Old Male Friend Resurfaces

[Guest]

Recently, my wife sat me down one night and said she wasnt sure about our marriage, and maybe wanted a break, and that something was missing etc. This was all a bit sudden, but we have been having a few arguments lately. Now, she did this the night after she caught up with an old friend whom she hadnt seen for 3 years. I did not know this at the time, but she recently told me he was there etc.

 

She has his number in her phone now, and has called him when I am not around. She called him whilist I was bringing the shopping in from the car, and she called him last night after she dropped me off at the pub (and I mean straight after!). She has said she spoke to him etc. and it was good seeing him again. She also said that next time she is over there she will call him and meet up so that he can meet our 2 year old son.

 

Now, I don't want to make too much of this situation, but it all seems a bit of a coincidence that after seeing him for so long, the next night she tells me her doubts about our marriage, and now calls him a few times when I am not around. She doesnt tell me on her own, and I often have to prod around her to get an answer about it.

 

What should I do, is it all in my head? And how do I go about saying something about it (given that I am trying to work hard on our marriage, and if I bring it up it will probably make her mad ... )

 

PS: She has never had a sexual relationship with him, but use to be friends.

[reservoirdog1]

I think your suspicions are bang-on. She may not have seen him for three years till recently, but undoubtedly they've been talking on the phone for longer than that. What's going on here is an emotional (and, hopefully, not yet physical) affair.

 

That being said, I think you need a bit more evidence. Have you met this "friend"? If not, you should suggest that she introduce you to him. If she resists in any way (especially given that she wants him to meet your son), that will be a huge red flag.

 

I think a bit of snooping on your part might be in order. Do they talk by email? If so, install a keylogger on your computer. You might even want to hire a private investigator for one night, to see what happens when she goes out to meet him.

 

People with respect for commitment and obligation don't just rush into the arms of others when there is "something missing" in their marriage. They try to fix what's wrong. Once you have a bit more info, you have to -- sternly, not angrily -- demand that she work on the marriage with you. She must commit to couples' counselling immediately. And, VERY soon, you'll have to insist that she cease contact with him. That may seem harsh, but he is a cancer on your marriage. She has a primary obligation to you, which you should remind her of. Your wedding vows didn't say "till I find somebody I like more."

 

I wish you the best... by all means, become a member of the forum and keep us posted.

[Guest]

I know a bit about him, but have never met him. She saw him yesterday when she went over to her parents house (i was playing golf). She told me about it freely, as I asked her what she had been up to. She said that she went over there for about an hour, and took our son. She said it was good catching up with him again, and she has always been able to tell him anything. I asked what they spoke about, and said said 'just things'. I really don't want to make too much of it, but it makes me feel uncomfortable. I know if I say anything about it, she will get upset and fly off the handle. But I don't know the best way to tell her how I feel.

 

I had a look at her phone this morning, and there were messages from him and from my wife. But it was all just common stuff:

 

wife: 'what are you doing, i am in the area. do you feel like some company'

him: 'just doing things around the house, have to be somewhere at 2pm, your married ha ha'

 

(not quite sure what that meant)

[Grinning Maniac]

Um...buddy...that phone message seems a bit suspicious. "You're married" ?

 

 

Yeah...red flag.

[Guest]

I dont know what was said for him to give that message, because it was on its own message 'your married ha ha'. I know he couldn't believe it, when my wife told him she was married with a son. Maybe it was something in response to that. My wife is only 24 (i am 28).

 

The other messages where all seperate to - 'doing things at the house', 'going out at xx' etc etc

 

She didnt even tell me she saw him again, I had to pry that out of her - but she said it was good to see him again, and she could talk to him about anything etc.

 

He recently split up from his girlfriend of 2 years, and my wife has been really distant. I dont want to say you cant see him anymore etc., because that will just cause more problems. But I feel really uncomfortable about it.

[DazednConfused]

Hi;

 

Ya know, you are in your marriage and your situation on your own. I have been in roughly the same position as you and found out after the fact that my wife was sleeping with the guy.

 

Looking back, I see that I actually empowered her to do by beieving what I wanted to believe. I accepted her reasoning because I wanted to. I did not want to face the facts that were staring me in the face, much less act upon them and start a big mess of conflict and hurt feelings. And yes, she will be open and honest about seeing him until you express your dissatisfaction; then she will most likely stop mentioning him and continue her friendship with him on the sly. Then you will start having vague signs that she is further withdrawing from you, etc. She will give you the old "we're just friends" and make you think you are crazy for being anything besides trusting and encouraging.

 

If you are like me, you will suck up all the insults to your intelligence, and refuse to bring up the subject for a while... "she knows I don't like it, but she's gonna do what she wants anyway...so why start another argument?" - That was my mentality.

 

Guest, you and I are men. We know the motivation behind this other guy; he started talking with her in the guise of being her friend. She has opened up to him; and he now knows she is vulnerable. Whether he is after a quickie or a life partner is in question, but you can bet he will start twisting her emotions. You see, he knows what she is wanting because she "can tell him anything". Now that he knows, he can simply provide and she come willingly. (This is due to the fogging effect created by a new inter-personal relationship).

 

I will not say that she is having an affair with this guy. You may be correct and they may possibly "Just be friends" But the very fact that you are uncomfortable should be telling you something.

 

If you want to keep her, talk with your wife. Don't talk at, don't talk to, talk with your wife. Be honest, sincere, and understanding. Hear what she has to say and stay civilized. Don't let her put heel marks in your back, but be prepared to hear some things you don't want to.

 

None of it is going to be easy. But in the end, you will both feel the better for it.

 

I wish you the best of luck.

 

-Dazed

[jmargel]

What you need to do is tell her "This friend of yours is making me uncomfortable by the things you two are saying or doing together, and it seems like lately things have been distant between us". Sounds like she's not mature enough for marriage, that she sees something 'shiny and new' and like a kid needs to have it.

 

If she values your love then she knows what the right thing to do is. Have you ever met this guy in person? Right now this guy is probably her emotional tampon, hoping to get more out of ths whole situation. Him saying 'You're married', though is actually showing that he is declining her advances. He's leery about the situation, as well as he probably still wants something to do with his ex gf.

 

You two need marriage counseling. 24 to me, sounds too young to be married. Has she ever lived by herself? How long have you been married, how long have you known her?

 

Right now she is probably infatuated with him, and eventually the newness will wear off. But she is being disrespectful to you and the relationship by doing this. However you are allowing her to do this. If she flies off the handle because you said something about it, so what. Don't let her intimidate you into accepting this kind of behavior.

[Owl]

Jmargal- Not sure how to do the quotes on this board, but you stated- What you need to do is tell her "This friend of yours is making me uncomfortable by the things you two are saying or doing together, and it seems like lately things have been distant between us". "

 

I have to say that from my personal experience, that is not going to be enough. I tried that during the course of my own wife's emotional A, and she did exactly what Dazed noted his wife had done...she said that they "were just friends", and that there was nothing for me to be worried about. She was empatic about that. It even got me to back off for a few days until I really couldn't lie to myself anymore. The truth is, a WS will almost never admit to there being an A going on (emotional or other) unless they're confronted by overwhelming evidence. Even then, they'll do their best to minimize, hide, refute, or otherwise deny it's going on if they feel they've got any chance of avoiding it. Affairs were meant to be hidden, that's a big part of the attraction.

 

Guest- I would never suggest you not talk with your wife. Give it a shot. But I would seriously recommend you listen to the warning bells if you start seeing response like what you've read about here. You would be amazed at how much I've read that could have been direct quotes from my own experiences. If you ever hear the words "I love you, but not sure I'm IN love with you"...panic. If you feel she's become witdrawn emotionally from you, then it is very likely because she's giving those emotions to someone else. If you really suspect something, you're probably going to have to "catch" her, and work it out from there. My suggestion is to do what I've read on these boards...if you suspect something, then think about what you're going to do BEFORE you catch/confront. If it IS true she's having an A, then what are your plans. Stay and work it out, or call everything off. Have them worked out before you go into the confrontation. If she's not having one, then what do you need to do to bring the two of you closer together?

 

Whatever you do, good luck to you my friend!

[Guest]

I did tell my wife, that I was uncomfortable with her seeing and talking to him. She said that they have known each other for 9 years (altho they havent seen or spoke to each other for the last 3 - 4 years). She also said that he was a wild boy, and described him to me. She then went on to say, that the only reason she didnt see any of her past male friends, was because we live too far away, and that I get jealous.

 

I asked if I will see him, and she said 'probably at xmas'. As we are having xmas as her family's house, and her mom really likes him (she said that)

[reservoirdog1]

Keep checking her emails and cell phone, for a start.

 

Secondly, tell her that you'd like to meet him the next time she gets together with him (if it's before Christmas), and see what she says. Based on what she said, it could be that she's hoping you'll just drop the subject and be satisfied with her reassurance. Only you can decide for sure if that's what you should do.

 

All the best...

[Owl]

Guest- After looking back at your original posts, and given the responses I've seen, I've got to say that it looks like you've got some serious concerns here friend. I really do think that what you've described looks/feels/sounds like at least the beginnings of an affair...emotional, or otherwise.

 

1. She's told you she feels like she needs a break from the marriage. (Sounds exactly like what I was hearing before I caught my wife).

 

2. There is another man in her life that she "feels like she can tell anything to". (again, big warning bells....there should ALWAYS be boundaries for opposite sex friends that you're not married to...my wife didn't understand this until after it was too late)

 

3. She's not being honest with you about their communication. (This was the final straw that caused me to begin tracking what was going on in my circumstance...) It's the dishonesty that MAKES it an affair. It was the dishonesty that nearly destroyed my marriage.

 

You absolutely need to start doing some serious thinking. What do you want to do if this is an affair?? Do you feel like there is a chance to rescue your marriage?? I can't really give any GOOD advice on what to do next, but can reiterate what I said earlier... she's going to continue to deny it unless you can flat out prove it or break her down emotionally to tell you the truth. Another option might be to discuss it with her friend without her present...if you think there is a chance that he would be honest.

 

You might consider telling her that you would like to start counseling with her, since she feels like something is missing in your marriage. I don't know that she'll agree with it, as she may fear that the truth will come out during the counseling. Regardless, if you're intent is to keep your marriage, counseling will be critical.

 

I could be wrong friend...I've just gone through all of this myself recently, and am darn sure hoping I never go through it again. Again, best of luck to you!

[Guest]

I am having a very hard time trusting her at the moment. I continually look at her phone records, which makes me feel bad, as I am having to track everything she does. She has not communicated with him for about a week (at least she has not contacted him - as far as I know), but I fear that everytime she goes out she will want to catch up with him.

 

For instance regarding tonight, I said that maybe we should get a movie and relax (as she said she wanted to go out with her girlfriends). She said that she didnt feel like watching a movie, but wanted to go out and that her girlfriends couldnt make it tonight, so she said she doesnt know what she is doing. I immediately start to think, that if she wants to go out and she cant with her g/fs, then she will call him and see what he is doing and go out with him, which I will NOT be happy about.

 

If I go out, I can also not relax and I think she is doing something suspect, and I hate being jealous or doubting her. However, over the last week she has been really good. I am not looking forward to tonight as I think it will definately be on her mind to contact him.

[sami]

If both she and her mom like him then you got two against one. Now she is working on your son to like him two. What are you waiting for?. Talk it out or go out. Soon you will have no place in her heart if you still have anything left.

[jmargel]

Guest you are way over analyzing and thinking this.

 

Jealously and insecurity are broken down into two things. Once you fix these two things you'll feel alot better and so will she.

 

These two things are:

 

1) Getting irrational thoughts in your head about her wanting to see him / spend time with him every time she wants to go out.

 

2) Acting on these irrational thoughts by saying things to her or doing certain things.

 

In order to get over these two obstacles, the best way to do that is to take a moment that you treasure with her. Whether it was a year ago or just yesterday, it doesn't matter. When these irrational thoughts start popping into your head, literally tell yourself that's what they are.. Irrational. And replace those thoughts with the good one that you picked out.

 

Otherwise if you continue to do this you are going to push her into his direction.

 

Now, onto her side. Is she into any sort of depression? When there is depression, the person will lash out at the ones closest to them. How long have you two been married? Have you two considered marriage counseling? Most of the problems that come within' a marriage are because of misunderstandings / miscommunication. If these problems aren't fixed, they just grow.

 

If you keep asking her about the relationship then you must stop that. All that is doing to her is making her feel like you don't trust in the marriage. I think you are just a little paranoid about the whole situation and you are making assumptions about things that are not true.

[Cecelius]

I know this is a long term wife and not just a g/f, but this is shady in the extreme and only goes on so long as you let it. A decent person who is affirmatively in favor of their relationship does not intentionally do shady things. At a minimum, you're being taken for granted. At a maximum, she is involving you in a negative and selfish arrangement that is bound to be trouble: at the moment, it seems this guy is the only one between him and her who is worried about your marriage.

 

I would recommend that you approach her about counseling, but I would also recommend that you get accross to her, without drama or angst, that her relationship with him in this way is not appropriate on its face and that you're not going to be involved in this kind of thing. You need to be prepared for her to say things about how nothing will happen, or you are overblowing it or you are just insecure, but you need to stick to your guns.

 

I think she's already said tough break to you. I'd give it one more try, then walk. If she feels the need to act like this, more power to her, but you need to head out and do what you need to do.

[Guest]

Well, I was right while she was out last night she messaged him 4 or 5 times. No idea what they were about as often she deletes these things from her mobile. She didnt call him, but he maybe called her - dont know.

 

Am I still reading too much into this? I am going to ask her later today is she heard anything more from him. Knowing that she did, it will be interesting to hear her reply. If she says no - then something must be up. If she says yes - then maybe it is all innocent?

[Guest]

Went out yesterday for about 4 hrs with some friends, and guess what? She messaged him, and also called and spoke to him for 4mins (according to her cell phone bills). I have spoken to her many times about this, and she always says 'you've got nothing to worry about', 'i love you' etc etc. I also said that she needs to tell me these things when she speaks to him. She said that sometimes she doesnt tell me, because she doesnt want me to get jealous etc. to which I replied that probably is not a good idea - to keep me in the dark.

 

Anyway, why would she continually keep in touch with him only when I am not around? It doesn't make sense to me. I think I believe her when she says nothing is going on, but I dont understand why she keeps it a secret and does not tell me (i always need to prompt her).

[Bryanp]

Hello,

 

It seems pretty obvious why she continually calls him when you are not around.

It is because she does not want you to hear what she is telling him. It is pretty obvious don't you think. By the way, how do you think your wife would be reacting if the roles were reversed and you said you have nothing to worry about. Do you think she would believe such crap or do you think she would wonder why you have to do this, why you have to do it in secret, and why do you have to cover it up and not tell her the truth? I think this is a huge red flag and it is clear that your wife does not seem to care how disrespectful it is to you and your marriage. I suggest marriage counseling and fast. This is classic behavior of a person who is addicted to an affair.

[Owl]

Totally agreed. Everything you've described is not only classic signs of an affair, it also is EXACTLY what my wife was telling me during her emotional affair. "You have nothing to worry about." While I'm not there, I will tell you that I am convinced that she IS having an affair, emotional if not physical. You need to quit blinding yourself, and admit to yourself about what you think is going on.

 

Time for you to decide what you want to do. Do you want to try to reconcile? If so, you need counseling NOW. She'll likely refuse, deny, and continue to hide...you're probably going to have to catch her at it. That may mean "leaving", and then coming back to catch her while she's messaging/talking with him, and forcing the issue into the open. She's going to deny it until the proof is irrefutable...and perhaps even then.

I don't know any other way to do this. But I do wish you the best friend...

[Guest]

OK, an update. Everything has been going well these last couple of weeks or so, as far as I can tell she has not been in contact with him ... HOWEVER ... last night has put a serious wedge between us. My wife went to a pub last night with her family (I didnt go, as we couldnt get a babysitter). After being there for 10mins she messaged her 'friend' and to cut a long story short asked him what he was up to. He ended up coming down to the pub.

 

At approx 1am I hadnt heard anything from her, so I decided to call and see if everything was OK. No answer. I kept calling every 10 or 15mins for 45mins, until she finally picked up. She was at HIS HOUSE! Apparantly they went over to his house after the pub and had a few drinks. She said they were watching TV and she fell asleep on the couch and he left her there. When I asked why she hadnt picked up the phone, she said she hadnt heard it til now.

 

I was very pissed off, and she couldnt see that I had a problem with this, and he is just a friend etc etc

 

Now, wtf is going on here? I think it a little strange, that he would come down to the pub for a couple of hours, and then on closing decide to go back to his house, instead of my wife coming home. I assume she had to drop him home anyways, as he was a little drunk (which makes me worry even more). While on the phone to her last night, she also said that maybe she might just stay there, as she is very tired etc etc etc I ended up getting her to drive home, and I havent said a word to her since...

[Bryanp]

What an absolute slap in the face this is to you. I don't see how much more

disresctful and humiliating she can be to you. If you believe that she got picked up and went to the OM's house to just watch TV then you are in total denial. I think after all you have gone through she knows she can do anything and you will accept this. It would be hard to imagine that nothing physical took place. No consequences to her actions equals no motivation to change. She knows she can go to the OM's house after drinking and knows that you will get mad but accept this.

She is playing you for a total fool. She had made it quite clear to you that she will be with this OM regardless of how you feel. I see no reason for her to stop since again there are no consequences. At this point, I would suggest not being intimate with your wife until she is checked since it seems pretty obvious what she has been doing. How much more humiliation are you supposed to endure. Judge a person by their actions and not by their words. Her actions speak volumes. I feel very sorry for you.

[reservoirdog1]

My god. That pretty much takes the cake. People with respect for their marriages and who AREN'T cheating don't do things like that. You've gotten the signal to end all signals, yet fortunately you're on the ball enough to have noticed it and seem to be seeing it for what it is.

 

DO NOT, under any circumstances, allow her to placate you with an explanation or excuse. If she tells you that they're "just friends", DO NOT BUY IT. They are not. You have to be aware, as I'm sure you are, that they probably did the deed last night, if they haven't before on many occasions.

 

I went through something similar, very early into my marriage, only I was too stupid to see the signs that were staring me in the face. Don't make the mistake I did, and be bought off by her explanations.

 

If she values your marriage, she should be willing to do anything reasonable to keep you feeling secure in it. Starting now, you must insist that she immediately break of all contact with him, and she must send him a message / email / or phone him to tell him so. You should phrase it in those terms -- ask her which is more important, him or your marriage.

 

Bear in mind that she may do exactly what you ask and then keep talking / screwing him on the sly. Unfortunately, you probably will have to become a detective, and start checking her phone records, internet use and whereabouts. Don't lapse into complacency.

[Owl]

Guest- At this point, you know very well what is going on. Of course, you're wanting to doubt it, but I'm sorry friend... You are absolutely at the point where you have to make that decision. She's having an affair, there's no two ways about it. So, do you want to try to fix things up? You're going to have to lay down the law...make her come clean, and flat out insist that all contact with the OM end now. Counseling for both of you is an absolute must. But all of that only works if the two of you decide to rebuild your relationship. The other option=divorce. I don't know what the laws are where you live, but I'd start documenting everything, and gathering as much information as you can. I'd do that regardless of what your decision is. You need to contact a lawyer, and start working out a game plan.

 

I really feel for you friend. A lot of us have been where you're at right now. Good luck, whatever you decide to do.

[Cecelius]

Frankly, she's breaking up the marriage but she wants you to do it since she's too wimpy. She does these things to get to your breaking point.

 

Reward her. Go talk to a lawyer (and tell her that you did) about "for cause" divorce (I sense from your language that US divorce laws might not apply). Then let her know how you see things (you'll take care of her financially till she can get on her feet, since she clearly needs to be taken care of).

 

Lay a record down of why you are moving out (don't accuse her of anything but make it clear about the innapropriate nature of her relationship).

 

Then get out. Get out.

[Guest]

Well, since that night, I have had a look at her phone records, and the other night after I had fallen asleep she called him (it was around midnight). Last night after getting home from work, she got a call from him, which she freely took. I was standing next to her, at which point she took the phone from her ear and said 'are you f*cking right there? I am on the phone'. At which point I left the room. I came back after she finished and said 'i didnt realise it was so secretive' which she didnt really have a clear answer for.

 

Also, last night she had an appointment for her work, she turned up at this place, and called me saying there was noone there so she was going to go to her friends house (which proved correct). But before calling me she called him for 5mins, and then called me. I think it was to see if he was available, he probably was not, so she went to her other friends. Also on the way home from her friends, she messaged him just before she got home, probably to say she was home and she will speak to him tomorrow.

 

There are all these signs, which indicates an affair to me! But I do want to work on our marriage, and this morning she said she needed a hug, which I gave her and then she kissed me and said she loves me. It couldn't be innocent though, could it - between her male friend and herself?