How to decide if MM is a player

[Blue73]

Hello all- please no judgements just looking for some advise. (I am MW)

 

I am involved with a MM for about a 1.5 months now. Our emotional connection was intense right from the start even before we met and our physical connection is off the charts.

 

MM is the most romantic man I have ever met. He refused to sleep with me until he could spend the night with me and hold me, he made sure there was wine, candles, gifts (the non sexual kind) and even called down to the spa and made sure I had a massage while he went to work. The second business trip was even more special than the first and there were gift bags waiting for me in the hotel as well as little "thoughtful"- again non sexual, gifts throughout the business trip. ALOT of time and effort/planning was obviously put into this. I am a literal thinker and think this is all BS! Is this guy a player? My logical side wants to say yes but he finds every way to stay in contact with me- several times a day emails, texts and wants to talk at least once per day even on weekends.

 

His reason for his A is because passion in his marriage is gone and he misses it. I just have a red flag going up because there are way tooooo many little thoughtful conversations and gifts that are perfectly planned so early in a relationship like he has done this several times.

 

FYI this is both of our 2nd affairs. His most recent ended 4 months ago which puts me a little on edge as he did love her. Another reason why I am a bit skeptical, how can you be done with someone you loved for two years only 4 months ago and already produce actions like your are falling for someone else? Did he lure me into the emotional piece on purpose?

 

Thank you for your insight for those that have seen all walks of affair life.

[MissBee]

He may not be a player per se, but some people live for romance and how that makes them feel, esp. if they are on the rebound or are the type who hope from one relationship to another. It's all very new so it makes sense he'd be doing this and esp. if he is is not over his other OW, sometimes people use that energy to be extremely invested (too early) into a new person to compensate.

 

What do you want from this affair? It's your second, his second....I mean....what is your ultimate wish? Enjoy and have fun til it ends or do you expect it to be like a normal relationship where you're heavily emotionally invested, in love and exclusive? IMO...it's best to just enjoy the romance for what it's worth than for either of you to try to invest in each other, as red flags, besides the obvious, that you are both serial cheaters, abound.

[mammasita]

The title of this thread is such a big fat oxymoron. I'm definitely not judging you and your choices, but any married man or women who pursues an affair is a player. How can you not be?

 

Maybe he is not a player in the sense that notches are being carved in bedposts or that he is looking to be deceitful, but a player none the less.

[Pierre]

The title of this thread is such a big fat oxymoron. I'm definitely not judging you and your choices, but any married man or women who pursues an affair is a player. How can you not be?

 

Maybe he is not a player in the sense that notches are being carved in bedposts or that he is looking to be deceitful, but a player none the less.

 

I think both of the MM and the OP MW are players. As a player the OP can tell MM is a player.

 

 

Men that are over the top romantic so early in the game are probably sociopaths. These men know how to pick susceptible women. I hope OP can see through all the BS.

[scatterd]

He sounds like a player to me. You say he misses the passion in his marriage and that is why he does this.

If he romanced his wife the way he has you he most likely would have more passion in his marriage. I understand how you wonder with him just doing this 4 months ago also. Try to guard your heart.

[whichwayisup]

I am a literal thinker and think this is all BS! Is this guy a player?

He seems in it for the fact that it's fun and just an affair, since you say he's had an affair before.

 

What is it that you are looking for in him and by having an A with him? Are you hoping that he is in love with you, thinks you're special? Do you want him some day to leave his wife and be with you? Do you have plans to leave and divorce your husband? Hope it's okay that I've asked you some questions.

[Blue73]

Thank you for the comments- for clarification on some of your questions:

 

We both are happily married- Not getting divorced for serious personal reasons on both ends. (We do NOT want Divorces and feel very strong about it). Our first Affairs were different and he said this is so much more emotional than his first affair even though he loved her and cared about her. They really ended 8 months ago but the final straw was 4 months ago. She adopted a baby emotions were being dragged away from her family. He wanted her to enjoy this time of her life with new baby and spouse. (BS??? I don’t know) He just said that she was so emotional all the time and he felt guilty about her actions and behaviors and it became not enjoyable.

Ultimate wish: To enjoy this relationship fully in love for as long as it will allow- we both agree on this. I am missing that from my marriage and it feels nice to have it for once in my life. We both want exclusive and yes he has tried to romance his wife, after his boys were born his wife wanted no part of romance and runs around every day focusing on kids. She never wants to be intimate and pushes him away. Although she is a very kind woman, she just not emotionally feed him. I believe he is the kind of man that really loves doing this kind of stuff- but it just seems so perfectly planned.

 

NO I DO NOT want him to leave his spouse for me… one – it will destroy both our children also I could never trust him.- that is no way to live. I already live with one spouse I don’t trust. I am concerned that this is all smoke and mirrors and while I would love to be the only “side” person he can’t live without and vice versa (understanding we will never really ever be together)

 

“Men that are over the top romantic so early in the game are probably sociopaths. These men know how to pick susceptible women. I hope OP can see through all the BS.”- Thank you for that comment- that what scares the crap out of me and will guard my heart! Any other things I should look out for?

Edited June 17, 2013 by Blue73
font messed up

[veryhappy]

Do you see any problem with saying you are happily married to a person you don't trust, while having an affair with no intention to leave your marriage? What does happily married mean to you? That your family picture looks happy on a holiday card?

[Pierre]

his wife wanted no part of romance and runs around every day focusing on kids. She never wants to be intimate and pushes him away. Although she is a very kind woman, she just not emotionally feed him.

 

 

That phrase is standard and used by all philanderers.

 

You don't know anything about their marriage. He simply says what you want to hear so you will put out. This is right out of the MM cheater's manual.

Edited June 17, 2013 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[Heavensdreamer]

trying not to be as judgmental as possible, yes he is a player. He looks for what is missing in the marriage, and as soon as it becomes like a marriage he wants to leave. It sounds like he is feeding you what you want to hear. I am glad that you both have come to the understanding that you are both M and it is going to stay that way.

 

advice... DO NOT let it become emotionally charged. hard as it sounds, because of all the "thoughtful" things he does, it will become like a second M, and you both will start to exaggerate the flaws in your own M.. Enjoy the little things, and by all means appreciate what he does for you, but do not try to be more than his romantic break from reality. Beginning of any relationship is great, all the butterflies, the romance. Look at why you said he left the last A, she was emotional... nuff said.

[Pierre]

trying not to be as judgmental as possible, yes he is a player. He looks for what is missing in the marriage, and as soon as it becomes like a marriage he wants to leave. It sounds like he is feeding you what you want to hear. I am glad that you both have come to the understanding that you are both M and it is going to stay that way.

 

advice... DO NOT let it become emotionally charged. hard as it sounds, because of all the "thoughtful" things he does, it will become like a second M, and you both will start to exaggerate the flaws in your own M.. Enjoy the little things, and by all means appreciate what he does for you, but do not try to be more than his romantic break from reality. Beginning of any relationship is great, all the butterflies, the romance. Look at why you said he left the last A, she was emotional... nuff said.

 

Otherwise, proceed with unattached sex!

[spiderowl]

His reason for his affair is because he is missing romance. What is your reason? If you are hoping for this MM to leave his wife, then think again. He is having great fun being romantic but has he said anything about leaving his wife? Even if he did, would it be true?

 

I've been lurking on this forum for a short while and already I'm reading lots of stories of MM being ever so romantic and attentive, but they don't leave their wives. They talk about futures with the OW, but they don't leave their wives. Some have left their wives after D-Day - for 24 hours - then gone back.

 

It does seem clear that in many cases the OW is clearly being romanced and deceived, in other words 'played'. The MM may even be deceiving himself about what he's doing, but it doesn't seem to bode well for the OW.

[Lillyfree]

yes, he's a player. your logical side and literal thinking should have you running away screaming if this is what he's doing after 1.5 months.

 

although, as someone already mentioned - it seems to be working for him. at least he knows what he's doing ...

[HonestNeurotic]

well - of course he is a player - i.e., he's "playing around" - right? That would make you one too.

 

Or do you mean that he has more than one OW? Some guys are serial cheaters, one at a time. Some have many women. Some guys really like to do the romance stuff. Some don't. But they still have affairs. Some have to be "in love" though I am not certain I understand that.

 

I think maybe it's just the high from the newness - there's all kinds of stuff you can read about the addictive qualities of kissing and chemicals and such. It's an ego high. It's a secret that no one knows about. They might really feel that they are in love or whatever - and maybe they are - but it's only within some very small boundaries.

 

Whatever you do - safe sex! Cuz you cannot know completely where he goes. Emotions get in the way - and well - it gets messy and complicated. Staying married and keeping a lover are really hard things to do. One relationship is bound to suffer - and one AP is likely to develop more emotions than the other. Endings are usually painful.

 

This particular MM sounds like a serial cheater. i.e., he always has an OW and he's probably learned what to do to keep her happy. Or what he THINKS makes her happy. I personally don't like too much gift stuff or expensive things as then I feel like an escort. That's just ME. Drive my guy nuts.

 

And that's all I know on the subject.

 

IMHO~ as always

[Elfie]

 

We both are happily married- Not getting divorced for serious personal reasons on both ends. (We do NOT want Divorces and feel very strong about it). Our first Affairs were different and he said this is so much more emotional than his first affair even though he loved her and cared about her. They really ended 8 months ago but the final straw was 4 months ago. She adopted a baby emotions were being dragged away from her family. He wanted her to enjoy this time of her life with new baby and spouse. (BS??? I don’t know) He just said that she was so emotional all the time and he felt guilty about her actions and behaviors and it became not enjoyable.

Ultimate wish: To enjoy this relationship fully in love for as long as it will allow- we both agree on this. I am missing that from my marriage and it feels nice to have it for once in my life. We both want exclusive and yes he has tried to romance his wife, after his boys were born his wife wanted no part of romance and runs around every day focusing on kids. She never wants to be intimate and pushes him away. Although she is a very kind woman, she just not emotionally feed him. I believe he is the kind of man that really loves doing this kind of stuff- but it just seems so perfectly planned.

 

NO I DO NOT want him to leave his spouse for me… one – it will destroy both our children also I could never trust him.- that is no way to live. I already live with one spouse I don’t trust. I am concerned that this is all smoke and mirrors and while I would love to be the only “side” person he can’t live without and vice versa (understanding we will never really ever be together)

 

“Men that are over the top romantic so early in the game are probably sociopaths. These men know how to pick susceptible women. I hope OP can see through all the BS.”- Thank you for that comment- that what scares the crap out of me and will guard my heart! Any other things I should look out for?

 

If you think like this, why should it bother you if he is a player or not?

 

Aren't you one to your husband?

 

His wife is running around focusing on the kids - maybe because he is running around after you and she has to? Why doesn't he focus on his kids? Does he not like being with them? Does running around planning romance with you take up his energies so he has to leave her to take up the slack? Maybe she pushes him away emotionally and physically because she is knackered?

 

It is one thing to have been swept into an A, but to not learn is something I can't get my head around, so forgive me for asking difficult questions.

[Blue73]

Thank you for your candid answers (Although I wish some were not so judgmental on this lifestyle)

 

clarification... I HATE HATE HATE the emotional baggage and the need to fall in love, do not want gifts and feel uncomfortable every time he does this.

I wanted to keep it light and fun. He is the one who keeps pulling me in deep. He knows that Im really a guy emotionally while he is the needy female. He said its hard for him not to do these things because he does not know any other way. He has asked that I allow him to do this because this is a bad situation and it makes him feel good to do these things and wants to take care of me. (whatever that means).

 

His affair ended 8 months prior to us talking (ups and downs, on and off again) until NC finally happened 4 months prior to us talking. I think he still cares about her and their relationship but she became way to unstable and he does not have "those feelings" for her anymore due to it. He saw the relationship destroy her emotionas and he felt he was the cause of it. Me on the other hand...Im not very emotional and can handle how deep we are getting so soon. Actually I enjoy it as it fills a great void in my life that spouse cannot provide. BUT I dont emotionally get deep very often and would be a shame to go in when this man is a player. (yes I know he is one and so am I on a certain level).

 

I dont think he is... but I also think I have some mega blinders on at this stage. I want to believe he is one of those men that is missing the romance and needs to fall in love and be emotionally vested to have an affair. (He has admitted this to me several times- he does not like cold sex...he gets that at home and does not feel connected)

 

AND I agree he is tellng me what he wants to about his life.. and Im telling him what I want to about mine, rules are a little different when married. Those people in affairs will understand this concept.

[whichwayisup]

What is it that you're looking for? You're all over the map with what you say.

 

(yes I know he is one and so am I on a certain level).

 

I dont think he is... but I also think I have some mega blinders on at this stage. I want to believe he is one of those men that is missing the romance and needs to fall in love and be emotionally vested to have an affair. (He has admitted this to me several times- he does not like cold sex...he gets that at home and does not feel connected)

 

You two are NOT in happy marriages, otherwise neither of you would be cheating. Each of you are broken inside, reaching out and filling a void.

 

And yes, he IS a player, and even you've said you are too. See bolded above.

[weedsandposies]

You're both players and him being married is a HUGE red flag. Do you really *need* him to fall in love with you? You're both playing a role. Just enjoy it while it lasts and stop dissecting all his moves.

[Livingeachday]

He definitely sounds like a sociopath to me. He did sense exactly what you are missing in your marriage and that is what he is feeding you: Romance, beeing desired, showered with gifts, feeling special. His ultimate goal is to make him the center of your life.

 

Can I ask you: Do you know how old his boys are? Cos I can sure sense a pattern here: His last affair ended shortly after his OW adopted a baby, his wife allegedly changed after she had the boys and that's why he started getting into an affair bla bla bla. Truth is: He wants to be the center of attention and starts to feel neglected when a womens love and life doesn't concentrate 100% on him.

 

Even if you tell us that you are less invested emotionaly - reread your posts. In the same post you tell us "He knows that Im really a guy emotionally while he is the needy female." and only some sentences later:

"Im not very emotional and can handle how deep we are getting so soon. Actually I enjoy it as it fills a great void in my life that spouse cannot provide. BUT I dont emotionally get deep very often and would be a shame to go in when this man is a player." Don't fool yourself girl - you are already in deep. Emotionally probably even deeper than him - cos he is following an ultimate gameplan with all the romance: To get you hooked - while you think you got the upper hand he is sucking you in. He ultimately doesn't only want to **** your body but your mind.

[jlola]

Thank you for your candid answers (Although I wish some were not so judgmental on this lifestyle)

 

clarification... I HATE HATE HATE the emotional baggage and the need to fall in love, do not want gifts and feel uncomfortable every time he does this.

I wanted to keep it light and fun. He is the one who keeps pulling me in deep. He knows that Im really a guy emotionally while he is the needy female. He said its hard for him not to do these things because he does not know any other way. He has asked that I allow him to do this because this is a bad situation and it makes him feel good to do these things and wants to take care of me. (whatever that means).

 

His affair ended 8 months prior to us talking (ups and downs, on and off again) until NC finally happened 4 months prior to us talking. I think he still cares about her and their relationship but she became way to unstable and he does not have "those feelings" for her anymore due to it. He saw the relationship destroy her emotionas and he felt he was the cause of it. Me on the other hand...Im not very emotional and can handle how deep we are getting so soon. Actually I enjoy it as it fills a great void in my life that spouse cannot provide. BUT I dont emotionally get deep very often and would be a shame to go in when this man is a player. (yes I know he is one and so am I on a certain level).

 

I dont think he is... but I also think I have some mega blinders on at this stage. I want to believe he is one of those men that is missing the romance and needs to fall in love and be emotionally vested to have an affair. (He has admitted this to me several times- he does not like cold sex...he gets that at home and does not feel connected)

 

AND I agree he is tellng me what he wants to about his life.. and Im telling him what I want to about mine, rules are a little different when married. Those people in affairs will understand this concept.

 

He is probably a romance Addict. People who are addicted to the high of the beginning of a relationship. They love being in love(infatuation). It usually last about 2-3 years. When the chemicals leave their body, they are no longer "in love " stage,they begin to look for fault in their partner(devalue) and on the hunt again(discard) for a "new love".