It just was. I'm still following through with my plan to help myself through counseling and learn to be ok with not being with her. Interacting with her didn't change that. I'm not harboring any delusions that she's tell me next week that she's getting a D and we'll live happily ever after. Trust me. And I doubt she and I could ultimately be friends. It would be too hard with so many feelings involved, and it would be unfair to the BS if they do stay together. I have to learn to be ok with that, too.

 

So yeah, zevahc, sounds like an interesting couple of days for the both of us.

Edited May 31, 2013 by Clemenza

[zevahc]

Hang in there, man. Just know that you really do seem to be gaining some valuable perspective, and your heart does seem to be in the right place. Whenever you feel like you have some semblance of peace and clarity, latch on to those moments and recognize why you're feeling peaceful and clear. Realize that, even though you love her, you do deserve a better situation. We all do.

 

I had a down moment at work today after seeing my xMW walk past my office. I had to go outside to get some fresh air and try to have some positive self talk. When I was sitting on a bench by our building, I noticed that she had gone to her car to get something. She saw me sitting there, and she walked up to me and sat next to me. We talked for probably a good 45 minutes. I told her about some of the positive strides I've been making. I told her some of the stuff I wrote in the OP of this thread (though, I didn't tell her specifically about LS. Hah). I said that I just want her to be happy, no matter what path she takes. We both ended up expressing that, even though we've had very limited contact, we care about each other very much. She told me that she has to stop herself from texting me when she has a funny thought that only I would appreciate. I have to stop myself from doing the same. She told me how hard it is to just treat me like she treats everyone else in the office because I mean more to her than that. I echoed those sentiments. I updated her on things going on with my family, and how my new nephew is doing. We discussed what was going through our minds during various points in our A. She re-iterated that everything she felt about me over the past year+ has been 100% authentic. I didn't ask, but she volunteered that. She's had some pretty scary health problems over the past couple of months. I asked her if there's any way I could be updated on how she's doing when she has another episode. Even if it's through our mutual friend. Maybe I shouldn't have asked that, but I don't like being in the dark about serious health issues involving someone I care about so much. We touched on a lot that I probably can't even remember right now. She thanked me for talking to her, and thanked me for how I've been toward her for the past year. She said she's never met anyone like me.

 

I don't know if it's good or bad that we talked for so long today. It just was. I'm still following through with my plan to help myself through counseling and learn to be ok with not being with her. Interacting with her didn't change that. I'm not harboring any delusions that she's tell me next week that she's getting a D and we'll live happily ever after. Trust me. And I doubt she and I could ultimately be friends. It would be too hard with so many feelings involved, and it would be unfair to the BS if they do stay together. I have to learn to be ok with that, too.

 

So yeah, zevahc, sounds like an interesting couple of days for the both of us.

 

Clemenza....it is eerily crazy how similar our lives are tracking....my conversations with my xMW are exactly like this also...almost to the tee...it's these things that only solidify how great I think she is...in spite of us slipping outside of societal norms...and believe me...even I agree with those norms and standards....it doesn't discount the 100% authentic feelings.

 

Anyhow..I agee even with your last paragraph.....i too doubt ultimately that friendship will be there..out of respect and because my feelings won't die...regardless of what people say...i'll cope and I guarantee move on...but I'll always feel love and that it was 100% authentic also. I will find a better place and be healthy and happy for someone. I too have no real hope we'll end up together....there is a small shred of it...but I know it's pretty much just a glimmer and it certainly needs to be displaced because it's not where focus should be....

 

But anyways...eerily tracking...almost to the moment/day....not that we are the only ones who experience the situation...but the conversations and i guess the path on the road seems to be at the same mile marker.

[DelusionalOne]

Hang in there, man. Just know that you really do seem to be gaining some valuable perspective, and your heart does seem to be in the right place. Whenever you feel like you have some semblance of peace and clarity, latch on to those moments and recognize why you're feeling peaceful and clear. Realize that, even though you love her, you do deserve a better situation. We all do.

 

I had a down moment at work today after seeing my xMW walk past my office. I had to go outside to get some fresh air and try to have some positive self talk. When I was sitting on a bench by our building, I noticed that she had gone to her car to get something. She saw me sitting there, and she walked up to me and sat next to me. We talked for probably a good 45 minutes. I told her about some of the positive strides I've been making. I told her some of the stuff I wrote in the OP of this thread (though, I didn't tell her specifically about LS. Hah). I said that I just want her to be happy, no matter what path she takes. We both ended up expressing that, even though we've had very limited contact, we care about each other very much. She told me that she has to stop herself from texting me when she has a funny thought that only I would appreciate. I have to stop myself from doing the same. She told me how hard it is to just treat me like she treats everyone else in the office because I mean more to her than that. I echoed those sentiments. I updated her on things going on with my family, and how my new nephew is doing. We discussed what was going through our minds during various points in our A. She re-iterated that everything she felt about me over the past year+ has been 100% authentic. I didn't ask, but she volunteered that. She's had some pretty scary health problems over the past couple of months. I asked her if there's any way I could be updated on how she's doing when she has another episode. Even if it's through our mutual friend. Maybe I shouldn't have asked that, but I don't like being in the dark about serious health issues involving someone I care about so much. We touched on a lot that I probably can't even remember right now. She thanked me for talking to her, and thanked me for how I've been toward her for the past year. She said she's never met anyone like me.

 

I don't know if it's good or bad that we talked for so long today. It just was. I'm still following through with my plan to help myself through counseling and learn to be ok with not being with her. Interacting with her didn't change that. I'm not harboring any delusions that she's tell me next week that she's getting a D and we'll live happily ever after. Trust me. And I doubt she and I could ultimately be friends. It would be too hard with so many feelings involved, and it would be unfair to the BS if they do stay together. I have to learn to be ok with that, too.

 

So yeah, zevahc, sounds like an interesting couple of days for the both of us.

 

OMG you are so strong. I could never have a conversation like that with my xAP. Reading yours and imagining it....hurt me.

[zevahc]

OMG you are so strong. I could never have a conversation like that with my xAP. Reading yours and imagining it....hurt me.

 

It's encouraging to read Clemenza's post...I relate to him on so many levels...His strength encourages me....although I'm not sure I'm seeing the positives as much...i do want her to be happy...and to me it means having less and less meaningful conversation. She posted her vacation pics today...and when I see her with her H...i think truly that she still loves him..just doesn't feel the emotional connection...i need to let her find that..

[Clemenza]

I don't know if you'd be calling me "strong" if you would have seen how much I've been crying these past few weeks. Hah. I even teared up during our conversation today. I didn't completely sob, but tears came out. I also wake up anxious every morning and have to ramp myself up to logical thinking. I do think I'm on the right track, though, and I'm glad I can help someone. It seems like zevahc and I definitely have a lot in common with our situations, and we seem to be on similar trajectories.

 

I think xMW and I are able to have conversations like that because that's just our nature. We've always been willing to hear each other out, without judgement. There have been times in which I was the one who was more in control, and she was an anxious mess and really needed to talk to me. Instead of getting aggravated, I heard her out and let her say what she needed to say to me. It's funny, I think I've been in the power position (that sounds horrible) for about 14 of the 15 months of our A. Not that it was by design on my part, but she was always the one who wondered what I was thinking and was more of the pursuer than I was. It's only been over the past month that I've seemed to have lost control. It's probably because she gave up on us, decided to try to reconcile with her H, and now losing someone special is becoming real to me. I wasn't stone cold with my attitude toward her prior to this month, as I knew I loved her for a while and told her as much. It's just that she always imagined ending up with me, but something apparently changed a month ago.

 

She and I have also never said hurtful things to one another or fought. We've had misunderstandings at various times, but never once went below the belt with our words. For 15 months, we were able to sit down and rationally talk about what was on our minds. That includes today. I think we've gained a certain amount of respect for one another as communicators. As much as we both think it would make things easier, we have never been able to be mad at each other. So instead of coming out of these conversations with regrets and pain, we both seem to be a little more calm with more clarity.

 

My ability to compartmentalize might be better than I thought, too. Which will serve me well in the end.

Edited June 1, 2013 by Clemenza

[zevahc]

I admire the way you are treating to things. The mutual caring and respect I have with my xMW is what makes me have no regret. I just hope there is another one out there for me that is that special and single. Right now my heart and head don't think its possible.

[zevahc]

I woke up this morning at 5 choked up... I immediately thought about what I've read here in your post. I'm actually going to copy and email your perspectives to myself. I think the same things....but I believe reading them is critical in my healing.

 

Even yesterday as she put me in my place, I felt better...then last night felt down. I wake up this morning and feel all over the place again. Every moment I think about her.

 

i told myself...let my ego die and let her do things the right way, whether she ultimately choose her marriage, or moving on with her life. She wants the right path and I want that for her...I need to put my ego and my selfish desires to bed.

 

I told myself it might not even work, though I don't believe that our world is fantasy....i'm working on convincing myself of this...

 

The big one...if I truy love her...as cliche as it sounds....i need to let her go, wether or NOT it's meant to be, that's what love is...it doesn't mean...she'll be back.

 

I'm scared to death of being lonely forever. I've been a single parent for 10 years and although I've dated a handful of people over 10 years...I've never found that person that made me feel alive until now. I've never been in love until now. I'm scared I won't find that person for 10-20 years or ever. These are my fears. They may be comletely unwarranted. But in my current situation...I DON'T ever meet new women. In my career and as a single parent I'm just not exposed to those situations. So yes..i worry.

 

Anyhow, I woke and need to read and re-read this...I'm also a prayerful person...I've asked God to do what I'm not strong enough to do...to fill the gap, become my focus, and let me find the will and place he intended in my life.

 

I continue to feel very up and down...as I've posted on here before, I've been a BS before 10 years ago. And I'll be honest and say this has been the hardest thing I've ever faced. Harder than when I was the BS...it took me 3 years to heal from that...but I was forced to move on. And...the love was entirely different. In my marriage it was not pure. My ex cheated on me when we dated, and when we married again obviously...and I didn't truly love her from day one. I married out of duty as we share a child.

 

Perspective perspective perspective....i'm trying to hang in there..just wish this was easier.