Should I continue chasing her if she wishes to focus on her career?

[Mave]

Hi, I am new to the forums but I like to ask for some advice.

 

I am not from the US, but here's my story. This girl and I met in college, and we have a very flirty/fun friendship.

 

Last week, I took her out on our very first date - I would say both of us wanted it since she gave me obvious signs like "let's grab dinner some time". We had a great time at a nice restaurant, and the conversation was smooth. Towards the end, I told her what I wanted, and that was to date her, with the eventuality of getting into a relationship with her. I told her she didn't have to say yes then, but I would like to know in the future when she is ready. I didn't wish to game her and I thought being genuine and forward would be the right thing to do.

 

She said she knew what I wanted, but that I have to wait. She said she wishes to focus on her career (we are still in college, but she is very career-minded, as am I), and that she might only be able to let me know in a few years time. She also said she wishes to keep her options open - not sure what this pertains to exactly, since she might wish to go abroad to work. I guess it has a dual meaning, of exploring work opportunities and other men.

 

Anyhow, I told her that I understood, paid the bill (a pretty hefty one), and that she shouldn't feel obligated to owe me anything.

 

I am not sure what all of this means, but here are some questions I like to ask:

 

1. Is she interested in me, if at all? She continued to try to contact me the next day after the date, sending me some funny pics of her and us. I responded with a casual thanks, but didn't bother to follow up because I thought she made her position clear that she wasn't interested in dating me atm.

 

2. Prior to asking her out on the date, I knew she went out on a couple of other dates with guys, which didn't go anywhere. That made me kinda unsure if her reply is genuine. Because if she isn't in the market for dating, why is she going out for dates and all?

 

3. I like her quite a lot but a couple of my close friends have confided in me that she isn't a "long-term" partner kind of girl, and I shouldn't bother with her any more. For the record, I am more interested in dating for the long term, and am pretty opposed to short term flings and hookups (I am not judging those who do, however, so don't flame me).

 

So, should I continue chasing her? Any advice on how to do it? One friend of mine said that my approach was too direct, and a relationship with a girl like her should be one that isn't explicated by words. I would love to hear advice on how to proceed, thanks so much!

Edited August 11, 2013 by Mave

[Mascara]

When men and women say they don't have time for a relationship, they mean with YOU. Don't be that guy who challenges her excuses when you see her dating someone else. All you need to know is that she doesn't want a relationship with you, and she was trying to let you down gently.

 

She does however want to be your friend, that's why she's staying in touch.

[Mave]

Hey, thanks for the reply.

 

I thought about that as well, but then she was very open to flirting/motivating me and being a part of my life. For instance, SHE initiating wanting to hang out/meet me after work at my internship area etc.

 

Some of my friends who saw our exchanges also commented that she was definitely into me.

 

I definitely don't want to be that guy who challenges her excuses - I just want to know what I can do better, date/relationship wise.

 

And, probably, what can I do from here on out? Don't bother and just move on?

[Miss_raptor]

Perhaps she's a natural flirt? Sometimes flirting doesn't mean much. She's made it clear that she's not interested in dating you right now. I would move on and date others. If she comes around (don't bank on it), great. If not, oh well.

[irc333]

Yeah, I don't get the whole, "I want to FOCUS on my career" Line....I go to work, work 40hrs a week, come home every day after work....have fun on my weekends...and of course DATE on the weekends.

 

I'm trying to figure out how 'Focusing on your career" would interfere with dating? You can only focus on your career ONLY while you're at work.....right??

 

If a woman is going to use a line, use one that makes sense. LOL!

 

 

 

Hi, I am new to the forums but I like to ask for some advice.

 

I am not from the US, but here's my story. This girl and I met in college, and we have a very flirty/fun friendship.

 

Last week, I took her out on our very first date - I would say both of us wanted it since she gave me obvious signs like "let's grab dinner some time". We had a great time at a nice restaurant, and the conversation was smooth. Towards the end, I told her what I wanted, and that was to date her, with the eventuality of getting into a relationship with her. I told her she didn't have to say yes then, but I would like to know in the future when she is ready. I didn't wish to game her and I thought being genuine and forward would be the right thing to do.

 

She said she knew what I wanted, but that I have to wait. She said she wishes to focus on her career (we are still in college, but she is very career-minded, as am I), and that she might only be able to let me know in a few years time. She also said she wishes to keep her options open - not sure what this pertains to exactly, since she might wish to go abroad to work. I guess it has a dual meaning, of exploring work opportunities and other men.

 

Anyhow, I told her that I understood, paid the bill (a pretty hefty one), and that she shouldn't feel obligated to owe me anything.

 

I am not sure what all of this means, but here are some questions I like to ask:

 

1. Is she interested in me, if at all? She continued to try to contact me the next day after the date, sending me some funny pics of her and us. I responded with a casual thanks, but didn't bother to follow up because I thought she made her position clear that she wasn't interested in dating me atm.

 

2. Prior to asking her out on the date, I knew she went out on a couple of other dates with guys, which didn't go anywhere. That made me kinda unsure if her reply is genuine. Because if she isn't in the market for dating, why is she going out for dates and all?

 

3. I like her quite a lot but a couple of my close friends have confided in me that she isn't a "long-term" partner kind of girl, and I shouldn't bother with her any more. For the record, I am more interested in dating for the long term, and am pretty opposed to short term flings and hookups (I am not judging those who do, however, so don't flame me).

 

So, should I continue chasing her? Any advice on how to do it? One friend of mine said that my approach was too direct, and a relationship with a girl like her should be one that isn't explicated by words. I would love to hear advice on how to proceed, thanks so much!

[Mave]

Hey guys,

 

Thanks for the responses. The thing is, she is probably going into investment banking or corporate finance, and work-life balance is going to be tricky.

 

She recently completed an internship with a bulge bracket bank, and was putting in about 80-100 hours a week + is looking to work overseas, so that might say something about her ambition/authenticity.

 

During the date, however, she said that she won't hook up with her bosses or colleagues. But she said it along the lines of "even if I hook up with someone, it won't be with my bosses or colleagues" - does anyone have any take on that? Does it necessarily mean she is the kind of girl to screw some random hot guy she just meets? In front of me, she is pretty sweet. But I know she goes to clubs, parties and gets high because she likes it as well.

 

If a woman is going to use a line, use one that makes sense. LOL!

 

Yeah, I told her that she could attempt to balance work and life, but she said she was too involved when she had a boyfriend that HE was the center. This led to her undervaluing her own ambitions and career, which led to their breakup.

[irc333]

and was putting in about 80-100 hours a week

 

Just wondering, why would anyone WANT to work 100 hrs a week, that alone would make me switch professions.

 

WHy don't people have the motivation to clock out on a Fri at 5 oclock and enjoy their weekend? I find those people quite strange...if they aren't strange, then they're just BS'ing you.

[Mave]

Well, from what I know, she comes from a middle-income family whilst mixing with peers from well to do families.

 

So getting into banking is for the money and ability to scale socially. At the same time, she says it is okay if her boyfriend doesn't work or isn't as smart. Which strikes me as quite weird?

 

On the one hand, she professes to like very smart and confident guys (which I think I would fall into that category if you met me in real life), and yet on the other, she is probably okay with dating a bum? IN fact, her ex boyfriend was quite the bum. Dropout, smoker, doesn't do any real crap.

 

AGAIN, I don't wish to castigate women on their choices in men, but it's kinda disconcerting especially for well-educated, supposedly intelligent women to want to make such poor choices when their partners/mates are concerned.

[Mascara]

If she went out with a smart, successful man even though she wasn't attracted to him, that would make her just as shallow, no?

 

She isn't attracted to you. You can be all those things on paper, but as you surely know - you can't help whether or not you're physically attracted to someone. Does it matter to you if you have absolutely no physical attraction to someone? Would you still date, marry, have a family with someone you find physically unappealing?

[Mave]

Absolutely.

 

Physical attraction might be a factor though I definitely think I am pretty good-looking. Plus, she said she was looking to date smart and confident guys.

 

That said, is it possible to build up physical attraction assuming you don't go under the knife?

 

Thanks.

[GravityMan]

I think Mascara is on point with both her posts.

 

- She is not interested in you. Move on.

 

- Women (or men) who are really attracted to and interested in someone WILL almost certainly try and figure out a way to "fit" that someone into her or his life. Even very busy, career-focused women. They want to see you again and again, and soon...not put you "on hold" for a few months or years. Depending on circumstances, it might mean only being able to see each other once a week or every two weeks. It might mean you or her making a lengthy drive. Etc..

 

- Being direct, assertive and clearly knowing what you want is a quality many women view favorably. However, I agree with your friend that you came on too strong during the first date. In the future it may be better to keep first dates loose, light and fun...and gradually (over a series of dates) and ideally naturally build things up, provided the attraction between you two remains. You can do that without beating around the bush.

[Mascara]

Being physically attracted to someone has very little to do with how good looking you are. Sure, someone who is considered traditionally handsome will have a greater pool of women who find that attractive.

 

You may be thought of as handsome, but she won't find you attractive. Another guy might be thought of as handsome and she WILL find him attractive. For example, Brad Pitt does nothing for me, but David Morse does.

[Mave]

Wow, thanks so much for the responses.

 

For the record, I hope I am not coming across as bitter. I really just wish to navigate the social complexities of dating, and get better.

 

I would admit that I can come off as stiff, driven and serious. While that has won me points on confidence and charisma, I think I am losing out in terms of fun and excitement.

 

My friend commented that while any girl would be lucky to have me (being loyal and dependable), the problem is with my age (relative youth in 20s), and how it isn't a valued trait, especially since most people in my age-bracket are just out to have fun. For instance, I have only gone clubbing twice, and my time isn't spent getting wasted.

 

Is there any way to reconcile the two? Be exciting and full of fun without being a crazy party/social animal? I am very career-oriented, and I typically spend the bulk of my time finding ways to grow intellectually, or to learn skills.

[Mascara]

You don't come across as bitter, and I hope you don't become one of them.

 

Best tip I can give you - practice talking and striking up conversations and learn to be relaxed with women you DON'T find attractive. I know that sounds odd, but if you're chatting and getting into light hearted conversations with the mother at the bus stop, the old lady in the library, the granny in the checkout queue.... you're not invested in them, so you're more likely to be relaxed. And the more you practice just interacting with people on that level, the easier it will come when you're interacting with a girl you like.

[Sunshine87]

Wow, thanks so much for the responses.

 

For the record, I hope I am not coming across as bitter. I really just wish to navigate the social complexities of dating, and get better.

 

I would admit that I can come off as stiff, driven and serious. While that has won me points on confidence and charisma, I think I am losing out in terms of fun and excitement.

 

My friend commented that while any girl would be lucky to have me (being loyal and dependable), the problem is with my age (relative youth in 20s), and how it isn't a valued trait, especially since most people in my age-bracket are just out to have fun. For instance, I have only gone clubbing twice, and my time isn't spent getting wasted.

 

Is there any way to reconcile the two? Be exciting and full of fun without being a crazy party/social animal? I am very career-oriented, and I typically spend the bulk of my time finding ways to grow intellectually, or to learn skills.

 

Wow, reading through your posts makes me realise how silly I was to question myself.

 

I went on a date with a guy who declared his intentions on the second date. He said he wanted to get into a relationship. I admired his honesty and frankly speaking, he was a breath of fresh air from the unserious guys around. But I didn't get into a relationship with him because he is a year younger than me and I'm not sure if he would be looking to settle down in the nearest future.

 

Anyway I am quite similar to you, so I understand your predicament. My advice to you would be to be yourself! Nothing indicates that you are boring from your posts. So what if you're not a party animal? You're traits would be very desirable to a woman looking for a serious relationship.

 

I have friends who work for city investment banks. I have brothers who work in city law firms. Like many of the posters mentioned, no one is top busy for love. Even the president of America is married with a family.

 

Perhaps she doesn't want a relationship with you, so what? That does not detract from your awesomeness. She made reference to the future: this might indicate that she sees qualities in you suited for a husband or long term partner. Alternatively, it could be her way of gently letting you down.

 

Either way,there is absolutely nothing wrong with you. You sound like a responsible, hard working and focused young man, looking to get into a serious relationship. Infact,you're the sort of man ild love my daughter (when I have one) to date in college. Lol.

 

Chuck this up as a learning experience. I know it might hurt a bit. But you have no control over the dynamics involved. Be yourself. If you think you're too stiff, then lighten up a bit but I'm pretty sure that you're not. I'm positive that you wouldn't mind having a beer in a bar or hanging out with friends on a Friday night? Why would you want to be a party animal anyway?

 

In a few years time, she will be looking for a guy like you to settle with and maybe she might come on L'S to complain about why she can't find any decent guy! Lol.

[Mave]

@ SunShine.

 

Thanks for that. Reading your post made me smile.

 

Yeah, I definitely hang out with my friends in the pubs every now and then. I just don't go all crazy and get wasted because I think losing control isn't cool or responsible.

 

I am just (somewhat) worried because some of my friends who are players keep telling me to "game" women, and that I shouldn't be focused on developing long term relationships. They gave me some advice, and said that the goal isn't to "be serious" or to "display any signs that you are a provider", but to show her that you are fun, exciting, and even crazy.

 

After our date, she went to a club with her friends. I told her to "take care, not allow herself to get taken advantage of, and to let me know when she reaches home" because I was brought up that way, and believe that's what a guy should do. I.e. even if you aren't going to date her, at least see the date through to its end, and keep her safe. A couple of my closest friends said that just reeked of beta weakness, sighs.

 

Some of them even suggested that I should just focus on getting into her pants.. But to be honest, that's NOT why I am attracted to her. Sure, she is attractive, but I am attracted to her because she believes in me and we are able to have fun, playful banter. I can be pretty serious, so it really takes someone of a particular nature to get me on my soft side.

 

Anyhow, I will be moving on. That's what I should be doing, thanks!

[Axee]

Hi Mave,

 

This girl is not looking for a serious relationship. But she will try to keep in touch with you..And she might play you around.. Be careful ..

 

Its obvious you are really into her since you have taken the pains to talk to all your friends about her...But honestly speaking I find you have different temperaments.. She might not like you checking in on her.. Finding it too restrictive maybe..

 

I would say move on , and find a girl who is more suitable to you and to your temperament..

 

And why do you like this girl? My guess is 70% looks and 30% (witty banter/charisma or whatever you would like to call)

[Mave]

I like her because she believes in me, would actively encourage me and goes out of the way to keep in contact etc.

 

Looks wise, she is attractive but she is flat-chested. I would say that I am more attracted to her personality than looks.

 

Yeah, I understand that she might wish to play me. I am an excellent group-mate and have won several decent placements at various competitions. She likes to work with me because I deliver top-notch work. I am unsure if that's the only reason why she wishes to be with me, but thinking about it, that kinda makes sense now.

 

I guess because I am often the de-facto leader in any work setting (competitions, projects etc), that she associates me alpha work-wise. It's just really sad and disturbing if that's all she views me, and all the other stuff between us doesn't matter. I talked to her and said while I like to win, my soft side sometimes makes me take in weaker members than I usually should because they are close friends, and she agrees with me. I thought that we were similar in that we both (albeit strong-headed) share a common trait of wishing to help the less fortunate, and having a softer, gentler side.

 

Oh well.

Edited August 11, 2013 by Mave

[mortensorchid]

Guy, ditch her. Life is too short to waste on this nonsense. She wants to focus on her career? B*******. She wants to do anything but be with you is what she's saying. She'll make up another excuse after another. MOVE ON. LIFE IS TOO SHORT to waste on those who don't deserve the happiness you have to offer.

[charlietheginger]

Banks are closed Sunday

 

Mon to sat 15 hours a day is 90hours a week.

So she works from 7am till 10pm everyday....

????????

 

Well anyways atleast she isnt a lazy women that sits

On her butt cant find a job kinda women. If she is to

Buzy to date then she probably is looking for companionship

On her day off dinner movie coffee. Just hook up when

She is available but also date other people becuase this

One isnt gonna be your girlfriend

[Pookie5]

I think your a sweet guy but this chick is playing with you and when she's saying somehting about her career, she's just making cute excuses. i would leave her alone, because she will always find a stupid excuse.

[hoping2heal]

Hey, thanks for the reply.

 

I thought about that as well, but then she was very open to flirting/motivating me and being a part of my life. For instance, SHE initiating wanting to hang out/meet me after work at my internship area etc.

 

Oh honey, if I had a quarter for every time that a woman flirted with a guy she didn't want to date...

 

Here's a few of the reasons this happens, none in order of importance or prevalence.

 

1. It's good for the ego

2. It's fun, flirting is fun even if you don't want to date the guy. It's light hearted, jovial, flattering, and fun

3. Loneliness, some women want the attention and flirtation of their male friends because they don't have a boyfriend

4. Validation, some women need constant attention and some women don't need it constantly but they do need it from somewhere.

 

Flirting means not a damn thing. Not.A.Damn.Thing

 

 

Some of my friends who saw our exchanges also commented that she was definitely into me.

 

Yeah, except she gave you the slip. Someone already said it; if you ever get told the "not right now" excuse they mean no relationship with YOU.

 

I definitely don't want to be that guy who challenges her excuses - I just want to know what I can do better, date/relationship wise.

 

Who says you are doing anything wrong in the first place? Not everyone will be attracted to us, not everyone will want to date us. So? Does that mean we're flawed because some people don't want to date us? No, of course not. You couldn't help that you want to date her and she couldn't help that she doesn't want to date you. No one is at fault here for why it couldn't begin or couldn't work out.

 

And, probably, what can I do from here on out? Don't bother and just move on?

 

Could it be any clearer? She doesn't want to date you. She clearly enjoys your company and wants you in her life as a friend. She doesn't want to date you though and believe me, very little can stop a woman who wants something especially when it comes to relationships.

[Mave]

Alright sure, the reason why I am enquiring is because I know a number of friends whom have succeeded in pursuing the girl in spite of initial road blocks (friendzoned, cold treatment etc), and I am just wondering if my case is a similar obstacle that can be overcome with time, love and persistence.

 

Guess not, judging from the responses.

[Sunshine87]

Alright sure, the reason why I am enquiring is because I know a number of friends whom have succeeded in pursuing the girl in spite of initial road blocks (friendzoned, cold treatment etc), and I am just wondering if my case is a similar obstacle that can be overcome with time, love and persistence.

 

Guess not, judging from the responses.

 

It is possible, but it really depends on unique circumstances. Let me give you three examples.

 

I had one guy who was interested in me. He never came on strong per se,

but he always asked me out, wanted to hang out, talk on the phone etc. He was intelligent ( has an MBA from Harvard Business School), he was working for a big development finance bank, he was VERY well- mannered ( the type that wouldn't get wasted on a Saturday night because he had

church on Sunday morning), he was very polite, he was considerate and very supportive. But I was hung up on another guy so while he was trying to get to know me, I used to enquire about the other guy. Lol....pretty much friend zoned him and spoke to him like he was one of my girlfriends.

 

 

When I eventually got over the guy I was hung up on, I started to see this HBS guy in a different light. However, he had moved on and gotten back

with an ex of his. I guess it wasn't meant to be either way. The point is: the personal issues I was dealing with, impeded any relationship from

taking off. It had nothing to do with him: he was so different from many of the other men aka duds I had met. The circumstances weren't right and

neither of us had control over that. Timing sometimes makes the

difference. I WAS attracted to him ( not overly- I never had any urges or anything lol) but timing wasn't right.

 

 

Case Study 2

There is this guy who is very sweet, supportive and caring. He is also very

intelligent ( has worked for one of big oil giants an currently owns his own

business). He is divorced with two kids. He pursued me hard and continues to do so till today. But I don't think I'll ever be with him. I just DON'T like

him in "that way". There is no physical attraction. Nothing he does will

make a difference but he doesn't seem to understand that. He is a chubby

guy ( nothing wrong with that but not my preference) and he pursues too

hard. He says things like "How do I find the way to your heart? How do I make you fall in love with me"? His choice of words are a bit dramatic and it's just a bit excessive!!! Plus he also struck me as insincere...

 

Case study 3

 

I went out on a date with a guy a few night ago. He was a complete

gentleman and I know he wants to date seriously. Im not sure if I would date him: I don't really find him physically attractive but he has a cute face. Let me explain. Im a small lady ( I,e petite) so I tend to go for slim guys.

However, I find buff guys attractive but I don't find chubby guys attractive

( even though they are). Anyway this guy is sort of chubby but he is very driven and motivated. He is also a thoughtful and kind person. He COULD

grow on me, if he plays his cards right. So it really depends.

 

 

These are three different situations. In case study 1- there was a mild level of attraction. In case study 2- there was NO attraction but the guy did

himself no favours by sending me "textbook" love scripts and declaring his

love for a woman he has only seen twice. Case study 3- Not my cup of tea ( physically) but he has an amazing personality and this has increased his

chances of getting together with me. Ild love to hang out with him again.

 

So it is possible to "win" a girl over but I would NOT recommend pursuing

her lest you become that guy who just doesn't get it. Do you think there is a level of chemistry between you two? If there is a mild attraction, then

yes you could win her over. If she appreciates a good man, then yes you

could win her over. But so many other things come into play for example whether or not she is looking for a serious relationship. The reason why I'd consider the guy in case study 3, is because I'm looking to settle down and

 

I know that a good LTR isn't based on looks alone but on character. I am 26 years now and it took me years of dating to accept that. When I was 22years, I wouldn't give a guy I had no attraction to a chance! I just

wouldn't consider it but now I've learnt to look out for the more important things. Hence my personal growth is a contributory factor.

 

Life is so dynamic! Almost anything is possible, if the odds are in your favour.

Edited August 12, 2013 by Sunshine87

[Sunshine87]

Just want to add that the guy in case study 3 isn't pursuing my relentlessly. He gauges my responses and acts upon them. He doesn't bug, he doesn't pester me and he gives me time to miss his company. This is why I would never recommend pursuing anyone. You can show interest in a consistent but mild manner, Consistency to me is the most important indicator of reliability and sincerity and that could win me over. Don't chase her.

 

The guy in Case study 2 continues to beg me for photos. Who does that? ...beg a female for a photo for months. I still don't think he is sincere because his gestures come across as excessive which in my opinion, is indicative of superficialness. He also started pursuing me 2months after his

divorce. My intuition tells me that something is wrong so I'm happy that I have no attraction toward him.