Trying to understand a MM mind.

[9Lives]

Originally posted by izzybelle

jvjrose, i'm sorry that you were hurt so badly by your MM, i was hurt by mine too. and while i agree that in most cases the MM won't leave it does occassionally happen. knowing that, it's still not the best of situations and i know it's wrong. but still, our hearts sometimes lead us to people that they shouldn't.

 

after reading a number of posts here with all the statistics against an MM leaving his wife and ending up with his OW, i'm convinced that i must know all of them that live on the planet. and granted, those who didn't leave, i probably wouldn't have heard about. but i know of 3 who are now married, 2 who are living together and 1 (my brother actually) who is divorced from his wife and is still seeing his OW and has been now for over 5 years.

 

please don't misunderstand me to say that i think all women should go out and look for a married man. they shouldn't. it's not good for anyone, but since it does happen, we learn to live with the consequences. and hopefully we learn to be more careful the next time. and yes, i know we all appreciate your warnings but some are not always ready to hear those things when we say them.

 

and i can't help the fact that i try to be understanding of my MM and his situation. i care about him, and in spite of everything, i still consider him to be a friend. what we did was wrong and i do believe that he didn't do this specifically just to hurt me. plus, it's my nature to try and see both sides of a situation. sometimes i'm more successful than others but i do try, and in that way i try to understand. i also believe that people are inherently good, even MMs, MWs, OMs and OWs.

 

i hope in time that you'll be able to put what happened to you behind you. i hope i can too, but for me getting rid of the anger and trying to understand is part of my healing.

 

 

You have NO IDEA WHAT YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT.

 

Secondly, You dont hear bitterness or hurt. It just comes to a point in your life where SECOND BEST...IS JUST NOT GOOD ENOUGH. THAT....is what you are hearing.

 

Be understanding. Be caring. Be considerate. It is your life. Do your thang. I hope you wind up with the prize baby.

[izzybelle]

jvjrose, thank you. i hope i win the prize as well. and whether i do or not it doesn't matter. i no longer feel second best. maybe i wasn't the one he "chose" in the end, but i don't believe that makes me 2nd best, or 2nd rate, it just wasn't right. there have been times recently when i have felt more down then i have ever felt before in my life, i felt useless and used. and at that point i felt not 2nd best but somewhere around 20th. yes, i admit i felt those things too. and i'm sure there's probably somewhere on this site that i've posted those feelings, and if not, i know i've confessed them to others. but....i'm not convinced that those feelings are any different than those that someone would feel after any break up. and i no longer feel 2nd best and i don't view my relationship with my MM as making me 2nd best. i've beat myself up about this enough and i need to move on and for me looking at that relationship as being "not good enough" for me doesn't help. i know that's a common theme for getting over any relationship, to believe that they weren't good enough for you anyway, or that you deserved more or better. i know that for many that's the what they need to do to be able to move on and perhaps i'm in the minority here, i don't know, and it doesn't matter. do i deserve a situation where the person is "free" to give me all the love that he can? yes, but i don't feel that i deserve a "better" person because, to me, that would be putting him down, and that's something i'm choosing not to do. i know you may not agree with treating the situation that way, but that's just who i am. i care deeply about the people in my life and whether they like it or not, whether i'm hurt by them or not, the people who have managed finding their way into my heart stay there. perhaps that's the reason why i have managed staying friend with many of my exs over the years. whether they hurt me, i hurt them, or one of us "left" the other for another, it didn't matter, it's something that i have worked hard at. that's just me.

 

whether or not you think i know what i'm talking about isn't important. i'm basing my comments, my feelings and my insight on my experience. and granted my part of the world is just a small piece but it's what i have to go on. i'm not some young kid who's just discovering love for the first time. and in spite of that i'll freely admit there's a lot i don't know.

 

and i apologize for thinking that your notes were expressing bitterness or hurt, my bad.

[9Lives]

YOU hurt my feelings I must admit.

I was just trying to help you. I do accept your apology.

 

I am just trying to get you out of the little league into the WINNING league.

I dont want you to be understanding. I dont want you to care.

I dont want you to see his point of view. I want to kick his a/ss to the curb.

I dont want you to be sympathic anymore. They have is all regardless of whether

they are happy or not.

 

I want you to be the QUEEN OF THE CASTLE. I want you to be very proud of yourself. Be able to share your love freely.

To have a family of your own. The good life so to speak.

 

The only way to get in the game is to change your thinking.

 

YOU HAVE TO THINK YOU ARE BETTER THAN THIS ....BECAUSE YOU ARE.

 

I know I am. That is why I say...no more leasing me. You got to bring it

from now on or get away from me. People can say whatever they want but as for me, I am going to be the Queen of the castle. I like there.

[izzybelle]

jvjrose, i never meant to hurt your feelings.

 

and i do believe you and i are at an impass. not that either of us is right or wrong, we just have a very different view of the world and how we deal with it. i have a family, i have 2 kids and i am "queen" of my rented castle (and at this point in my life, i have no desire to own my own home again!!! ). i'm not waiting for a knight in shining armour to come and rescue me, or to come and stay with me for that matter. i am happy (most days) with my life. whether it's little league or big league, rented or owned, that's not important to me at this point in my life. i am proud of myself, i have two wonderful children, i'm successful, i'm a cancer survivor and i'm proud of everything that i've accomplished. i have loved and been loved and i know in time when i'm ready, that will happen again.

 

but the bottom line is, i care about him. even if he's with his wife 'til death do us part, he will always be a part of my life because i choose to have him there. even if i never speak with him again, he is a part of my past. and as terrible as things ended up, for a brief time they were wonderful. you and i just see things differently and there's nothing wrong with that. i'm not going to try to change your mind or the way you see things. i have no right to try and i don't want to. you are who you are and you deal with the things that happen in your life in a way that works for you. and so do i. and for me being happy means that i can still be understanding, that i can still be sympathetic, and that i can still care AND move on with my life at the same time.

[9Lives]

I TOTALLY RESPECT EVERYTHING YOU SAID.

YES, you are the Queen of the Castle.

I did not mean to make it sound like you

wasnt the Queen now. Because you are and

not because I say you are either.

 

I guess I am just saying I dont want to

be told we cant cause he has other obligations

and priorities that are over me. That is

how I feel.

 

I know I cant change your feelings towards him.

That is fine. He brought some good times and

happiness into your life. I understand that.

It is all good.

[SadAndLonely]

I would never be with a married man. I would have enough self respect to walk away, regardless of how much I "loved" him or how he was my "best friend". However, that's not why I'm posting. I want to relay a story.

 

Many years ago my grandpa started cheating on my grandma. They had had five kids, she had gained weight, she was busy, etc. When my grandma found out she divorced him. So the OW got him, right? Well, yes and no. He continued to sleep with the OW, up until the day he died last year. To my knowledge he didn't cheat on the OW. HOWEVER....he also didn't let her move in, he refused to move in with her, and he refused to have children with her even though she really wanted to. He said he had his kids already. And when he died, he didn't leave her anything. Not a single cent.

 

Up until the day he died he also continued to pine over my grandma, although not in view of the OW. He truly loved her, had always loved her, and would have gone back to her in a second if he would have taken him back. The OW who seems hot stuff now becomes the "wife" if the married man gets divorced, and often the man will start to see his ex-wife as the lover he can't have. I don't know why anyone would want to be in a position like that. You can "love" someone else. If you fear being alone then you need to work on your own issues, not find a man to act as a band-aid. My mom has been "alone" for more than 20 years, ever since she divorced my father (not for infidelity), and she's fine. She recognizes her own self-worth, has friends, goes out and has fun, either alone or with others, etc.

[izzybelle]

Sad,

 

touching story about your grandparents and i'm sure the situation you describe is common. i do know of several MM/OW realtionships that have survived and those couples seem completely happy. and as for my grandparents...married over 75 years, from what i've gathered most of the time they were fairly miserable, of at least my grandfather was. divorce was unheard of where i grew up and honestly i think they both would have been happier without the other. to me that's sad. that they could have had a chance for happiness with someone else but instead lived out their long lives (they were both in the 90s when they died this year) in an unhappy situation. but that's what they chose and they lived with the consequences of their choices much like your grandparents did.

 

i don't believe that OWs are lacking in self-respect, or at least no more than the general female population. i think, like just about everyone else, we perhaps make some decisions that don't work out best in the long run. i don't know of anyone who hasn't made at least a few wrong moves, things that at the time made a lot of sense but in the end didn't.

 

and i do sincerely hope, for your sake and the sake of others that you can stick to your statement of never being with a married man. there would have been a time a few years ago that i would have made the same statement and meant it with all my heart. sometimes you just don't know until you've been in the situation yourself. and we frequently see postings by new members that starts out with "i never thought i'd be in this position...."

[Shiraz]

Hey Izzy, glad you said it, because I was giong to say the same thing. I think there is a belief out there that OW or OM have planned that in their life they would do something like this. It's not so. It JUST HAPPPENED> I would probably say the majority of us aren't proud of it. But it happens. I would also say I would never do this, but..... I will also say I"ll never do it again. And I honestly hope I don't, but you never know who will catch your heart. And your heart is a powerful thing.

 

and i do sincerely hope, for your sake and the sake of others that you can stick to your statement of never being with a married man. there would have been a time a few years ago that i would have made the same statement and meant it with all my heart. sometimes you just don't know until you've been in the situation yourself. and we frequently see postings by new members that starts out with "i never thought i'd be in this position...."

[Owl]

Shiraz- I'm not too sure I agree with your comment "you never know who will catch your heart". You CAN control how far you go with someone. I've been married for 17 years...and yes, I've found myself attacted both physically and emotionally to a few women besides my wife. BUT, I recognized that I found myself attracted to them, and took steps to ensure that I wouldn't/couldn't cross the "boundaries" of appropriate relationships with those that aren't my spouse. Had I let myself spend time with someone like that, or allowed myself to begin sharing things with them that I should have shared with my wife, I would have found myself in a bad situation...the same situation that most straying spouses find themselves in. What created the heartache and pain that I'm going through now is that my wife couldn't understand for many years what those boundaries were, or what they were there for. So, when things seemed the most difficult for us, she didn't recognize when she'd crossed them...and that of course led into an emotional affair with someone else.

 

NOW, she knows why there have to be boundaries with opposite-sex friends when you're married or in a relationship.

 

NOW, she's promised to clearly mark those boundaries when she's dealing with other sex friends/contacts.

 

NOW, she knows better than to put herself in a situation where she could be tempted to cross those boundaries herself.

 

I just wish she could have learned this lesson BEFORE. Before she got involved in an affair with someone else...BEFORE she decided to hide all of this from me, BEFORE she agreed to fly away and leave the kids and I (she didn't go, but there is still a lot of pain there).

 

So, I can understand that everyone gets attracted to others, but I have to say that any adult can CHOOSE to get involved with someone or not. If you chose to be involved with a married man, that was your DECISION. No one forced you to do so...just as no one forced him to choose you. You both made a decision to get involved with someone, and to continue it when you knew it had gone too far. I'm not condemning you here...just point out that it was a DECISION, NOT something that "just happened".

 

And, its up to you to CHOOSE whether or not you'll repeat this same cycle with another MM in the future. I hope that you find someone single that you can start an open, honest, awesome relationship that doesn't have to hide in the shadows. And I hope it works out so that you'll always keep him.