Dating now vs. late 80's early 90's

[hotpotato]

I'm not penalizing her for anything. I want short-term, no strings sex and so does she. No problem. Why do you think it's some sort of penalty?

 

 

 

Well, that's a bit rude. But you seem to be agreeing with me and making my point for me.

 

Do you tell them you want no strings attached?

 

You are penalizing her. You asked for sex, she gave it to you. You assumed she was easy, and left.

 

If a dude wants sex in first three dates that normal. If a girl gives it to him she is easy and a guy must move on the the next. All she did was give him what he was asking.

 

What I proposed doing is no more rude than a hump and dump. What am i supposed to do, really? If I had sex with him, I'm easy and he will leave after sex. He has led me on by taking me on a date. Many guys will push hard for sex right away, and that's not what I want so I will leave and quickly. If he only wanted sex, it was not necessary to take me on a date. He should have been honest. If he can assume i'm easy for having sex early, I will assume he is only after one thing and is showing his true intentions for pushing for sex early. So...Adios!

 

People just need to be honest about their intentions.

 

Like," I want to have sex with you. If you give it to me, i will probably leave because you are a slut. Cool with that?"

 

I (and most men in their teens and twenties) are pervs. I don't think there's any dispute about that.

More like from puberty to death. At least we can agree.

[Els]

Wow, I must be living in a time machine, because I started dating in the mid 2000s, but everything mentioned about dating in the 80s/90s pretty much coincides with my experience...

[Els]

Why penalize a woman for doing something you asked her to do? I could easily say pushing for sex so early makes guys looks like pervs, but I doubt they see it that way.

 

Don't do something you don't want to do just because you're asked to do it, perhaps? You teach people how they treat you.

 

Anyways, I have a new rules. If a man asks me for sex too soon i just leave, in the middle of a date if I have to. Adios!

 

I'd at least wait til the meal is over, but yeah, definitely sounds better than doing something you don't want to do just because you're asked to do it.

[GG3]

It was exactly the same in the 80s and 90s. Exactly. I could have written your post word-for-word in 1987.

 

The big difference I see nowadays (and admittedly, I'm looking at it as an outsider now) is that women seem way more gullible. Back then, women called us on our bull****. We then faced the decision of sticking around and becoming boyfriends or moving on to look for easier prey. The 3-date rule evolved because that told us what kind of woman we were with: If she slept with you in the first 3 or so dates, she was "easy" (our word back then) and we would screw her for a few weeks (and push her to do more unusual sexual activities) until we got bored or we found someone else. But if a woman said no to sex, that meant she was girlfriend material and expected us to behave like boyfriends. So we did.

 

I don't think it's qualitatively different now. Most of the people in healthy relationships will read my description and say "That's how it still is today, moron!" I think the difference is quantitative: that more (most?) women today don't demand that men treat them with respect. And they usually justify it with some ludicrous rationalization like, "Well, I have to do whatever a guy wants me to do or else he'll just find someone who will." WHY THE HELL WOULD YOU WANT TO DATE SOMEONE WHO TREATS YOU LIKE CRAP??? I honestly don't get it.

 

Women are always in control of love/romance/sex/whatever you want to call it. A guy will do whatever you let him get away with. If a man doesn't treat you well, DON'T DATE HIM! It's not terribly complicated.

 

Despite the explosion of information on dating/relationships in books, magazines, TV, internet (there was no such thing as a relationship book when I was in my 20s) young people seem more clueless than ever. I suspect it's because most of the information out there is really disinformation. Until women get a clue, men will keep treating them as badly as they let us.

 

You have a point but try being female and doing that and being single for years. There are so few good guys that respect women, you basically end up not dating for years. Speaking for myself and my girlfriends. One girlfriend it took her 4 years to find someone.

[EasyHeart]

Do you tell them you want no strings attached?

 

You are penalizing her. You asked for sex, she gave it to you. You assumed she was easy, and left.

The transaction is complete. There is no reason to stay.

 

What I proposed doing is no more rude than a hump and dump. What am i supposed to do, really? If I had sex with him, I'm easy and he will leave after sex. He has led me on by taking me on a date. Many guys will push hard for sex right away, and that's not what I want so I will leave and quickly. If he only wanted sex, it was not necessary to take me on a date. He should have been honest. If he can assume i'm easy for having sex early, I will assume he is only after one thing and is showing his true intentions for pushing for sex early. So...Adios!

 

People just need to be honest about their intentions.

 

Like," I want to have sex with you. If you give it to me, i will probably leave because you are a slut. Cool with that?"

Again, I think you are agreeing with me!!!

[EasyHeart]

Don't do something you don't want to do just because you're asked to do it, perhaps? You teach people how they treat you.

Exactly. I usually frame it as: "People will treat you the way you expect to be treated."

[xxoo]

Wow, I must be living in a time machine, because I started dating in the mid 2000s, but everything mentioned about dating in the 80s/90s pretty much coincides with my experience...

 

I'm not dating, but most of the couples I know who have met and married over the past 10 years met the "old fashioned" way.

[Els]

You have a point but try being female and doing that and being single for years. There are so few good guys that respect women, you basically end up not dating for years. Speaking for myself and my girlfriends. One girlfriend it took her 4 years to find someone.

 

I'm a woman (in my 20s, even) and it has never been a problem finding guys who respect my desire to wait.

 

I can sympathize with demographic/social circle/cultural differences, but that really still isn't a reason to do something you don't want to do, in hopes of getting something that isn't guaranteed in return. Sounds like a recipe for disaster. Put it this way, if he's pressuring you for sex and you cave just to 'have someone', how compatible do you think both of you will be in the long run? There doesn't seem to be much long-term potential anyway, so might as well stick to your guns and next him.

[EasyHeart]

You have a point but try being female and doing that and being single for years. There are so few good guys that respect women, you basically end up not dating for years. Speaking for myself and my girlfriends. One girlfriend it took her 4 years to find someone.

Well, I'm of the mind that it's better to not date than date someone who doesn't treat me well.

 

One thing that is different now than 20-30 years ago, though, is demographics. Back then, people of common dating age were born during a time of decreasing birth rates, so there were more men than women, and thus women were in higher demand. People now in their 20s and early 30s were born during a period of increasing birth rates, so there are fewer men and more women. That might explain some differences.

[xxoo]

If women want to engage in early sex (and I understand the appeal), be grown up enough to understand that it is just sex, and it has no solid emotional foundation. Often, it will cause a man to see you through a narrow lens (sexual) and not be interested in learning more.

[HokeyReligions]

I feel like there's no such thing as "dating" anymore.

 

At least in my area (NYC) most dudes are looking for casual hook-ups. So they'll be interested for a few weeks, to a couple months TOPS and then they'll pull the "ghost" move where they just completely disappear from your life never to hear from them again.

 

I don't know what happened between past generations and now, but it seems like the respect for dating and honoring the woman has just been lost.

 

Now it's blatantly all about getting laid as soon as possible... there are tons of websites out there that say, "If she doesn't put out by date 3 move on to the next."

 

Everyone has an agenda these days. Very rare is it to find someone truly genuine and honest and open about their situation. Lying is rampant, guys dating multiple women and having sex with multiple women at once is common.

 

Dating is really disgusting. I wouldn't even call it dating. I don't even know what it is lol.

 

Guys don't come up and act respectful, they come up and make comments about a woman's tits or a.ss. They call out from the car as they drive past... like you really think that's going to get you a date?!

 

You just described dating in the 1960's forward. I know because I was there. The differences I see are people swear more. Pregnancy before marriage was shameful - at least in the 60's & 70's - women had more respect for themselves. Now its like they want to be treated just like men with additional special 'entitlements' because they are women. And I don't think men really want 'men' that can have babies. Overall I think people traded morality for anarchy regarding sex and totally confused themselves.

[GG3]

I'm a woman (in my 20s, even) and it has never been a problem finding guys who respect my desire to wait.

 

I can sympathize with demographic/social circle/cultural differences, but that really still isn't a reason to do something you don't want to do, in hopes of getting something that isn't guaranteed in return. Sounds like a recipe for disaster. Put it this way, if he's pressuring you for sex and you cave just to 'have someone', how compatible do you think both of you will be in the long run? There doesn't seem to be much long-term potential anyway, so might as well stick to your guns and next him.

 

I never said I was doing that. I'm speaking in defense of women though and it is tough trying to meet someone these days.

 

Men need to treat women better.

[hotpotato]

The transaction is complete. There is no reason to stay.

 

Again, I think you are agreeing with me!!!

 

At least you are honest. Many men are not.

 

They go through the motions of wanting to date, but really just want a piece.

 

If a guy wants a transaction, there are plenty of prostitutes. Why not go to one of them?

[GG3]

To further add a rant to my own situation...I rarely have sex these days because I haven't met anyone and am happier alone and then I have certain friends around me who find it strange that I won't do friends with benefits and keep going on at me about it. (Men of course)

[Imajerk17]

KatZee, I'm definitely not attempting to invalidate nor dismiss your bad experiences or those of your friends. The disappearing act is horrible, even more so after a few months. I have never done that to anyone. It goes both ways though.

 

For one thing, many relationship-minded men have gotten into pushing for sex early because we have learned that oftentimes if we don't, the woman will (at best) friend-zone us.

 

Meanwhile, that it is much easier to screen communication makes it much easier for BOTH genders to disappear. You go on a couple dates with a guy, but you aren't feeling it? No problem just ignore his communication from now on. Nevermind that the guy put in all that effort and money to show you a good time, he doesn't deserve the respect of you responding back or anything. (I'm not saying you personally do it, I am saying that this is something that guys have to deal with too.)

 

Eventually said guy comes to the conclusion that "dating" the way his dad might have done it doesn't work. Taking women on proper dates seems to make him look like a tryhard square. Better to "hang out" with the girl instead.

 

By the way, I agree with what Sith Apprentice said about how getting a girl's phone number meant much more back 20--25 (or maybe more like 30--35) years ago. Back then, because she couldn't screen communication, you were almost guaranteed a chance to at least talk to her on the phone.

 

 

 

 

 

 

I feel like there's no such thing as "dating" anymore.

 

At least in my area (NYC) most dudes are looking for casual hook-ups. So they'll be interested for a few weeks, to a couple months TOPS and then they'll pull the "ghost" move where they just completely disappear from your life never to hear from them again.

 

I don't know what happened between past generations and now, but it seems like the respect for dating and honoring the woman has just been lost.

 

Now it's blatantly all about getting laid as soon as possible... there are tons of websites out there that say, "If she doesn't put out by date 3 move on to the next."

 

Everyone has an agenda these days. Very rare is it to find someone truly genuine and honest and open about their situation. Lying is rampant, guys dating multiple women and having sex with multiple women at once is common.

 

Dating is really disgusting. I wouldn't even call it dating. I don't even know what it is lol.

 

Guys don't come up and act respectful, they come up and make comments about a woman's tits or a.ss. They call out from the car as they drive past... like you really think that's going to get you a date?!

Edited September 22, 2013 by Imajerk17

[hotpotato]

Don't do something you don't want to do just because you're asked to do it, perhaps? You teach people how they treat you.

 

 

 

I'd at least wait til the meal is over, but yeah, definitely sounds better than doing something you don't want to do just because you're asked to do it.

Fhe is pushing early, I will assume he has no respect for me.

 

I guess my issue is the double standard that wont go away. And guys not being upfront. If you just want sex, man up, and say so from the beginning.

 

Instead guys go through the motion of courtship. He has wasted both our time and his money. He could have taken the same $$$ and gone to a strip club or escort.

 

Ill just put some money on the table and leave in the middle of the meal. No need in wasting any more time. Hot tater dont play.

[xxoo]

I guess my issue is the double standard that wont go away. And guys not being upfront. If you just want sex, man up, and say so from the beginning.

 

Instead guys go through the motion of courtship. He has wasted both our time and his money. He could have taken the same $$$ and gone to a strip club or escort.

 

Ill just put some money on the table and leave in the middle of the meal. No need in wasting any more time. Hot tater dont play.

 

Well, that's one thing that hasn't changed, except that maybe more women are willing to engage in early sex.

 

Men love the chase. There is no chase in paying a prostitute. And early sex ends the chase--time to move on if there is nothing else keeping him interested (an emotional attachment).

 

I never said I was doing that. I'm speaking in defense of women though and it is tough trying to meet someone these days.

 

Men need to treat women better.

 

Why would they, when women don't require it?

[Leegh]

I think nowadays with texting or emailing a possible date, one cannot tell their interest level nearly as much as speaking with someone over the telephone. Sometimes the tone and sound of a person's voice can tell you a lot about them in general, and also their interest level in you. I liked the style of dating back in the "olden" days much better than today.

[hotpotato]

Well, that's one thing that hasn't changed, except that maybe more women are willing to engage in early sex.

 

Men love the chase. There is no chase in paying a prostitute. And early sex ends the chase--time to move on if there is nothing else keeping him interested (an emotional attachment).

 

 

 

Why would they, when women don't require it?

 

And thats why I rarely date.

 

Ive heard men say something similar. Even saying it was ok to be dishonest to a woman than go to a prostitute bc theres no chase -and no bragging rights- in banging a prostitute. Maybe guys need to create an tailor made experience with a gfe prostitute.

 

Anyways, ill just assume the man is a perv and move on if he asks too soon. A perv with major double standards.

Edited September 22, 2013 by hotpotato

[KatZee]

Until women get a clue, men will keep treating them as badly as they let us.

 

See, what you say makes sense. There are tons of gullible women out there... but my question to you is:

 

Why would you knowingly and WILLINGLY want to treat women badly? Is this something you all get off on?

 

And then the good men are confused as to why there are no good women left, or we turn around and do the same to them... and then wonder why.

[HoneyBadgerDontCare]

The times I've dated since my divorce I've noticed that it's incredibly difficult to find a sane, down-to-earth girl to have a romance with that can potentially blossom into a LTR. There's so much odd or unacceptable behavior/personality traits...and drama. I definitely think part of it is that many women have gotten burned badly over and over again.

 

It's a cycle. I'll start from the man's point of view (since I'm a man):

 

1) Man finds what he thinks is nice woman. Gets burned BAD in some way.

2) If he's very nostalgic, he'll go through this cycle a few more times.

3) Man is hurt, reads things online, and talks to friends.

4) Man decides to just care about himself and has sex with girls as soon as possible. He doesn't open himself to getting hurt again.

5) Man meets nice woman. Screws her over.

6) Woman goes through the same cycle.

[HoneyBadgerDontCare]

I'm talking about general attitudes and behaviors in society as a whole though. So many women think "flirting" is talking raunchy or sexual. For example, I've met women who talk about blowjobs and pulling their hair during sex and various positions etc. To complete strangers. In public. Women who argue that they like sex as much or more than men. Whatever. My point is, once the cat is out of the bag, its out. Once guys (in general) get the idea that women (in general) are that accessible for sex, the committed relationship option becomes less attractive.

 

I've occasionally met girls like this, but I don't think they're the norm.

 

To be honest, I wasn't even interested in having sex with them, no less dating them (I feel that talking about sex in this terms is masculine.....and, thus, I'm turned off by it).

[HoneyBadgerDontCare]

Not sure if I would ever try to meet someone on-line there is something creepy about that for me but if it works for others I don't judge. It's been almost 20 years since I've "dated" and from my observations and what my kids tell me I almost cannot wrap my head around it. It was so much easier then, no pressure, no BS and there were no "blurred" lines as someone mentioned. Thanks for the responses, I am very old school and noticed the change in dating "norms" and I'm not even currently dating, though I do have an old friend from that era that comes around once in a while

 

Haha my mom tells me the same thing (she's a boomer and got married in the late 70s).

 

Her advice was always "Just get her flowers and be nice to her". I took that advice up to age 14 or so.

[HoneyBadgerDontCare]

Do you tell them you want no strings attached?

 

You are penalizing her. You asked for sex, she gave it to you. You assumed she was easy, and left.

 

If a dude wants sex in first three dates that normal. If a girl gives it to him she is easy and a guy must move on the the next. All she did was give him what he was asking.

 

What I proposed doing is no more rude than a hump and dump. What am i supposed to do, really? If I had sex with him, I'm easy and he will leave after sex. He has led me on by taking me on a date. Many guys will push hard for sex right away, and that's not what I want so I will leave and quickly. If he only wanted sex, it was not necessary to take me on a date. He should have been honest. If he can assume i'm easy for having sex early, I will assume he is only after one thing and is showing his true intentions for pushing for sex early. So...Adios!

 

People just need to be honest about their intentions.

 

Like," I want to have sex with you. If you give it to me, i will probably leave because you are a slut. Cool with that?"

 

 

More like from puberty to death. At least we can agree.

 

You make it seem like he asked her and she reluctantly agreed.

 

In my experience, women want sex just as much, if not more, than men. Women are supposed to be the gatekeepers. If they have give it up too soon, it's logical to believe that she's done that many times before and will do the same many times after you.

[Woggle]

Back then men and women seemed to like each other for the most part. These days the hostility is so thick you can cut it with a knife. It's a vicious cycle that goes like this.

 

Men screws woman over

 

Women decides that all men are scum so she screws a man over

 

Man decides there are no good women so he screws a woman over

 

Woman is bitter so she screws a man over.

 

Man is bitter so he screws a woman over

 

 

It goes on and on and on. This is what dating and relationships have devolved to.

 

Another thing is that most men don't get off on treating women poorly but many get tired of treating women well and having it blow up in their face. We have feelings and get hurt just like women do and like women when we get hurt sometimes we want to lash out.