All men are dogs, right?

[compulsivedancer]

I was thinking today about my back and forth with H about OM. H is very invested in the idea that OM manipulated me and was just out for one thing and didn't care for me in the least in person, and that OM was only invested in our conversations when they were about sex.

 

It's so hard to tell whether he's right, or whether this his way of blameshifting from me to OM.

 

I don't really want to believe it. Some of that is because it hurts to think that I was just a prize to be one, some male game being played, etc, or that I was interchangeable in OM's mind with any other interested woman.

 

But today I was thinking about it and realized that I don't want to believe it because it darkens my worldview a little. I am a generally optimistic and hopeful woman (H would agree, but add naive). Even though I am fully capable of thinking of men in terms of meat, it shades my thoughts of men a little to think of them primarily as animals searching for a sex partner.

 

I'm not sure that there's a question in there. Maybe there is. Hopefully you guys can figure out better than me what I'm really asking.

 

Sorry for so many posts today. Got a lot on my mind. (besides, I've been posting kinda lightly lately, so I guess I have to make up for it, right!?)

[ageofaquarius]

I think I'd vote for potential blame shifting because it might be easier for him than to think about your role/feelings? Not sure, just a thought.

 

IMHO, some men are game players, others not, just like us women! I've come to learn, the hard way, that it's not about them, but about how I allow them to treat me--so it's really about me!

 

Believe me, I've gone through the "I hate all men" phase but it was, again, really about me and my issues.

[It-is-what-it-is.]

I do not believe all men are dogs.

 

I have raised a male child to a man and seen love and pain from him that makes me know he feels.

 

I have seen his friends and teammates cry privately, give each other comfort and advice and celebrate each others happiness, in love.

 

I have also seen them act like complete jerks. Selfish and without regard to other people's feelings to get what they wanted.

 

I believe in your case, you husband needs you to be less culpable. He needs you to not assume the blame for the OM because to do so makes you somehow sympathetic to him. KWIM?

 

I believe that people who cheat are not thinking of others, not their spouses, not their AP, not their APs BS. Affairs are selfish. So even if he has that great guy in him, he was not being a great guy with you, and it's best to assume you could have been anyone.

 

Not sure if this makes sense or not.

 

IIWII

[HopingAgain]

I know exactly where you are coming from. I started off originally thinkingv that all men cheat and that no matter how many years a mans been with a woman, he won't hesitate to trade her in for a younger model. This was just from my own observations in youth and seeing how many older MM hit on me and other girls I knew. Iv actually started changing that POV with my husband and now I'm right back where I started almost. I read many accounts of men being faithful but I always think they're extremely rare and exceptions to the norm. I no longer think humans are monogamous by nature. But that we can choose to be.

[ChristopherRobin]

"All men are dogs" is a big generalization. Would I be wise to assume that all women cheat and that all women are dogs, based on the fact that you cheated on your husband?

 

You cheated on your husband with another man, and you wonder whether he was just using you? You are a married woman, and there are many other unattached women out there. If he wanted a real relationship rather than sex, he would have gone after someone unattached.

 

Of course he wanted you for sex. A guy that isn't a "dog" would have stayed clear of you the moment he saw a ring on your finger.

 

Edit: I would like to add however, that the blame does not belong to the other man. The other man made no promises to your husband, and did not rape you. The ball was completely in your court.

[Woggle]

All men are not dogs but most men who go after married women don't do so with good intentions. Most players look at married women as easy targets. There are plenty of men who are faithful and do not mess with married women.

[Tayla]

Since I am a female (like that makes perspective any different), I will say this...

Guys for the most part are rather simple to understand and "read". There is no "depth" to them...They take things primarily at surface level...I mean that as a compliment...There is no hidden agenda...Yet a lady will take a sentence or a gesture a guy makes and twist it around and make it more then or think there was an undertone to it...There rarely is....they aren't that clever

 

As someone earlier said, they raised a son...SO to that I tip my hat in understanding that when speaking of either gender....A Parent out there hopes their child isn't cast into a stereo type of Dog or pig ...Its rather disappointing ...for to a parent its an insult....Think of that next time a negative term is used...A parents heart breaks...

[Toddbt12y1]

The irony of all this.....mind blown*

[ChooseTruth]

In a sense, but in a sense not.

 

I think the vast majority of men have a very strong physical desire that is pretty difficult to control, especially younger men. I've heard about a case where women were injected with the same levels of testosterone as an experiment and they experienced so much arousal that the never wanted to repeat the experience.

 

At the same time, I'll never forget a particular thread on another infidelity site where a woman asked faithful men what their secret was.

 

Reply after reply said the same exact thing:

"I don't trust myself, I avoid dangerous situations." I feel the exact same way. If I were alone with an attractive woman, and she came onto me...I might be in huge trouble! The thing is, I avoid situations like that. I also watch what I say and to not take a friendship beyond where it should go emotionally. (Actually, if an extremely attractive women came onto me at this point, I'd probably go for it lol...I'm *this* close to having D finalized)

 

Dr. Harley says the people who are most likely to commit adultery are the ones who don't recognize the capability in themselves and therefore take no measures to prevent it.

 

There's another book called "Women's Infidelity" which says that men go into marriage knowing that they will have to suppress their strong urges...and most women go into marriage thinking they will never even HAVE these urges. So now we come to where I get screwed up the other way. I'm constantly afraid women are so naive they don't even see the potential for themselves to cheat. I think most men know this about themselves...but vary on how well they prevent it.

[ChristopherRobin]

Women and men both have urges, as the OP must well know based on her experiences. The thing that separates us from the beasts is when we have self control over those urges.

 

But this entire thread is ironic as noted earlier, because the OP is calling every last man on Earth a dog, when she herself could not control her sexual urges even during a marriage.

 

Women are not sluts, men are not dogs. Some people just have self-control and boundaries, while others don't.

[HopingAgain]

In a sense, but in a sense not.

 

I think the vast majority of men have a very strong physical desire that is pretty difficult to control, especially younger men. I've heard about a case where women were injected with the same levels of testosterone as an experiment and they experienced so much arousal that the never wanted to repeat the experience.

 

At the same time, I'll never forget a particular thread on another infidelity site where a woman asked faithful men what their secret was.

 

Reply after reply said the same exact thing:

"I don't trust myself, I avoid dangerous situations." I feel the exact same way. If I were alone with an attractive woman, and she came onto me...I might be in huge trouble! The thing is, I avoid situations like that. I also watch what I say and to not take a friendship beyond where it should go emotionally. (Actually, if an extremely attractive women came onto me at this point, I'd probably go for it lol...I'm *this* close to having D finalized)

 

Dr. Harley says the people who are most likely to commit adultery are the ones who don't recognize the capability in themselves and therefore take no measures to prevent it.

 

There's another book called "Women's Infidelity" which says that men go into marriage knowing that they will have to suppress their strong urges...and most women go into marriage thinking they will never even HAVE these urges. So now we come to where I get screwed up the other way. I'm constantly afraid women are so naive they don't even see the potential for themselves to cheat. I think most men know this about themselves...but vary on how well they prevent it.

 

You know, this actually makes a lot of sense. That those who are successful at being faithful simplyv run from temptation and avoid it like the plague. Those that are unfaithful are the type to either scoff at danger or think they're above it all.

[ChristopherRobin]

It's called self-control.

 

And it absolutely takes work. I refuse to have lunch alone with female coworkers, exchange phone numbers or Facebook with other women, hell.. I don't even flirt back to women. I'll pretend they didn't even do it.

 

The first step towards an affair is allowing emotional or physical connections with someone of the opposite sex.

 

I know that I am a human, a highly evolved animal, and that I have to control that animal or it will control me. Every person can have an attraction to others, it's what you do with it that counts.

[HopingAgain]

It's called self-control.

 

And it absolutely takes work. I refuse to have lunch alone with female coworkers, exchange phone numbers or Facebook with other women, hell.. I don't even flirt back to women. I'll pretend they didn't even do it.

 

The first step towards an affair is allowing emotional or physical connections with someone of the opposite sex.

 

I know that I am a human, a highly evolved animal, and that I have to control that animal or it will control me. Every person can have an attraction to others, it's what you do with it that counts.

 

Right! And people who have shaky boundaries are ripe for affairs! They just push the envelope a little bit further each and every time.

 

My H is one of those people who thinks they can be friendly to everyone at all times, and he is a friendly person but he is also a people pleaser to an extent and I am finding that his personality type is very common to people who wind up in an affair. Knowing how and when to say NO goes such an incredibly long way!

[ChristopherRobin]

Right! And people who have shaky boundaries are ripe for affairs! They just push the envelope a little bit further each and every time.

 

My H is one of those people who thinks they can be friendly to everyone at all times, and he is a friendly person but he is also a people pleaser to an extent and I am finding that his personality type is very common to people who wind up in an affair. Knowing how and when to say NO goes such an incredibly long way!

 

I agree, you can't please everyone so you should do everything in your power to please and protect the person you decided to spend the rest of your life with.

 

I would just like to say though that someone who is a people pleaser in most aspects of their life doesn't necessarily have poor boundaries when it comes to fidelity, unless you have seen them have a hard time saying no to something inappropriate. I would be looking more for signs of self-control and patience.

[HEY2147]

My friend is a player. To a player married women are often the most preferred choice as

 

1) No commitment some men just don't like commitment. If a man wants sex or someone to talk to, who is better to go for than a married woman.

 

2)No BS of a relationship as most dont date and if they do its not often and dont spend much money plus the MW doesnt act like your GF or Wife no fighting and no opening up emotions, no hassle just show interest even when you dont and they're yours

 

3) Most MW do more freakier and dirtier stuff to the OM than their H

 

4)Plus the thrill that they choose to sex with them than their Hs

 

And many other reasons

 

As for are all men pigs watch this The Science of Lust (Full Documentary) - YouTube

 

It shows you the reason for lust on both men and women.

 

Why men are more lustful than women?

What makes women lustful?

What happens to lust when we are in love? and

Can love overcome lust?

[ChristopherRobin]

Thank you for that link. I'll watch it later with the Fiance. Looks interesting.

[compulsivedancer]

Women and men both have urges, as the OP must well know based on her experiences. The thing that separates us from the beasts is when we have self control over those urges.

 

But this entire thread is ironic as noted earlier, because the OP is calling every last man on Earth a dog, when she herself could not control her sexual urges even during a marriage.

 

Women are not sluts, men are not dogs. Some people just have self-control and boundaries, while others don't.

 

CR, H is trying to convince me of this. I personally have never thought of men this way. The title actually IS meant ironically. H says that I don't understand the extent to which men are dogs. I'm not sure I want to, if in fact they are.

 

OM was not a player, but from my H's perspective, he put a lot of time into me. He spent over a year getting to know me, and we were starting to have boundary issues. Around that time, H initiated open marriage discussions, I talked to OM about it, H hemmed and hawed. Eventually H said no, but not before we had crossed some significant boundaries. Instead of stopping, we took it from there. OM was H's best friend.

 

From my perspective, OM and I were friends with poor boundaries, and once we started talking about sex, they eroded pretty quickly, leading into the A. We both said early on we were only looking for sex, but I think we both thought there was a friendship somewhere in there too.

 

From H's perspective, OM used his knowledge of me from years of listening to H talk about me in order to seduce me. H does not think he necessarily intended that from the start, but that whenever opportunities presented themselves, he was sure to insert himself quickly. He believes there was only sex, no friendship.

 

Both of us put blame on me, but H puts a lot of additional blame on OM. In part just because of their friendship, but also because he trusted OM as much as he trusted me. Actually, he trusted OM more.

[Lamron]

Just had a quick look at the responses, so my apologies if I am being redundant.

 

Of course not all men are dogs! Those that want to f a married (or otherwise taken) woman are dogs, of course. All men know that.

 

Actually, come to think of it, this term/discussion is a disservice to dogs. My dog is faithful and honourable.

 

There is an over-simplification with the “all”.

 

Your husband is in pain. Yes he is correct about “the guy”, but the statement that all men are such is just his attempt to try and cope. I’m sure he doesn’t feel that he is (or ever was) in that camp…

 

But go with it as long as possible. Because, really, it is a coping mechanism for your husband - and eventually his mindset will start to turn…

Edited August 31, 2013 by Lamron

[aliveagain]

The only man that I know who was a real player was a friend I called Sluty Jim. He specialized in married women and as a realtor he got to meet a lot of lonely wives. That man got laid more than any man I have ever met. All men are not like him. I on the other hand keep meeting women that cheat on me, I am starting to believe all women will cheat if the opportunity is created and they believe they can get away with it. I hate thinking that way because it clash's with the respect I was taught to have for women. I doubt that I will ever marry again but if I did I would only do so with a postnuptial agreement in place. I have become very successful and I don't plan on giving another house away anytime soon. I think I would prefer to be in a relationship that is friendship based, live together, travel and see the world, she would never have to worry about anything financial again and I know I could just walkaway if there is any infidelity. Not all men are dog's just as not all women cheat, at least that is my hope.

[road]

All men are all dog's.

 

Every attractive girl we see we would like to do.

 

Thing is some men can be attracted to many women yet still be monogamous.

[road]

Just had a quick look at the responses, so my apologies if I am being redundant.

 

Of course not all men are dogs! Those that want to f a married (or otherwise taken) woman are dogs, of course. All men know that.

 

Actually, come to think of it, this term/discussion is a disservice to dogs. My dog is faithful and honourable.

 

There is an over-simplification with the “all”.

 

Your husband is in pain. Yes he is correct about “the guy”, but the statement that all men are such is just his attempt to try and cope. I’m sure he doesn’t feel that he is (or ever was) in that camp…

 

But go with it as long as possible. Because, really, it is a coping mechanism for your husband - and eventually his mindset will start to turn…

 

 

You have never seen dogs in heat.

 

You never had a dog try to hump your leg.

 

You have not experienced either one.

[oldshirt]

I'm a man who has never cheated on my wife of 18 years so I hate to say that men are dogs.

 

But here's a way you can address your own question. Take a good hard look at how much time, money, energy, emotional investment etc etc that a man will put into a woman/women that he is NOT the least bit interested in sexually (excluding close female relatives )

 

The answer = not much to none at all.

 

So basically if you aren't a close blood relative and a man is spending his time, energy, money and emotional investments on you (or at least making it look like he is), he is interested sexually and is at least hoping to go there.

[oldshirt]

 

So basically if you aren't a close blood relative and a man is spending his time, energy, money and emotional investments on you (or at least making it look like he is), he is interested sexually and is at least hoping to go there.

 

What I think your real question here is whether this OM had real feelings for you or whether you just fell for a playah'.

 

Hard to say. As someone mentioned earlier, players often specifically target married women because they are actually easier to get some NSA poontang off of than single women.

[dichotomy]

Is your husband a dog?

 

If a woman cheats is she always a cheater?

 

Both my wives cheated on me (1st was PA, second was leftover EA) - are all women cheaters, users, and not to be trusted?. Myself, and maybe a few other BH's might have concerns.

 

Only you can decide after time and perspective what OM was about.

 

After much therapy my wife finally said to me "OM/MG was worm who used me" to which I responded "Great, you finally get that ! .....and YOU used him as well". To which she responded like a deer in the headlights. When I said that I didn't necessarily mean sex with OM/MG (but they both did) but that she used him to feed an unhealthy need in herself. They used each other - for their own selfish needs. Sex, esteem, fake words, loss, what ever.....

[Woggle]

My friend is a player. To a player married women are often the most preferred choice as

 

1) No commitment some men just don't like commitment. If a man wants sex or someone to talk to, who is better to go for than a married woman.

 

2)No BS of a relationship as most dont date and if they do its not often and dont spend much money plus the MW doesnt act like your GF or Wife no fighting and no opening up emotions, no hassle just show interest even when you dont and they're yours

 

3) Most MW do more freakier and dirtier stuff to the OM than their H

 

4)Plus the thrill that they choose to sex with them than their Hs

 

And many other reasons

 

As for are all men pigs watch this The Science of Lust (Full Documentary) - YouTube

 

It shows you the reason for lust on both men and women.

 

Why men are more lustful than women?

What makes women lustful?

What happens to lust when we are in love? and

Can love overcome lust?

 

These men always seem to forget the part where the women is distant from her husband and he doesn't know why then he finds out and things can get really really hairy.