Question for professional women

[Gatsby]

For the ladies that work in a professional office environment. Have you ever felt compelled to forgo a relationship with someone based on what they do for a living? Does the potential reaction from co-workers/boss play a part in your decision? I'm having a hard time getting to just what I mean so I'll lay out my experiences.

 

I meet women outside of work. I have varied interests (avid reader, fine wine, good athlete), am well groomed, dress nice and am modestly attractive. So, no problem meeting women and engaging in conversation...until the job question comes up.

 

Woman: So, what do you do?

Me: *Gulp* I work in construction.(Vague answer)

Woman: Who do you work for?

Me: "name company"

Woman: What do you do for them?

Me: *Here we go* I work in the field.

Woman: Oh.(As wheels start spinning thinking of how to get away)

 

This is obviously a condensed version but the end is usually the same. I'm just out of a 15 year relationship(10 married) so I'm curious as to whether this is the norm today. Is the corporate culture so cut throat that you can't risk having your image sullied by being with someone percieved to be on a lower social level. BTW, money is not the issue. In most cases I make more than they do.

 

I remember a post from a few months ago from a woman asking where the nice guys were that just wanted to be with them and not trying to constantly get ahead of the game. Well, we're out here but apparently you don't really want us.

[Merin]

Well I can't speak for all the Ladies.. but no what someone does for a living wouldn't deter me from dating them if I had an interest in him for who he is.

 

My most recent EX is in the USMC..

 

The list of guys I've dated go from everything to a stripper (LOL no kidding) a Police Officer (however he was a Van driver when I met him for a hotel) A Airforce dental tech, A bankteller, A construction worker, A fireman, A waiter..

[SoleMate]

I'm a manufacturing executive and no, I absolutely do not have "prestigious employment" requirements for a possible man. Such things might have meant a little more to me when I was younger (although still not a lot), back when I was still trying to find myself and demonstrate to the world that I deserved to be taken seriously. Now I'm 41, and I find that while all the corporate stuff can bring in a nice income, I don't ever want any portion of my self-esteem to be tied to my job - or my (theoretical) husband's. I find that I have a lot in common with people in the trades. And my dream has always been to be married to a man who is great at fixing things around the house, and enjoys doing it. If you can do all the electrical, plumbing, carpentry, finish work, and miscellaneous, you get MAJOR points.

 

So, no. Not for me. However, I don't doubt that there are plenty of women who respond as you have described.

 

If you want some tips to improve your odds, here you go:

 

* Look for women who are secure and confident with themselves

 

* Be proud of what you do, and talk about it with pride. People will tend to take on the opinion of yourself and your employment that you project

 

* Meet a mix of women, not just those from an office environment

 

* As always, do your best to make sure that appearance, grooming, fitness, clothing, etc. are all they need to be, and that you smile, talk, and especially LISTEN

 

Happy hunting!

[Gatsby]

Such things might have meant a little more to me when I was younger (although still not a lot), back when I was still trying to find myself and demonstrate to the world that I deserved to be taken seriously.

 

I believe my ex had a big issue with that. Her career never really went the way she planned and I guess I just became another symbol of failure for her. That's why it's so frustrating to go through that every time. It's like having my face rubbed in it.

 

If you can do all the electrical, plumbing, carpentry, finish work, and miscellaneous, you get MAJOR points.

 

Got all that covered(as long as cooking doesn't fall under misc.)

 

* Look for women who are secure and confident with themselves

 

Been with an insecure one for 15 years so I know what to avoid.

 

* Be proud of what you do, and talk about it with pride. People will tend to take on the opinion of yourself and your employment that you project

 

I am proud. I'm the fourth generation in my field and while I could have done anything(cliche as that is) I just didn't have a passion for any field of study when in college. I don't mind working with my hands. I get to do something different every day and stay active. I would probably go insane if I had to sit behind a desk staring at a computer. It's the constant looks of disdain I'm subjected to daily that start to wear on me though.

 

* Meet a mix of women, not just those from an office environment

 

That's just it. I meet them away from the office. I'd be lucky to get them to look at me sideways there anyway. But most of my activities and interests place me in contact with college educated people. As a general rule they are more likely to be professionaly employed.

 

* As always, do your best to make sure that appearance, grooming, fitness, clothing, etc. are all they need to be, and that you smile, talk, and especially LISTEN

 

Really, I don't think any of these are the issue. I'm in great shape(triathlete), clean shaven, slacks and a nice shirt for casual(I wear jeans and boots all day at work-can't wait to get out of them.) Always being told I clean up pretty good. As if the expectation is I should be walking around in a dirty t-shirt, ball cap and swilling beer.

 

Sorry, this turned into more of a rant. It's just perplexing to me why people place so much importance on their job.

 

Thank you for the replies.

[alphamale]

Dear Great Gatsby:

 

Yes I have a couple buddies who have same problem. One is a plumber and other is a welder and both have good decent paying jobs.

 

The funny thing is that if you lied to these same women and told them you're a brain surgeon most of them would have their phone number in your hand within 10 minutes.

 

My little brother is an eye surgeon in chicago and he can walk into any bar and have 3 phone #s from different beautiful women within an hour. All he has to say is "well, i'm an eye surgeon". The guy has literally got a line a half mile long of gorgeous single women waiting at his door.

 

It shows you how shallow many women are.

[Pocky]

I'd be more prone to talk to a hard working down to earth man that's intelligent and enjoys the finer things in life than an executive of a large firm that's more interested in how much money he's making, what his stocks are doing and which is the most prestigious country club to join.

 

There are good women out there that are looking for a man just like you. However, you're going to find they're rare, but well worth it once you find them.

[alphamale]

Originally posted by Pocky

There are good women out there that are looking for a man just like you. However, you're going to find they're rare, but well worth it once you find them.

 

 

Good men and good women are rare... I agree totally. I would also like to add that many women SAY they don't care about a man's job or how much he makes but the women's ACTIONS do not jive.

 

When many women say "oh...where are all the GOOD men", what they really mean is "where are all the rich, young and good looking men"

[Gatsby]

The brutal honesty of alphamale is always welcome. I know some find you too cynical but most of what you say is just reality without the sugarcoating. And when men say they're looking for nice women they're really saying "Where are the hot, skinny girls with the nice tits!"

 

In your brothers situation, I guess they deserve each other. It's just as much a game for him as it is the women. I'm not interested in the masses anyway. Maybe I misrepresented the type of interactions I've had. These have not been bar meetings where the goal is to pick up women. These have been casual conversations at events that have progressed nicely until the topic of work comes up. At that point conversation just drifts back to mundane subjects.

 

I'm not trying to make a moral judgement about behaviour. I have my own ideas about why women might behave this way. I'm just trying to flesh out the ideas with some honest and thoughtful feedback from the ladies.

 

Just to clarify, the question is not would you do it but have you felt any doubts about doing so and why you think you felt that way.

 

Let's try not to get into a tit for tat battle of the sexes.

[alphamale]

Originally posted by Gatsby

The brutal honesty of alphamale is always welcome. I know some find you too cynical but most of what you say is just reality without the sugarcoating.

 

 

Dear MR. Gatsby:

 

I realize you are looking for female responses here but I just cannot resist.

 

When you tell them what you do for a living do you come of as proud and passionate about it??? Women pick this shyt up damn quick. If you tell them "oh, yeah....i'm just in construction" and then look down at the floor then they will think negatively about it.

 

Stand tall, be proud of your career and acomplishments. Next time don't let them ask you what you do, you offer it first. Early in the conversation say something like "you know...I have been in the construction trade for 15 yrs and I just absolutely love it and would not want to ever do anything else, so, what do you do for a living?"

 

The other trick you can do is make it a game. if she ask you what you do, say "well, what do you think i do, why don't you guess?"

 

It is 90% about how you come off and if you are coming off as being embarassed about your job then it will show. But if you are positive and enthusiastic then she will see that vs what you do. Tell them a cool story about something you did at work that was unusual.

 

Hey man, someone has to build all the shyt we see around us.

[Gatsby]

As I said before, I am proud of what I do. I do not hesitate, look down, mumble or give any other indication that my job is insignificant. The reason I do not bring it up first is because I don't believe the job you perform is a reflection of the type of person you are or an indication of what your real interests are. All of my social interaction is done at functions and during activities of which I choose to participate, not at a job I am required to go to. I would prefer to talk with someone about the type of art they like, where they have traveled or what sports they enjoy.

 

The question "Where do you work?" just sounds coarse to me. I don't find it necessary in a first conversation. It lacks imagination and tells me nothing about the person other than someone has to pay them to go someplace for 8 hours a day. Very few people are fortunate enough to have jobs that are also their passions. I'm not one of them. If I should meet someone that has a passion for their work I'm sure they will volunteer that information during the couse of conversation.

 

By all means keep posting with any other thoughts. This thread is not limited strictly to women. One idea can provide an unlimited number of paths to knowledge.

[tokyo]

You spend 40 hours a week in this job, you should feel something for it. Many people want to have a job that gives some meaning to their life.

[moimeme]

The brutal honesty of alphamale is always welcome. I know some find you too cynical but most of what you say is just reality without the sugarcoating. And when men say they're looking for nice women they're really saying "Where are the hot, skinny girls with the nice tits!"

 

That might be true for younger types. One hopes a little maturity eventually shows how shallow and worthless those things are.

 

I suspect you have stereotype going against you; the assumption is probably that you couldn't cut it in school due to lack of ability and so went into the trades. It's much more common in Europe or elsewhere for people to want to go into the trades and it's considered more prestigious there than in North America. So you do have an uphill battle. You may have to spend a little more time wowing them with your charm and intellect before talk gets around to occupation.

 

You could try having people guess. When they've all guessed wrong, then announce with a twinkle that you're in construction with the air of 'now isn't that a hoot' about you. Then go for the poetic. Something like "I love the fact that I have participated in creating something that will last" and maybe talk about a couple of the buildings you've worked on. Or if you're building homes, you can talk about how people will live in something you created.

 

Many people want to have a job that gives some meaning to their life.

 

Yeah, that's a grand plan but things that create meaning don't necessarily pay you. There's nothing wrong with doing work that brings in cash which allows you to conduct the rest of your life the way you want. It's a perfectly valid career option. I'm doing exactly that and so are many people who live where I do. People are so glad to live here, they'll take whatever job there is just to have the lifestyle. And if there weren't people willing to do this, the market would be short on an awful lot of labour because there an awful lot of jobs which just are not the sorts of things which provide meaning to one's life.

[tokyo]

Originally posted by moimeme

Yeah, that's a grand plan but things that create meaning don't necessarily pay you. There's nothing wrong with doing work that brings in cash which allows you to conduct the rest of your life the way you want. It's a perfectly valid career option.

 

Of course, there´s nothing wrong with it, but for some people it´s important. And for many people it´s highly attractive if you feel some passion for your work and it´s doesn´t have to be about the amount of money one earns.

[alphamale]

Originally posted by kooky

Of course, there´s nothing wrong with it, but for some people it´s important. And for many people it´s highly attractive if you feel some passion for your work and it´s doesn´t have to be about the amount of money one earns.

 

 

KOOKY:

i have found in my experience that as women get older money matter a lot more. There are more bills to pay, mortgage, kids expenses, keeping up with the jones' and all that.

 

A lot of younger women just go for a good looking guy even if he is a janitor. But when that same woman is 10 yrs older they now realize that money = security and they start going after men that make better livings.

 

just an observation i guess.

[Lonestar]

When many women say "oh...where are all the GOOD men", what they really mean is "where are all the rich, young and good looking men"

 

I don't give a damn about rich and young, but they better be good looking. If I'm not physically attracted to them, it'll never work.

 

I work in a very large law firm. I've dated people of "my own" if we're talking about the corporate world, and I find that I don't really want to come home to one of those after working with them all day. Personally, I'm attracted to men who work with their shirt off and walk in the door at the end of the day tan, sweaty, and dirty as hell. At that point I want to jump him before he even makes the shower, or in the shower works too.

 

No, a guy's job doesn't bother me in the slightest as long as he has a career of some sort and is hard working like I am. I'm currently dating my ex who does construction. I like what he does. If I need something fixed, he's right there. I only wish I could get him to fix things naked.

[whichwayisup]

When you tell them what you do for a living do you come of as proud and passionate about it??? Women pick this shyt up damn quick. If you tell them "oh, yeah....i'm just in construction" and then look down at the floor then they will think negatively about it.

 

Stand tall, be proud of your career and acomplishments. Next time don't let them ask you what you do, you offer it first. Early in the conversation say something like "you know...I have been in the construction trade for 15 yrs and I just absolutely love it and would not want to ever do anything else, so, what do you do for a living?"

 

G, Alpha nailed it right there...Confidence is the key. He's right, be Proud of what you do for a living.

 

When you do meet someone, the right someone, you will just know...It won't matter what either of you do for a living, as long as there's some feelings involved.

 

Yes there probl. are some women who wouldn't get involved and judge a guy on what he does...But the same goes the other way around too. Some guys won't date women who are 'secretaries' or 'Librarians'.

 

Happy hunting!

[tokyo]

Originally posted by alphamale

KOOKY:

i have found in my experience that as women get older money matter a lot more. There are more bills to pay, mortgage, kids expenses, keeping up with the jones' and all that.

 

A lot of younger women just go for a good looking guy even if he is a janitor. But when that same woman is 10 yrs older they now realize that money = security and they start going after men that make better livings.

 

just an observation i guess.

 

Hm, when I was younger, I basically just wanted to have a boyfriend, whoever it was Ok, more seriously, I still wouldn´t have taken the good-looking janitor. I think my hormones would have run crazy, if one approached me, but I listen to my brain, most of the time at least.

 

Now I find there´s a shift in my interests. I still want someone who is attractive in my eyes, but I found out that the kind of attractive guy I would have fallen for as a girl is less interesting. With time I´ve met attractive, but dumb guys and I know that as little girl I might have fallen for them, but now I found them to be such huge turn offs that they had a clear impact on my hormones.

 

I always thought I will earn my own money and I always thought a smart guy would know how to make money. I either haven´t reached this level yet where you marry people for money or you are mistaken with your theory.

[moimeme]

A lot of younger women just go for a good looking guy even if he is a janitor. But when that same woman is 10 yrs older they now realize that money = security and they start going after men that make better livings

 

Well, you must be talking about women who aren't making their own way in the world. If you believe money=security, that's plenty reason to earn your own, no?

 

Some guys won't date women who are 'secretaries' or 'Librarians'.

 

Huh? 'Librarians' happen to have to have degrees for their jobs. It is a profession. Plus, don't you know about the theory of the steamy librarian - all prim by day but at night a tigress?

[Gatsby]

'Librarians' happen to have to have degrees for their jobs. It is a profession.

 

 

See, this is really the point. It's not about the money. Hell, I can top six figures if we have a busy year. The issue is image. The equation money=security is only applicable to women who have associated their base desire for a strong male to money. The cultural shift of the last twenty-five years has emphasized image above all else. Working in an office, wearing a suit and tie just implies financial security. Whether the money is there or not is secondary.

 

 

And the comparisons of who a man would/wouldn't date are not equivalent. The stigma for the man would be to date someone percieved to be in a more powerful position. Remember, under all the cultural indoctrination our psyche still operates on a base instinct. alphamale gave a perfect example: women who say they want a nice guy but whos actions are contradictory. They say what society has taught them to be right but they act on their base instinct. I'm not saying it's right or wrong. If one prefers to wade in the shallow waters of society that is their choice. But how does one hope to understand another person if he is not willing to examine himself?

 

 

I understand the sociological/psychological reasons for the behaviour. I'm just confused as to how supposedly educated people can be manipulated so easily.