I dont think women realize the difference

[MrTurk]

if it truly does get harder for women as they age, I guess that is karma for them, for all of those years they rejected and friend-zoned guys, labeled them creepy, weirdo, stalker, that would be karma hitting them

 

 

That is too true. Not until a woman starts to lose her looks, then she begins to lower her standards, and change her attitude, hoping to quickly find a good guy to spend the rest of her life with.

 

Women will explain this situation as " I've dated the bad boys in the past....now I've learned my lesson and want to find a nice guy.

 

Wrong....you dont have it anymore, and you cant get any more bad boys, so now you are settling.

[Darkmaybehandsome]

I used to be a single, honest, non game playing male...and other than a bad time in my life when I was trying to get back with my ex, I had no issues with dating, etc.

 

In fact, I would say, compared to most of my friends, I've had the easiest time. First one to get snapped up, first to get married, etc.

 

So you have been fortunate that does not discount the genuine difficulty encountered by honest males.

 

Its not too irrelevant to point out that females do get to choose for the most of the time from a wider pool of partners as oppose to men who do the majority of the work with approaching women.

 

There seems to be huge misunderstanding i,e, if your a good guy and want a relationship whereby you can offer value to her, that you will somehow be treated with more consideration.

 

It can be confusing sometimes as men seem to associate the feminine-ness (is that even a word?) and some of the traits that nature has endeared women with compassion, kindness and affection that they somehow owe us Men.

 

Women choose who they want to give their time and attention to and corresponding affection and I sympathize with the guys who do not "qualify" for that affection.

 

The lack of understanding on behalf of females about men who do not "qualify" is beyond me.

 

Guys what do you think of:

Briffault's Law: The Most Important Thing You Can Know As A Man... - YouTube

[MrTurk]

This whole last page is just sad. I used to think I was cynical and a little jaded but this is bitterness and cynicism at it's finest. I feel like freaking Pollyanna. I wonder when men will realize that hating women gets you nowhere?

 

 

Most men I know feel that way towards women. The only difference, is many of them hide it, because they have an agenda, and they know they have to put on their act and smile to get the woman to like them.

 

Just because you dont see the above opinions and attitudes from men you know personally, doesnt mean they dont feel the same.

 

I am confident enough to voice my opinion and not care about if a woman doesnt like it. Women would rather choose the guy that lies to them, than choose the guy that tells it like it is.

[Roadkill007]

responses in bold

 

Most men I know feel that way towards women.

 

Birds of a feather flock together, was the saying?

 

The only difference, is many of them hide it, because they have an agenda, and they know they have to put on their act and smile to get the woman to like them.

 

So, not only do you hang out with misogynists, but some of them are also wanna-be-players?

 

 

None of my friends are this pathetic: no idea where you're meeting yours. Even though most of them are somewhat desperate about their social awkwardness, they don't try to turn the blame on women as a whole, and are still giving it their best...

[MrTurk]

Women choose who they want to give their time and attention to and corresponding affection and I sympathize with the guys who do not "qualify" for that affection.

 

 

And my complaint about who they choose....is that many women do not have good judgment or skills to know how to choose a good guy. Instead they are suckers for guys that play on their insecurities, and emotions, going for guys that dish out compliments, and tell them what they want to hear.

 

This means that a guy that could be a great guy, mature, good job, never cheats.....he gets passed over simply because he doesnt have the "game" that other guys have.

 

Many women are attracted to a guy that can give and take with her, that witty flirty banter back and forth, with a dash of arrogance. You can disagree, and say you arent one of those women.....but you cant disagree that most women do like it. They will always pick a guy like that, even though it doesnt relate to how he treats her in a relationship.

[MrTurk]

responses in bold

 

 

 

 

None of my friends are this pathetic: no idea where you're meeting yours. Even though most of them are somewhat desperate about their social awkwardness, they don't try to turn the blame on women as a whole, and are still giving it their best...

 

 

A guy can still give his best....AND be aware of what he stacked up against.

 

You all talk as if we're supposed to just smile and be naive...and act like the stacked deck doesnt exist.

[L1ght]

This whole last page is just sad. I used to think I was cynical and a little jaded but this is bitterness and cynicism at it's finest. I feel like freaking Pollyanna. I wonder when men will realize that hating women gets you nowhere?

Does loving women really get men that much further? I've been around the block and shown my love and affection to enough women to realise that by nature women are selfish, egotistical to an extreme that a guy could never ever be, self absorbed, self conscious, deceitful in even the most trivial matters depending on which way the wind blows, have no control over their emotional mood swings which always leaves the direction of the relationship with an air of unpredictability and all of this while taking zero responsibility for how much of an effect their behaviour plays in the failings of a relationship.

Generally I don't have any sadness or problems in my life until I have to deal with my latest partners emotionally fragile soul and weak mental state and I'm really starting to wonder if there is any point bearing my soul to a women and wearing my heart on my sleeve as I strive to fight for the good of a relationship cos it seems to me that the deeper a guy goes with a girl the more venomous the bite once she inevitably succumbs to her ever changeable emotional state and decides she wants something else in her life.

FYI I don't hate women. I'm just aware of what I have to deal with when I commit to one.

Edited June 27, 2013 by L1ght

[Roadkill007]

A guy can still give his best....AND be aware of what he stacked up against.

 

You all talk as if we're supposed to just smile and be naive...and act like the stacked deck doesnt exist.

 

 

 

 

The world is unfair. But if you give in to the unfairness, it kills your chances even more than even the conditions alone might. On the other hand, constantly fighting and struggling your way up, there's a much better chance of having someone recognize and appreciate that effort, whether it's a potential spouse or a potential long term friend. Getting an LTR isn't a race... we all go at it our own pace, which IS somewhat predetermined by our "skillset".

 

If you compare it to exercise, when you first start (assuming you haven't really done it for a long period of time), and you're exercising in a group (like a spinning class or workout groups, etc), you notice very much that you are lagging behind everyone. What they do effortlessly destroys you to a point where you're almost fainting. OFC being in this position is completely grueling, humiliating, and makes you want to give up. But consider this.... most people in that class probably also started from the beginning at some point(in terms of exercise), and for some, this class is what probably got them really into it. When you stick to it and attend regularly, and constantly push yourself to your limits, suddenly you're looking back to when you started, and you feel like a completely new person. OFC some people are more athletically preset than others. Some had a headstart. But if you don't push along, you WILL be left behind for SURE. And somewhere along the journey, you may even find more reasons to like yourself, making your smile genuine. So the next time you meet a girl you want to take out on a date, maybe you won't have a fake smile and can really just enjoy the date instead of over obsessing over every little "mistake" you make along the way.

[LOSTnMT]

 

 

I completely get what Mr T is saying. A significant majority of women now days are on the defensive even when you are just saying hi and being nice. I grew up in a small town and thats just the way we are we say hi to everyone. I have gotten to the point that I rarely say hi to women anymore unless I am interested in them, so basically never.

Edited June 27, 2013 by LOSTnMT

[MrTurk]

FYI I don't hate women. I'm just aware of what I have to deal with when I commit to one.

 

 

Well said. I feel the same. Yet it seems many people want to burn us at the stake for daring to open our mouths and voicing our opinions.

 

I know MANY women in person that agree with my view of women, and also agree with how L1ght explained women to be. But there will always be those women and some men, that will instantly fight for women, no matter what is said, and no matter how true it is.

[Roadkill007]

I completely get what Mr T is saying. A significant majority of women now days are on the defensive even when you are just saying hi and being nice. I grew up in a small town and thats just the way we are we say hi to everyone.

 

 

 

Do you live in a crowded city now? Because if that's the case, social dynamics are definitely different. Do you think if you lived in New York all your life, you'd even begin to attempt to say hi to every random person who walks your way? It's one thing if you're always in their life somehow (like if you were working at a restaurant they frequent regularly), but generally, in bigger cities, people pick their own "communities", and tune out those not in it.

[L1ght]

If you keep ending up with women who act this way you need to take a good long look at yourself. You are placing blame on them where it lies predominantly with you. You are so passive and insecure that you are easy prey to predatory women (and no one here is arguing there aren't predatory women). It's not your latest partners "emotionally fragile soul and weak mental state" that's the problem, it's yours. You possess none of the mental acuity it takes to reasonably look at a situation or series of situations and both make strides to alter your own behavior as well as look at their own culpability. You continue to select bad women then form your opinions around the entire sex as a whole. If I dated nothing but abusers it would say a lot more about me than it would about the men I chose.

 

You have oversimplified male-female relationships based solely on the (probably) limited experiences you have lead yourself to. You don't want to take responsibility for your own failings and poor decisions yet claim women are the guilty parties? You refuse to recognize how complicit you are in a bad relationship.

 

If you're going to make sweeping generalizations allow me to make a few of my own. Many women here would argue that 'by nature MEN are selfish, egotistical to an extreme that a woman could never ever be, self absorbed, self conscious, deceitful in even the most trivial matters depending on which way the wind blows, have no control over their emotional mood swings which always leaves the direction of the relationship with an air of unpredictability and all of this while taking zero responsibility for how much of an effect their behaviour plays in the failings of a relationship. Not to mention lazy, co-depedent, hypersensitive and passive aggressive. Does that make this true of all men? Of course not. Not even most men.

 

You 'wear your heart on your sleeve' because you want a mommy, not a partner. You're not fighting for the good of a relationship, you get with women who are negative influences and try to love and smoother them into the woman you want them to become. I'm sure you tell yourself you're the nice guy women are always passing over for the bad boys as well.

 

Its always the same counter argument from every women on the planet when guys tell them the truth about how they behave in relationships. "continue to select bad women" so what do you mean? Do you mean that you are better human being than every partner I have ever had? That's quite a bold statement to make since you have no idea how many women I had been intimate with in my life. Don't act as if you are any more experienced in relationships than I am and don't try to act like you are any better as a human being than any of the other partners I have been intimate with. "Easy prey to predatory women"? Excuse me but I'm the one who is the mental rock in my relationships and I know how to keep my sh*t together while my female partners always end up bringing unnecessary drama into my life. My comments about women being emotionally and mentally weak are truer than you want to admit and I know that I sure as hell aint the one who cries and gets upset about the silliest, lamest and pathetic things when I'm going about my day to day life. Women are fragile beings who have no control over which way their emotions take them and they lash out when their partners get sick of putting up with their nonsense. The only blame I could really put on myself is that I lose patience with the way women behave and I start to become less sensitive to their needs but what do you expect after all the crap and baggage women carry around everywhere with them. How does wearing my heart on my sleeve make me need a mommy in a relationship? I wanna f*ck my girlfriends actually and I have no intention of ever getting a women who can mother me or whatever the hell you are talking about. When I say wearing my heart on my sleeve I mean that I have been prepared to lay everything on the line for the women I have loved after allowing myself to believe that a long term future was indeed possible.

I noticed you just copied and pasted the points that I made about women and used them to make your own generalizations about men. Thats pretty lame actually and I expected that you would come up with your own arguments instead of stealing mine.

[number122]

Not to mention that these simple points does not work with men:

 

- no control over their emotional mood swings

 

Men are not ALLOWED to have emotional mood swings. These men are considered "weak" by women/society. Hence why you usually don't see a man crying... or making a fuss. We HAVE to be in control of our own emotions. That's what EXPECTED from us.

 

- an air of unpredictability and all of this while taking zero responsibility

 

Once again, this is wrong. We have to take responsibility for our own actions. We have to be "predictable". That's EXPECTED (again). For our decisions, for our actions, for our words. For everything. The option that we don't have full responsibility for these does not exist...

Edited June 27, 2013 by number122

[L1ght]

You spoke no truths about how I behave in relationships whatsoever and how you got that I was trying to say I was better than anyone I will never know.

 

 

 

 

You are so naive it's actually painful. You claim your female partners are always bring unnecessary drama into you life...how can you seriously continue to deny that some of the blame lies with you?? And being a 'mental rock' does not exclude you from being prey or preyed upon.

 

You also seem to have confused my use of the word predatory so let me explain it in a way you can comprehend: You are a captain save a ho, you have an obvious attraction to damaged, broken, emotionally unstable women. You no doubt exhibit these traits early on and as such, women in need of just such a man will naturally gravitate toward you. All women aren't crazy, we don't all cry about the ' silliest, lamest and pathetic things'. however the kinds of women you chose apparently do. Barring a death, I can't remember the last time I cried.

 

 

 

The women you choose are fragile beings. Not all of them. Understand that.

 

 

 

 

No one stole anything, what on earth do you think I italicized the words for? Really? I also unitalicized my own words.

I didn't even read your argument cos yet again you come into it with the approach that I'm naïve and that I know less about love and life than you do. Make a response where you talk about behaviour in relationships between males and females without trying to make out that I have no significant experience and then I might actually get past reading the first line.

[L1ght]

Or you have no argument because you refuse to acknowledged you own faults. I wholeheartedly apologize for my naive comments however as I can see that upset you. In fact, I don't think you're naive, merely stubborn and unwilling to see another point of view.

 

You can go back and read what I wrote or not, it's of little consequence to me as I have no dog in this fight because it isn't me who continues to find themselves doomed to misery with the same kinds of psychotic women over and over again...

To be continued...I gotta head into town. And no I didn't lie actually about reading your post and I was being completely honest, lol I still havn't read it. Its as if you think that you would make a response I wouldn't be able to respond to....who do you think you are? You obviously have a very high opinion of yourself to jump to such conclusions. Anyway I'll read it when I get back since you seem to think that whatever the hell you just wrote was so amazing I would be totally dumfounded and wouldn't be able to respond. Later.

[MrTurk]

I would move mountains to find the man who is in total control of his emotions the way you claim men are.

 

 

LOL that would be me I do not wear my heart on my sleeve, and I've been told its hard for women to read me because I rarely let my emotions overflow.

 

 

 

 

Earlier, a few of you were arguing over emotions and accountability, and such. It reminded me of Jack Nicholson in the movie "As Good as it Gets". He plays a writer, and is just leaving the publisher. The young female receptionist asks Nicholson a question.

Receptionist:

“How do you write women so well?”

Nicholson:

“I think of a man and I take away reason and accountability.”

 

 

 

 

I highly recommend watching the video clip to get the full effect

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

.

Edited June 27, 2013 by MrTurk

[number122]

I would LOVE to date these men. Where are they because I'm on my way? I have seen men cry, overreact, become overemotional (unwarranted anger is an emotion too); I have known men to 'make a fuss' over the most trivial of things including missed phone calls or a failure to 'check in' on time to a failure to say I love you at the end of every phone call. I would move mountains to find the man who is in total control of his emotions the way you claim men are.

 

 

I said "ALLOW", that doesn't mean that they are not doing it... I've met plenty of men who've done what you described. Now imagine how the other people view this... Is it manly? Is it attractive? The first thing you think is that "wow, he can't even handle this!".

 

Being in total control is extremly hard and demanding and requires a huge ammount of willpower. And now remember what I said in the beginning? This is EXPECTED from us, while for women it's "natural". It's accepted. You guys are allowed to freely let go of your emotions. And in our case?

 

 

 

 

You have taken what is supposedly expected of men by women and society at large as what men actually do. There are plenty of men who DO NOT take responsibility for their actions, are extremely unpredictable both in mood AND action and are reckless in almost every aspect of their lives. 'The option that we don't have full responsibility for these does not exist...' In what magical, nonexistent world? That option damn well does exist and men choose it every day.

 

Once again, I said "expected". That doesn't mean men will take responsibility for everything they do... We're humans after all, not saints nor gods... Sad thing is, this should be a normal thing ( I mean taking responsibility), but people are a lazy bunch and they love to take the easier path... Most of the time. Oh and one more thing: 'The option that we don't have full responsibility for these does not exist...'

 

I meant that it "should" not be an option.. Miscommunication on my part.

[L1ght]

Yes, because how on earth would me, a hysterical woman be able to say anything you wouldn't immediately be able to counter with your superior masculine adroitness? And yeah of course...my thinking I had something of value to say must mean I'm what...a narcissist? The way you talk to women man... see you later.

lol "Captain save a ho" ? You give me too much credit....I mean who is actually capable of being able to distinguish exactly the type of person a partner is gonna be before they hook up with them? You act as if I know exactly what type of person a women is before I even get talking to her when in actual fact the first thing that is on my mind is what she is gonna look like when she is laid on her back and I'm f#cking her. You see my point? How many guys really care about anything other than sex in the initial parts of a relationship? I certainly don't so your perception that I hook up with partners that I wanna rescue is actually total and utter garbage. Who gets deep with a partner emotionally in the initial stages anyway? It takes a good 6 months to a year before lovers really get to know each other and connect on a deep emotional level. My opinions about relationships are obviously based on being with a partner for a long enough time to build a bond with them as the barriers come down and 2 people really get to know each other so your opinion that I simply know a women before I have even built a bond with her suggests to me that actually its you who doesn't have a clue about how relationships work in the real world. It all takes a long time to build and once the honeymoon period is over you really get to know a person for who they are.

Soooooo.....uhm what made you think that I was incapable of responding to your comment that I'm a captain save a ho? It really wasn't that special and it didn't strain my brain cells as much as you seem to think it would. Anyway you said something about the way I talk to women? So what do you mean? Do you mean I should be more polite so I don't upset your weak little fragile mind? Surely that's not what you mean cos then it would pretty much prove my point that women are emotionally inept and get upset at the silliest, dumbest and pathetic little things. You asking me to be nicer to you or something? well that's kinda lame.

I know who I am and I know that I generally keep my sh*t together in love and life. Modern society gives women an absolutely massive sense of entitlement and at the end of the day you expect guys to put more into a relationship than you think you should put in yourselves. Its just the way things are....hopefully my next partner lets me f*ck her a lot so I don't have to focus on how much of a c*nt she actually is once I get to really know her.

Oh and yes you did pretty much quote my words and use them to describe men when you could have instead formed your own opinions without sponging off mine.

[L1ght]

Guys who have repeatedly found themselves with crazy bitches? Unless you're just 18 and horny, after you've found yourself being blinded by sex and lured in by a nutcase once or twice you kinda realize you need to start reconfiguring your potential partner evaluation process.

 

Sex is an inherent biological need but if you're getting into serious relationships solely based on how nice it is to have steady vagina that's an issue.

 

 

 

First off, I was "sponging off" your words, my point was that the EXACT things you say of women, women can (and do) say about men.

Lol that's the whole point.....All women are essentially crazy bitches. How is it possible I could end up with one particular women my whole life? That's not feasible at all and I'm just like anybody else on the planet who is open to dating partners of various shapes and sizes, race or religion....My point is I aint as picky as you say(as long as they are attractive) so the chances are that if there were 10 types of women on the planet then i've most certainly already been with all of them multiple times over.

[Star Gazer]

Tip: In general, they don't care. Harsh reality for many of us. That's alright. Not caring can be a two-way street. Good luck.

 

Wow. That's pretty inflammatory against women in general. I would expect more from you.

[L1ght]

Just like women who constantly, "miraculously find themselves in relationships with emotionally or physically abusive men, users, drug addicts, felons or general asshats, you continue to find yourself with women who are severely emotionally unstable. It's only after the second or third man that people will cease to feel sorry for this 'battered, used, abused, etc' woman and start to wonder whether maybe just maybe, the woman is somewhat at fault. The same is true of you. What are you doing to make you such a draw to these women, no, what are THEY doing to be such a draw to you? Are they whimsical, vulnerable, self-conscious, too ridiculously good to be true, etc? Because I promise you, we're not all like this.

 

Things never start out bad; they never do. You'd swear SHE was 'the one'. You congratulate yourself on having found this love and finally being freed of all the insanity your other exes brought you. She's probably attractive, smart, easygoing and all around fun. It doesn't last. Now, given your history, at the first emotional outburst your instinct should be to run. Far, fast and across as many states as your legs will carry you. You should heed that instinct but instead you stick around, maybe you tell yourself you're in love with that woman and are NOT a quitter. Maybe she gives good BJs or has a neat vagina.

 

Either way, you are determined to make things work. It's just a phase, you say, she's 'having a bad day/week/month/life', or worse "That's just how all women are". Whatever the case, to leave now would be accepting failure and defeat. Not to mention giving up the sex. For a man like you, that's unacceptable. Maybe you even tell yourself she NEEDS you. Perhaps she threatens to harm herself if you leave or worse, take everything you own, slander you or otherwise "ruin" your life. I don't know what it is or why, but you stay.

 

According to your own words I surmise you literally wait until you physically and emotionally cannot take any more. That's your own fault. You can't always help it when a person's character turns for the worst (it *does* happen) but you can damn well help how long you endure it.

 

You are then a victim of your own devices at this point because on any given day you have a thousand opportunities to say NO MORE very early on but instead you chose to martyr yourself to these women, internalize all your anger, disappointment and maybe a little pure, unadulterated rage and allow it to build until even all those nifty little mental defense mechanisms malfunction and the dam breaks. I mean honestly, look at the time between the moment you first thought 'This bitch is crazy and she's making me miserable' in your relationships and when you actually ended things. Or rather, when they imploded.

 

 

Like I said, we're not all crazy we don't all act like this. There is a clear patten to the women you date and it's not good. I'm not sure what it is, but it is impossible for a pattern to be random. There is something these women are doing probably very early on, even if its small that is a fire engine red flag, yet...you ignore it.

 

 

(The alternative theory is that you haven't been at all honest here and are blatantly doing things to make these women crazy. I don't mean sexually either. I mean something you are doing (maybe it's verbal abuse) is making these women lose it which would in fact make YOU the predator.)

Your opinions are all good and well(though Im starting to actually wonder if you have a life the amount of time you spend on here) but like I have said to you MULTIPLE times now.....I don't date one type of woman.....when will that statement resonate in your tiny brain? I will agree with you that perhaps sometimes I do stay too long because I wanna find a solution to the issues we are going through but that tends to be based on already getting through issues previously and fighting TOGETHER to make things work. Who doesn't fight in a real relationship? how much of a loser would a person be to run away every time things get tough? Nah I totally disagree with you and think male vs female issues in real relationships always end up boiling down to the same things, same tensions, same arguments, same emotional and mental strains, same misunderstandings, same lack of communication....etc etc etc.

Same story different vagina.

[carhill]

Wow. That's pretty inflammatory against women in general. I would expect more from you.

My life experience. Take it as you will. I don't care, seriously. And, since you and I have a history, it's not news to you. EOS.

[jma500]

responses in bold

 

 

 

 

None of my friends are this pathetic: no idea where you're meeting yours. Even though most of them are somewhat desperate about their social awkwardness, they don't try to turn the blame on women as a whole, and are still giving it their best...

 

None of mine are either. The women I have known and became very close to me were all very good to me and cared about me. Therefore I will never consider hatred. The best example of this was a former coworker of mine. She didn't want me driving home in a heavy snowstorm. I cooked a simple meal for us. Soon we were sitting on the floor looking out at the falling snow laughing and talking into the wee hours.

[MrTurk]

Hold on, I'm on Priceline booking a flight. What's the closest airport to you again?

 

But no, in all seriousness, in my experience men like you are not as common as we are lead to believe and I would honestly sacrifice a few limbs to actually meet one . Perhaps it's unhealthy that I prefer someone "stoic" or who doesn't wear their heart on their sleeves (I've got a whole thread on this subject in fact) but it's the way I am.

 

Cleveland would be the closest LOL Many women find it a turn off....because they cant read me, which means they cant speculate, which means they have to actually ASK!

 

Guys who have repeatedly found themselves with crazy bitches?

 

You always get the best sex from the crazy bitches !!

[Pompeii]

Wow. That's pretty inflammatory against women in general. I would expect more from you.

 

It's true. Women don't really care about the emotional burden the average man has to go through. For women they have support groups, social media, and friends. A man has none of that to vent through. He's just told to suck it up.

 

The release is at the bottom of a stack of papers, the bottom of a bottle, or the bottom of a bridge.

 

Sorry but that's the way it is.