Thoughts on why some BS become WS or OW/OM in the future?

[Confusion_Reigns]

What is preventing you from leaving your husband now?

 

Fear, love, history…and the idea that when I committed to him all those years ago it was forever. I literally have a war going on inside of myself.

[Betterthanthis13]

Fear, love, history…and the idea that when I committed to him all those years ago it was forever. I literally have a war going on inside of myself.

 

I wish I could give you a giant hug.

[Betterthanthis13]

To me, a free pass means "I had sex outside the marriage - here's your opportunity to do the same".

 

I also believe I said that it isn't for everyone in every situation, and that there might be some drawbacks as well, most likely for the WS.

 

If we could rewind our process, I would do it again - it was at this time my wife decided two things; that open marriage probably wasn't for us and that she felt the pain in her stomack, which to her meant that our relationship probably was worth saving.

 

I am not sure, but my guess is that many people view the free pass as an idea presented by the WS to allow the BS to "even the score", and I'm just not getting that from you. Do you think she meant it that way? Or maybe it's because your view onthe free pass was not primarily "even the score" related? Less revenge, more experience? I'm not sure if I'm asking the questions that are in my head coherently

[dichotomy]

You think this free pass worked out great?

 

You need to hear from his WW/BW first.

 

Then from other WS turned BS.

 

Last lets hear from all the new BH's that this guy created with his free pass.

 

 

I am BH, and also read his post wrong - his free pass did not inlcude hurting any husbands. In this case there was an understanding with his WW - and while I don't think it was healthy, it was honest and open from what I understand. In this case - all parties honest - not one unware - then I can't take any issue.

[Zenstudent]

I think there would be a difference between bullying another and weaker person instead of bullying the original offender who maybe is perceived to be stronger?

[Betterthanthis13]

Haven't read all of the replies but your question reminded me of a type of experiment I saw. It was years ago so it's a little vague to me now but basically the study involved taking children between the ages of about 12-15 years of age and who were normally the target of bullying and abuse by their peers and putting them in a situation where another child was being bullied and abused. The people conducting the study expected that the children who were experiencing daily bullying would feel empathy and sadness upon seeing it happen to one of their peers. To everyone's surprise not only did the natural victims of bullying not feel empathy or sadness for the kid they were witnessing being picked on, but they were quick to jump right in participate in the abuse themselves. I am vague on what the reasoning was for this now, but I believe the psychologists involved stated that by victimizing another child the child who was normally victimized took back some of their power and distanced themselves from their own victim status by becoming bullies themselves. I have often wondered if this could be applied to BS who go on to become OW/OM.

 

That's really interesting. I bet I can find it on Google- the other experiment that I sometimes think of with infidelity is the prison experiment, where college students were randomly assigned to be either prisoners or guards, and how they took to their roles in a frighteningly realistic way very quickly. I'm not sure why it's relevant, I haven't made a connection yet really but I keep coming back to it.

[dichotomy]

I have spent a long time understanding my wife changes in behavior the three years before she met me. For the majority of her life she was very "reserved and formal" in her realtionships. Not many partners - and certainly no cheating. I won't bore you witth all the details but she was cheated and abused in her first marriage, and after her divorce, found out her beloved father had been cheating for years on her mom. Then a bad female friend became her best friend...and everyone around her was cheating and it became...nothing that big anymore - she did not even really hide her behavior with others much - until she met me.

 

No excuse - just part of my understanding of what would drive a former BS or no cheating person ... into cheating.

[Zenstudent]

I am not sure, but my guess is that many people view the free pass as an idea presented by the WS to allow the BS to "even the score", and I'm just not getting that from you. Do you think she meant it that way? Or maybe it's because your view onthe free pass was not primarily "even the score" related? Less revenge, more experience? I'm not sure if I'm asking the questions that are in my head coherently

There are a lot of shades in this, and my linguistic skills may be inadequate

What my wife SAID was that I should get the experience myself, so that I would know that I would be able to love her the same time while dating. She also thought it would be a good idea to have the experience from the opposite side (of course there wasn't any dishonest component, which is the worst part of infidelity IMO).

 

she had entertained the idea of opening our marriage up, so that she would be free to see her AP again - this idea died emmediatly when I was successfull in finding partners.

 

If she in fact MEANT that the pass was "evening the score", she didn't say so, and haven't hinted at it since (happened two years ago).

[Betterthanthis13]

I have spent a long time understanding my wife changes in behavior the three years before she met me. For the majority of her life she was very "reserved and formal" in her realtionships. Not many partners - and certainly no cheating. I won't bore you witth all the details but she was cheated and abused in her first marriage, and after her divorce, found out her beloved father had been cheating for years on her mom. Then a bad female friend became her best friend...and everyone around her was cheating and it became...nothing that big anymore - she did not even really hide her behavior with others much - until she met me.

 

No excuse - just part of my understanding of what would drive a former BS or no cheating person ... into cheating.

 

The saturation theory of BS's turning WS's or AP's

[Betterthanthis13]

There are a lot of shades in this, and my linguistic skills may be inadequate

What my wife SAID was that I should get the experience myself, so that I would know that I would be able to love her the same time while dating. She also thought it would be a good idea to have the experience from the opposite side (of course there wasn't any dishonest component, which is the worst part of infidelity IMO).

 

she had entertained the idea of opening our marriage up, so that she would be free to see her AP again - this idea died emmediatly when I was successfull in finding partners.

 

If she in fact MEANT that the pass was "evening the score", she didn't say so, and haven't hinted at it since (happened two years ago).

 

That is what I inferred from your original description. I did not think it was about evening a score to either of you, which is why I think your marriage was able to gain insight from the experience. Some experiences cause pain and can be learned from. I would not call those "great ideas" as another poster suggested. But I also don't think always trying to avoid things that are potentially painful is a good way to operate either. Your wife had an idea, perhaps for (somewhat) selfish reasons, you implemented the idea, she was surprised that her hypothesis was wrong and that it was easy for you to date, you both analyzed the results and gained some insight.

 

Not bad, not good or great- just an idea, just a choice you two made, after she had made a very poor choice on her own that she was sorry for, but still trying to figure out. That's how I see it.

 

Some people might not be able to imagine a situation in which a free pass is not motivated out of pure revenge, or can imagine it in theory but not believe that it could ever be a beneficial tool in reality.

[dichotomy]

The saturation theory of BS's turning WS's or AP's

 

Yes for sure that.

 

I did not add this, but her father suddenly died around the time of her divorce from abusive cheating ex husband. That is when she found out her dad had mistress and sex addiction issues. How does one resolve that she so loved and adored her dad - but he cheated on her mom. How could he be "bad" or adultery/cheating be "bad" if she loved her dad so much. Did he love her mom? Can one cheat and still be good and loving father and husband ?

 

He passed and she could not understand....and so she got involved with an older married man who cheated on his wife. And her "Best Female Friend" at the time is the one who hooked her up with MG and cheered her on.

 

The seeking to understand Daddy theory.....

 

 

Never shared this on LS before...

Edited August 14, 2013 by dichotomy

[2.50 a gallon]

Road

 

If you were trying to insult me you failed.

 

As for the BH's, it was their loss for not taking proper care of their marriages. Had they done so, I would not have been a factor.

 

Just to show how stupid they can be. One of my partners, whom I thought had a solid very much in love with her husband marriage had met and dated her H in college, marrying shortly after they graduated.

 

My co-workers and I used to meet about once a month on a Saturday night at a bar just to have some fun. She had never attended.

 

They had put off having kids until they were financially secure. Their fifth wedding anniversary was coming up and they decided that they now could afford to start a family. Towards that end they reserved the weekend of their anniversary at a B&B. As it turned out this would have been the right time of the month for her to get pregnant. The idea was they would conceive their first child on the night of the 5th anniversary.

 

On Wednesday of that week her H announced that instead of the B&B, he and his buddy were heading for Reno to watch a poker tournament. He left on Friday, on Saturday night she showed up at the bar in this hot sexy little red outfit barely covering that which needed covering.

 

She then announced to me that her marriage was over and she was going to get laid that night, I was her first choice, and if I was not willing she would find someone else.

 

As for the sex with a MW, being as you are a woman, how do you know what is good sex from a man's point of view?

 

My first MW was my neighbors wife. When the EX and I broke up she moved in with the OM. I left her no choice as I told her it was not safe to come home and our marriage was over. That weekend the next door neighbor's wife left town to be with her sick mother for the weekend. And he then invited my EX, the OM and several of her hopeful OM co-workers over for a BBQ, in order to rub my face in our separation.

 

The EX promptly got drunk and at their behest did a strip for them.

 

The neighbor's wife found her panties behind the couch put two and two together and we began a revenge affair. It was one of the most erotic nights of my life. As we shared a bedroom wall and we kept him awake all night with our screwing. He kept pounding on the wall wanting us to keep down the noise, not knowing that it was his wife that was doing all the screaming.

 

From a man's point of view a married woman, or a just divorced woman are generally fantastic bed partners, as they want to try all the dirty things that they refused to do with their husbands.

Edited August 14, 2013 by 2.50 a gallon

[road]

Road

 

If you were trying to insult me you failed.

 

As for the BH's, it was their loss for not taking proper care of their marriages. Had they done so, I would not have been a factor.

 

Just to show how stupid they can be. One of my partners, whom I thought had a solid very much in love with her husband marriage had met and dated her H in college, marrying shortly after they graduated.

 

My co-workers and I used to meet about once a month on a Saturday night at a bar just to have some fun. She had never attended.

 

They had put off having kids until they were financially secure. Their fifth wedding anniversary was coming up and they decided that they now could afford to start a family. Towards that end they reserved the weekend of their anniversary at a B&B. As it turned out this would have been the right time of the month for her to get pregnant. The idea was they would conceive their first child on the night of the 5th anniversary.

 

On Wednesday of that week her H announced that instead of the B&B, he and his buddy were heading for Reno to watch a poker tournament. He left on Friday, on Saturday night she showed up at the bar in this hot sexy little red outfit barely covering that which needed covering.

 

She then announced to me that her marriage was over and she was going to get laid that night, I was her first choice, and if I was not willing she would find someone else.

 

As for the sex with a MW, being as you are a woman, how do you know what is good sex from a man's point of view?

 

My first MW was my neighbors wife. When the EX and I broke up she moved in with the OM. I left her no choice as I told her it was not safe to come home and our marriage was over. That weekend the next door neighbor's wife left town to be with her sick mother for the weekend. And he then invited my EX, the OM and several of her hopeful OM co-workers over for a BBQ, in order to rub my face in our separation.

 

The EX promptly got drunk and at their behest did a strip for them.

 

The neighbor's wife found her panties behind the couch put two and two together and we began a revenge affair. It was one of the most erotic nights of my life. As we shared a bedroom wall and we kept him awake all night with our screwing. He kept pounding on the wall wanting us to keep down the noise, not knowing that it was his wife that was doing all the screaming.

 

From a man's point of view a married woman, or a just divorced woman are generally fantastic bed partners, as they want to try all the dirty things that they refused to do with their husbands.

 

 

 

Because you had a good time does not make what you did right. And without quoting me I do not remember if I was trying to insult you. Not going back to read past posts.

[eleanorrigby]

That's really interesting. I bet I can find it on Google- the other experiment that I sometimes think of with infidelity is the prison experiment, where college students were randomly assigned to be either prisoners or guards, and how they took to their roles in a frighteningly realistic way very quickly. I'm not sure why it's relevant, I haven't made a connection yet really but I keep coming back to it.

 

omg did you see the movie based on that experiment? It had Forrest Whitaker in it and the guy from The Pianist. Very engaging movie.

[whatatangledweb]

Not revenge affairs.

 

I've heard this a few times and it seems counterintuitive, considering that a BS would have experienced firsthand all the pain and anguish an A brings. Any thoughts on why this might happen?

 

My first guess would be dissillusionment- they lived their life a certain way according to principles, thinking that would help protect them, and then the world came crashing down and they never fully recovered, "if you can't beat em join em"

 

Or

 

Sideways justice- "righting a wrong", (subconsciously), but with different people

 

Or

 

Morbid curiosity?

 

Am I way off? I'm somewhat concerned about this because I hear its common and whatever the psychology is behind it I want to know so I can avoid developing it.

 

I asked my therapist and she said I shouldnt be concerned with that- she said I am far too analytic and neurotic to be in danger of such a thing. She's irritating me. I get thoughtful answers from LS for free.

 

 

 

I have wondered the same thing. The OW in our case was a BS in her marriage. Her husband left her for the OW. She then became an OW in our marriage. This lead her to believe that when I found out like she did, I would give him a choice and he would pick the her as her husband picked the OW. Didn't happen. I just could not understand her doing that after it being done to her.

[GG2W]

I am a single guy, have never been married, and only date married women. The reason, as Mr. Gallon posted they let it all loose when they are with somebody other than their husband

[dichotomy]

I am a single guy, have never been married, and only date married women. The reason, as Mr. Gallon posted they let it all loose when they are with somebody other than their husband

 

I am not saying I have not heard/read this more than a few times, so I believe what you say happens (sad as it is) but...

 

You can't find a single gal to get wild with you?

[Got it]

I am not saying I have not heard/read this more than a few times, so I believe what you say happens (sad as it is) but...

 

You can't find a single gal to get wild with you?

 

I am always surprised by this question. Why do people think that one has attempted to exhaust one marital status before going to another.

 

It isn't about him not finding a single women, it is about him not discriminating based on marital status and/or actively seeking those with a married marital status based on the reasoning in his post.

[Confusion_Reigns]

It probably has more to do with not having to face the commitments that would be more likely to come with a single woman than a married woman. As long as the married woman knows there's no future then it's all good. That would be my guess anyway.

[Betterthanthis13]

omg did you see the movie based on that experiment? It had Forrest Whitaker in it and the guy from The Pianist. Very engaging movie.

 

The Experiment (2010) - IMDb

 

Nope but definitely going to rent

[Betterthanthis13]

I have wondered the same thing. The OW in our case was a BS in her marriage. Her husband left her for the OW. She then became an OW in our marriage. This lead her to believe that when I found out like she did, I would give him a choice and he would pick the her as her husband picked the OW. Didn't happen. I just could not understand her doing that after it being done to her.

 

Stories like that just really break my heart, I almost always have something to say.... that whole story just makes me so sad. It sounds like a lot of misplaced anger after being really hurt herself- and a lot of self delusion in order to carry on with the idea that she could recreate the same ending. It's still no excuse, it doesn't detract from what was done to you or the pain and anguish you must have gone through- just a tragedy all around. I'm really sorry you had to experience that and go through it.

[Zenstudent]

Well, infidelity really messes with your brain and emotions, doesn't it - you'll never get to be the same person again. Some change for the better, some for worse.

[Betterthanthis13]

I am a single guy, have never been married, and only date married women. The reason, as Mr. Gallon posted they let it all loose when they are with somebody other than their husband

 

I can imagine. Pent up sexual frustration + craving attention + new lover = a single guy's dream come true in the bedroom, is that accurate?

 

Do you ever give any thought to being in a LTR yourself, or have you been?

 

I'm wondering what affect (if any) you think having this experience will have on your relationships in the future, if you choose to have one?

 

What I'm asking is- If you ever got married- do you think having this experience with all the married women will make you a better lover as a husband, more likely to stay in tune to your wifes's sexual needs, or do you think it will make you paranoid that she will cheat, or something else?

[Betterthanthis13]

Well, infidelity really messes with your brain and emotions, doesn't it - you'll never get to be the same person again. Some change for the better, some for worse.

 

How you deal with the pain of betrayal is a choice you have to face whether you like it or not- it's your responsibility because its your life

 

Not dealing with the bad emotions is in itself a choice

[Betterthanthis13]

Yes for sure that.

 

I did not add this, but her father suddenly died around the time of her divorce from abusive cheating ex husband. That is when she found out her dad had mistress and sex addiction issues. How does one resolve that she so loved and adored her dad - but he cheated on her mom. How could he be "bad" or adultery/cheating be "bad" if she loved her dad so much. Did he love her mom? Can one cheat and still be good and loving father and husband ?

 

He passed and she could not understand....and so she got involved with an older married man who cheated on his wife. And her "Best Female Friend" at the time is the one who hooked her up with MG and cheered her on.

 

The seeking to understand Daddy theory.....

 

 

Never shared this on LS before...

 

I think it's really brave of you to share that info- thanks , and you were brave for ever even wanting to know any of that. That is some unpleasant stuff. She also gets my admiration for facing it, even if it was later than sooner.