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On the eve of something new and I'm nervous..


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Hey all, I figured it was time for a new thread. To read my "story", go here. http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t49042/

 

So, through the advice of those on the forums, people I know, and my own observations, I have finally come to the conclusion that I wasn't acting crazy in how I was interpreting my ex's actions. Why he has not made the final "move" is a bit beyond me, but I guess I'm in no hurry. Historically, he's always, always been more expressive in terms of how he acts than what he actually says. It was something I stupidly took for granted in our relationship-I wondered why he didn't tell me he loved me all the time, yet he loved doing me little favors, sharing his deepest/coolest thoughts with me, cooking for me, buying little gifts etc. So, that's basically what he's been doing these days, by the way. :o Last night he even took me out to dinner and coffee...on a school night! So, I'm following the old adage "Actions speak louder than words" and trying not to feel insecure and such.

 

However, I'd like him to feel comfortable to tell me how he feels-how do I do so? I'm not very flirty, or warm either. I try to be, but it's actually really hard for me because my idea of being warm or flirty is holding hands, rubbing a guy's back, or something similar-however it's not something I'd do to a guy I was not actually dating. So er, what do I do? I just want him to see through my actions that I'm also interested, without being literally all over him. It just makes me feel stupid, as I've said, I've never been the flirty type. Also, guys who overly flirt with me I usually become way disinterested in. I've always liked cultivating friendships before relationships. :sick:

 

Yeah, I'm not exactly "smooth". :eek:

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Hmm...

 

Just be affectionate towards the guy. Touch him a lot when laughing or talking and stuff like that. Give him lots of looks and smiles.

 

Say comments that usually point towards a person having a romantic interest but could also be audibled into just "friends" comments if the person isn't receptive. An example could be you two are doing something, having a good time and you are say

 

"you're so awesome (insert his name)"

 

but say it in a sorta casual way rather than holding his hands, and focusing on his eyes, etc.

 

If the guy has a clue he will pick up on all this and see you have interest and *should* make a move. However, if by chance he isn't interested (as you know, I think he is) and says something you can just audible out and say you are just being friendly and didn't see anything wrong.

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Thanks for the advice Wierd but...I'm not a very touchy-feely person; for instance, touching him when laughing, is really not my sort of thing. What your describing for me to do is be really flirty, which I'm not very good at-I don't like doing it. I would hope there'd be another way to get across to him that I'm interested without compromising that. I don't have anything against it per se, but it's not something that comes naturally and I don't particularly enjoy doing it-which would probably make a situation more awkward than pleasant.

 

Complimenting works though, yeah...but when you're as good of friends as I am with this guy it's not going to be effective on its own, I think. But, perhaps throwing in extra compliments here and there will make him notice enough to feel comfortable doing something.

 

Bah, I know I'm being difficult, sorry. :o

 

Honestly, I think everything would be so much easier if this guy and I weren't so terrified of being hurt again. :( As much as I know that he's worth waiting for, and this relationship is worth not rushing things, at times I really do get quite frustrated with the status quo. However, I know that's because as time goes on and he simply continues to pursue without actually saying anything, the more I doubt my intuitions on the matter. :(

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you're starting to doubt ... don't let that ruin things. realize that loving someone is an active choice. think about things that establish a romantic connection beyond just shared experiences -- i'd say write him a letter or some other small romantic gesture, don't spend every day with him, give each other some time apart to sort of "miss" each other.

 

I understand what you mean about the doubt -- I'm doing the same thing right now, doubting my own feelings about my ex since he's acting so weird. Make yourself less available to him and at the same time do some romantic gestures. He'll get the clue to pursue only when he can't see you every time he wants. Hope this helps at least a little, I know you're in a tough situation. Maybe try reading some books on relationships and dating at the library; some of those people really know their stuff. Good luck! :)

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Originally posted by Rayne84

Historically, he's always, always been more expressive in terms of how he acts than what he actually says. It was something I stupidly took for granted in our relationship-I wondered why he didn't tell me he loved me all the time, yet he loved doing me little favors, sharing his deepest/coolest thoughts with me, cooking for me, buying little gifts etc. So, that's basically what he's been doing these days, by the way. :o

 

awww! actions do speak louder than words, by the way. so do something active to show him that you're interested. it doesn't have to be a backrub ... how about returning those actions that he does for you, like cooking, sharing your thoughts (if you're not already)?

 

also, he knows in his heart that the longer he takes to come back to you, the greater the chance is that YOU will change your mind about being with him. maybe spend time out with friends and doing fun things without him -- it's kind of in the genre of "playing hard to get" though I find "hard to get" to be nothing more than the tip of the iceburg of showing someone that you love yourself and you are socially healthy, which is attractive to people. keep in mind that he needs time to himself too, even if he doesn't realize it.

 

the more you show him that you love yourself, that you have friends, that you go out and do things with them, the more incentive he'll have to make that final move you want him to make. and when you DO get back together, remember to keep doing those things for yourself without him. I'm assuming you guys are in college together, and you can end up spending almost all of your social time together. that can be dangerous to a relationship.

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Yeah, we are in college together and although we don't share any classes, we're on campus at the same time a lot and end up eating lunch together several times a week; not to mention he calls and IMs me a lot (I instigate those things at pretty much a minimum.) We're both private people, so there's not really a danger of overexposure, even when we were dating, thankfully. The problem is, most of our "real" friends are back in our hometown, so here at school we end up spending most of the weekends, together. I thought this would change when we sometimes went home on weekends (usually together to save gas money, etc.) but even then we see each other in one large group and he still pays the most attention to me. The one weekend I didn't really see him he kept calling to talk. So, I can't exactly get rid of him, either.

 

I do do things at times for him to show him how much I care. He gets frustrated a lot with his pig roomates (he's a borderline neat-freak) so one weekend that he wasn't feeling well I cleaned the apartment for him. Things like that. Sometimes if I make a sweet dessert in my apartment I'll bring it the next day for him at lunch or something. He knows I care...however I also have a very, very close male friend (gay) that I do a lot of the same things for, so if he thinks hard on it that's not really something I do just for him. The very few extremely close friends I have I usually go all-out for. I just tend to jump at the chance a little more for B. :cool: In terms of talking and sharing, I tell him pretty much everything...serious or not. We have so many inside jokes it's sick.

 

I all ready did that whole thing of not seeing him, talking to him, having other friends etc. a year ago; that's what brought him around to this point. Now, suddently dropping him and "doing my own thing" after we've been so close lately would be almost hurtful to him, I think; not to mention it's exactly the type of passive-aggressive behavior I employed in the relationship that was a major source of our problems. It may drive him nuts enough to do something, I'll agree there. I also believe it'd hurt him unnecessarily; and be fake on top of that. I mean, regardless of anything else, he's my best friend...you don't do that to a best friend.

 

Perhaps I'm being stubborn (in fact I am) but I simply refuse to be the one who brings up the topic. If he wants to come back so bad, he needs to be a man and own up to that responsibility. I won't tell you that the status quo doesn't irk me, but I've proven before that I have what it takes to just come out and say what I felt. He has yet to...and if the relationship would ever work anyway he'd need to ****ing learn how to do it. Yes, you could say that he's telling me all of those things "in his own way"-and I agree that he is. And although I have come to accept that that is how he expresses how he feels the best (through actions), if he has half a brain he'll know that's not good enough. If he doesn't have that half of a brain yet, do I want to be with him at all? No.

 

That's what I mean by "doubting" things. I know that I have come to love him again, and the properties of such are not beyond my understanding. I know, because I know him enough and can interpret the way he acts well enough, that he feels the same. What I do not know is if he's matured well enough during our break to sufficiently be in a relationship with me. His lack of saying anything yet acting the way he does proves to me, at this point, that he may not. What I also do not know, because it's not been said, is whether or not he even desires a relationship at this point. That's not totally ridiculous-he may just be being an a**h*** and keeping me on a leash until he feels ready. If such is the case and I come to perceieve this, then I will be out of there faster than you can imagaine...I'm not tolerating that sort of crap, as it's hurtful to me and proof that's he's just an immature ass. Now, I know B is a very kind person and stringing someone along is extremely out of character for him...he certainly didn't do it when he dumped me and I wanted him back very badly. He has a few girls interested in him now, but for whatever reasons he's not interested in them in any way, shape or form and avoids them purposefully to prevent them getting any "false hopes"; more so since school started and weve become closer. So I'd like to think B isn't stringing me along, and I doubt he is; but if I'm to be a good scientist I cannot exclude it from the realm of possibilities.

 

So yeah, I'm PMSing just slightly..that's why the tone of this post is abrasive. I know you all are just trying to help, and thanks. :o I just get so mad because I feel as if I'm stuck between a rock and a hard place with this stupid boy. Seeing how I abhor feeling as if I'm in those situations, if this seriously goes on any longer I'm out. This is no longer High School, for ****'s sake..

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Speak it sister! I know all about the ex acting like a chicken. It is annoying and I can relate to your frustration with it.

 

BTW I am staying out of your path for the next few days as i fear you'll bite my head off. :p hehe

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Oh, yeah, and tonight we're going to a concert with a large group of friends, so we'll see how that goes. I'll talk to other people and hopefully be able to prevent him from talking exclusively to me all of the time, or something. It's the most I could do. He all ready said he wouldn't let anyone else but me ride shotgun on the way there, so I'm stuck in the front with him for the drive.

 

Not sure what's up with the rest of the weekend. I think if he invites me to go someplace tomorrow night I'll just decline and stay in and read, or something. He needs a good rejection, I think.

 

Why am I so venemous today? (i know why.) Maybe I need some chocolate. :p I'm normally very weight-conscious (I used to be really heavy and over the course of a few years have lost quite a lot of weight), but I always treat myself at this time. :D

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I think he needs a reality check that you have a life without him and that if he doesn't come around, you will move on with your life. I don't have any ideas about how you can tell him that in a loving way right now, but think about it.

 

And remember if you do so it DOES need to be in a loving way, or he may feel that all of his effort that has gone into your relationship was not good enough for you and that you disapprove of him. That can be really hurtful to guys' self-esteem and it gets projected onto you. (That's an issue with my ex.) One thing I might suggest you do is read men are from mars, women are from venus. I've been reading it and it's so frustratingly true ... the problem is my ex and I aren't close enough yet for me to apply what I've learned from it very often. But I'd recommend it, it explains a lot of the differences between men and women and I've found it even helps me understand my own emotions in the relationship. a lot of it applies to what you've been going through lately.

 

I think guys can be reeeeeally slow to come back to the way things used to be after they've felt that all is lost, and that's extremely frustrating. I know my ex is acting like he doesn't need love and affection from me lately -- but I think that being patient and not getting upset will work to my advantage.

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Yeah, I do agree with you there, Unicorn. I read "Men are from Mars.." a very long time ago but I do not remember it much; it's my mother's book. It would probably help me for me to read it again. I don't know why I feel so frustrated lately with this whole situation-I think it's because he keeps acting like he does yet never makes the final move. Right now I just feel sad yet numb at the same time. I don't want to hurt him or push him away, but this is far too much to keep doing forever. Maybe I'll have to break my "vow" of not speaking to him about it, I don't know. It has been more than a year, after all..but the idea also makes me feel sick. Whatever. I'm heading to bed now. :(

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Today is pretty bad for me, emotions-wise. It's the first weekend night in weeks that we have neither spoken nor hung out. We've both been online at the same time and neither has messaged the other. Historically, he's almost IMed me first the most, but I do every once in a while as well...today there is naught but silence. All of my other friends have opted to stay home tonight, so now I have nothing but my own mind to haunt me on this Devil's Night.

 

After last night, I decided that since he's apparently either a.) not interested or b.) not man enough to tell me what's going on, that I'm going to have to do it, or I think I'll go insane. Much to my dismay, I have to admit to myself how much I had fallen back in love with him, and how high I had gotten my hopes. I tried my damnest to be a skeptic the whole time, but as you all have seen, his actions are screaming that he loves me, yet nothing comes out of his mouth. Sure, there was that two year period in high school that he loved me while we were friends and never said a word. That's because I was very obvious at the time that my feelings for him were completely friendship only, and he knew the friendship would have ended (or at least been terribly awkward) had he said something before I had feelings for him back. Well, I don't think I've been nearly cold enough now for him to draw those conclusions, but perhaps I can give him the benefit of the doubt and ASSume that there's a possibility that he could be very paranoid of rejection.

 

There's also something else about his behavior yesterday that's getting to me that I should mention. He seems to be acting...in some way..like I am already "his woman". These all sound like trivial events, but hear me out and you'll see why I'm putting this together and why I feel that he can't possibly think I have no feelings for him. Yesterday at lunch I was making my salad at the salad bar (as I always do) and he always waits for me while I sit there undecisive about what I want for 1,000 years. So, a week back or so he told me to try bacon bits on the salad..I had never really eaten bacon bits much, but I did. So, yesterday he's all like "put bacon bits on your salad" and I said snarkily "What if I don't feel like bacon bits today?" to which he responded "Just do it", so I did. (Usually I'm the one that tells him to do these silly things, seeing as I'm one of those short women with a total Napolean complex and he's the type of cool-tempered guy who lets myself and his similarly statured and fire-tempered mother boss him around all day; so this was an unusual order.) After I obliged, he just grinned and said "I've trained you well" to which I glared at him and said "Pfft." If I didn't like the bacon bits, I wouldn't have put them on there just because he told me to. So, we sit down and are eating/chatting/whatever, and start discussing this concert we're going to that night and driving arrangements (big group of friends requires 2 vehicles.) He was one of the two driving, and I was riding in his car as he was leaving later and my last class finishes late (for a Friday.) So, he mentions how he's going to listen to a certain CD we both like on the way there and why our other friends will be annoyed, to which I responded "Well, if x sits in the front he'll just take it out" to which he responded "No, they know better, that you're the one that's always supposed to be in the front." I was slightly shocked about this, as that was certainly never a rule post-breakup, over a year ago I was spending a lot of time sitting in the backseat while other friends, even these same ones, rode shotgun in his car. Sure, while we were dating I always did ride shotgun-that's "expected." I won't say that I haven't notcied that over the last couple months his friends insist on sitting in the back when he's driving, or sit in the front so he can be in the back with me when another friend is driving, or how he assumes shotgun and other friends sit in the back without him ever offering shotgun back when I'm driving. I mean what...has he told them how he feels so suddenly I have this pseudo-gilrfriend status? Ridiculous. Furthermore, when we were at the concert (well, it was actually a comedian) the comedian said something about chauvenisitic guys expecting their girlfriends to do everything for them (cook, clean etc.) to which he poked me and whispered "Yeah, go make me a sandwich" to which I retorted "Go make your own damn sandwich." I'm sorry, maybe I'm looking a lot into it..but I don't think I am. It's exactly the type of behavior/kidding around that he employed when we were together. If these are the "signs" he wants to give me, then he can shove it. Being possessive or acting stupid is not the mature way to express one's feelings, in my opinion. I just couldn't help noticing it..who wouldn't?

 

Here's another example of how he can be. Last night, I even tried to distance myself from him socially. As we were all ( a group of 8) gallavanting about the town searching for a place to eat, he continued to do what I've always noticed in the past few months: ALWAYS walk next to me, like a faithful dog, even if we weren't talking and I was talking to someone else..EVEN IF somone else (even another one of our girl friends) was talking to him. I tried walking really fast ahead of him-he'd speed up to my pace. I tried falling behind-he'd just stop walking till I caught up to him. If I stopped at a window to look at something "interesting", he had to stop too with me and look. Of course in the restaurant I pick the chair on the farthest end, and as always, he plops down right next to me. I mean, it's a bit cute when you think about it, but IRRITATING when someone follows you around like a lost puppy and you have feelings for them and they won't OWN UP to those feelings (if they're there, but the fact that I wonder and there's evidence like this makes me want to pull my hair out and scream.)

 

So, in conclusion, I've been thinking long and hard tonight about having this conversation with him..I think I have to to keep myself sane. The thought of being rejected again really makes me sick. I need advice, if possible. Is it the right thing to do to bring this up? How do I do it without freaking him out? If he's really just been scared I don't want to make him feel bad about it either (even though I sound harsh in my posts I'm not as mad at him as I may seem if such is the case.) Should I start out by telling him exactly how I feel or asking how he feels? Or, if in the end, I am looking far too much into this frienship please do not hesitate to say "Rayne..you're a maniac..he's just not that into you..get over him." Or, if it seems to you that he may have feelings for me but does not desire a relationship, tell me as well. Because if that's what crosses into your brain, say it. If I need to be hit with a 2x4 I need to be; I am being 100% honest about what goes on between us because I WANT to hear that if such is true. But, if it really sounds to you that he's got a lot of feelings for me and is scared, tell me why I should be the one to bring this up and what YOU think is the best way to do it. :o I can assure you I've never been this scared/distraught in a very, very long time.

 

Thanks in advance to anyone that helps. I know this was a rather long, rambling post to sift through, and I thank you for doing that. :)

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Calm down!!! :)

 

One of the best things about my relationship with my ex is that we never "defined" ourselves -- never asked each other to "be" something for the other, just grew together and fell in love, and from our first kiss we knew we were for each other. I'm having problems right now similar to yours -- when we see each other, it's romantic, it's sweet, he does nice things for me, he pays, he looks into my eyes in a way that gives me butterflies. But I'm not sure it means anything to him. It's something I don't know, and I can't ask him to define, and that I can't expect to define.

 

Your problem: you've got these great romantic experiences, but no formal definition. That makes you nervous.

 

Frankly, it makes me nervous too -- nobody wants to be the "friend," the "gal pal." We want to be the beautiful love-goddess that transfixes a knight in shining armor, who is mesmerized by us, who wants to be with us and kiss us and tells everyone how much he loves us and who would never think of leaving us.

 

I don't know for sure, but it sure doesn't seem like you're just a really close friend to him. But if you ask him outright, he may freak out and run away. Boys tend to go running and screaming back to their caves when they feel like a girl, even if it's his girlfriend, is trying to ensnare him.

 

For example, my ex once flipped out and told me to stop talking about marriage because I had suggested that I would want to get married before we moved in together after college. And HE was the one who had brought up marriage in this conversation, and who had proposed to me months ago. HE was always the one more sure that he wanted to marry me and have children with me, etc., the whole nine yards. I never suggested anything more than an affinity for the idea of growing old with my soulmate. :love: Well, when he behaved this way, I naturally flipped out and assumed he was being a typical macho guy, afraid of commitment all of a sudden. In actuality what happened was that my clingy behavior just plain scared him, because I seemed like I was possessive and insistent when in reality I wasn't. Hard to explain, I still don't fully get it, but my ex does. Anyway, that's a sidetrack, but still pretty relevant.

 

The point is, you're at a point where you can't reasonably continue with the way things are. Try doing something that in that "How to get your lover back" book we all keep mentioning suggests: the loving take-away. To do this you need to establish equality in your relationship by clearly communicating to this guy that you love him, and you want to be with him, but you are moving on with your life. I can't tell you how to do this, but you can figure that out based on your own circumstances.

 

And I'm sorry to tell you that "distancing yourself socially" means doing things ENTIRELY without him. Go out to lunch with another guy. Go to a party where he's not invited. Join an interesting club he's not involved with. Don't let him follow you around. He'll get the message ... trust me.

 

Anyway. I have to go now but this is what I have to say for now. This is really tough, I know. My final piece of advice (for now) is this: Don't say he's not "man enough" to tell him. Would you like it if I told you you weren't "woman enough" to give him a big kiss and tell him you love him? You say you don't flirt with him much physically, etc. ... that's not giving him the confidence that you love him and that he's your hero. All guys want to be a hero for their girl, or they feel defeated. And when it's a girl they REALLY LIKE and REALLY don't want to screw things up with, they're REALLY TIMID!!! They need some encouragement in the form of "I have a social life without you," "I love myself," "I am attractive to many men besides you." It may sound like playing hard-to-get but it's really just showing you love yourself more than anything else. Think about the loving take-away and try to figure something out.

 

But don't get discouraged. And SPEND SOME TIME WITHOUT HIM! Please! It can kill a relationship to be in college together. Go have some real fun. REAL fun, and don't think about him while you're out. Tonight I went out for Halloween and had a fabulous time -- when I started to think of my ex I pushed it away and dealt with it later -- and realized no guys I meet give me that spark that he does. Just reaffirmed the fact that I love the guy. And a night of dancing till dawn and having a blast with all of my wonderful friends will add a special glow to my face when I go out to dinner with him tomorrow -- the glow of self-love and self-respect, and of confidence -- I know there are other guys out there that are crazy for me, and I know my ex is going out of his way to see me -- I am wonderful. ;)

 

And good for you for not making him food. ;)

 

GOOD LUCK! I am proud of you for hanging in there and I know it's tough. Don't despair, and do go check out a copy of that Mars/Venus book in the library -- I swear it explains so much it's scary.

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babe, just tell the guy how you feel. All you are doing by waiting/expecting him to say something is making yourself go insane. Why would you want to keep waiting and give yourself even more stress?

 

Your posts scream of emails I was sending my ex early last year when I was trying to work things out with her. I'd have my emotions swing from being ticked off that she wasn't doing what I want (trying to resolve things) to telling her how much she meant to me. It was frustrating because I knew she still loved me and stuff but she wasn't doing what I expected her to do. In your posts you are doing the same thing...you say how much you love this guy and want to be with him then you go off on how he is being pathetic, is a pussy, is a lap dog, etc.

 

You can go and give the guy the cold shoulder by ignoring him and see if it works but all you will do is over analyze it all and make yourself mentally and emotionally explode. You are making the situation way worse than it has to be by constantly thinking about all this and me thinks if you keep doing it you will get to the point where you will get super pissed off with him and will blow up at him one night and he'll be like "wtf is that for?" since it will just come out of the blue. Don't hold in feelings because it NEVER makes things better.

 

I say you just don't play any silly mind games and tell the guy how you feel ASAP. It'll ease your mind but hey, if you want to keep playing the wait game and keep making yourself all stressed out then go right ahead.

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Thanks guys, for giving advice when I was having a really bad couple of days. Even though I hadn't read the book, Unicorn, I guess I basically did that whole love-take way deal over a year ago when I realized that our relationship was truly over and I needed to move on, which i did. It seems like now I'm not dealing with so much of an ex that I need to employ that kind of strategy as a good friend for whom i just need to bite the bullet and tell him how I feel (as Wierd said.) We spent months where we didn't see each other...going out and doing things without him at this point is not going to fix anything. I can assure you we were never one of those couples that didn't have other friends and weekend nights where we didn't see each other...because that kind of attactment would drive each of us crazy. On top of that, we're also people who need alone time from everyone in general. So, for that reason i'm not afraid of overexposure, really; nor do I think it's the problem. Anyway, as it is I do have friends he barely knows whom I hang out with, and several school organizations for which I have administrative posititions and he has nothing at all to do with them. So, I do have a life other than him and the friends we share in common...the problem is that most of them are back home 2 hours away; and none of my other friends up here were doing anything of importance last night.

 

I think you defined it well, Wierd. Obviously I am getting ultra-frustrated whilst he's probably wondering why I'm getting snappy at him..in fact, game-playing behavior is exactly what I want to avoid. It's going to be hard, (as hell!) but i'll just muster up the courage and sit him down I guess. I just can't help but wonder if this is the right thing to do if he has not instigated such a talk himself. :o

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Well, he invited me to his place to watch movies with him for Halloween, so I went. No, I didn't talk to him, as I really wanted to get my head sorted out before I did any of that sort of stuff; and anyway his roomates were home and "around".

 

First though, I decided to stop being an icy bitch and actually act interested in him (flirty)..and god damn was it hard but results were very good. He seemed very happy and was flirting hardcore back, and we had a great time horsing around and being stupid. :) I don't think I had been that touchy with him in a very long time (or with anyone but family..I'm SO not a touchy person) but he totally basked in it which made me bask in it. I basically had to force myself to leave, because we were having such a great time but there was homework to be done that i had neglected. He usually stalls when it's time for me to leave, but last night it was some quite bad stalling, heh. :p He said he wanted coffee then ended up just making some for me, then he walked me to my car and SAT on it and stalled me more by blabbing for another 30 minutes and being generally "cute". :D

 

I'm glad, because that was definitely something to build my confidence to talk to him. When to do this, is the main question. We're both very busy during the week with school, and I'd prefer to do it in person (not at lunch!); so I guess it will have to wait for the weekend. Guess I'll just be "flirty" until then, hehe. :eek:

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Nice:)

 

No question he wants your lovin again. I am sure you are totally convinced now. Dude if he isn't interested in getting back together then he is one of the best actors ever. If that is the case tell him he should go to acting school and then on to Hollywood.:)

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HOORAY!

 

See? All he needed was some encouragement that he's your sexy knight in shining armor.

 

It's not that unpleasant to flirt with a guy you like, now, is it? :D

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