Demonizing the wife

[HopingAgain]

In regards to the taking of the car keys.

 

It is not as simple as saying one should not parent another adult. Its what would a reasonable person do.

 

A reasonable person would take the keys (hide them if need be) from a post surgery, medicated individual, a person trying to drive drunk, or an emotionally distraught person.

 

A reasonable person can see the big picture and would do within reason their part to prevent injuries and/or deaths of the loved one, or strangers.

 

Personally, I would view it as my duty as a human being to prevent injuries and deaths if it was in my power.

 

Absolutely. Love is action, not just words, and clearly this wife loves her husband and that in itself irritates the hell out of OP. I am willing to bet my right arm that if OP was in the position of the wife, she would have taken the keys too and not let him drive home. Why? Because she loves him and would have wanted to make sure he was safe. This is a classic case of jealousy pure and simple.

[thefooloftheyear]

If another adult is "unreasonable", it's not your job to make them be reasonable.

 

 

Perhaps...and while it may seem like a "motherly" thing to do, many women will do these types of things for their husbands. I dont see anything all that crazy about it..

 

Lets face it...Some of us are extremely hard headed....

 

TFY

[MissBee]

The funny part of this ridiculous car keys debate is that a BS cant win for losing, as in the case of demonizing, that's exactly the point: ridiculous or not, reasonable or not, dumb or not, wonderful or not etc. the OW who despises her will find ANYTHING to latch on to and obsess about.

 

First off MM is reporting this tale so that could already be an exaggeration, but even if his wife took his keys so he wouldn't possibly kill himself, she's treating him like a child? Then the SAME OW if his wife didn't and he drove into a ditch you'd hear "His wife doesn't give a shyt about him like I do...how could she have let him drive, it's her fault he's in a ditch, if it were me I'd never do that..."

 

LOL! No matter what a BS does or doesn't do, the point is that those doing the demonizing are being irrational and will find a fault with anything and everything they can because that's what demonizing is.

[ComingInHot]

besides all of page ten being nothing more than twisted and regergitated vomit from those AP's Still trying to "demonize" the BS, the Topic of the driving/BW/A thing, well if a grown adult Doesn't want to be Treated like a child, they shouldn't Act like one*

 

What I read beyond the topic are a whole lot of justifications as to why it's alright "in their A stitch" to bang someone ele's spouse.

It's just Not. But geez don't blame the BS or envision her "evil", just to serve your stitch.

[MissBee]

If bartenders in some states are required to make the choice to not serve a drunk customer and say "You've had enough sir", because although an adult this adult is being irresponsible...then how much more should someone's spouse be able to be like alright...gimme your keys because you're not gonna be driving while medicated??? I hope if I decide to do something dumb like that my spouse/bf/friends would stop me...I'll get over being treated like a child and I'll get over OTHER people looking in and thinking so, rather than if they allowed me to and something happened.

 

But again: the OP admits she despises this woman just cause. So how is it even up for debate that when you despise someone you will find fault with everything they do?? I don't know about anyone else, but when I know someone either really hates or loves someone, I take their opinions about them/their behavior with a grain of salt, as I know intense hate or love can cloud your mind....the former makes everything the person does negative and the latter makes them blameless.

[velvette]

For what its worth, this MM is a recovering alcoholic, so they probably have a long history of her playing designated driver or taking his keys away......most likely with good reason.

[HopingAgain]

For what its worth, this MM is a recovering alcoholic, so they probably have a long history of her playing designated driver or taking his keys away......most likely with good reason.

 

Bingo! Was wondering who else was going to notice that dynamic!

[janedoe67]

Is it the sex part that bothers you so much?

 

BS's hide behind marraige certificates far to often.

 

Takes more than paper to have somebodys love, attention, affection and heart.

 

Some married people always share that special place they once were in when they married, their love evolves and they are happy, faithful and fulfilled. Others simply dont, and sometimes they meet and fall in love with a partner more suited to them as the person they are currently, but xyz needs to take place before they rip up the marraige paper.

 

Some BS's treat their marraige certificate like a vehicle ownership, you cant own somebodies heart, they have to want to share it with you. Living in the same house or attached by a marraige certificate does not translate to owning anothers heart.

 

 

Let me speak slowly. If a man is married to someone else...he is NOT your man. If you screw him, love him, feel "coonected and soul-matish" to him....YOU are invading a marriage.

 

Let's be grownups. Let's be honest.

 

When you mess with a person who is married to someone else, you are doing something morally wrong.

 

Period.

[janedoe67]

I said if ANY adult sees another adult as unreasonable, it is not their job to make the other adult be what they deem reasonable. No labels at all - ANY adult. You can be the WS, the BS, the AP - whomever, if you think it's your job to parent another adult (one that is not MR and in need of that physically or mentally by diagnosis), you have issues. Period. Those types of people overstep boundaries a LOT because they think they "should". That's dangerous and unhealthy and annoying.

 

 

A BS taking up for AP's is a kind of special denial all its own.

[jlola]

A BS taking up for AP's is a kind of special denial all its own.

 

I think many WS have selfishness and entitledment issues. That is what git them in the affair in the first place. The character continues in affair. Because they are entitled and selfish, they refuse to give comforf or assets up. They want it all.Just like some of these people who murder their spouse rather than deal with consequences and simply divorce.

 

I always say I would rather eat peanut butter sandwiches and live in a small apartment with a man I love, then live in a mansion and eat lobster with a man I do not love. These people searching for a million excuses why he stays with BS need to wake up and smell the the coffee.

 

You are not even number 2 on his list. You are below his finances, wife, family and friends.Hardly a love story .Because the person you claims love you so much has no idea love is actions.Not mere words. He cares only for himself and what he stands to lose. Selfish and entitled.

[HopingAgain]

I think many WS have selfishness and entitledment issues. That is what git them in the affair in the first place. The character continues in affair. Because they are entitled and selfish, they refuse to give comforf or assets up. They want it all.Just like some of these people who murder their spouse rather than deal with consequences and simply divorce.

 

I always say I would rather eat peanut butter sandwiches and live in a small apartment with a man I love, then live in a mansion and eat lobster with a man I do not love. These people searching for a million excuses why he stays with BS need to wake up and smell the the coffee.

 

You are not even number 2 on his list. You are below his finances, wife, family and friends.Hardly a love story .Because the person you claims love you so much has no idea love is actions.Not mere words. He cares only for himself and what he stands to lose. Selfish and entitled.

 

When I was the WS in my prior relationship, I was a very selfish, entitled person. I can admit that now as at the tie I couldn't and would NOT allow myself to take any of the blame for our failed marriage and there was quite a period of time where I did relish in cakeeating until Dday blew all of that out of the water. From a WS standpoint, I can say that many times the WS is looking completely at what is in the affair for THEM, whats in the marriage for THEM. They aren't looking at the love for the BS or for the OW, they are looking at how both relationships can make their own lives better.

[2sure]

The A is always a result of a broken M. M are broken because of two people the WS & the BS. If both the BS & WS were happy in the M and in love with eachother, at any stage of love. An A wouldn't happen, the WS would adore and respect the BS, the WS would feel fulfilled by the BS and not feel empty hearted and go out seeking love and attention, validation.

 

Like mentioned earlier WS, dont always stay with the BS because she just fantastic and a great match for him, ALOT of the time they stay cause they dont want the witch to take them to the cleaners...

 

My MM assures my happiness all the time, he wants to make sure I'm ok with everything,,,,, somedays I teeter on wanting him more but in the end, as hard as it is to believe I'm still his primary romantic relationship. BS is a technicality.

 

His M is like an old brake pad, worn out from too much grinding.... he doesnt feel the connection, attraction to fuel any motivation to want to fix it.

 

I don't think most OW or WS will even be able to agree with this.

Edited October 6, 2013 by 2sure

[jlola]

Hmmm. I see people doing the best that they can. I mean, who doesn't want "it all"?

 

And, when there are children involved, I think we can all agree, that it's a pretty sucky set up that one has to give up their children when they don't want their SO any longer. It sucks that those two things are a package deal, but they are - and yes, I'm sure they knew the risks - but when it comes down to it, it's probably pretty damn hard to walk away from your children.

 

Since when do you give up your kuds if you divorce? Joint custody is the norm these days unless you are a deadbeat or abusive parent.

 

And so.e of the best parenting I have seen is from divorcex peoe who have kids half the week, but give iots of quality time and love.They u use the other half of the wd ek to get personal things done, get together with friends and DATE. Dating whe married with kids takes time and emtio al support away from kids.As wel as giving them future trust and self esteeem issues. You want your freedom and to be with the one you ultimately love? Divorce.50% of people do it.

[ForeverHopeful1]

It is gross cause imho a BS that takes back a WS thats in love with and never cheat on her. They are out there, my xH was farrrrr from perfect, but faithful 100% of the time, never sneaky, if he ran out somewhere he would wante with him, not texti another woman is grossly broken and needs the validation of simply being somebodys wife over finding a good man for herself who will loveng the OW re: where to meet while scuffling out the door like a sewer rodent.

 

So you prefer the sewer rodent? I think you need to figure out why you would subject yourself to a mcould behave this (husband) and ? Why cant we focus on the issue that is the MM amd leave his wife out of it. What kind of dirtpig could do the things your MM is doing? And you "are in love with him." I am so confused.

 

 

 

I fixed this for you. The other woman is grossly broken and needs the validation of simply being somebodys somebody, over finding a good man for herself who will love her instead of some wsste of a sewer rodent.

[ForeverHopeful1]

You don't have 100% of the time with them like you did. Anything less than 100% is giving up something.

 

How much of that 100% of the time does he spend away from his kids with the OW?

[thefooloftheyear]

How much of that 100% of the time does he spend away from his kids with the OW?

 

I see your point, but....

 

How would it be any different if he was divorced and dating someone? ..Or having to lose time because he needed to take a second job to afford the CS and alimony payments??...

 

I know some parents dont give a shyt about their kids, but for some of us, anything less than the maximum amount of time with your kids is a tremendous loss..

 

TFY

[jlola]

I see your point, but....

 

How would it be any different if he was divorced and dating someone? ..Or having to lose time because he needed to take a second job to afford the CS and alimony payments??...

 

I know some parents dont give a shyt about their kids, but for some of us, anything less than the maximum amount of time with your kids is a tremendous loss..

 

TFY

 

So you go aheax and havd an affair which will almost guarentee the outcome you are tryi g to avoid? PLUS AN ugly divorce and risk your Children's respect.Does yhis make sense?

[Got it]

I used to poo poo the idea of people being afraid of divorcing, that these fears had any validity and wasn't just them being wussy or complainers who dreamed but never actually planned to do more than that. My parents were like this. Staying for the kids, how much "better" that is. Please, spare me.

 

Well I can say after seeing my MM/husband's divorce I have a better understanding of the other side. From seeing my friend's brother's divorce I have a clear picture how some states can rule on things and how hard that even though parental alienation is wrong, how hard it is to repair that damage.

 

There is a validity to the fears, far more than I ever expected or wanted to believe. I know with my friend's brother, she cheated and he has been RAKED over the coals all upheld by the courts. She has turned the kids against him, has made numerous false claims, just disgusting things. Here was a man that was a hands on dad, saw his kids every day, and with the courts support had to go weeks where he couldn't see them on top of months of limited contact, all tied to false claims and dirty tactics. All of this and paying a substantial support.

 

And for my husband, not seeing his kids as much is very hard on him. To not be there for them as freely. He made it through his wife's affair, his goal was to make it to their adulthood. To make it a little easier.

 

My father stands by his decision to wait as well. While can't say I agree or fully understand, he felt it was better to stay married financially and for the kids and divorce would have been worse.

 

I can't say I have always understood or agreed, I can say I understand a little better now, but I can say that from the men I know there is a valid fear of divorce and the changes tied to it. Obviously not all stories are like these, everything has a bell curve, but I have a little better understanding now.

 

 

And I still think this thread is meant to inflame and be trollish.

 

For me, I never hated his wife. I don't hate her now. She has done things that I haven't always understood and haven't always made me happy but I don't hate her. I don't know her. I never really thought about her very much and any shortcomings or limitations on our relationship was directly tied to his decisions and actions or lack thereof. I fully recognized that no one was holding a gun to his head.

[sweet_pea]

I see your point, but....

 

How would it be any different if he was divorced and dating someone? ..Or having to lose time because he needed to take a second job to afford the CS and alimony payments??...

 

It would be different because there wouldn't be any lies involved. I cant imagine how hurt I would be to find out that my dad lied to me about not being able to make it to my ballet recital because he had "work," but it was really him going to spend time with AP. That's a betrayal, and that's the difference in my eyes between a married + cheating parent and a divorced/single parent. One needs to lie to their kids about time spent and the other doesn't.

[sweet_pea]

Agreed. And, I find it fascinating that so many of the people that say that divorce is "so easy" and "just do it, it's not that big of a deal" stay with WSs and themselves attempt to avoid divorce at all costs. It's interesting in a very confusing sort of way.

 

Actually, I'm divorced and agree with their sentiment. I believe that a few here who are currently with their WS had also kicked them out/started divorce proceedings before reconciling, so I guess they didn't really avoid it at all costs...

[yellowmaverick]

You don't have 100% of the time with them like you did. Anything less than 100% is giving up something.

 

Enlighten me - how does a MM who is screwing and texting a OW spend "100% of the time" with his children?

[thefooloftheyear]

So you go aheax and havd an affair which will almost guarentee the outcome you are tryi g to avoid? PLUS AN ugly divorce and risk your Children's respect.Does yhis make sense?

 

You missed the point entirely....

 

Forget about the "affair"..In my case I already set the wheels in motion and there was a divorce decree a year before I met the OW..I was out...done..Maybe your comments are better suited to some other scenario.

 

The point that seemingly ALL OW make about totally disregarding the MM's devotion to his children and mocking it like its only a lame excuse as to why they cant leave is absolute nonsense...theyll come a time when i will explain everything to her...Im not worried. Unlike seemingly all OW, I admit I made a huge mistake at that time, confessed when I didnt even have to, and owned every bit of it. I blame no one, heck, I dont even blame my kids mother-even though she indulged in years of neglect, rejection, passive aggressiveness, and failure to recognize the problems in the M..Ill just say we werent compatible and leave it at that.

 

Point is dont underestimate the devotion a father has for his kids..MANY fathers(that never indulge in affairs or infidelity) live in miserable marital conditions to sacrifice their own happiness for their kids..happens every day.

 

TFY

Edited October 6, 2013 by thefooloftheyear

[jlola]

 

Point is dont underestimate the devotion a father has for his kids..MANY fathers(that never indulge in affairs or infidelity) live in miserable marital conditions to sacrifice their own happiness for their kids..happens every day.

 

TFY

 

having kids does not mean sacrificing everything in life for them. I had parents who were unhappy with each other. My father had NPD and a serial cheater. My mother a fixer who had the biggest heart and could not let go of the fantasy of the man she met years ago.

 

 

I used to beg her to divorce since "Don Juan" my father was a cake eater. she would say she stayed married for the kids, he would tell anyone who would listen what a great father he was and he would never leave because of his love for "his kids".Hearing them argue was beyond destructive to all of us. The atmosphere in the house more tense than peaceful. But ultimately for whatever sick reason, they stayed where they were because they wanted to.

 

I was speaking to a few women friends recently who grew up with mothers who sacrificed everything for the kids. We all agreed we wished our mothers had followed their passion such as art,or further education or travel or whatever, instead of making us their lives. We wished they searched for their happiness beyond their children.

 

Marriage should not be a sentence for everyone involved. It does the children no service to have parents who do not love each other , but may cheat and think they are being sacrificial lambs for them.Then everyone is unhappy because even children can sense tension and betrayal.

[thefooloftheyear]

having kids does not mean sacrificing everything in life for them. I had parents who were unhappy with each other. My father had NPD and a serial cheater. My mother a fixer who had the biggest heart and could not let go of the fantasy of the man she met years ago.

 

 

I used to beg her to divorce since "Don Juan" my father was a cake eater. she would say she stayed married for the kids, he would tell anyone who would listen what a great father he was and he would never leave because of his love for "his kids".Hearing them argue was beyond destructive to all of us. The atmosphere in the house more tense than peaceful. But ultimately for whatever sick reason, they stayed where they were because they wanted to.

 

I was speaking to a few women friends recently who grew up with mothers who sacrificed everything for the kids. We all agreed we wished our mothers had followed their passion such as art,or further education or travel or whatever, instead of making us their lives. We wished they searched for their happiness beyond their children.

 

Marriage should not be a sentence for everyone involved. It does the children no service to have parents who do not love each other , but may cheat and think they are being sacrificial lambs for them.Then everyone is unhappy because even children can sense tension and betrayal.

 

I see your point....but you(nor anyone else) are in any position to judge someone for throwing their own life away for the sake of the kids.(or the part of their life until their kid is emancipated). Thats their right and they seek their own comfort level.,,

 

Not to be dramatic, but I would rather kill myself than not see my kid at least 5 days a week..I cannot for the life of me understand how some divorced men(or women) actually agree to only see thier kids on alternate weekends or some other garbage. I even know of a guy that agreed to allow his divorced wife to move the kids with her across country..He now gets the kids 2 weeks out of the year..I couldnt do that with a dog..

 

I also scoff at the people that think that kids of divorce are now all of a sudden happy and understanding of the breakup of the family..truth is they almost never are. Most of that thought process is solely to alleviate the guilt of the parents for turning their kids lives upside down...Kids are incredibly "selfish"...They dont care about their parents woes(heck they dont even understand it when they are little-you can explain it to them a thousand times)They grow up with a complex, especially when they compare themselves to their peers that have "normal" loving parents and are a cohesive family unit. i lived it myself..

 

Im not criticising you here, but now that you are an adult, its easy to play monday morning quarterback and say your parents should have divorced. But they didnt, and in fairness, you really have no idea what impact that might have had on you as a child/young adult, if they went ahead and did divorce..

 

Point is, unless there is overt domestic violence, drug abuse or some other devastating condition, in cases where the two parties just arent on the same page, divorce sucks for kids and it always has..

 

Sorry for the t/j....do these threads ever stay on topic??

 

TFY

Edited October 6, 2013 by thefooloftheyear

[LilGirlandOW]

It would be different because there wouldn't be any lies involved. I cant imagine how hurt I would be to find out that my dad lied to me about not being able to make it to my ballet recital because he had "work," but it was really him going to spend time with AP. That's a betrayal, and that's the difference in my eyes between a married + cheating parent and a divorced/single parent. One needs to lie to their kids about time spent and the other doesn't.

 

I cant speak about every MM, but mine never misses anything involving his kids for any reason... including spending time with me. I would guess lying to the children from the (M)AP is rare? Or at least no more common than a non WS lying to their child. From most accounts on here the AP's seem to be good hands-on fathers.