amazing kind of fate ... or not?

[srf9]

Hi

 

This is my first post....I need to talk about this a bit....maybe others are in the same place and can offer some perspective?

 

i knew this woman, we worked together when I was about 19 years old. I had this crush on her like you would not believe. She was older, about 32 at the time. she and I were flirty a bit together and i actually did "ask her out" once, something super casual...remember it distinctly....we would both work late at night together on the same shift, and i asked if she wanted to goto donut shop after work! she didnt go, but said that would be nice/etc. she actually did ask me to meet her and some of her friends one night at a softball game that some family friend was going to. i was on a happy high for a week, but i think her friends were picking on her after the fact...given the age gap/etc.

 

I left to get a job elsewhere, she was moving away too, both of us pursing school/etc....so that was that.

 

so....19 years later....current time frame....

 

i am married for 15 years now, two kids, made some very risky carrer moves that have paid off well and have a very good lifestyle.

 

about 2 years ago, through facebook, a mutual friend of mine told me that this woman was on facebook and had asked about me. as soon as I heard the name...i had to find her to say hello. so we became FB friends. chatted a few times over the two years, maybe 6 or 8 times?

 

she is married, almost 13 years, has kids of her own as well.

 

about 4 months ago...i was going to be traveling to the area in which she lived for a few days. we talked on FB and made plans to meet for a drink and catchup.

 

as soon as she entered the room and I saw her....i had a replay of every thing i could remember about her in mind, like a flash. she is now 52 and I am 38.

 

we spent 4 hours together talking, having some drinks, catching up on our lives. we saw each other for the next 2 days as well. met out a different restaurant, talking more. third night out, we met at one place for a drink...took my car together to go to another spot since the first place was closing way early that night. later in the evening....we kissed. not a peck on the cheek either. making out in the car for about 20 minutes. with this woman who i had such a crush on.....i've never never never done anything like that with anyone while married.

 

so....its been about two months. we have texted/talked nearly every day. she is about 2 hours from me. we have seen each other about once a week now since then. we have not been too much more physical than kissing...which...is so incredible with this woman.....

 

we text late in the evening together, even a few nights of very racy texting....we had even talked about some 'rules' of what we should and should not do....but...we both have had small freak outs

 

she has had two small freak outs, in that she says she was feeling so overwhelmed with her feelings. i had a similar one, when she was away for a weekend. being with her...we say similar things, even somhow picked the same resturant to goto for lunch last time. a two hour away area, that i was looking at online...picked a place she always wanted to try...because I thought she would like it.

 

we have talked about going to new york together to see a show.

 

i think we are both very close to the point here in that our interest with each other is become an addiction. she may be past that point already?

 

we both say we have no intention of leaving our marriages, each one of our marriages has some issues obviously. hers more than mine. claims her husband is lazy and does nothing. i have seen pictures she has showed me of her dragging things around her yard...doing lawn work, changing pool cover (her sister took pictures apparently a year ago...remarking at how she does it all). i feel like i am the opposite of her....i feel like i have provided my wife with a 'bubble' to live in that she now takes for granted.

 

she has kids and is very commited to them, laments her home life terribly though. i have many good things in my marriage, but the constant feeling of not being appreciated for years, has been growing.

 

i swear i could be with this woman for hours, just holding her and being with her.

 

her 2nd little freakout has occured here over the last two days. we saw each other for lunch, some kissing of course....she is going away for 5day vacation with her kids and husband. texting....she said she is excited to spend time with her kids.....feels like she is living a lie with her husband, doesnt love him, like roommates.

 

says she feels like its a dream when we are together?

then she started to say how she should get back to reality....raise her kids...and stop dreaming. says she can't stand the idea of not seeing me. i dont want to not see her. she says that she is just feeling overwhelmed by emotion. i told her i was feeling the same in a few very specific instances.

 

i cant think of not seeing her, we were making plans to go out the night she returns from vacation.

 

if we really cant think of not seeing each other now....what about in 6 months? 1 year? 5 years?

 

i feel like i have this person in my life now and i dont want to let her go away? we both have kids to raise.....can we find a way to stay close? or is that just not realistic??

 

the last thing I want to do is burden her with more things to think about or for her to feel like she has to burden herself as to not hurt my feelings?

[eleanorrigby]

Sounds like you two should make this permanent. Your wife needs to experience the real world and start taking care of herself, your OW's husband needs the same. (Both so lazy and shiftless.) And it's about time after 14 years your OW got a chance to rest and be pampered by a man that loves her..

 

I think it is high time for two divorces.

[Journee]

I realize that your concern right now is not with your wife and family but with a woman that you have not spent years making a life with. Someone that you are seemingly trying to recapture that "crush" feeling with. You are no longer single and 19. Whether or not your wife "takes you for granted" or not you need to make a decision. If your wife were to start flirting and making out with an old crush like a teenager would you feel excited for her?

 

You think that being with her in real time over the years that you and your OW would not have your own set of issues? How could you trust someone fully if you know what they are capable of doing to their own spouse and family for some thrills?

 

Facebook isn't fate. It's social networking and it did what it does for millions of people.

 

I notice that people in affairs tend to have fairytale view of stuff. Lots of "soul mate" talk , "fate" and "meant to be talk". Marriage can be difficult but can you honestly say that even given your wife's imperfections that she deserves this? Have you even expressed how you are feeling to your wife? Has she even had a chance to fix what you perceive as wrong? OR is she having to compete with a woman that has the ability to just be sunshine and rainbows to you?

 

All the lazy talk from your OW about her husband is just her trying to justify why he somehow deserves to be betrayed. Your talk about your wife also.

 

If and when your affair progresses and the truth comes out you will likely not feel so enchanted about this all. Are you willing to lose your wife? For her to move on herself as you seem to have already?

 

Really ask yourself these questions. If you want this woman you really barely know in comparison to your own wife then let her keep her health and dignity. DO not expose her to STDs and make her a fool. Let your wife go.

 

Please ask yourself the hard questions. I am not trying to he harsh with you but your romanticizing of this has been seen here a thousand times. I hate to see yet another person fall into this trap.

Edited June 10, 2013 by Journee

[eleanorrigby]

 

Facebook isn't fate. It's social networking and it did what it does for millions of people.

 

 

Thank you. With FB you can reconnect with practically anyone from your life no matter how many years it's been since you have seen them. Before I deleted my FB I was getting friend requests from people I've not seen since Jr. High. It's not fate, it's just the internet.

[C00kie]

OP,

 

I'd like to know what you feel about your wife and how you feel about your marriage.

 

I disagree with the previous reply - jumping into divorce sounds like rushing things to me. You need to let the dust settle first.

[srf9]

wow! thanks for the fast replies

 

i meant fate....not in the facebook/internet sense. i have reconnected with many people from my past on FB. Some of them females and have met them back in my home town occasionly when visiting family. 10000% friendly, never ever once thought of anything beyond that.

 

but when seeing this woman again....it was completely different. i could not believe i was there with her. whats the story with that?? that's what i meant as in fate....not necessarily that we are 'fated to be together' ...but that...feeling like that after 18-19 years upon seeing and talking to this person...could not just chalk that up to internet/facebook/whatever

 

divorce? well...i thought about that a year or so ago. not in that i would have done it a year or two ago....just looking at the process. kind of fantasy about not being married anymore? even talked to a lawyer friend of mine ... as in "say...i know this friend who is thinking of divorce" but I too have young kids and would not want that to happen to them. my kids are ~9.

 

i do know myself and this other women...are presenting our best sides to each other. i havent seen her mad, she hasnt seen me mad or irritated.

 

i did start talking to my wife about 3 months ago. friends of ours are having some marriage issues, they are going to MC. I was talking with the husband one night.....after they started MC. He said he thinks lots of people are in the place they are. After listening to his issues and offering advice...i started feeling WORSE about my marriage. His issues seemed to be basic communication problems....that they both wanted to correct.

 

My issues seemed to stem from just personality stuff. I wouldn't exactly say my wife is "warm" ... that's not the right wording...but i find myself more and more wanting a "warm" person. I am kind of a planner...actually very much a planner in certain aspects of my life, other things I do love spontanaity!! i was thinking about my marriage...whats it like in 5 or 10 years? told my friend i was not sure if i can still see myself married in 10 years.....five years, yes.

 

So I did start talking to my wife...i feel like she has made some changes, been a little sweeter.

 

I dont want to say i am making my wife compete against this other woman / rainbows & sunshine and all..... there are many things i like about my wife!

 

i don't think this OW and I will be trading full on s.e.x though....i feel if we did that...she would be very upset with herself. i would be upset with myself too. we did talk about how there is still a pretty wide spectrum though available of fun......part of our racy texting.

 

i'd love to keep seeing this woman....she has this same inner sweetness that i remember from all those years ago. a bit trampled on by being a live-in-servant in her own home I think....she is probably a bit vunerable? i dont want to abuse that....but at the same time....i want her to keep seeing me. she texted me about 1 hour ago and said that "she can't bear the thought of not seeing me".

 

is it stupid to think we can have a relationship, for years, and who knows...maybe we do end up together? i have to think there is at least a slightly higher than zero percent change of that happening. do I meet her and take her to dinner that friday as planned and spend time with her? or are we boarding a non-stop train here that is picking up speed?

 

i like to think i am patient...its not in my nature, but it has been an acquired skill over the last 10-15 years...patience and planning....

[eleanorrigby]

or are we boarding a non-stop train here that is picking up speed?

 

 

*backs slowly out of thread*

[srf9]

@eleanorrigby --> so does that mean we are on high speed train already and I am being naive?

 

i'm a pretty rational person, but there is a part of me that believe in the whole idea of fate/destiny/etc. i have had a few experiences in life that despite my best efforts, i was forced to go in a different direction and I am glad that I did. Although it was very difficult and painful changing directions.

 

i'd like to think that the world is not really a collection a random events. although...that doesnt always mean that there a good outcomes either.

[HonestNeurotic]

It's not amazing fate. For whatever reason - you're BORED. It's a great, intensive, "rush" of some kind. It could have happened with someone else for you. You don't really want a lasting relationship with this other person - because that would be the same as what you have. It wouldn't be exciting anymore. It's called cake eating.

 

Not judging you. Not at all. I'm in an affair. I consciously choose to be in it. I own it. I also don't feel that sex outside of marriage is some awful thing. It's the same as eating to me. I have an open marriage - I only have sex with MM. I haven't had sex with my husband for 30 months now.

 

But you have to KNOW - and understand, yourself. And what you want, what you can live with - and if you can be who you say that you are. You have to take responsibility for yourself, and not put blame on your wife as your reason that you "strayed".

 

Affairs usually do not last forever. Eventually, one side or the other will want more than what the other is willing to give. Having children complicates things - because no matter what - they will be hurt somehow. You are responsible for shaping their future lives, where they get their ideals from.

 

I think wanting/desiring an affair is a symptom of our own character defects. A bandaid that covers the cut, but does not heal the wound. I use words like "we" and "you" in a collective sense - not personally.

 

But it's not fate.

 

Please do not lead the OW on ~ making her feel as though she can perhaps have a future with you. As to whether you can carry on an affair only? Like I said - it doesn't seem to work out well for most. Emotions get in the way - and most people are not wired to accept a polyamorous situation. If you are asking about outcomes? Read the stories here of all the OW/OM's that were thrown under the bus. Promises that were broken to them as well as the BS's. Read how the BS's feel upon discovering that their spouses had done this. It's not pretty - and seemingly rational people can get downright nasty on both sides. Professional careers threatened or ruined.

 

It's definitely drug like. The kissing - well, I know that feeling. I could do it for hours. But it's not really "real". There is no greener grass on the other side of the hill. It's just more grass.

 

IMHO ~ as always

[srf9]

you are right in that there is a part of me that is Bored. I feel like i am missing certain things (part of the content of the racy texting .. we were both talking of things we feel we are missing).

 

but, i'm not looking for a random hook-up, trolling the internet looking for women, or some such thing....no way no way.

 

i dont want to blame my wife or make her a scapegoat...saying something like "well...if you did X then I would not have done Y"

 

and i so do not want to hurt, lead-on, this other woman. i am caring alot about here, so quickly.....

[Minnie09]

The affair you're having right now is not based on fate..... it's a mere coincidence that you stumbled across each other. You want to read more into it, because you need an excuse. That's all you're doing.*

 

The one thing that's clear is this: you are quite straightforward with what you want. You want your W, because you like her, but you want the A with ow to continue. That's cool. At least you're being honest about it without putting the blame in your W. I'm so tired of reading about sloppy wives, no passion in marriages and nasty attitudes toward the poor victim WS.....do they are literally driven to cheat. You're not that person. I appreciate that. But what you're not doing is this: look at the sitch from your W's pov. Yes, I know she doesn't know.....good for you......but your lying by omission. If you want an open M and some flirting/passion/excitement on the side.....offer her a deal. She can do the same. What's the problem?

 

Oh right.....then it's gonna be only half the fun, because the secrecy is gone. You need the thrill of screwing her over without her knowing? Why? Do you know why? Because you don't want to hurt her? Really? Bull****.......you're afraid of the consequences. And right now you don't give a **** about your W's feelings, because if you respected her, my friend, you'd be honest with her. What you're doing now is backstabbing her. Not cool. I know it's a thrill. I know you're a thrill-seeker. I know ow makes you feel important/desired/validated/manly. But common, you're not manly if you have to hide things. Own up to your ****.....stand tall and look your W into her innocent eyes and tell her you have the hots for someone 15 years her senior......oh you won't do that? If you deserve some fun on the side, you should definitely demand it. It's your life after all. Never mind the consequences.

[secretlady76]

You're bored, she's bored. Marriage can be very boring, with all the bits that go with it.

 

This affair on the other hand is exciting! It's secret and full of lust, dreams, feelings etc. Of course it is going to seem a lot more interesting than the boredom that is home life.

 

Problem, is these situations become addictive and you end up acting like an addict. The hit, you have to have the hit, how ever small.

 

Unfortunately, this is a train wreck waiting to happen. What you hold dear at home, that you have currently forgotten about is on the line. When your spouses find out, you may lose it all. And at that point you may have no choice but to remove eachother from your lives.

 

My advice here is to stop this before it gets out of hand. Otherwise you will fall deeper into this. You may fall in love, have sex, you name it. And once all that happens it will be way more difficult to walk away from.

 

As for fate, nope. You both actively looked for eachother. It wasn't like you bumped into eachother on the street.

 

But you're not going to finish this though are you?! Because it makes you feel good...and why on earth would you want to walk away from that?

 

Give it a few months and you'll wished you had walked away whilst you and everyone else that's about to get sucked into this remained relatively unscathed....

[srf9]

I don't want to shift this to my wife.....make it seem like she is the scapegoat.

I think my thoughts have changed....starting to want some different things out of life perhaps?

 

My wife is physically attractive, certainly not sloppy, we do date nights together, travel with our kids on some island vacations. Sometimes when we go out....she is dressed too fancy and I don't look as good as her! but....she is pretty straight laced.....a narrow set of things she "enjoys" ... You can fill in the blanks. then there is the appreciation aspect of things....I'm not saying I want a high 5 everyday....but some adoration would be nice

 

 

I've been thinking about this for a while. Did start talking to her a few months ago....before I met the OW again for first time in years.

 

My main issues i guess I've had are

 

1. She could be more open minded in the bedroom

2. I think I have provided her a nice lifestyle....some genuine appreciation would be nice?

 

I have not ruled out the idea of telling her I want time apart? Seeing this OW has now complicated it a bit.

 

I was kind of hoping that since OW is commited to her kids....she wouldn't yet want to run off together - haha! maybe that is naive?

[srf9]

Sounds to me like a broken heart to be is in your future. I dig your train analogy though, never heard that here before.

 

so this is a lost cause? the woman that I am so fond of....you are saying that there is no way for her to be OK? what if she leaves her husband? she has said that when her kids are older, she is leaving. claims she has been fantasizing about it for a couple years. says she has a job to finish (i.e. raise her kids). it breaks my heart to think of her stuck like that.

 

and then my wife and kids. what do I there? I had thought a year...a little more ago...about someday leaving after my kids were older. this was well before meeting the OW.

 

(thanks for the replies though! helping me walk through all this....)

[Journee]

If I missed your answer to this I am sorry but I did not see it.

 

How would you be feeling about all of this if your wife were the one making out and sexting another man? Fantasizing about him? Would you want enough respect from her to let you go in order for her to pursue? Or would you want her planning secret meetings and pining away for another man's touch?

 

I think she deserves at least that from you. You are robbing her of her choices in life. Maybe she has some qualms about you too. Is that an excuse for her to betray you? It isn't for you either.

 

You said you didn't want to make this about your wife..that puzzles me.

 

This should be more about your wife than someone you barely know. Throw it all away for someone that is willing to cheat on her husband and the father of her children because he is "lazy". Really? My husband leaves wet towels on our bed after he showers sometimes. It drives me crazy. He has his lazy days as do I. Reason enough to disregard him as a human being and someone that I genuinely care for?

 

Has your wife ever cheated on you? If not then why lay it all on the line for a woman that IS cheating!? If you can't put forth the effort to really dig deep in your marriage or get out ,then why expend it into an affair...and that is what you are having. Penetration is not the only way to cheat.

 

You will more than likely do what it is that makes you feel good. That makes you feel special and validated. Then when either her husband finds out ( or your wife) you will more than likely be forced to make a decision or a decision will be made for you. Life is too short. If your wife isn't worth effort because she is comfortable and spoiled then so be it.

 

Good luck to you, you are going to need it.

[Lillyfree]

are you still going to feel the same way when you're in your 50s and she's in her 70s?

 

yknow, with various saggy and dry bits.

 

are you boarding this speeding train with a return ticket?

[srf9]

are you still going to feel the same way when you're in your 50s and she's in her 70s?

 

yknow, with various saggy and dry bits.

 

are you boarding this speeding train with a return ticket?

 

 

that's funny...you know....I thought about that entire scenario as well.

when I am 50, she is 65? that doesn't sound too bad....

when I a 60, she is 75? that's getting a little old perhaps?

but I am planning to live to 160 with gene replacement therapy....my wife says she doesn't want anything like that....

 

in seriousness....as I thought through the scenario.....it made me upset...thinking that I would watch this OW pass away.....awful.....

[Journee]

You seem to be avoiding the question about if the tables were turned. Most people in affairs do. Very well. Sorry to have wasted my time.

 

 

Adios

[Journee]

Yea, I'm out too. Can't shake the feeling that I've encountered this OP before. :confused:

 

 

If this thread morphs into Parts II and III , we can be certain.

[Mycatsnuggles]

My mm and I also have several years between us, he's younger but the years have never mattered. The feelings for each other are addictive and only increase with time. We have been together for 3 years now the feelings only growing more intense as the time passes.

 

It becomes a relationship. We've had our fights, moments of anger, mean comments generally from my end. Are you sure you want two women to fight with? The addiction becomes very strong. It's difficult to be apart. We both have experienced jealousy, it's difficult to separate your mind from their "other" but you have to. Longing for the "normal experiences" we don't get to share. Wishing we could be together, sleep all night, cook meals together. We keep finding more things we share in common. It becomes difficult to not want we know will never be. At least he was honest with me and said from the beginning he would never leave his marriage. I to am married.

 

We've had some scares of discovery. I have felt intense guilt for doing this to her. But it hasn't stopped me or him. We continue on knowing one day it could end suddenly with maybe one message exchanged saying "never contact me again".

 

On the flip side.

 

We both felt something was missing in our marriages. It was never there. We love our spouses but were never in love. Never experienced sexual pleasure like we have with each other. It's an experience I don't regret. We only live once. So I jumped and had an affair with a mm, I fell in love with a mm, and our times together feel perfect.

 

Be aware once you jump in you can never go back to who you were before. I recognize the speeding train. I don't think your getting off. Be prepared. It's difficult to be with the spouse after spending a day together. You'll have resentment and anger towards them with no outlet for the emotions. It will effect your marriage and not in a positive way.. If you continue be honest with the OW tell her your expectations up front.

[srf9]

Hi

 

I didn't mean to avoid any question!

 

You mean about how would I feel if my wife was out toolig around with some other man? Yeah......I wouldn't like that at all. I don't think she would be happy to know I was spending some time with another woman like that.

 

I am sure I am not a peach! I probably annoy my wife in many ways. Spend too much time working, or playing on my personal hobby projects, trying to fix this little snore issue I have....and other things. I am not perfect.

 

I had thought a while ago about going to a marriage counseler just myself....maybe I should do that? I know penetration is not the only way to cheat.....

 

maybe I should try to unwind this with the OW? I don't want her hurt....I don't want to be completely stepping out on my family obligations either.

 

I've been justifying this in my mind....something like so what if the OW and I are special friends....spending time together and a kiss? I suppose there are worse thing? Maybe I am very wrong.....I need to my head straight I think

 

Wife and I have a date night tomorrow. I'm happy to go....just feels routine? How bad is that??? Blaaaahhh....maybe hard fact is I am bad person....

[Journee]

Hi

 

I didn't mean to avoid any question!

 

You mean about how would I feel if my wife was out toolig around with some other man? Yeah......I wouldn't like that at all. I don't think she would be happy to know I was spending some time with another woman like that.

 

I am sure I am not a peach! I probably annoy my wife in many ways. Spend too much time working, or playing on my personal hobby projects, trying to fix this little snore issue I have....and other things. I am not perfect.

 

I had thought a while ago about going to a marriage counseler just myself....maybe I should do that? I know penetration is not the only way to cheat.....

 

maybe I should try to unwind this with the OW? I don't want her hurt....I don't want to be completely stepping out on my family obligations either.

 

I've been justifying this in my mind....something like so what if the OW and I are special friends....spending time together and a kiss? I suppose there are worse thing? Maybe I am very wrong.....I need to my head straight I think

 

Wife and I have a date night tomorrow. I'm happy to go....just feels routine? How bad is that??? Blaaaahhh....maybe hard fact is I am bad person....

 

 

Ah yes, snoring. My H snores too. Like an adorable freight train. That can hinder intimacy for sure. Especially if someone has to leave the marital bed in order to get some sleep.

 

Look, I don't mean to come off as judging you and I certainly do not believe that you are a "bad" person. Lost, yes. Who hasn't been lost? I was at my lowest points the past couple of years. My marriage in shambles (both of our doing) and just mentally in a bad place. I just really want you to see what you are standing to lose. I don't know your story aside from what you have posted but if your wife truly loves you and has been good to you...then what's the major issue? Please before you meet with OW again just read some of the stories here. Read all of the justifications and all of the "true love" stories. Read some of the posts from married women and married men. Take a good look into the psyche of the married woman you are building up in your mind. It's old and tired but if she will cheat with you ,she could cheat on you. You both may be the type that need lots of attention and validation. I also happen to require a lot from my H in that way. There is nothing wrong with that as long as you are not always waiting for the next fix. Because that is all surface. Your wife probably seems spoiled because you have been a good husband up until this point. Has she not done things for you as a wife and mother to your children that go above and beyond? She probably thinks you did some of the great things you have done because you love her and your family. She might just be proud of you. Might be comfortable and content in life. She probably does not view her behaviors the way you do. It seems you are rewriting your marital history in order to continue with disrespectful relationship.

 

I understand that life is short but don't have your fun at your wife and OMW's husband's expense. She and you get to enjoy the fruits of new and exciting courtship but your spouses are left in the cold? Read some of the posts in this forum. There is this "What about me?" attitude that saturates the threads. For the poster I am sure it is romantic and heart stopping as it comes but really read it. Only the cheater deserves happiness and fulfillment. The betrayed somehow deserves to live a lie because of some lame excuse.

 

I have done and said some wicked things in my day and I am sure you have too. Do you really want to be that guy? Imagine the complete devastation in your wife's eyes. Her whole life will feel like a lie.

 

 

P.S. Counseling is wonderful. It can really help you get to the bottom of why you would even entertain this notion...and anything else you may need to get out. Really think long and hard about this. It just never seems to be worth it from what I have seen here and offline of course.

Edited June 11, 2013 by Journee

[srf9]

Thanks for all the replies. I appreciate all of them.

 

I have not seen too many posts of affairs gone good? I suppose it does Happen.../probably the exception though.

 

I was kind of hoping that myself and this OW could control things better. She doesn't want to leave ... Has kids to raise. I feel same way...kids to raise.

 

I may go and talk to someone. Was thinking about that for a while....before OW anyway.

 

we will see

[ComingInHot]

remember, what You do is what you Have to be accepting of with Your Wife the OW and... Your daughter. So when she's M someday w/a child to raise and starts romping around w/a MM Fifteen years her elder, give her a hug and tell good for you while High Fiving the MOM*

It'll be just, oh so... perfect. Won't it? Can't you just picture it?!

Champagne for everyone!!

Cheers dude.

[Realist3]

Sounds to me like a broken heart to be is in your future. I dig your train analogy though, never heard that here before.

 

It also sounds a lot like BrokenHeart2B.