I finally have closure

[WakingUp]

Waking Up: Who is exactly made you Judge, Jury, and Executioner on the matter? What makes you believe that just because he was the WS, he doesn't have a right to closure?

 

Go and stand upon your soapbox calling b.s. all you want, but it doesn't mean you're right about MMY, or his situation. Your thoughts and beliefs on the matter are not gospel, and in this instance, they are in no way conducive to the topic at hand. If you don't agree with it, fine. But unless you actually have something to offer to MMY in this thread, your post was not needed.

 

 

What I offer to MMY is this -

 

Do not send any more feeble texts to OW. Do not reopen her wounds.

 

Leave her alone!

 

Tell your wife you did this.

 

And RD I am just as entitled to have an opinion as you. Everyone deserves closure, yes, I agree. But MMY is still acting dishonestly by doing this and with no concern for either BW or OW.

[Pierre]

Let me get this straight.

 

A WH comes to the OM/W board and tells us he has closure.

 

That he and BW are reconciling, dancing laughing and dining.

 

His OW called NC on him over two months ago whilst going through a very traumatic divorce.

 

And we congratulate him for texting OW in the midst of all his marital fun?

 

We are glad he reopened contact and found his closure?

 

And he wont be telling his W that he did this?

 

How is this good?

 

This is not over. Not by a long shot. MMY all you wanted was to have the final word. I bet OW was not at all pleased to hear from you, however she retained her dignity and well done to her.

 

NC is NC. Not this.

 

I call Bull****. What a load of rubbish.

 

I think the congratulations were given to the OP. We don't really know what the MOW is thinking. From the posts it seems she is ready to move on.

[WakingUp]

I think the congratulations were given to the OP. We don't really know what the MOW is thinking. From the posts it seems she is ready to move on.

 

Then LET her move one. No contact!

 

I think MMY has been quite selfish with this action.

 

So Im just saying how I see it.

[JustAReformedGirl]

What I offer to MMY is this -

 

Do not send any more feeble texts to OW. Do not reopen her wounds.

 

Leave her alone!

 

Tell your wife you did this.

 

And RD I am just as entitled to have an opinion as you. Everyone deserves closure, yes, I agree. But MMY is still acting dishonestly by doing this and with no concern for either BW or OW.

 

I'm aware you're entitled to your opinion; it just seemed to me that you expected your opinion to outweigh everyone else's.

 

I do agree with you, that he should refrain from further contact. He needed closure, and he has it, now.

 

As far as BW is concerned...yes, it may be a little dishonest, gaining closure without letting her know, but I'm not of the mind that every situation that looks the same, should be treated the same. Things are getting better in his marriage; yes, if he told her, it may cause a hiccup, and yes, things could smooth out again after said hiccup...but MMY has a right to decide if him seeking closure really merits putting him and BW back at square one again. It seems unnecessary.

 

As for OW, perhaps you're right; she declared NC, so she had her closure. So by that same token, wouldn't it be selfish of her to seek her closure, and not expect him to need the same? Yes, it may have inconvenienced her. But that's the thing about life; in order for one person to be happy, another is bound to be unhappy. It's inevitable. Maybe MMY was selfish for doing it, but I can't blame him for it. After all, we've all been selfish, in some form or other. If someone tries to tell me otherwise, I'm not likely to believe them.

[WakingUp]

I'm aware you're entitled to your opinion; it just seemed to me that you expected your opinion to outweigh everyone else's.

 

I do agree with you, that he should refrain from further contact. He needed closure, and he has it, now.

 

As far as BW is concerned...yes, it may be a little dishonest, gaining closure without letting her know, but I'm not of the mind that every situation that looks the same, should be treated the same. Things are getting better in his marriage; yes, if he told her, it may cause a hiccup, and yes, things could smooth out again after said hiccup...but MMY has a right to decide if him seeking closure really merits putting him and BW back at square one again. It seems unnecessary.

 

As for OW, perhaps you're right; she declared NC, so she had her closure. So by that same token, wouldn't it be selfish of her to seek her closure, and not expect him to need the same? Yes, it may have inconvenienced her. But that's the thing about life; in order for one person to be happy, another is bound to be unhappy. It's inevitable. Maybe MMY was selfish for doing it, but I can't blame him for it. After all, we've all been selfish, in some form or other. If someone tries to tell me otherwise, I'm not likely to believe them.

 

 

Look, Im just not going to agree with you. OW calling NC was quite possibly her seeking closure... not final closure! Its a process, this closure thing. An ongoing process.

 

As an OW this really triggered me. It is, after all, the OM/OW board.

 

So yeah I feel a sense of entitlement to my opinion here.

 

It is NOT the BS, WS board, they have their own.

[JustAReformedGirl]

 

It is NOT the BS, WS board, they have their own.

 

If you're referring to the Infidelity board....nuh-uh. That is a veritable playground for BSs, mostly. Yeah, there are WS topics there...and as you've likely seen, they get eaten alive, there.

 

Besides, many BSs and WSs come here as well, to offer support and advice-ranging from sympathetic to enraged. I don't think everyone has to stay on one side of the board or the other; everyone can contribute in their own way, provided their manner is respectful.

 

Anyway, just wanted to point that out.

[WakingUp]

Well, as an OW my instincts are to stand up for the rights of MMYs exOW.

 

She may or may not have closure. She may be glad to see the back of him.

 

I just feel very strongly that after she has sought and maintained NC it is very unfair of MMY to text her in the midst of a traumatic divorce and announce he is working on his marriage and will never contact her again.

 

I actually do value the opinions of BS and WS. However I also think MMY needs to see it from OWs point of view.

 

I am just weighing in on the side of the OW here.

[JustAReformedGirl]

Well, as an OW my instincts are to stand up for the rights of MMYs exOW.

 

She may or may not have closure. She may be glad to see the back of him.

 

I just feel very strongly that after she has sought and maintained NC it is very unfair of MMY to text her in the midst of a traumatic divorce and announce he is working on his marriage and will never contact her again.

 

I actually do value the opinions of BS and WS. However I also think MMY needs to see it from OWs point of view.

 

I am just weighing in on the side of the OW here.

 

That's fair.

[whichwayisup]

Well, as an OW my instincts are to stand up for the rights of MMYs exOW.

 

She may or may not have closure. She may be glad to see the back of him.

 

I just feel very strongly that after she has sought and maintained NC it is very unfair of MMY to text her in the midst of a traumatic divorce and announce he is working on his marriage and will never contact her again.

 

I actually do value the opinions of BS and WS. However I also think MMY needs to see it from OWs point of view.

 

I am just weighing in on the side of the OW here.

 

The thing is, she isn't the (single)OW. She is a MW, married, just like he is.. Except she is in the midst of a divorce (or so she says, who knows if that's true) either way, she is still a MW, not single.

 

I knew she was going through a D and everyone on this board has provided me with great advise.

 

She did reply back, said what we had was real to her and that I had helped her in so many ways. Said the D (which isn't final) is so much harder on her than she could ever had imagined.

[WakingUp]

OK I will bite.

 

Please amend my post (which didn't refer to SOW) to read:

 

(Possibly STBD MOW)

 

Better?

 

Anyways, looks like MMY is too busy with the newly discovered dancing dining and laughing to respond.

 

With all due respect.

[MMY]

OK I will bite.

 

Please amend my post (which didn't refer to SOW) to read:

 

(Possibly STBD MOW)

 

Better?

 

Anyways, looks like MMY is too busy with the newly discovered dancing dining and laughing to respond.

 

With all due respect.

I will catch back up with everyone on Monday. but thanks for the view from all sides.

[It-is-what-it-is.]

I know that this is posted in the om/ow forum so MMY was looking for validation and celebration of his needed "closure" from people who themselves justify and excuse they betrayal of a marital commitment. So don't read further if you just want an "attaboy"

 

I think the thing that most jumps out is that by reaching out to get that closure, and the validation that what you had was "real" you are putting a lovely bow on a "relationship"... is a continuation of the self-centered thinking that allowed you to look for and invest outside your marriage.

 

It shows that you are still most interested in satisfying your own selfish needs over the well being and success of your marriage. Moreover you are justifying that with further dishonesty by not discussing it with your wife because YOU KNOW IT WILL HURT HER....BUT YOU DON'T CARE. You want what you want no matter who it harms.

 

I was disappointed in this because I had hoped based on your other thread that you were trying to invest in your marriage and struggling with the fallout, but now I see that you are really just trying to make sure you have your backup plans in place.

 

I hope that you wake up to your selfish wayward thinking before its too late, but it's probably already too late. When your wife finds out...and she will...she'll rightfully see this for the thoughtless betrayal that it is. She will know that she's not only not your first choice(you), she's not your second choice(MOW), she's your fall back plan.

 

You are still not "all in" and doing this and posting here so you get validation from people who have the same inauthentic coping mechanisms shows you may never be.

 

Do your wife a favor and let her go now. She'll get over you. But when you go back to your AP after her divorce (that's what the contact was for by the way...to make sure she still loves you) you will destroy her. Hey but at least you won't be alone, right?

[MMY]

I know that this is posted in the om/ow forum so MMY was looking for validation and celebration of his needed "closure" from people who themselves justify and excuse they betrayal of a marital commitment. So don't read further if you just want an "attaboy"

 

I think the thing that most jumps out is that by reaching out to get that closure, and the validation that what you had was "real" you are putting a lovely bow on a "relationship"... is a continuation of the self-centered thinking that allowed you to look for and invest outside your marriage.

 

It shows that you are still most interested in satisfying your own selfish needs over the well being and success of your marriage. Moreover you are justifying that with further dishonesty by not discussing it with your wife because YOU KNOW IT WILL HURT HER....BUT YOU DON'T CARE. You want what you want no matter who it harms.

 

I was disappointed in this because I had hoped based on your other thread that you were trying to invest in your marriage and struggling with the fallout, but now I see that you are really just trying to make sure you have your backup plans in place.

 

I hope that you wake up to your selfish wayward thinking before its too late, but it's probably already too late. When your wife finds out...and she will...she'll rightfully see this for the thoughtless betrayal that it is. She will know that she's not only not your first choice(you), she's not your second choice(MOW), she's your fall back plan.

 

You are still not "all in" and doing this and posting here so you get validation from people who have the same inauthentic coping mechanisms shows you may never be.

 

Do your wife a favor and let her go now. She'll get over you. But when you go back to your AP after her divorce (that's what the contact was for by the way...to make sure she still loves you) you will destroy her. Hey but at least you won't be alone, right?

We are all selfish in our own little way. I came to LS to try and gather the understanding of my "Mixed Emotions" I had read several post and decided to post my situation.

 

I never claimed to have all the right ideas and always knew that I had done wrong. I will continue to make mistakes in my life as we all will, I just hope that I learn from them.

 

As for my W being 3rd, you are wrong. I (at one time) not very long ago had her a lot further down the list than that. I had lost the things that make a marriage a marriage. I had lost my friend and found the things I was missing in someone else. There are very few people you can call your friend and over the last 18 months the AP was my closest friend I had. That was what I had validated. I wanted (yes for selfish reasons) validate that the friendship was real, knowing good and well that we will never see each other again. Did I want to add more crap to her life by doing that .... No... But she knows that I did not take my friendship with her lightly and that in someway during the 18mths we in some weird way helped each other.

 

She ended our conversation by thanking me and said she is waiting to see what God has planned for her... I told her to be still and listen because he will never let you down.

 

That was the end. Was I wrong, what will happen tomorrow, next week or next year. God only knows but as for today my wife and I are working on us and I think the people on LS played a role in that.

 

I hope to keep in contact and I hope that I prove you wrong.

[DelusionalOne]

We are all selfish in our own little way.

 

I had hoped to stay out of this , but I just can't. As a xOW I have to speak up as well.

 

This was NOT a little "selfish". This was a LOT selfish. I'm so happy that you found your closure by one last stab in the heart to your OW. How nice for you.

 

I pray to God that I NEVER get a phone call from my xAP "seeking closure" by, in essences, telling me how he made the right choice and is sooooo happy with his marriage and his W. Talk about rubbing someone's nose in it. Some things are best left unsaid... you know what I mean.

 

Sorry... to me, knowing that your xAP's life has imploded, doing this was not just selfish but cruel. But as long as you got closure...that's the important thing. It's nice to see that SHE handled it with grace and dignity.

[Pierre]

We are all selfish in our own little way. I came to LS to try and gather the understanding of my "Mixed Emotions" I had read several post and decided to post my situation.

 

I never claimed to have all the right ideas and always knew that I had done wrong. I will continue to make mistakes in my life as we all will, I just hope that I learn from them.

 

As for my W being 3rd, you are wrong. I (at one time) not very long ago had her a lot further down the list than that. I had lost the things that make a marriage a marriage. I had lost my friend and found the things I was missing in someone else. There are very few people you can call your friend and over the last 18 months the AP was my closest friend I had. That was what I had validated. I wanted (yes for selfish reasons) validate that the friendship was real, knowing good and well that we will never see each other again. Did I want to add more crap to her life by doing that .... No... But she knows that I did not take my friendship with her lightly and that in someway during the 18mths we in some weird way helped each other.

 

She ended our conversation by thanking me and said she is waiting to see what God has planned for her... I told her to be still and listen because he will never let you down.

 

That was the end. Was I wrong, what will happen tomorrow, next week or next year. God only knows but as for today my wife and I are working on us and I think the people on LS played a role in that.

 

I hope to keep in contact and I hope that I prove you wrong.

 

I continue to think you are a pretty normal person and your heart seems to be in the right place.

 

There is a difference between an OW and a MOW. The latter is very much like you. OTOH, a single OW is a completely different animal. For the single OW the affair relationship is everything, the relationship is her romantic life and she is 100% involved with no "affair bubble" or compartment. The affair is her one and only compartment.

 

The MOWs are like you: They live in two compartments: The marriage bubble and the affair bubble. Each reality in each bubble is quite real and valid. Once there is a d-day the bubbles burst and there is chaos.

 

Quite often the married OM goes back to the wife (as you have done). Sometimes the marriage gets better with a lot of hysterical bonding. It seems you are doing this.

 

The MOWs are a bit different, some go back to the BH and many end up divorced.

 

The main issus with single OWs is that they thought they were in the relationship for the long haul and most are blindsided by the d-day decisions.

 

A single OW is not likely to see your story as a happy ending. In fact, it is quite irritating. Nevertheless, most single OWs accept the outcome and move on. However, quite often the ex married OM stays in touch and this prevents the wounds from healing.

[lilmisscantbewrong]

I'm here to tell you that keeping this from your wife while you are reconciling is foolish and selfish. It is a bomb that will most definitely explode and send you back to square one. It isn't a matter of IF she finds out it is WHEN.

 

Most of us FOW (and I am married) want to know we meant something for certain, but so much of the time we find that the xom just wants to save his own a@@. He doesn't really want to look bad in the xap's eyes nor anyone else's. Mine could never, ever say it was over and I asked him to many times - he couldn't do it. I can almost understand if she came to you but she didn't - you reached out to her and that was probably one of the cruelest things you could have done.

 

It is also extremely cruel to your wife to keep this from her. And because you have, the further down the road you get when it does come out, it will be far worse - she will always wonder what else was said. I know this because of what I relayed to you earlier about my husbands encounter with his xow and my not finding out until 3 months later. I do not trust that this three minute conversations didn't have "I love yous" in them . Had he told me immediately then I would have had more cause to believe him, but he didn't and I don't.

 

Don't do this to yourself or your wife - you came here for advice and I am both a FOW and a BS - if you want to recover your marriage you must be transparent or it will limp along. I can handle my husband seeing the xow from time to time ( this is a very small area) but I would rather know about it.

 

Tell her.

Edited June 30, 2013 by lilmisscantbewrong

[spice4life]

I continue to think you are a pretty normal person and your heart seems to be in the right place.

 

There is a difference between an OW and a MOW. The latter is very much like you. OTOH, a single OW is a completely different animal. For the single OW the affair relationship is everything, the relationship is her romantic life and she is 100% involved with no "affair bubble" or compartment. The affair is her one and only compartment.

 

The MOWs are like you: They live in two compartments: The marriage bubble and the affair bubble. Each reality in each bubble is quite real and valid. Once there is a d-day the bubbles burst and there is chaos.

 

Quite often the married OM goes back to the wife (as you have done). Sometimes the marriage gets better with a lot of hysterical bonding. It seems you are doing this.

 

The MOWs are a bit different, some go back to the BH and many end up divorced.

 

The main issus with single OWs is that they thought they were in the relationship for the long haul and most are blindsided by the d-day decisions.

 

A single OW is not likely to see your story as a happy ending. In fact, it is quite irritating. Nevertheless, most single OWs accept the outcome and move on. However, quite often the ex married OM stays in touch and this prevents the wounds from healing.

 

Pierre's last paragraph is spot on. It's good your reconciling with your wife and it's going so swimmingly, but your contact with the xOW probably fogged her brain up again and set her healing back. You should leave her alone so she can heal properly and move on now.

 

Now that your focus is on your wife you should move it over to the infidelity board because this one is for OW/OM's single or married dealing with nuances of affairs or trying to get over one.

 

The fact that your story is going so smoothly doesn't really sound like your wife even knows that you had an affair? If she does I suspect things will change once hysterical bonding and being in shock wears off.

 

But anyway, good luck.

[spice4life]

I had hoped to stay out of this , but I just can't. As a xOW I have to speak up as well.

 

This was NOT a little "selfish". This was a LOT selfish. I'm so happy that you found your closure by one last stab in the heart to your OW. How nice for you.

 

I pray to God that I NEVER get a phone call from my xAP "seeking closure" by, in essences, telling me how he made the right choice and is sooooo happy with his marriage and his W. Talk about rubbing someone's nose in it. Some things are best left unsaid... you know what I mean.

 

Sorry... to me, knowing that your xAP's life has imploded, doing this was not just selfish but cruel. But as long as you got closure...that's the important thing. It's nice to see that SHE handled it with grace and dignity.

 

I agree with this 100%. Closure is good, but if you rubbed how great your life is going with your wife then I suspect you were actually trying to jab your xOW once before saying goodbye. Nice.

[WakingUp]

Yay, I wasn't the only person concerned for the MOW!

 

I must say this thread is the only one I have ever read that made me absolutely furious! I was so angry I was shaking whilst I typed.

 

Obviously some work I need to do. Interesting.

 

That's what I like about LS... it makes you look at yourself.

[thecharade]

Yes, WakingUp, I also want to stand up for the OW, and I am married, attempting reconciliation, and a former OW. I have no idea how she feels, but she didn't go Bunny Boiler or spout hateful venom, so why didn't you just let her be, MMY? Oh, right. YOU needed closure, so who cares about her or your poor, sweet W, right? Ugh.

 

1. Please move to Infidelity.

 

2. Please stop hurting women to get what YOU want.

 

I've written before about my anger and frustration with selfish men who use OW and destroy their Ws, so I need not repeat myself.

 

Good luck to all.

[JustAReformedGirl]

I mean no disrespect WakingUp and thecharade, but it really sounds like you're both projecting your own issues-past or present-on MMY's thread.

 

For one, OWs and MOWs are likely to react differently; that being said? There's no certainty that his MOW reacted badly after he sought closure, at all. From what I gather from his posts, she was understanding of his need for closure, and didn't kick up a fuss over it.

 

So I have to ask; why become indignant on her behalf? You're not her, and she is not you. She has experienced things with MMY that neither of you have with him, and likely knows he didn't seek closure in an effort to hurt her.

 

Just saying.

[Praying4Peace]

Hi MMY,

 

Some food for thought from me, take it or leave it as always

 

In your past posts you always seemed very upset about one thing in particular- that MOW walked away, hasn't talked to you, DID she care, DOES she still care...? It seemed like you missed her but mostly your ego was bruised. Yeah, that's totally normal btw, just calling your attention to what it seemed caused you angst (bc you always said you wanted to R with your wife).

 

Now, you got in touch with MOW and got that confirmation. I think you said she told you "What you two had was real to her" (what you needed to hear) and that "This D is harder on her than she thought it would be" (she's not having a great time without you and she's not reconciling with her H.)

 

That information caused you quite a lightness, which you are calling closure. You felt happier, you dined and danced and talked with your wife (but didn't feel bad at ALL about not telling her, maybe she would have understood).

 

I have a feeling this is temporary. You are on a 'chemical' high from talking to MOW, from hearing that she did really care for you, from hearing that your life is better than hers is so you don't feel like you were inferior to her H.

 

This is causing you to dance a little Irish jig (imagine someone clicking his feet in the air). Pierre often called this a 'hit' for the affair/heroin addict.

 

Ask yourself- why did you care SO MUCH what she was doing when you've got your hands full at home? Probably not because you care about AP but because it feels good to you to be wanted/missed/better than another man. Please look into this feeling, because when it comes back you may go looking to get it back from someone/somewhere. I'm not saying you'll cheat again! Maybe you'll go shoe shopping and come back with 10 new pairs?

 

Don't underestimate the power of the high from breaking NC. Yes, it even puts you in a good mood for your spouse.

 

Hope you are doing well.

 

btw- if I were in your shoes (and im thinking of my situation, not yours) and had that conversation with my xAP I wouldn't sleep all night, I'd be so sad that a person I loved/cared for was going through a difficult time.

[WakingUp]

I mean no disrespect WakingUp and thecharade, but it really sounds like you're both projecting your own issues-past or present-on MMY's thread.

 

For one, OWs and MOWs are likely to react differently; that being said? There's no certainty that his MOW reacted badly after he sought closure, at all. From what I gather from his posts, she was understanding of his need for closure, and didn't kick up a fuss over it.

 

So I have to ask; why become indignant on her behalf? You're not her, and she is not you. She has experienced things with MMY that neither of you have with him, and likely knows he didn't seek closure in an effort to hurt her.

 

Just saying.

 

Um... the devil is in the detail.

 

thecharade is an ex MOW attempting reconciliation. I am a single long term OW. And we agree.

 

So that says something.

 

You and MMY are both WS. And you agree. Something in that too.

 

I stand tall on my soapbox, my dear.

[waterwoman]

I don't know about the OW, I'm sure it was painful for her too, but it does seem also treacherous to his wife. Yes it's over, yes I'm sorry, yes I know you have been hurt and betrayed but I just needed to make sure that this was something important and I did matter to her and there was a time when I was right to not give a stuff about you and be quite happy to consign you and our marriage to the dustbin. Hmmm...... I think best to leave it all alone.

 

If H had had a little closure talk to his OW, compared notes, told each other that 'if things were differernt we'd be together... blah blah' i'd have felt betrayed all over again.

[sweet_pea]

Um... the devil is in the detail.

 

thecharade is an ex MOW attempting reconciliation. I am a single long term OW. And we agree.

 

So that says something.

 

You and MMY are both WS. And you agree. Something in that too.

 

I stand tall on my soapbox, my dear.

 

Well, technically he was also the OM and his MOW is a WS, too. But yeah, I agree with a lot of your points...