Found out wife cheated 7 years ago

[Owl]

I think there is some lost perspective here.

 

For her...this all happened several years ago, and she's had all that time to process it, and "get over it".

 

What she did then may be nothing like what she's doing now...who she was then may not be who she is now.

 

She DID cheat...not arguing that point. But that doesn't mean that she's not since learned to regret her actions, learn from them, and change.

 

With that said, I also get that the OP just found out...for him, the betrayal happened yesterday...and may well be still happening today.

 

That doesn't give him the right to treat her like shyte.

 

It does give him the right to decide what he wants to do in light of this information. Which is what he needs to do.

 

OP...you confronted her and got the truth. Granted, she followed the standard pattern of lie, deny, minimize, and blame-blame shift.

 

But now you got your confession out of her...

 

So...now what?

 

Treating her like crap is an option...but it won't 'fix' anything at all. It won't make you feel any better, it won't make her love you more or take back what she's done.

 

You're faced with the choice...is there enough left of your marriage to rebuild upon, or not?

 

What do you want out of all of this??? If you don't know...you need to figure that out before you do anything more to destroy options you may wish were still available later.

[JustAReformedGirl]

Most people minimize the affair; at most they only talk about the tip of the iceberg.

 

I don't think the wife is a bad person. I think she thrives on external validation and for some there is nothing more validating than to be sexually desired. I suspect the wife is turned on when she sees the lust in the eyes of the OP.

 

Agreed; she's not necessarily a bad person. She made a bad choice, a hurtful choice-but she's a human being, too. Her feelings are just as valid as OPs. I just figure with the confrontation, she could have saved herself, if only a little, by being more honest. Her denial only made the OP angrier. But yes, I do believe your theory to be right; she likely requires validation, and got it through sexual means.

 

 

OP has decisions to make. The main issue here is:

 

 

 

 

 

Is the wife simply enslaved by external validation and is other wise a good

person who cheated once. Or-------is the wife simply a chronic cheater that has

done this during the entire marriage?

 

That's what I wondered, too. Did he ever confirm whether this happened seven years ago, or whether it's continued for the past seven years? If the former, how frequently? I know, cheating is cheating, regardless. But still, knowing her motives could make a difference (at least if reconciling is an option).

 

 

 

I think there is some lost perspective here.

 

For her...this all happened several years ago, and she's had all that time to process it, and "get over it".

 

What she did then may be nothing like what she's doing now...who she was then may not be who she is now.

 

This is true; but it doesn't really erase the fact that while she was screwing around on her husband, she raked him over the coals for his own infidelity sometime after the fact. I'm with you on the fact that she's not necessarily the same person that she was seven years ago...but she attempted to continue denying the truth when she was confronted. Of course, it may not have been a cold-hearted move; more like a move borne from fear and desperation.

 

 

With that said, I also get that the OP just found out...for him, the betrayal

happened yesterday...and may well be still happening today.

 

Hopefully the key logger can confirm which it is. If he's even contemplating a chance of reconciliation, I can see whether it's still occurring or not being the deciding factor.

 

That doesn't give him the right to treat her like shyte.

 

Agreed; in his bout of hysterical bonding (and every time he gives into it, rather than exercising self control) he's essentially using her, getting revenge on her through sex. Not a healthy approach, in my opinion. But he did say it was out of character for him. His emotions are justified; treating her like that while he tried to make up his mind about what to do was not, so I agree.

 

It does give him the right to decide what he wants to do in light of this

information. Which is what he needs to do.

 

Also agreed.

 

 

Treating her like crap is an option...but it won't 'fix' anything at all. It won't make you feel any better, it won't make her love you more or take back what she's done.

 

You're faced with the choice...is there enough left of your marriage to rebuild upon, or not?

 

What do you want out of all of this??? If you don't know...you need to figure that out before you do anything more to destroy options you may wish were still available later.

 

What Owl says is sound, OP. Try not to act rashly anymore, if possible. You're upset and hurting, and that's perfectly understandable. But your actions can either make or break this situation-and I'd say it's very fragile, indeed. Use caution; and above all, come to a decision about what you want to do, once you have all the information you require.

[Pierre]

Agreed; in his bout of hysterical bonding (and every time he gives into it, rather than exercising self control) he's essentially using her, getting revenge on her through sex. Not a healthy approach, in my opinion. But he did say it was out of character for him. His emotions are justified; treating her like that while he tried to make up his mind about what to do was not, so I agree.

 

 

 

 

However, it seems the wife enjoyed the sex quite a bit. She had the big O. Like I said before, Those that seek external validation thrive on being sexually desired.

 

 

HB is not something that can be easily controlled. It is odd to be turned on by a spouse that is cheating. However, this contradictory response to infidelity is well described.

 

Sometimes, the wandering spouse gets HB as well with the threat of losing the marriage. A friend of mine discovered infidelity and the first thing the cheating wife wanted to do was to have intercourse.:eek:

[Owl]

However, it seems the wife enjoyed the sex quite a bit. She had the big O. Like I said before, Those that seek external validation thrive on being sexually desired.

 

 

HB is not something that can be easily controlled. It is odd to be turned on by a spouse that is cheating. However, this contradictory response to infidelity is well described.

 

Sometimes, the wandering spouse gets HB as well with the threat of losing the marriage. A friend of mine discovered infidelity and the first thing the cheating wife wanted to do was to have intercourse.:eek:

 

I'm not sure I agree. Both times, the OP initiated things...not the WS.

 

Of course she enjoyed it...why wouldn't/shouldn't she? Was she suddenly not supposed to enjoy it because out of the blue her H found things out (and she didn't know that at the time)???

 

Doesn't make sense...if she wasn't aware of his newfound knowledge...then why would you expect her to act any differently?

 

OP is the one initiating the HB, without his wife realizing that's what it was. How is she to blame for enjoying it???

 

Everyone in a relationship wants to be 'desired' by their partner. That in no way indicates that she's got some kind of unusual or unhealthy need for validation.

 

If anyone does at this point, it's clearly the OP...and that's totally understandable...it's HB, as you've pointed out.

 

None of what he's described of her recent behavior says anything to indicate that she's continued her previous behaviors.

 

Right now, the only 'test' of that will be the results of the keylogger.

 

The REAL focus here needs to be for the OP to figure out what it is he 'wants' out of all of this, and to help him insure that he's taking the right actions to reach his goal...and to make sure he's not preventing himself from reaching that goal with contradictory actions.

Edited July 3, 2013 by Owl

[beach]

I'm sorry for your pain...

 

It's expected that she would be surprised that you found out. Makes me wonder what else she's lied about through the years...

 

 

She obviously, was never going to be honest with you. Even when caught she didn't intend to give you her truth.

 

So, IF you'd never found that info - she would have allowed you to carry the load of being the cheater who did the hard work to dig yourself out of the rubble of your bad behavior...

 

When all along she KNEW she cheated too. And SHE never intended to offer up the basis of any healthy, solid relationship = honesty!

 

There is no way to trust when one half is THAT unwilling to offer honesty.

 

I mean, where are you supposed to go with that? What will the M be built on... More of her lies and cover up and omissions to suit her needs but hurt you?

 

She wants a different set of rules for you - rules she's not willing to play by. Maybe...she can change into a person that OFFERS HER TRUTH? If she can't/won't show complete evidence of being capable of changing the core being and soul of who she is and what she's made of - I can't see a reason to stay. Unless she starts changing...you're just stuck with a woman that holds YOU to high standards but can do whatever she wants as long as no one finds out.

 

He's like a 5 year old. Buy worse because her guideline for you is different than her rules.

 

You need to come to decision of what seems right for YOU...in your heart and your gut...and take actions to carry out your plan - whatever that may be.

 

 

Love becomes hate when you use sex to hurt, or as a weapon - please stop growing that bigger by participating that way. It hurts me to even read you using a beautiful thing in such a hurtfilled manner. You want to talk to her - then TALK. But I think you need to scrutinize your ability to justify using sex in this way. It's very twisty... Talk to your counselor about what you're thinking while you are acting this way - it could help you sort it out.

[Pierre]

I'm not sure I agree. Both times, the OP initiated things...not the WS.

 

Of course she enjoyed it...why wouldn't/shouldn't she? Was she suddenly not supposed to enjoy it because out of the blue her H found things out (and she didn't know that at the time)???

 

 

 

OP described the situation. I was not there. OP talked dirty during sex and the wife had the O. I would suspect the interaction was a bit out of the routine for these two. I also suspect the wife enjoyed the change in routine. I stated that the wife enjoyed the sex because another poster implied the act was not a good idea. Hysterical bonding sex can be very kinky.

 

 

 

OP is the one initiating the HB, without his wife realizing that's what it was. How is she to blame for enjoying it???

 

 

I did not assign blame for the orgasm.

 

Everyone in a relationship wants to be 'desired' by their partner. That in no way indicates that she's got some kind of unusual or unhealthy need for validation.

 

And all of us have traits of narcissism. I am talking about excessive wants.

 

 

The REAL focus here needs to be for the OP to figure out what it is he 'wants' out of all of this, and to help him insure that he's taking the right actions to reach his goal...and to make sure he's not preventing himself from reaching that goal with contradictory actions.

 

What does he want?????????????????

 

 

No one knows what they want immediately after a d-day.

[aliveagain]

Your problem is what is true, how can you believe anything she tells you at this point, she lies too easily. Will she agree to a polygraph to save her marriage? How will you get all the truth otherwise? Will her confessing to what you already know be enough for you to feel safe again? How are things going today?

[beach]

OP described the situation. I was not there. OP talked dirty during sex and the wife had the O. I would suspect the interaction was a bit out of the routine for these two. I also suspect the wife enjoyed the change in routine. I stated that the wife enjoyed the sex because another poster implied the act was not a good idea. Hysterical bonding sex can be very kinky.

 

 

 

 

 

I did not assign blame for the orgasm.

 

 

 

And all of us have traits of narcissism. I am talking about excessive wants.

 

 

 

 

What does he want?????????????????

 

 

No one knows what they want immediately after a d-day.

 

 

Pierre - in THAT moment - his W didn't KNOW he was using sex as punishment for her bad behavior.

 

That's much different as his intent was to harm or for revenge - out of anger. That rings negative emotions into an act that's SUPPOSED to be a loving and giving act.

 

The fact that she didn't yet know - indicates he was trying to overpower her with angry actions.

 

 

What is the intent moving forward...? It will be determined - but I hope more than anything that IF OP stays he stops bringing such power plays and negative emotions into an action that is SUPPOSED to involve love!

 

Looking back - his W has got to be thinking he intended to hurt her deeply. That sucks!

 

You've both now cheated and were found out. But what you DO with that from here moving forward still determines your integrity and character. I hope you stop the harm to self and harm to her!

 

And Pierre - I DID know what I wanted (or rather what I did NOT want) onD Day - I no longer wanted a cheater as my husband!!!!! And I went to great lengths to remove him from 23 years of my life history.

Edited July 3, 2013 by beach

[Pierre]

Pierre - in THAT moment - his W didn't KNOW he was using sex as punishment for her bad behavior.

 

 

That's much different as his intent was to harm or for revenge - out of anger. That rings negative emotions into an act that's SUPPOSED to be a loving and giving act.

 

The fact that she didn't yet know - indicates he was trying to overpower her with angry actions.

 

 

HB is what it is. It does not make sense! Why be aroused by a wife that has been unfaithful. Many betrayed men are overpowered by that sensation. This is not a malicious act unless the wife refuses to have sex, then it is rape. If you tell a man that he will developed intense sexual desire for his wife after discovering infidelity he will think you are insane. The natural reaction should be repulsion. However, HB happens. It is what it is.

 

Sex can be performed in a religious manner for procreation, but sex also has a kinky side.

 

 

Looking back - his W has got to be thinking he intended to hurt her deeply. That sucks!

 

 

I doubt that. She was ready for him. But, we can ask OP when he posts.

 

 

 

And Pierre - I DID know what I wanted (or rather what I did NOT want) onD Day - I no longer wanted a cheater as my husband!!!!! And I went to great lengths to remove him from 23 years of my life history.

 

More power to you. However, many other people are in such despair after d-day that they cannot think straight.

[Pierre]

She got blindsided by an accusation of infidelity from 7 years ago. OF COURSE she is going to lie and blameshift at first. Ease up on that. Don't read too much into it.

 

I agree.

 

Furthermore, the indignation of the wife with the infidelity of the OP was likely genuine. When a cheater is cheated on they can be very hurt and indignant. No one is more jealous than a philanderer.

[Owl]

HB is what it is. It does not make sense! Why be aroused by a wife that has been unfaithful. Many betrayed men are overpowered by that sensation. This is not a malicious act unless the wife refuses to have sex, then it is rape. If you tell a man that he will developed intense sexual desire for his wife after discovering infidelity he will think you are insane. The natural reaction should be repulsion. However, HB happens. It is what it is.

 

I disagree. His act of calling her a wh*re as it culminated was absolutely a malicious, angry, intentionally abusive act. She didn't ask for it, request it, or anticipate it.

 

He did it to hurt her, as he'd been hurt by her...but she had no idea that she'd hurt him in that moment.

 

It was an attempt at payback, pure and simple. It wasn't "claiming territory" as in normal HB...it was an act intended to degrade and insult her since he was hurt by her actions.

 

That is NOT 'standard HB'. I know...I've done the HB thing myself.

 

 

More power to you. However, many other people are in such despair after d-day that they cannot think straight.

 

Which is why our best 'support' here is to help him to get to that point, and to try to assist him in avoiding actions that he may later regret because they undermine a possible path he may choose to take later. We should be helping him to figure out what his goal is, rather than cheering him on in doing things solely with the intent of lashing out at his wife.

 

Don't take me wrong...I get it. She cheated on him.

 

But he needs to figure out what that "means" to him, and not let himself act the way he has so far. From my perspective (as a former BH myself) he's acted with as little control as she did all those years ago. He goes home with the theoretical intent of discussing things...but instead proceeds to take an entirely...animalistic approach.

 

He's got a history here too...and frankly from the posts I've read so far, I'd say he's more ruled by his 'instincts' than she is. We've only read of one period in time where she conducted herself badly...he's cheated AND he's treating her like crap right now too.

 

I think they both need some serious counseling, and frankly I find his behavior more appalling than I've found hers to be, throughout the whole thread. She cheated and lied....yep. He cheated as well...and now he's doing nothing more than seeking revenge on her.

[JustAReformedGirl]

Just for the record, this has never been true in the 4 billion-year his2ry of life on this planet, and it won't be true in the next 5-10 billion years when the sun swallows up the Earth when it leaves the main sequence and becomes a red giant. ...just for the record.

 

 

 

This has always been true and always will be true.

 

Just for the record.

 

-ol' 2long

 

So you're stating that you 100% know, for a fact, that every case of infidelity has to do with the "cheater" simply just wanting to cheat? There are no other reasons, no other excuses that trigger their behaviour? Can you really claim that? Do you know everyone of those WSs?

 

Somehow, I think the answer is "no".

 

Just saying; providing your opinion as fact doesn't work in every circumstance.

 

Before anyone says it (why must I always add a disclaimer?) I'm not condoning cheating; I'm merely pointing out that seldom are situations so black and white. The cookie-cutter generalizations are beyond tired.

[Pierre]

Just for the record, this has never been true in the 4 billion-year his2ry of life on this planet, and it won't be true in the next 5-10 billion years when the sun swallows up the Earth when it leaves the main sequence and becomes a red giant. ...just for the record.

 

 

 

This has always been true and always will be true.

 

Just for the record.

 

-ol' 2long

 

You are an absolutist.

 

Yes, it is safe to say with 100% certainty the sun will become a red giant and swallow the Earth. That is what medium size stars do.

 

 

But your black and white perspective on cheating is simply too black and white. To make your assertion true we must enter the metaphysical world.

[Pierre]

I disagree. His act of calling her a wh*re as it culminated was absolutely a malicious, angry, intentionally abusive act. She didn't ask for it, request it, or anticipate it.

 

He did it to hurt her, as he'd been hurt by her...but she had no idea that she'd hurt him in that moment.

 

It was an attempt at payback, pure and simple. It wasn't "claiming territory" as in normal HB...it was an act intended to degrade and insult her since he was hurt by her actions.

 

That is NOT 'standard HB'. I know...I've done the HB thing myself.

 

 

I guess only OP knows. We are trying to read his mind here.

[Owl]

I guess only OP knows. We are trying to read his mind here.

 

Well...it's not really mind reading, is it?

 

Not so much rocket science to read what's been said and done, and to infer the motives behind it based off of our own knowledge and experiences.

 

There's nothing mystical or 'metaphysical' here.

[drifter777]

She got blindsided by an accusation of infidelity from 7 years ago. OF COURSE she is going to lie and blameshift at first. Ease up on that. Don't read too much into it.

 

You are right - it's completely expected that she lie and blame shift. Although it's not because it was 7 years ago because lying and blame shifting are the cornerstone of the cheaters initial reaction when busted. Just sayin'

 

The way you are reacting is typical of a betrayed husband who just found out his wife was/is having sex with another man. Anger, hurt, shame, disgust are the most common emotions that a BH feels. Regardless of what any other posters say, you are entitled to your emotions and the right to express them as long as you restrain from physically hurting your wife (rough sex, if she likes it and it doesn't leave a mark, doesn't count here!). Even those who think that because you cheated or because it was 7 years ago you don't have the right to react so vigorously are denying you are a betrayed man. Ok, that said you will begin to think and feel more like yourself within a day or so. I don't remember if you are in individual counseling but if you are not, you need to start ASAP. A counselor will be a great help to you when the mind-movies of your wife in bed with this other man start intruding on your thoughts at random times. You also need marriage counseling if you want to attempt to reconcile with your wife.

 

One more thing; you have a right to the whole truth - or at least as much as YOU want. It's not up to her to pick and choose what facts she is willing to tell you. And remember that she is still going to lie about anything she is absolutely sure you cannot verify. Things like which sex acts she performed, how many times they met for sex, where they met, etc etc. She will withhold as many of these details as possible but, if you insist on the truth, she will give you a general outline of the sordid details. That has to be enough for you as she will take the whole truth to her grave.

[Owl]

I agree with much of what Drifter says/recommends.

 

Counseling will help you sort through this and help you get on track with figuring out what you want and where to go from here.

 

Your wife will almost certainly minimize and deny as much as she can for as long as she possibly can, and frankly you'll probably never know if you have "all the truth" or not.

 

You have to decide what that means to you.

 

The only part I disagree with Drifter on is how far is "too far" when it comes to lashing out at her with the pain you're feeling right now.

 

You'll have to figure out 'how far is too far' or not for yourself. Just keep in mind...you can't take words back that you've said, nor actions back that you've already done. Better to THINK before you act, rather than act and regret later.

 

That's my advice...and I will stick with it.

[beach]

Your actions and reactions define you.

 

My hope is that now that you understand how you HAVE reacted may cause MORE harm to the situation - that you might THINK things through before taking any action.

 

I'm sure you have enough to sort through. When emotions run high, doing nothing is better than regretting what you can't undo.

 

Better to calmly have discussions with your wife at this point. That way you can gain perspective on how YOU would like to proceed from this travesty.

 

What she offers you now should define how you make your decision. If she can get honest it may allow a new and improved beginning point.

[JustAReformedGirl]

More accurately "choosing 2 cheat." Of course, most people choose things because they want them, so that's also true.

 

Though that may be true, there are also people that literally had no clue what they wanted, and acted on an impulse.

 

 

 

 

Oh there may be lots of reasons, and there are certainly tons of excuses, but

none of them are valid that are attributed 2 the BS as "the trigger." That's

blame-shifting, or at best an inability 2 accept responsibility for one's own

actions.

 

 

 

 

I wasn't suggesting that the BS is to blame at all; I was merely pointing out that there are consequences to every action (or inaction). Of course the WS could have dealt with the situation differently; you will never catch me saying otherwise. I'm just saying, things are seldom so simple.

 

 

 

 

No, the cookie-cutter rationalizations for infidelity are beyond tired.

 

But that's just my opinion!

 

-ol' 2long

 

Honestly, I find cookie-cutter rationalizations in general to be beyond tired. I wasn't implying one was worse than the other.

[JustAReformedGirl]

I can only agree with what you say, until that black and white part.

 

Beyond that 2long, what you say is sound (IMO).

[dichotomy]

ISayWhoa,

 

 

I am sorry but my thoughts are it will be very hard for you to survive this. As I understand it :

 

first - You both cheated, but this is a woman who really took you to task for your cheating - made you work for it - will avoiding her own accountability and responsibility. At the very least you would have expected some level of letting you off the hook all those years ago for your infidelity because she did the same. At no point did that thought enter her mind "hmmm.. maybe I ought to take it easy on him as I am a cheater too". Nah - I will make him jump though hoops, get remorse and what I want - and take it easy on myself.

 

Second - you got the sex issue. She got better sex with "Brian" - and she gave better too (oral) she won't give you. Again, you might think after getting away with cheating herself and making you work for your forgiveness of cheating - she might think "ya know I ought to try to bring some of this heat to my own marriage now that this is behind us, I kind of feel guilty".

 

 

I don't see a way to repair these things. I don't see her ever being able to repair or be accountable for her actions.

 

I am sorry.

[janedoe67]

Since I am a WW myself I wasn't sure whether to post on here, but after the OP got called a few things I wanted to add my two cents

 

To me, THE crux of this whole thing is not even who cheated (because they both did). THE crux is that his wife (who had cheated FIRST) made his life absolute guilt ridden hell on earth and played up the faithful victim role to him and everyone else KNOWING she had already done the same thing. That to be takes things to a whole other unheard of level.

 

After my first D-Day, my husband called me the "wh" word on more than one occasion. And you know what? While I was cheating I was one. That is kinda one of the definitions of the word. And since he just found this out after doing hard time for his own affair at the hands of a woman who had ALREADY done what she was punishing him for....

 

 

I'm sorry, I just can't really fault him for any of what happened during the confrontation. She needs a ginormous dose of humility - which sadly is extremely rare for a wayward wife to have. Even lots of the ones who "say" they are sorry.

[twosadthings]

ISay,

 

It is true that it's only been a few weeks for you but you should look backward seven years. You talked about being dissatisfied in your marriage as a/the reason for your own infidelity. It is also true that being unfaithful never is justified but you must consider the thoughts and feelings you had at that time in order for you to talk about your current situation with your wife. I can only guess that the reason for your dissatisfaction was because of the lack of effort she was putting into your marriage due to the amount of effort and attention she was giving the affair person.

 

She is going to try to say that the playing field is now level but it is not. You came clean when she never did. She had her affair first which I suspect could have been the proximate reason for your own. She knew she had cheated but made your life miserable not only in the reconciliation in your private life but also with your councilor. I'm not saying to beat her over the head with it but be sure she understands the differences and that she takes responsibility for them.

 

Good luck and stay strong,

 

Twosadthings

[Chi townD]

I agree with JaneDoe67, I would be upset about her cheating, but I would be nuclear about the fact that she was the first one to throw away our wedding vows. And even thought I'm not defending his cheating, when she caught him she made his life a living hell for two years! And he endured her rath and accepted his humiliation and had to put up with degrading remarks all the while she KNEW that she was JUST as guilty of the SAME crime. She screwed some dude on several occassions and she laid it all on him for his cheating. And he paid for it in spades.

 

Also, he knew that this Brian character ended things with her, only to have her lie to him and informed him that SHE ended it. Which probably makes him feel even worse knowing that he was probably her second choice, her back up plan.

 

Really would like to hear a follow up on this.

Edited July 3, 2013 by Chi townD

[beach]

But that's part and parcel to this dynamic as well - is she sorry she did it? We know she's sorry she got caught.

 

He broke it off - yet she claimed she did (more lies).

 

Why did she cheat back then? I would need to know!

 

And how can he ever trust that she CAN or is WILLING to be honest - even moving forward when she also LIED to the counselor too without reservation? And why did she think she should get a hall pass when he was being punished? Is she narcissistic?

 

Well she continue to lie by omission?

 

Has she had more affairs than this one? How can one be sure after all her continued cover up?

 

What would she need to be willing to do to earn his trust back now and in the future?

 

And is that guys name really Brian? Maybe his real name is different. Where is he now? Has she ever had contact with him since then?

Edited July 3, 2013 by beach