viewing porn + masterbation - do I have a right to be hurt?

[FairyTail]

Moimeme -- Well, some people may understand, but I certainly cannot see why. It seems as though no matter what post I read where you reply, you're always just trying to insult people and tell them that they're stupid for feeling the way that they do. And I'm certainly not miserable. You're being quite presumptious about me -- like I said ealier -- I HAD a similar problem to the one of which started this entire post; I don't have it anymore. So, you can stop insulting the "ridiculous views" that I don't have.

 

And you're very, very wrong about behaviorism. It isn't being tossed aside by the up-and-coming; it IS the up-and-coming. You REALLY need to stop talking about things that you know NOTHING about (and stop presuming things about the way I view things, while I'm at it), because behaviorism is not just about "ringing bells" and "electric shock." Behaviorism is about treating problem behavior rather than assuming that someone has a deep-seated mental illness. I have seen behaviorists make a person with cerebral palsey walk again; I have seen it cure tourettes; I have seen it virtually stop hallucinations in schizophrenic people, and schizophrenia is both a physical AND mental illness. MOREOVER, I have seen behavior analysts -- THEMSELVES -- find the root of their problems and solve them all by their little-ol'-SELVES.

 

Why do I call it "psychoanalysis garbage?" Because most of it IS. It is rarely based on any scientific evidence AT ALL. And that second quote is nice and all, but people have different backgrounds in studying Psychology, and just as I think that most of it, while quite interesting and fun, is pretty much bull, they are entitled to their opinion on behaviorism. Oh, and by the way, that quote is wrong: Behaviorist believe that people DO think -- that's why they treat humans differently than animals. But you'd know that if you knew anything other than the surface of behavior analysis.

 

Dyermaker -- I did NOT say "You bitch!" or "You're a bitch" or "Stop being a bitch;" I said "All you seem to want to do is show just how much of a bitch you can be..." -- And if I had believed, even for a moment, that she were trying to just give good advice and she were NOT just trying to piss people off, I wouldn't have said anything about it. If you KNOW someone is wrapped up in themselves, and you're HONESTLY attempting to help them out, then you need to approach them in a way that they will not fly into attack-mode and TAKE your advice. But Ms. Para-Pro over here doesn't seem to understand that.

 

Immoralist -- Thank you much!

 

Grinning Maniac -- I was not trying to be dismissive -- as she disagrees with me, I also have the right to disagree with her. Why I said she should no longer continue to read forums that piss her off is because she said herself that she was sick of hearing it. I don't know what other people do, but when I am not face-to-face with something that I must address, such as ...oh, I don't know, penis enlargement ads in my email or neo-nazi websites, I don't respond to them. I don't seek them out. She seems to do just that. So, the best way to solve the problem is stop making everyone's lives miserable and your own by just avoiding the situation all together. That's all I'm trying to say.

 

And I'm glad we could see eye-to-eye, as well. But remember, what I said to you in that particular post wasn't how I feel; I'm just trying to be empathetic.

[RowanRavyn]

Originally posted by Grinning Maniac

"If you dislike my point of view, just go away, because *I* have a right to say what I please...not you."

 

When you post a thread, you'll get many different opinions. If you're expecting them all to be similar to yours, or even sugar-coated...good luck with that. If you disagree with someone, don't you think it would be wiser to actually refute their claims instead of just being dismissive? o_O

 

Just a thought. Glad we saw eye-to-eye on something earlier though. Laters.

 

PS: Yeah Dyer...count me into the "bitch" crowd as well. Um...well whatever the guy equivalent to that might be.

 

Part of the problem is that we all feel very passionate about our opinions. Our personal experiences often win out over our good sense. Some people just like to argue. Some people argue to make you think, to make you see a different point of view.

 

I'll join the bitch club though.

 

Originally posted by immoralist

 

 

 

Why must porn-victimized women be lumped together as suffering from "misconceptions" and "insecurities" and faulted for "getting it so wrong"?

 

Why this lambasting condescension, which trivializes their concerns, mocks their anxieties and skewers their suffering?

 

These women suffer enough hurtful invalidation at home with their hubby/bf whacking-off to porn every waking moment. To get mugged by LoveShack's "Porn Posse" when they dare to express grief and anger over losing their man to obsessive porn stroking is piling on.

 

Let these women be.

 

I don't try to belittle their concerns, but I frankly get sick of terms like addiction being applied to every situation when that is not necessarily true. Just like the assumption that often floats around here that the wives of MM are fat, selfish slobs that let themselves go.

 

Addiction has a very specific definition. I get annoyed when it is used so lightly and flippantly.

 

No one "Must" stay in a situation. No one deserves to stay in a situation where they feel demoralized, but they have the freedom and the choice to remain or leave. Staying and putting the burden of validation on your partner is worthless. Get counseling, educate yourself or leave. (and yes, I know its more complicated than that, but it can be done.) In a perfect world BOTH partners work to understand each other, and give validation without it being demanded. IMHO more often than not the real problem is that there is a lack of fruitful communication between the partners.

[RowanRavyn]

Originally posted by Grinning Maniac

"If you dislike my point of view, just go away, because *I* have a right to say what I please...not you."

 

When you post a thread, you'll get many different opinions. If you're expecting them all to be similar to yours, or even sugar-coated...good luck with that. If you disagree with someone, don't you think it would be wiser to actually refute their claims instead of just being dismissive? o_O

 

Just a thought. Glad we saw eye-to-eye on something earlier though. Laters.

 

PS: Yeah Dyer...count me into the "bitch" crowd as well. Um...well whatever the guy equivalent to that might be.

 

Part of the problem is that we all feel very passionate about our opinions. Our personal experiences often win out over our good sense. Some people just like to argue. Some people argue to make you think, to make you see a different point of view.

 

I'll join the bitch club though.

 

Originally posted by immoralist

 

 

 

Why must porn-victimized women be lumped together as suffering from "misconceptions" and "insecurities" and faulted for "getting it so wrong"?

 

Why this lambasting condescension, which trivializes their concerns, mocks their anxieties and skewers their suffering?

 

These women suffer enough hurtful invalidation at home with their hubby/bf whacking-off to porn every waking moment. To get mugged by LoveShack's "Porn Posse" when they dare to express grief and anger over losing their man to obsessive porn stroking is piling on.

 

Let these women be.

 

I don't try to belittle their concerns, but I frankly get sick of terms like addiction being applied to every situation when that is not necessarily true. Just like the assumption that often floats around here that the wives of MM are fat, selfish slobs that let themselves go, or other women are glamourus, thoughtless sluts, and that MM are always using both of them. Each situation is different.

 

Addiction has a very specific definition. I get annoyed when it is used so lightly and flippantly.

 

No one "Must" stay in a situation. No one deserves to stay in a situation where they feel demoralized, but they have the freedom and the choice to remain or leave. Staying and putting the burden of validation on your partner is worthless. Get counseling, educate yourself or leave. (and yes, I know its more complicated than that, but it can be done.) In a perfect world BOTH partners work to understand each other, and give validation without it being demanded. IMHO more often than not the real problem is that there is a lack of fruitful communication between the partners, before and after they become involved.

 

My advise. Clearly identify your boundaries. Make sure you know where they are flexible and where they are not. Communicate those boundaries with your SO or potential SO before things get out of control. Then stick to it. Don't live on what ifs or maybes.

[moimeme]

I have seen behaviorists make a person with cerebral palsey walk again; I have seen it cure tourettes; I have seen it virtually stop hallucinations in schizophrenic people, and schizophrenia is both a physical AND mental illness. MOREOVER, I have seen behavior analysts -- THEMSELVES -- find the root of their problems and solve them all by their little-ol'-SELVES.

 

And it cures cancer and turns metal into gold too, I'll bet.

[dyermaker]

Originally posted by FairyTail

If you KNOW someone is wrapped up in themselves, and you're HONESTLY attempting to help them out, then you need to approach them in a way that they will not fly into attack-mode and TAKE your advice. But Ms. Para-Pro over here doesn't seem to understand that.

I hope you cover ethics when you actually start graduate school.

 

It's totally unproffessional to give psychological opinions over the internet, to complete strangers.

[Nocturnal]

I haven't read through the entire thread, so with this in mind excuse any rehersing of previous opinions. I am just going to give my thought on porn here because there's so many threads on the subject and most of them has gotten pretty long and figured I should just pick one.

 

Anyway, porn is not a substitute for sex. It can never be. At least not in a relationship that is otherwise healthy. I'd like to think of porn as a less harmful fantasy. Why? Well, because it's a visually arousing 'assistant' when you masturbate, much like a fantasy. The reason I say it's less harmful is because:

 

1. It's no one you know personally in said 'scene.'

2. You don't set the scene, and you have no control over it.

3. You're not apart of the scene.

4. You don't see yourself as part of the scene.

 

In a fantasy however, you have the control about who is there, what they do and you can place yourself smack in the middle. And I know women do fantasize, as do men and often they do it about other people than their spouse. And whith this in mind, what's more harmful, a fantasy of someone else where you have 'creative' control over who/what/where and most likely putting yourself in the middle. Or images that just roll by? I have yet to meet a guy that masturbates to porn that actually feels part of the porn. I'm not saying I'm against having a fantasy either, in my opinion people have a right to their own personal sexlife. And I know for a fact my girlfriend masturbates at the thought of other people. And the reason it doesn't bother me is because I see fantasy and porn to be the same calibre and I consume porn. I need that extra visual aid, and it's commonly known that guys in general go off much easier on a visual aspect of something than a thought of something.

 

If a guy masturbates within a relationship, it doesn't mean he doesn't want sex or that he doesn't love his partner. Chances are he just needed to masturbate. And a lot of us guys grew up being told that porn is tabu (especially us with moms who were once part of feminist organizations), so a lot of guys will hide it out of fear that people will judge them for their consumption of it. The only time porn can be an alarm signal (fantasy all the same) is when it substitutes real sex with your partner (or like a fantasy, when you have sex and think of someone else). If someone choose porn over actual sex then there could be a problem, but the problem is probably somewhere else in the relationship. I think a lot of couples need to talk these things over, without judging eachother's choices. I could never be with someone whom would restrict my porn usage yet read erotic novels or have a ton of fantasies. Cause to me they're the same thing.

 

In the end, we have two sexlives. The one we share with our partner and our own. And the latter is the category that porn falls into in my opinion.

[moimeme]

Nocturnal -

 

I fear that no matter how many men take the time to post thoughtful, intelligent, and honest replies about how porn is *not* a 'substitute' for their partners or that they absolutely do *not* prefer the porn women to their own, the porn-phobics will insist on believing their own mistaken ideas and insist on being 'insulted' 'hurt', etc. by the fact their guys look at porn.

 

It's the 'my mind is made up; don't bother me with facts' syndrome, I'm afraid. Nevertheless, thanks for your reply. I'm going to keep a set of links to the men's posts in this thread (well, most of the men's posts) and send them along on the inevitable subsequent 577342564321 threads on this very matter which will be posted in the future.

[Bronzepen]

Originally posted by moimeme

Nocturnal -

 

I fear that no matter how many men take the time to post thoughtful, intelligent, and honest replies about how porn is *not* a 'substitute' for their partners or that they absolutely do *not* prefer the porn women to their own, the porn-phobics will insist on believing their own mistaken ideas and insist on being 'insulted' 'hurt', etc. by the fact their guys look at porn.

 

It's the 'my mind is made up; don't bother me with facts' syndrome, I'm afraid. Nevertheless, thanks for your reply. I'm going to keep a set of links to the men's posts in this thread (well, most of the men's posts) and send them along on the inevitable subsequent 577342564321 threads on this very matter which will be posted in the future.

 

It's the proverbial - You can lead a horse to water.....blah, blah, blah.

 

The men who ride the horses that don't want to drink, always get bucked.

[FairyTail]

Moimeme -- Are you saying that I'm lying? Would you like me to pull up the studies for you?

 

Dyermaker --

I hope you cover ethics when you actually start graduate school.

 

It's totally unproffessional to give psychological opinions over the internet, to complete strangers.

 

You're funny. Funny AND hypocritical. I'm giving advice, just the same as you. If giving advice is so incredibly unethical, why not just...oh, I don't know...remove all the advice columns from the face of the Earth? Delete all psychological webpages? Hell, why even have this ENTIRE FORUM? You are making no sense at all. What I said in the quote was using common sense. You and your little friend really need to THINK before you say something. Both of your posts in reply to me me would have been just as effective as if you simply said: "Yeah? Well, you're a buttface!" My posts make sense and you have nothing to really say to them, so save yourselves the time and effort and just shut up for once.

 

Bang and bang.

[RowanRavyn]

Originally posted by FairyTail

Moimeme -- Are you saying that I'm lying? Would you like me to pull up the studies for you?

 

Dyermaker --

 

 

You're funny. Funny AND hypocritical. I'm giving advice, just the same as you. If giving advice is so incredibly unethical, why not just...oh, I don't know...remove all the advice columns from the face of the Earth? Delete all psychological webpages? Hell, why even have this ENTIRE FORUM? You are making no sense at all. What I said in the quote was using common sense. You and your little friend really need to THINK before you say something. Both of your posts in reply to me me would have been just as effective as if you simply said: "Yeah? Well, you're a buttface!" My posts make sense and you have nothing to really say to them, so save yourselves the time and effort and just shut up for once.

 

Bang and bang.

 

 

 

Mature much?

[dyermaker]

Originally posted by FairyTail

You're funny. Funny AND hypocritical. I'm giving advice, just the same as you.

I'm calling you out for appealing to psychological qualifications you're in the proccess of receiving, which, indeed, would be hypocritical if I was even somewhat guilty.

If giving advice is so incredibly unethical, why not just...oh, I don't know...remove all the advice columns from the face of the Earth? Delete all psychological webpages? Hell, why even have this ENTIRE FORUM? You are making no sense at all.

Well, you know what they say--if you can't beat them, misrepresent them.

 

Perhaps my (actual) point will be clearer when you actually embark on your graduate degree--it's totally unethical to masquerade unsolicited advice to strangers as even somewhat qualified.

Bang and bang.

You should be careful to load your rhetorical gun correctly, it must be quite embarrassing to end up with soot in your face.

[shutup]

I know I'm way late on replying here, but I just had to.

 

 

You people need to give it the f*ck up. Pornography and masturbation do not belong in a monogamous relationship. (Unless it is TRULY in mutual agreement, which is their own thing.) I don't care what any psychologist, all-knowing wo/man, or any other I-must-be-qualified person says. It's all bullsh*t. And it's wrong. A spouse is there for a reason. A spouse has always been there. Pornography hasn't. And shouldn’t be. You want to do that sh*t when you're alone? Fine. You ain't hurtin nobody. But to disrespect your wife by having hard-ons and ejaculations without her, f*ck you. How can that be ok, acceptable? Is the world that f*cked up?

 

A lot of you say sex and masturbation are separate. Uhh... no they're not. They have the same conclusion. You may make them separate in your mind, by disassociation, but they aren't naturally that way. People make pornography/masturbation unemotional because then it would be "wrong". So what so they do? UNattach themselves. Then it's ok. It's just f*ckin around.

 

Then a woman who's upset about it is irrational? But it's not irrational for men (I have to refer to GM here because he himself said this) to call the porn stars they look at wh*res and dirty and all sorts of other degrading names? That's not irrational? Then why the f*ck do you look at them? To get your d*ck up? You need a dirty wh*re to do that? Then you wonder why women feel inadequate. Hmmm. I f*cking wonder.

 

Why don't you guys quit telling the "poor me"s to understand your carnal desires, and try understanding a little thing called emotion. I don't mean "understand" in a textbook, Dr.-so-and-so-hypothesizes-this, and I-took-this-class way. Nobody cares about credentials and studies. It's all overrated. I'm talking about life, communication, reality. Emotion is what matters in our individual lives, not a quick cum.

 

Quit trying to protect you "right" to look at porn and think about what's it's doing to the emotions of your spouse. (You know, the sh*t that really matters.) Humans have empathy. And believe it or not, that's a good thing. Although, some people don't think so.

 

And to all you strippers/ dancers/ porn stars/ whatever you want to call yourselves, quit. Just quit. I mean, what the f*ck are you doing? Are you really proud that your "job" is to sexually arouse (often married) men? Come on. You've got to have something else working for you. If not shame.

 

And the rest of ya'll just need to quit with the bickering. How meaningless is your life that you make numerous posts showing each other up? Not helping, not debating, but b*tching back and forth like 12 year olds. MAN!! GET OVER IT!!!

 

This woman felt like she had a problem and everyone either attacked her or agreed with her. No one clearly said, "Talk to him about it. Really talk. Get both of your feelings and ideas out there, and make something happen. If either of you are unwilling to change even a little, f*ck it. It's got to end. Relationships are about making it right. Not sticking to your guns." How come nobody said that to her? Or tried to help her out? Ya'll just started fighting back and forth. "I'm right." "No, I'm right. "No, IIIII know." "No, I read this book." SHUT UP!!!!

 

 

... and that's exactly what I'm gonna do right now ...

[moimeme]

I recommend you read Dr. Albert Ellis. He has some very interesting stuff about 'emotions'.

 

Here's a bit of news for you: not everybody feels exactly the same thing. Therefore your rant may be appropriate for people who feel the way you do and always will. However, since every human is different, with different thoughts and different ways of approaching life, your 'solution' will suit only the people who think exactly the way you do.

 

But if you really want to, you can understand situations from other points of view than your own and you can also change your own point of view and even the way you 'feel' about something. And if you understand that your guy isn't preferring the porn people to you, then that he looks at them will cease to bother you and - poof - everybody's happier. Practically magical, it is.

[Chris_T.]

Originally posted by shutup

I know I'm way late on replying here, but I just had to.

 

 

You people need to give it the f*ck up. Pornography and masturbation do not belong in a monogamous relationship. (Unless it is TRULY in mutual agreement, which is their own thing.) I don't care what any psychologist, all-knowing wo/man, or any other I-must-be-qualified person says. It's all bullsh*t. And it's wrong. A spouse is there for a reason. A spouse has always been there. Pornography hasn't. And shouldn’t be. You want to do that sh*t when you're alone? Fine. You ain't hurtin nobody. But to disrespect your wife by having hard-ons and ejaculations without her, f*ck you. How can that be ok, acceptable? Is the world that f*cked up?

 

A lot of you say sex and masturbation are separate. Uhh... no they're not. They have the same conclusion. You may make them separate in your mind, by disassociation, but they aren't naturally that way. People make pornography/masturbation unemotional because then it would be "wrong". So what so they do? UNattach themselves. Then it's ok. It's just f*ckin around.

 

Then a woman who's upset about it is irrational? But it's not irrational for men (I have to refer to GM here because he himself said this) to call the porn stars they look at wh*res and dirty and all sorts of other degrading names? That's not irrational? Then why the f*ck do you look at them? To get your d*ck up? You need a dirty wh*re to do that? Then you wonder why women feel inadequate. Hmmm. I f*cking wonder.

 

Why don't you guys quit telling the "poor me"s to understand your carnal desires, and try understanding a little thing called emotion. I don't mean "understand" in a textbook, Dr.-so-and-so-hypothesizes-this, and I-took-this-class way. Nobody cares about credentials and studies. It's all overrated. I'm talking about life, communication, reality. Emotion is what matters in our individual lives, not a quick cum.

 

Quit trying to protect you "right" to look at porn and think about what's it's doing to the emotions of your spouse. (You know, the sh*t that really matters.) Humans have empathy. And believe it or not, that's a good thing. Although, some people don't think so.

 

And to all you strippers/ dancers/ porn stars/ whatever you want to call yourselves, quit. Just quit. I mean, what the f*ck are you doing? Are you really proud that your "job" is to sexually arouse (often married) men? Come on. You've got to have something else working for you. If not shame.

 

And the rest of ya'll just need to quit with the bickering. How meaningless is your life that you make numerous posts showing each other up? Not helping, not debating, but b*tching back and forth like 12 year olds. MAN!! GET OVER IT!!!

 

This woman felt like she had a problem and everyone either attacked her or agreed with her. No one clearly said, "Talk to him about it. Really talk. Get both of your feelings and ideas out there, and make something happen. If either of you are unwilling to change even a little, f*ck it. It's got to end. Relationships are about making it right. Not sticking to your guns." How come nobody said that to her? Or tried to help her out? Ya'll just started fighting back and forth. "I'm right." "No, I'm right. "No, IIIII know." "No, I read this book." SHUT UP!!!!

 

 

... and that's exactly what I'm gonna do right now ...

 

 

And the 'talk" with you would go something like this.

 

You: Stop watching porn! End of talk.

 

You want to "talk" as long as YOU are heard. Seriously, go back and read your post.

 

Who the **** are you to judge anyone? You sound like an intolerant bitch. You need to grow the **** up.

[Grinning Maniac]

@ChrisT: Nice one.

 

I read her post earlier and just laughed. She says she doesn't give a damn what anyone says and that masturbation is dead wrong. How exactly would any compromise be made from THAT? This is one angry tw@t...

 

@shutup:

 

But to disrespect your wife by having hard-ons and ejaculations without her, f*ck you. How can that be ok, acceptable? Is the world that f*cked up?

 

This is just stupid. It's a slam to your wife/gf to have an hard-on when they aren't around? Man oh man...that's just flushing logic down the toilet. There's nothing to even logically respond to that with. You're insane. Getting a boner is a slap in the face to your wife? You sign over your body parts at marriage now? Last time I checked, people were free to do with their genitals what they pleased. Does your husband (god forbid you're married) have to give you a permission slip in order to get wood, you old battleaxe? Hilarious...

 

A lot of you say sex and masturbation are separate. Uhh... no they're not. They have the same conclusion. You may make them separate in your mind, by disassociation, but they aren't naturally that way. People make pornography/masturbation unemotional because then it would be "wrong". So what so they do? UNattach themselves. Then it's ok. It's just f*ckin around.

 

Uhh...yes they are. You see babydoll, sexual intercourse involves two people. Masturbation involves ONE. I'd call the complete lack of a second party enough of a difference. No **** they have the same conclusion. What does that prove? If your husband (*shudder*) had a wet dream would you yell at him then too?

 

"HOW DARE YOU CHEAT ON ME WITH YOUR SUB-CONSCIOUS YOU PIG"

 

Pornography isn't unemotional to us because we're guilty about it and secretly think it's wrong. Pornography is unemotional to men because...IT'S A LIFELESS, AIRBRUSHED, TWO-DIMENSIONAL IMAGE. Are you kidding me? Pornography isn't emotional because it isn't *real*. Where's the confusion. The crappiest Hollywood movies is more "real" and "emotional" than porn has ever been. You must be high lol. To the guys here, have you ever shared a bonding moment with your wank material? Shed a few tears? No? Ok...

 

Also, for the record, I believe I did attempt to help the OP with her issue. Unless I'm mixing up the 100 porn threads, along with suggesting she talk to her partner, as usual I think I tried to explain how guys see porn since I'm a guy...but it's like it goes in one ear and out the other. *shrug*

[moimeme]

Damn. Oh well. So much for logical and reasoned responses. Name-calling immediately devalues people's opinions and personal attacks even more so.

[immoralist]

Damn. Oh well. So much for logical and reasoned responses. Name-calling immediately devalues people's opinions and personal attacks even more so.

 

You have got to be kidding? Right?

[RowanRavyn]

They have these nifty little cages you can buy for your man to lock his penis in. He would only get wood a few times before his body becomes trained not to respond, especially if you get the one with the spikes on the inside.

 

Then of course you will need the help of pills, and probably pornographic stimulation to get him hard enough to do you. I guess then you would be experiencing that together as a couple and that would be different.

 

I think this poster got just want he or she wanted.

[Groovy]

Lol!

[moimeme]

Oh, heck, Rowan! This is the 21st Century!! There surely must be some sort of remote-control electronic device which can be attached to the offending body part (remote-control on and off that is) which will ensure that it gets a very hefty 'teaching' shock every time it dares to raise its head without explicit permission. Oh wait, I get it - these people are into B&D - the men are subs and must obey their doms. Except somebody needs to tell the men.

[RowanRavyn]

Originally posted by moimeme

Oh, heck, Rowan! This is the 21st Century!! There surely must be some sort of remote-control electronic device which can be attached to the offending body part (remote-control on and off that is) which will ensure that it gets a very hefty 'teaching' shock every time it dares to raise its head without explicit permission. Oh wait, I get it - these people are into B&D - the men are subs and must obey their doms. Except somebody needs to tell the men.

 

 

Moi! Why must everything be electronic?!

 

Somethings are better done Medieval!

 

You may have hit a point though.

 

Please gentlemen, don't get wood unless you are given permission. Its that simple. No saluting soldiers unless you are saluting the right officer, and she says ATTENTION!

[Hund1976]

The answer to this is very simple, if girls don't want a guy who wacks off to porno then they should ask every potential guy they meet on the first date do you ever look at porn, if the guy answers yes then they should politely get up and leave and keep doing that until they find a guy that isn't into it. A big difference between men and women is that most men are visually excited and most women are mentally excited. The girls I have talked to about masturbating have said for the most part they aren't really all that turned on by looking at naked guys, while 98% of the guys I know are very turned on by looking at naked girls. And most guys are just masturbating because it feels good and are using the porn as a visual aid. I'm sure some people get carried away, if a guy has a spare room full of porn and would rather look at that then have sex with an actual woman then I think he has some problems. But if he is just releasing some steam when he's home alone I don't think its a big deal. If my girlfriend had a playgirl magazine and said she liked to masturbate while looking at the guys in it that would be fine with me as long as she would rather be having sex with me if I was there. But the bottom line is if you're man jerking off to porn bothers you that much you need to either break up with him or get over it somehow. I know if my girlfriend told me "you need to promise me you will never jerk off again" there is no way I could ever keep that promise, nor would I want to. So expecting him to never ever do it again is a fantasy.

[LCoakley1]

I posted this message on another forum, but hopefully I can get some feedback here too:

 

Hi everyone!! I'm Lauren, 19 and new to this board, however...this subject really applies to me, and I'm hoping I can get some help.

 

I've been with my boyfriend for a year, and we've been living together for 6 months (we moved in together fairly quickly.)

 

However, recently our sex life has diminished (I'm lucky if we have sex once a week now, if that...) and for a while I wasn't sure why. Everytime I would try to initiate making love, he'd tell me he was tired or wasn't in the mood. I didn't get it.

 

Now, the other day I went online and was accosted by how many downloaded porn movies and pictures he has on our computer. I couldn't believe it. Pornography has never been a problem in our relationship before. In fact, when we first started dating sometimes we'd watch it together...

 

Now though, it's completely different. I've told him that it makes me uncomfortable when he looks at porn on the computer when I'm not around, and he told me he'd stop, but I know he hasn't. He's taken to the old, "All guys do it" line that I find complete and utter crap.

 

It's killing me because our relationship used to be perfect. Our sex life was great, we loved each other totally, and we've recently gotten engaged! However, this porn addiction thing is becoming a problem for me, and he can't understand why. I hate the fact that he's looking at other naked women, when he has a girlfriend! It's killing me.

 

He doesn't seem to understand, and I don't know what to do. I love him with all my heart, he makes me laugh so much...but I'm not sure if this will stop and I really hate it. He's even taken to getting up around 7 in the morning and creeping out of bed so he can come online and look at porn. I get up around 9 wondering, "what the hell?" and I come into the kitchen and find him doing that.

 

Any suggestions?

[moimeme]

I suggest you have a frank discussion with him. Porn use might be the problem, but often it's symptomatic of other problems in the relationship, which kill off people's desire for their own partner in particular. Yes, there are addicts, but they are not the rule.

 

It's far too easy to blame porn use when the relationship likely has very different problems, some of which may be due to the complainer. So you can continue to blame the porn, or you can attempt to get at what's really the matter in the relationship. Do NOT start the conversation with 'that $#@^&$ porn is ruining our sex life'. Rather begin by asking if he's still happy with you/glad to be living with you. Be prepared for the truth. And be prepared to do some joint problem-solving.

[LCoakley1]

Moimeme,

 

Thanks for the input. I had thought of what you said before, and have tried talking to him about it. He insists that nothing is wrong with our relationship, that he still loves me, and that it's normal for the sex in a relationship to decline after being together for a while.

 

Besides his viewing of porn, and our sex life seemingly going down the drain, our relationship is good. We make each other laugh, love cuddling...but when it comes to sex something is definitely lacking. I'm not sure what else to do. Talking to him about it just makes him get defensive...