question for recovered ow/om

[thecharade]

Hi, all.

 

Even though I ended things with my old MM/ex BF 11 months ago (without a DDay) and have worked my *ss off learning about myself and my marriage and my issues, I still feel very new to all of the stages of grief and loss that have come with ending something like this. It took me a long time to see through his double speak. He never lied to me, but he also never told the truth. He didn't protect anyone's interests but his own. Once I started to pay attention to what was actually going on instead of his beautiful words (one major incident brought the final blow), I said we were done. I agreed to see him once more a month later (big mistake, I was grieving and grasping) but went back to being done asap. Lots of depression. And then two months after that I saw him again for 45 minutes, just as friends. (LOL. I was so lost and in such despair.) Still so, so sad. But my resolve to respect myself remained even in the face of those slip ups, and our R did not ever restart. Semantics, I know, but I mean that I have worked every single day for the last 11 months to get over him. Those were just pot holes in the road.

 

I then went into a rage stage, threatening him and insulting him. He would have gladly continued the A, but my rage was huge--all my anger at being manipulated and played for his cake eating desires. We had a history and he took advantage of that. He knew I had loved him for decades. (He said he felt the same but it didn't matter.)

 

After the rage months passed--mostly silence but a few angry e-mails--I went into a sadness/acceptance. (Some anger sprinkled in occasionally.) During all 11 months, I have made lists. List after list after list. "Reasons I will hate him forever." "Reasons I am way too good for him." "Reasons I could not continue the way I was" "His worst qualities" "Things I will definitely not miss" I read over those lists multiple times a day. Whenever I'm feeling sad, I quickly read a list. They have helped tremendously by reminding me that he is just a guy, and a very imperfect one at that. And--well, I'm awesome. His loss.

 

And so now, something odd is happening. I am actually seeing him as uglier (inside and out) in my mind. I am thinking, "ewww" when he crosses my mind. I'm wondering, is this what happens? Will the love I felt for 25 years turn into "he's gross!" because I don't want to love him, have worked so hard to see his faults and the damage he has done to me, and I really WANT to get over him? Or is this a funky stage that will end and I'll go back to sadness? He sent a fishing "Hi" e-mail the other day, and I had no desire to write back. All I thought was, "Take your nasty self and go!" He got crickets in return (of course), but is all of this normal? Is the end of my painful journey actually in sight?

 

Thanks for your thoughts.

[Artie Lang]

the thing is, he has ALWAYS been an "ugly" person. too bad it takes this long to see these people for what they really are.

 

another thing..... no matter how monstrous you paint him, no one put a gun to you head. you have choices. that's where your effort should be placed- why you so easily succumbed to this behavior.

 

it's not about him..... it's all about YOU!

[carhill]

IME, most of the recovery process is self-focused, reflecting on the relationship, its impact upon one, one's marriage (if married) and resolving the emotions to a neutral state. As long as emotions are attached to thoughts, emotional memories are formed and the process of recovery continues until those memories are resolved to a neutral state, meaning one is indifferent to the person and past association. This is where NC (no contact) helps. This means erasing all forms of making or receiving contact.

 

For myself, professional counseling was a valuable assist. I don't think it's 'better' but sure focused the work efforts. YMMV on that. Good luck.

[thecharade]

He was not ugly all along, not to me. I have worked only on myself and made a concrete and firm choice to stop loving him, a choice to "get over this." I have read everything I could get my hands on and received professional help. My T calls me a "dream client" because of all the work done on myself. (She happens to be a BW whose H left her for the OW years ago.)

 

I am looking for my heart to follow my head. My head made a smart decision many months ago, but my heart has had a much harder time. I have grieved so deeply. But I want to be over him, indifferent, emotionless. I just wondered if anyone could tell me how long that would take, especially since I have a more negative view of him recently. I'm hoping that I really will feel nothing soon?

 

I work at a public place where we cannot block e-mails. There are many ways he could reach me, so preventing it is not my focus. Not caring iS my focus.

 

Thanks.

[Lostinlife4now]

Hi, all.

 

Even though I ended things with my old MM/ex BF 11 months ago (without a DDay) and have worked my *ss off learning about myself and my marriage and my issues, I still feel very new to all of the stages of grief and loss that have come with ending something like this. It took me a long time to see through his double speak. He never lied to me, but he also never told the truth. He didn't protect anyone's interests but his own. Once I started to pay attention to what was actually going on instead of his beautiful words (one major incident brought the final blow), I said we were done. I agreed to see him once more a month later (big mistake, I was grieving and grasping) but went back to being done asap. Lots of depression. And then two months after that I saw him again for 45 minutes, just as friends. (LOL. I was so lost and in such despair.) Still so, so sad. But my resolve to respect myself remained even in the face of those slip ups, and our R did not ever restart. Semantics, I know, but I mean that I have worked every single day for the last 11 months to get over him. Those were just pot holes in the road.

 

I then went into a rage stage, threatening him and insulting him. He would have gladly continued the A, but my rage was huge--all my anger at being manipulated and played for his cake eating desires. We had a history and he took advantage of that. He knew I had loved him for decades. (He said he felt the same but it didn't matter.)

 

After the rage months passed--mostly silence but a few angry e-mails--I went into a sadness/acceptance. (Some anger sprinkled in occasionally.) During all 11 months, I have made lists. List after list after list. "Reasons I will hate him forever." "Reasons I am way too good for him." "Reasons I could not continue the way I was" "His worst qualities" "Things I will definitely not miss" I read over those lists multiple times a day. Whenever I'm feeling sad, I quickly read a list. They have helped tremendously by reminding me that he is just a guy, and a very imperfect one at that. And--well, I'm awesome. His loss.

 

And so now, something odd is happening. I am actually seeing him as uglier (inside and out) in my mind. I am thinking, "ewww" when he crosses my mind. I'm wondering, is this what happens? Will the love I felt for 25 years turn into "he's gross!" because I don't want to love him, have worked so hard to see his faults and the damage he has done to me, and I really WANT to get over him? Or is this a funky stage that will end and I'll go back to sadness? He sent a fishing "Hi" e-mail the other day, and I had no desire to write back. All I thought was, "Take your nasty self and go!" He got crickets in return (of course), but is all of this normal? Is the end of my painful journey actually in sight?

 

Thanks for your thoughts.

 

 

Ummmmm.......not ugly....but a JOKE, A LOSER, A PATHETIC LOSER, LIAR, NARCISSIST, CAKE EATER, DELUSIONAL, Thinks he is such a Fantastic Father...UGH>>>>> Shall I go on?

[Eggplant]

Will the love I felt for 25 years turn into "he's gross!" because I don't want to love him, have worked so hard to see his faults and the damage he has done to me, and I really WANT to get over him?

 

Twenty-five years, you say? Wow! Your whole world must be shaken. I am amazed at your ability to admit his faults after (probably) denying them for 25 years. I wonder if you feel a weight has been lifted off your chest? I wish you a smooth recovery.

[thecharade]

Eggplant (cute name),

Your thoughts are very compassionate, thank you. Yes, a huge loss and a huge relief. It was not an A for those 25 years (oh, hellz no! I can't imagine) but I kept him 'alive' in my heart and head. I suppose this experience has ruined that somewhat, but that's actually a good thing. Pining for someone is a lot more unhealthy than healthy, escapism at its finest.

 

There seems to be a necessary balance of anger/hate for an AP, without venturing into "it's all his/her fault." I have struggled with that balance and believe that when the proper internal work is done, the balance of the anger and blame creates the indifference? I hate him for being the person who would do this to me, and I blame him a smidge. Because of those ugly realities, my feelings for him are diminishing. But I see that my own life and frustrations and dysfunction gave him the opening into my life again. I should have looked harder at the relationships in my own life and what I deserved (but was not getting) instead of triangling in a third party. I think the A was an exit affair for me, even though I am now working hard on my M to be certain it's what needs to happen. For my MM it was an "I deserve this treat" affair.

 

I will be excited when I realize that I'm not even much interested in exMM anymore, and I am dreaming of the day that no amount of begging or changing on his part would even turn my head. I suppose almost everyone here is dreaming of that day.

 

Thank you all for the input. And letting me share.

[chaser0195]

I think this is completely normal and is a stage towards healing. You discovered the real guy and you are now seeing the light. I have been head over heals for a guy and thought he was best thing on earth but after we broke up and some time had passed, I saw him again and thought to myself, what did I see in him? He isn't as great as I remember. lol You are on your way to feeling indifference towards your exAP. Its a rollercoaster of emotions and you may have days of sadness but the best thing for you is to focus on you and why he is bad for you.

[White Flower]

I think the A was an exit affair for me, even though I am now working hard on my M to be certain it's what needs to happen. For my MM it was an "I deserve this treat" affair.

 

I think this is an example of why there is such a thing as rOW. You didn't really need the relationship; therefore, you didn't really believe in the love. It seems that he was nothing but a distraction and so you can easily become reformed in order to overcome that guilty pleasure. Most of us OW do not look at our MM as a guilty pleasure.

 

We as humans have the wonderful conflict of heart versus mind. Logically you know (or believe) he isn't good for you, but emotionally you need him. That's the tough thing isn't it.

 

I will continue reading the whole thread before I post again but I just wanted to make a statement about reformation after seeing your comment above.

Edited June 14, 2013 by White Flower
The, not a

[White Flower]

Ok, read the whole thread.

 

I've had a few breakups with my guy and during those times I tried to vilify him in order to get over him. It's the logical thing to do but the heart isn't very logical. So where do you go from there?

 

You just accept it. You cry and mourn until you can't cry anymore. I hope you get over him soon.

 

The one question I have for you regarding your list, "Reasons I could not continue the way I was", is why? Why could you not continue (besides the obvious reasons)? Why, when you loved him for 25 years and he loved you? If he was a cake-eater, were you then, as a MW, not one too?

Edited June 14, 2013 by White Flower
My phone obviously doesn't know the word cake-eater. It's not hip to this forum.

[MissBee]

I think this is an example of why there is such a thing as rOW. You didn't really need the relationship; therefore, you didn't really believe in the love. It seems that he was nothing but a distraction and so you can easily become reformed in order to overcome that guilty pleasure. Most of us OW do not look at our MM as a guilty pleasure.

 

We as humans have the wonderful conflict of heart versus mind. Logically you know (or believe) he isn't good for you, but emotionally you need him. That's the tough thing isn't it.

 

I will continue reading the whole thread before I post again but I just wanted to make a statement about reformation after seeing your comment above.

 

I am always confused at this "most of us OW" stuff...as if OW are a species of people and aren't in fact their own individuals with different points of view, beliefs, rationales etc.

 

I don't believe there is ONE way to be an OW...and I think those who toss around the label "reformed OW" seem to almost try to act like they know the "true" way to be an "authentic OW" and go on about "we this" and "we that", attempting to prescribe certain modes of behavior and thoughts to all "good OW" and exclude others who didn't act and think as they did. It's soooooo bizarre. In any case....there is no OW monolith. An OW is simply a woman in a relationship with a man committed elsewhere....she may have stuff in common with others in the same boat...but it isn't a "we" thing.

 

What do you mean by "you didn't need" the relationship? What does needing a relationship mean? Perhaps you are right. Maybe "reformed" OW didn't desperately "need" the relationship and need to cling to hopes of love and endure trillions of ddays and so on, so are able to see things differently easier than whatever the opposite of reformed is...where perhaps that is more centered on "needing" the relationship and needing to believe in the love at all cost.

[spiderowl]

It sounds like the decision to opt out of the relationship was forced on you before because you were so unhappy, but you felt it wasn't from choice. Now, however, you have made a decision deep down and as a result your whole perspective has changed. I believe we make decisions at different levels and the ones we make on the surface are a real battle to enforce, whereas the deep down ones produce such strong anti feelings it's no problem to stick to them.

[thecharade]

Sheesh, deep stuff that's a little hard to follow, but I like deep. I don't know how I will feel about this person over the long haul, but I'd rather not hate him. I'd like to just be over him. I feel I am Recovering from this ordeal, but I wouldn't use the word Reformed. I don't villify people who have affairs now that I'm older and wiser, but I don't subscribe to black/white or right/wrong thinking. The idea that someone-anyone-can make a promise and be sure about the next 50 years is ridiculous. Human beings are imperfect! Marriage is a good thing but a tough thing. The one aspect that bothers me about humans is not trying to DO BETTER! We just have to take our imperfect selves and work hard to do better. What other choice is there since we can't be perfect?

 

My A was an exit affair because I was ready to leave my H and loved my old bf. But with him needing to stay (but wanting to stay in the A. Uh, no) I decided to figure myself out and take a good look at my M. My H is in IC, but he's not making much progress. He really wants me to be his mommy, and I would prefer to be his wife. I didn't need my MM? I don't know what that means. I certainly loved him, would have changed my life for him. I'm traumatized by the experience, so crushed and sad. But I don't subscribe to needing anyone. I just loved him and I guess I still do. My M is a separate issue that I didn't really know how to address. I'm a bit codependent, so it took a while to realize that my nice guy H wasn't really bringing to the M all that I needed and deserved. I think an M can appear very functional and happy and be creating a big hole in one person at the same time. It took quite a few T sessions to get that your S can be really great and NOT be meeting your needs. And that it's ok to admit it.

 

So, dysfunctional M and the old bf popped back in. I needed him alright! I was miserable and didn't know why. But even though the old bf is a better fit for me (parents broke us up years ago) he has young kids and a wife "I don't hate." (That's how he puts it.) So that is that. And I'll probably end up alone, which may end up to be good for me.

[JustJoe]

With all due respect, do you ever intend to think about anybody but yourself? In all of your posts you haven't mentioned what this has done to your husband, or to the OM"s wife, or to anybody else . It's been all about you. With this magnitude of self, I don't see how you can ever give anything to a relationship, regardless of who it's with. Perhaps you should be in IC yourself and try to show a little compassion for those whom you have betrayed and also try to see where YOU have been at fault instead of constantly blaming the OM, your husband , etc.

[thecharade]

I realize that people have all sorts of personal issues and pain to work through, but none of what you have written is in any way accurate about me. I have spent much time in IC, even prior to my A. My H would never, ever say I think only of myself; he is the one that did no work until I told him that I had made arrangements to move out. As I've stated previously, my current T is a BW whose H left her for the OW about 10 years ago, and she has called me a "healthy person" and her "dream client." She is completely anti-affair and pro-saving marriages, but she sees the why's behind affairs and knows that people simply do the best they can, often times making huge mistakes along the way. I feel that I have a right to my feelings and pain and struggles, just like any other human on this planet. Being a wayward spouse does not negate my value or needs. My H is a victim, but my H also knew of problems and chose to ignore them. To be honest, he has had three friends of his handle their marriages similarly, but unfortunately their wives chose to divorce them without giving them ample time to address the problems. My H is happy to still have his wife here, having chosen to end the A, working on her M, helping him figure his issues out, instead of just divorcing him.

 

I really was only looking for feedback from other OW or OM, not betrayed spouses. My stages of getting over my A and grieving the loss of my AP can only be understood by that group. Please, I'd rather no replies at all than BS interjection. Thanks.

[Artie Lang]

i'm neither a BS nor a WS, but just to be clear- are you telling me you were carrying a torch for this guy for 25 years???

 

if so, why did you ever marry your husband?

 

 

i suggest you don't get involved with ANYONE, given that they will never compare to this OM. you'd be living a lie.

 

 

if you do decide to get involved with someone, it would nice if you let that person know your feelings concerning this ex-BF/MM, so they won't be duped into believing you could love them with such passion as this OM.

 

i say this because it does seem like your hand was forced into deciding to end it. he wasn't gonna leave his wife, so you had to resort to the alternative- being alone.

Edited June 16, 2013 by Artie Lang