What do you think of this article?? "Trapping" men into pregnancy

[Els]

Of course it's wrong to deceive someone. I'm not defending women who lie about being on BC.

 

Men aren't the victims here though. They are willing participates in an activity that could cause pregnancy without taking all the necessary precautions. Leaving something that could significantly affect your life up to another individual is foolish.

 

So, if a man intentionally uses a faulty condom and the woman gets pregnant from that, she 'isn't a victim of deceit' because she willingly participated in sex with him despite the fact that she thought they'd actually had a functional condom on?

[iris219]

Would you feel the same way if a man went around infecting women with HIV through the use of intentionally sabotaged condoms?

 

What? I don't understand why you're asking me the above because it doesn't compare to anything I've said.

 

Men give up their reproductive rights when they stick their naked penises inside women. This is basically saying, "I understand pregnancy could occur and I'm OK with it."

 

Poking holes in condoms would be comparable to the guy who gave his gf the abortion pill laced drink.

[amaysngrace]

So, if a man intentionally uses a faulty condom and the woman gets pregnant from that, she 'isn't a victim of deceit' because she willingly participated in sex with him despite the fact that she thought they'd actually had a functional condom on?

 

Or like in my instance, he knew I was ovulating and I told him he needed to use one. He did the first time, came and then didn't put one on the second time and said he'd pull out when I asked did he have one on?

 

Yes I guess it's my fault for not watching to see if he put one on but I had told him what was up and thought that he would have honored my request.

 

[Eclypse]

It's different because he is willingly participating in an activity that he knows could cause pregnancy. She doesn't know that drinking from the cup he handed her could kill her unborn child.

 

And the condoms that were pierced? Anyway you can turn it around again. She knew he didn't want the baby she was carrying and he wanted her to abort. So she knowingly trusted him to not try sabotage her baby and accepted this drink from him that she should have known he might sabotage? She can't have known he'd do that, same as a man in a trusting relationship couldn't know his gf would screw him over.

 

Regrdless, I find this behaviour disgusting. It's not much of a relationship if you can't trust anything your partner does and have to police them 24/7.

[Els]

Your comparison makes zero sense, Iris. Basically, what you're saying is that the man can never be a victim no matter what sort of deceit the woman practices, but it isn't true the other way around.

 

Also, before anyone jumps on this, please let it be known that Iris' opinions do NOT speak for all, or even the majority of women here.

[iris219]

So, if a man intentionally uses a faulty condom and the woman gets pregnant from that, she 'isn't a victim of deceit' because she willingly participated in sex with him despite the fact that she thought they'd actually had a functional condom on?

 

Not what I said at all.

 

The above is as awful as a woman who pokes holes in a condom.

 

To clarify what I said: A man who is having sex without a condom cannot claim to be a victim if the woman gets pregnant even if she a terrible person and lied about her BC status.

[ImperfectionisBeauty]

Would you feel the same way if a man went around infecting women with HIV through the use of intentionally sabotaged condoms?

 

The difference is if you can prove that they did that it actually is illegal... There is a law established for that. Not this.

[iris219]

Basically, what you're saying is that the man can never be a victim no matter what sort of deceit the woman practices, but it isn't true the other way around.

 

Once again, I absolutely DID NOT say this. Reread my posts if you need to.

[ImperfectionisBeauty]

Or like in my instance, he knew I was ovulating and I told him he needed to use one. He did the first time, came and then didn't put one on the second time and said he'd pull out when I asked did he have one on?

 

Yes I guess it's my fault for not watching to see if he put one on but I had told him what was up and thought that he would have honored my request.

 

 

Ok in all honesty you shouldn't even tell people about that situation because it is just as much your fault as it is his. You could have stopped him and said no put a condom on, or anything and you didn't so that's your own fault too.

[amaysngrace]

Ok in all honesty you shouldn't even tell people about that situation because it is just as much your fault as it is his. You could have stopped him and said no put a condom on, or anything and you didn't so that's your own fault too.

 

Do you mean because I ran to the bathroom or that I shouldn't have been sleeping with a scumbag liar whom I was dumb enough to trust?

[amaysngrace]

Alright, what if a man neglects to tell his girlfriend/wife or even straight up lies about having HIV and they eventually decide not to use a condom because she's on the pill.

 

Would she be a victim?

 

I think no. There is such a thing as a blood test.

[Emilia]

Alright, what if a man neglects to tell his girlfriend/wife or even straight up lies about having HIV and they eventually decide not to use a condom because she's on the pill.

 

Would she be a victim?

In some countries you get prosecuted for this ommission

[ImperfectionisBeauty]

Do you mean because I ran to the bathroom or that I shouldn't have been sleeping with a scumbag liar whom I was dumb enough to trust?

 

Well first of all if you didn't trust him why would you sleep with him? Second you said you asked him if he had one on the second time you said he said he would pull out... Everyone knows pulling out isn't effective, I mean even I know that, yet you still let him in with no condom which makes you just as much to blame.

[amaysngrace]

Again, just because one life altering deception is legal and the other isn't doesn't matter when it comes to discussing the morality of those deceptions.

 

I agree. A scumbag is a scumbag and acts like a scumbag.

[iris219]

Alright, what if a man neglects to tell his girlfriend/wife or even straight up lies about having HIV and they eventually decide not to use a condom because she's on the pill.

 

Would she be a victim?

 

Completely different issue.

 

Unplanned pregnancy is not analogous to life threatening disease.

[Eclypse]

 

Poking holes in condoms would be comparable to the guy who gave his gf the abortion pill laced drink.

 

Hang on a minute here.

 

Scenario 1 - Woman: He doesn't want kids but I do. I know, I'll tell him I'm taking BC but in reality Im not taking the pills! Im just flushing them down the toilet so he can check the empty packet. He'll never know! Until I get pregnant anyway! Hahaha!

 

Scenario 2 - Man: she doesn't want kids but I do. I know, I'll have her think I'm wearing a condom but in reality I've poked holes in them! She'll never know! Until she gets pregnant anyway! Hahaha.

 

Why is only one viewed under the same heinous light as the abortion pill thing?

[ImperfectionisBeauty]

Alright, what if a man neglects to tell his girlfriend/wife or even straight up lies about having HIV and they eventually decide not to use a condom because she's on the pill.

 

Would she be a victim?

 

You can be prosecuted for that at least in the US I think it's called duty to disclose or something

[Emilia]

Again, just because one life altering deception is legal and the other isn't doesn't matter when it comes to discussing the morality of those deceptions.

I responded to the question you asked

[amaysngrace]

Well first of all if you didn't trust him why would you sleep with him? Second you said you asked him if he had one on the second time you said he said he would pull out... Everyone knows pulling out isn't effective, I mean even I know that, yet you still let him in with no condom which makes you just as much to blame.

 

No. He went in and then I asked if he had one on and he said no he'd pull out but I knew that I was pregnant then because he just came in a condom and sperm live for hours.

[sillyanswer]

To clarify what I said: A man who is having sex without a condom cannot claim to be a victim if the woman gets pregnant even if she a terrible person and lied about her BC status.

 

Really? How is the man not a victim of deceit like that?

[ImperfectionisBeauty]

Hang on a minute here.

 

Scenario 1 - Woman: He doesn't want kids but I do. I know, I'll tell him I'm taking BC but in reality Im not taking the pills! Im just flushing them down the toilet so he can check the empty packet. He'll never know! Until I get pregnant anyway! Hahaha!

 

Scenario 2 - Man: she doesn't want kids but I do. I know, I'll have her think I'm wearing a condom but in reality I've poked holes in them! She'll never know! Until she gets pregnant anyway! Hahaha.

 

Why is only one viewed under the same heinous light as the abortion pill thing?

 

Ok just to say lol scenario 2 happened in an episode of law and order svu, John Stamps did that and had all these kids like 20 and he would just up and leave them but I think he financially supported them idk. Also the abortion pill thing happened in L&O SVU because this college guy got his February pregnant and she was all in love with him and wanted to keep it but he was off raping other women and hooking up and stuff and when she told him he made this lube with some abortion inducer and had sex with her and she lost the baby (obviously) but because she didnt get medical attention some was left in her and she died and he was charged with murder. Ok the end:) proceed

[ImperfectionisBeauty]

No. He went in and then I asked if he had one on and he said no he'd pull out but I knew that I was pregnant then because he just came in a condom and sperm live for hours.

 

They didnt have plan b pills then? How come you weren't on BC? In the end I don't think you can say he "tricked you" when you knew he was condomless and didn't try to stop him

[amaysngrace]

They didnt have plan b pills then? How come you weren't on BC? In the end I don't think you can say he "tricked you" when you knew he was condomless and didn't try to stop him

 

No they didn't have plan b sixteen years ago.

 

And I trusted that he wasn't condomless because I told him he needed to wear one.

 

I thought he'd honor that. But he's a scumbag who only cares about himself.

[Mme. Chaucer]

It's the one and only form of socially acceptable fraud.

 

It's not socially acceptable. I have never met a single person who would find it so, and though I haven't read this entire thread, I would venture to guess that IB might be the one and only regular member of LS who would consider such a thing.

 

It's immoral, fraudulent, and sleazy to "trap" someone into creating a human life, for God's sake.

 

Creating human lives is not an activity people are supposed to be doing just because they "wanna." Get a doll.

[Mme. Chaucer]

I mean I guess I would consider it if I wasn't in a relationship by the time 30 hits but idk its weird to just pick some random persons sperms

 

Picking a sperm donor is a lot less "random" than potentially getting pregnant by one of the losers you've had sex with in your life so far, who you've barely known. You can learn a lot about the donors.