Are you a different man/woman in the new relationship?

[MaryFrancine]

I have a question for men/women who letf their SO for the OW/OM. Are you a different man now? Can you say that the new relationship made you change the views on life and the ways you acted even before the marriage/relationship?

 

To put a light on my question, my commited guy left his LT gf for me, i found out a lot of bad stuff about his past and his past relationships (i wasn't the first affair and this wasn't the first relationship he cheated on), and a lot of traits of his personality that were involved in the destruction of those relationship. We've had the affair for 6 months and now we live together for 4 months.

 

So i was just wondering if there is any truth when he says he is a different man now with me because i am "special" or is just the honeymoon phase of our relationship.

 

This could be answered by women who left for their AP too.

 

Thanks

[MissBee]

People are who they are and they change because they have seen it fit to change. Simply getting a new gf/bf/husband/wife doesn't change a person unfortunately, but many women esp, like to believe their love can change a man or that it's all his wife's fault but with them he will transform. It makes no sense.

 

My own mother was in a situation similar to yours. My dad had a history of cheating and he was talking to her and another woman in the beginning of their dating, in some ways she would be considered the OW, as he was involved with the other one first. In any case, she too simply believed that she and their relationship was special and things would be different. No. He continued being a serial cheater throughout their marriage. Anyone can say they are different. That is the biggest cliche of all time , it doesn't mean they're actually different. Every time my dad cheats and is caught he will even cry and beg for forgiveness, he even went to a counselor for like a week, and said he was different...LOL...he wasn't! Saying you're different, just like saying sorry, is an easy-peasy way to try to get back into someone's good graces without actually being different. He may even feel like he really is different...but if he hasn't learned new coping skills and new ways of dealing with whatever issue causes him to stray, when the honeymoon wears off and similar issues come up in your relationship, as issues will ALWAYS come up, that is when he will simply go back to his familiar and comfortable but dysfunctional coping skills likely. In the honeymoon phase you can't see any of this as their aren't that many huge problems and things haven't slowed down to a less novel and exciting pace to see.

 

Be critical and ask: how can he actually be different? What has really changed except I'm new? It is obvious from your post that you actually know that this makes no sense and you're worried that he really hasn't changed, but are of course hoping that someone will tell you, yes he has. If he hasn't received counseling, stopped to reflect and work through things, addressed his past etc. he is simply saying he is different with no evidence to back up this claim. Put your love goggles aside and look for the evidence. I would suggest attending couple's counseling together even, if you really want to be with him and if you really want to see him do the work.

 

Cheating may be a one off thing for some people, and for others, it is something wrong with THEM why they behave that way. If someone has a history of cheating, do not bury your head in the sand and follow the oft walked naive path of believing your love will be a magic potion that cures them. It won't be. They have issues to work through that are completely independent of their romantic partner.You can't make them work through it either. They must choose to address these issues on their own before they can be a good partner for anyone.

Edited November 22, 2013 by MissBee

[MaryFrancine]

i guess him blaming the partner for his cheating is the biggest red flag that he doesn't want to address those issues.

 

Yeah, he says the previous gf's pushed him to cheat because the relationships with them were bad, cold, lots of fights.

[cozycottagelg]

i guess him blaming the partner for his cheating is the biggest red flag that he doesn't want to address those issues.

 

Yeah, he says the previous gf's pushed him to cheat because the relationships with them were bad, cold, lots of fights.

 

It his not his partners fault he cheated.

 

I don't want to sit here and say you are not special or that it won't work. Maybe you are the relationship that he has always been looking for and the one that will last. But he needs to man up and own the fact that he is the cheater, and nobody but himself drove him to that.

[MissBee]

i guess him blaming the partner for his cheating is the biggest red flag that he doesn't want to address those issues.

 

Yeah, he says the previous gf's pushed him to cheat because the relationships with them were bad, cold, lots of fights.

 

Yupp.

 

Blaming everyone else besides looking at himself means he is not ready to be different at all and frankly, he has already cheated on you, sooo....really....he hasn't changed one bit.

 

His family history of cheating and abuse no doubt affects him, but that is something he has to work through otherwise he will continue to repeat the same cycle.

[MaryFrancine]

He shows remorse..but to me. He says things like: i am not a cheater...cheating is so wrong ..... i didn't want to go there.

 

He never said anything about it to his ex. she wants to have that conversation with him. you know...him telling the whole truth. But when it comes to that he's avoiding it saying it's a close subject. What's done it's done.

[MissBee]

He shows remorse..but to me. He says things like: i am not a cheater...cheating is so wrong ..... i didn't want to go there.

 

He never said anything about it to his ex. she wants to have that conversation with him. you know...him telling the whole truth. But when it comes to that he's avoiding it saying it's a close subject. What's done it's done.

 

 

Are you looking for hope to stay with him?

 

It seems like you are.

 

But it also seems like you know this is a bad idea.

 

I really would advise you to at least go to couple's counseling with him if you're insistent on staying with him. Simply hoping for the best will not get you anywhere.

 

He also is clearly experiencing some kind of dissonance where he has cheated on you and cheated multiple times on other women but is also saying he is not a cheater and cheating is wrong and he didn't want to go there...that's nuts! He did go there. He really needs to work on his issues.

[MaryFrancine]

you are right..i am looking for some hope. I don't know why? Maybe i would be left with nothing without him? You know... no job, no place to stay...no friends in this city and going back home is almost out of the question.

 

And going to counseling is not something he wants to hear about. Not even for himself to solve his childhood issues. He is focused on doing fun stuff that he didn't get to do, to get a promotion, to travel . We used to talk about making a place of our own. Now it all changed. Now he wants to become a partner in the firm he's working for, he wants to travel a lot. With me, of course, but .... that sounds like something he could do with or without me in the picture.

 

Does he have all the traits of a narcissist or what?

[MissBee]

Being so dependent on a partner (esp a new one) to where if you break up your life will be in shambles is never a good idea. You're 26, you need to have your own independence, money, friends, etc. outside of the serial cheater you're dating.

 

It seems like if he's a narcissist you're the codependent who is with him. Narcissists tend to be involved with codependent people and it's a complementary deal.

 

Please read up on this:

 

The inherently dysfunctional “codependency dance” requires two opposite but distinctly balanced partners: the pleaser/fixer (codependent) and the taker/controller (narcissist/addict).

 

Codependents — who are giving, sacrificing, and consumed with the needs and desires of others — do not know how to emotionally disconnect or avoid romantic relationships with individuals who are narcissistic — individuals who are selfish, self-centered, controlling, and harmful to them. Codependents habitually find themselves on a “dance floor” attracted to partners who are a perfect counter-match to their uniquely passive, submissive and acquiescent dance style.

Codependents find narcissistic dance partners deeply appealing. They are perpetually attracted to their charm, boldness, confidence and domineering personality.

 

When codependents and narcissists pair up, the dancing experience sizzles with excitement — at least in the beginning. After many “songs,” the enthralling and thrilling dance experience predictably transforms into drama, conflict, feelings of neglect and being trapped. Even with chaos and conflict, neither of the two spellbound dancers dares to end their partnership. Despite the tumultuous and conflict-laden nature of their relationship, neither of these two opposite, but dysfunctionally compatible, dance partners feel compelled to sit the dance out.

 

The Dance Between Codependents & Narcissists | World of Psychology

 

Sounds like what you two have going on...as you're still hoping to help fix him and figure him out even amidst all this craziness.

 

You should get some individual counseling for yourself, even if he doesn't want to, it may illuminate for you why you're so attracted to this man.

 

I would go ahead and start figuring out how to be financially independent and think of other options instead of being trapped with him, as sooner or later this will end and you will need to survive on your own.

[Got it]

I have a question for men/women who letf their SO for the OW/OM. Are you a different man now? Can you say that the new relationship made you change the views on life and the ways you acted even before the marriage/relationship?

 

To put a light on my question, my commited guy left his LT gf for me, i found out a lot of bad stuff about his past and his past relationships (i wasn't the first affair and this wasn't the first relationship he cheated on), and a lot of traits of his personality that were involved in the destruction of those relationship. We've had the affair for 6 months and now we live together for 4 months.

 

So i was just wondering if there is any truth when he says he is a different man now with me because i am "special" or is just the honeymoon phase of our relationship.

 

This could be answered by women who left for their AP too.

 

Thanks

 

Are we different people? Short answer, no. The characteristics that we have had our whole lives are still there as they are all the spectrum of our personalities.

 

I will say that with therapy and work you can change aspects of your coping mechanisms, etc. to change how you approach situations and how you handle them. But if he hasn't done these pieces, and just saying YOU will be the reason why he suddenly has healthy coping mechanisms, I would see that as a red flag.

 

I do think that there are aspects of one's personality that can be highlighted or minimized based on another person's personality and how they communicate but we are talking degrees not completely different.

[GG3]

Good lord...you can't diagnose narcissism on so little information.

[C00kie]

Yes, I believe it is possible that people change - not because we want them to (although being in a healthy relationship does help a lot) but because they figure out what they've been doing wrong and are unwilling to repeat their past experiences.

 

Blaming his exes for his cheating is obviously not right, he's responsible for his actions and he should find other ways of coping - if relationships were so bad, why not just leave them. But if he now finds himself in a happy, fullfilling relationship, then yes, cheating is much less likely to occur, not because he totally changed, but because he won't or shouldn't feel the need to cheat on you. Nevertheless, he should work on this way of dealing with situations. Cheating is never the answer no matter how he tries to justify it.

 

I may also add, from my point of view, previous comments are just jumping to conclusions which will lead you to feel paranoia. They're basically saying "people don't change, once a cheater, always a cheater" and that's absolutely wrong. Not all situations are the same.

 

I totally understand your feelings of insecurity but if things are fine between you, try to relax and enjoy your relationship. If he ends up cheating, you deal with it then, not now. He hasn't cheated yet so no point suffering for something that hasn't happened and maybe never will.

[MissBee]

I totally understand your feelings of insecurity but if things are fine between you, try to relax and enjoy your relationship. If he ends up cheating, you deal with it then, not now. He hasn't cheated yet so no point suffering for something that hasn't happened and maybe never will.

 

But he has: see her other thread about if she's fallen for a serial cheater.

 

He has already cheated on her and she made an entire list of all the other horrible things he has done and is still asking about if he can be a new person...

 

So at this point it's not even about hypothetical can he/can he not but the reality that he ISN'T at all different.

[C00kie]

But he has: see her other thread about if she's fallen for a serial cheater.

 

He has already cheated on her and she made an entire list of all the other horrible things he has done and is still asking about if he can be a new person...

 

So at this point it's not even about hypothetical can he/can he not but the reality that he ISN'T at all different.

 

I was responding based on this thread, I've only just read the other one...and really, that's a whole different story now. The thing is, even if he seems to be (or is) a good boyfriend to her now, it won't last much - she already has ground for suspicion and a relationship doesn't last much without trust. Besides, some of the things she found out will make it really hard to stay with him, knowing what she does...things started out already bad...leading his ex on at the same time?, and also, what's that sick thing of sabotaging her living style so that she wouldn't look attractive all about? OMG...

 

One thing (not making excuses though) is a married man who finds it hard to leave because there are so many things involved (children, emotions, finances...). But leaving a girlfriend (which he didn't seem to be the least bit in love with) should have been easier and NOT imply leading her on and all this mess. Nothing here plays an important role for him to try and keep her around except his selfishness.

 

OP, he's troubled, yes, and I do hope things work out for you and you find your way out of this (but in the long run, I doubt you'll stay together - stay strong, you're only 26 and your whole life ahead!!)

 

All the best!!

Edited November 23, 2013 by C00kie

[AlwaysGrowing]

GotIt....nailed It.

 

Life will always have stressors, attraction to other people, relationship issues, work issues...etc.

 

If one does not work and learn new coping skills, they will always revert back to what worked before.

 

Also, ones integrity, self respect, respect should never be based on another (new/existing relationship), it should be based on ourselves. So, that when things go wrong, or there are issues..it is dependent on who we are...not what someone else has done or not done.

 

Its accepting that the buck begins and ends with us.

[MaryFrancine]

We have been together, living together for almost 5 months. Had the LDR for another 5 ,almost 6 before that. And i was just thinking about it all these days, so i asked some direct questions to people that were close to the previous relationships(his sister)

 

He was saying he loved this woman to bits. A year before they broke up, because of the issues, she wanted to make a deal. To move in separate appartments, close to each other, so they could date because they moved in pretty fast and skipped that part. Date and see where it's going, if they have a chance. He said NO NO NO because he loved her. Now i think he was just afraid of being alone. I feel like i am in a rebound relationship, with the falls of an affair turned into a relationship that started badly all together.

I entered this forum because i honestly am afraid to put all cards on the table with him. Maybe because i am afraid i would end up alone or even afraid of the lies . I just can't find the strenght of having that hard conversation as it should be, not just confront him with just some of the stuff.

My first questions started when, after he led her on , and SHE put a stop to it(i found out about this later), he encouraged me to make our daily routine more public on Facebook, so everyone sees how much we enjoy our lives, and how happy we are.

He was never into that before we were together. He would be a pretty private person, kept it all professional on his networking profiles.

And i listened, of course, i made a fool of myself. Bragging about our relationship even if it was an affair for so long. But hey..i was doing my victory dance, because i actually believed him.

 

I went to see her. I wanted to see that "bad woman who made him so unhappy".

And i got pretty close to her and then i stepped back. She was kneeling to get a hug and a kiss from her nephew and then she stood up. And it hit me like a hammer on my head.

 

She's a proud woman, when she stood tall she made me think like she owned the entire place. She had sad eyes, but proud. You know when you see a person that from the first look, they give you the impression that if you step on their toes they will eat you alive?

That is what hit me.... she being strong and knowing him... the guy who wants the power. The guy who manipulated and sabotaged a woman just because he could not reach her level. She was out of his league , but still helped him to get all better . Supported him to learn more and get a better job....and yet he wanted more.

 

And here i am , the woman who believed i was special because i am a good girl, like he said. No.... i think i am special because i am not strong. I am special because i accept and shut up. I am special because i don't call BS on stuff. I am special because i say thank you for every tiny detail and don't hold him to higher standards.

And in his mind.... she was bad because she did all the opposite of that.

I was raised to think that is a way a woman is supposed to be. Submissive to her man's desires, listen to him, let him take the lead on everything, be forgiving and loving no matter what. And after all my doubts, all my question, all my victory dance that i got him, i hold my laptop on my lap and i think that i am jalous i could never be like that: a woman who looks like she owns the place, and she could take anything that comes her way. And i understood why he sends her emails about missing her.

 

She's moving on, and i am getting just the good part of a relationship with him, but for how long? How long before i start to be treated like a doormat?

 

I am so sorry for everything.

[goodyblue]

I don't necessarily.think we are better/different people. I think we are happier and more content in our relationship and that bleeds into all aspects of our lives. I think if you are happy and fulfilled in one area it makes life better all around.

[SincereOnlineGuy]

I have a question for men/women who letf their SO for the OW/OM. Are you a different man now? Can you say that the new relationship made you change the views on life and the ways you acted even before the marriage/relationship?

 

To put a light on my question, my commited guy left his LT gf for me, i found out a lot of bad stuff about his past and his past relationships (i wasn't the first affair and this wasn't the first relationship he cheated on), and a lot of traits of his personality that were involved in the destruction of those relationship. We've had the affair for 6 months and now we live together for 4 months.

 

So i was just wondering if there is any truth when he says he is a different man now with me because i am "special" or is just the honeymoon phase of our relationship.

 

This could be answered by women who left for their AP too.

 

Thanks

 

 

 

The answer to your initial question is one closely related to human psychology, and it is that human psychology which almost always makes the answer seem one way, for reasons relating far more to the psychology behind the individual pictures, than for anything to do with the 3rd person.

 

People who evolve so far as to land in affairs, have usually created the eventual outcomes long before meeting the 3rd party do to their own tolerance for, or practice of considerably unhealthy interaction there at home.

 

So of course, every time somebody is looking to get out (of what they created)... they're going to seem more motivated and somehow better during that effort.

 

It's the human mind playing tricks on itself... and a human mind playing tricks on itself is best comforted by another human mind doing same.

 

(and I say this NOT from a high moral plateau at all... instead, I just want to suggest taking a step back from the popular conclusion, and seeing a bigger picture)

[SincereOnlineGuy]

***proofreads*** (too late)

 

 

"Due" (not "do")

 

 

LOL

 

 

but while I'm here:

 

 

It's the human mind playing tricks on itself... and a human mind playing tricks on itself is best comforted by another human mind doing same.

 

 

Somewhere tangent to the above is the core reality behind the way that "internet-begun" relationships can take-off and soar to heights perhaps never previously experienced by one or both parties. (you've been a 'shy' person all your life, and it's terrifying to approach someone else socially, and even somewhat terrifying to BE approached that way... but now, suddenly, there is this machine in your den, where you can sit, wearing your favorite old slippers that you should've thrown-out seven years ago, and express yourself socially. Eventually you reach a point where, for being so invested in somebody else's life, you suddenly knoooooooooooooooow all the things to talk about when a lull in face-to-face conversation creeps toward you - and that always saves the day) (you've sort of tricked yourself past your shyness!)

 

 

Soooooooooooo you then combine that core reality with marriages in which two partners have painted themselves into a corner, communication-wise, and they can't/won't show/share the vulnerability needed to break out of that corner. Instead somebody puts on the old slippers, sits down at the machine, and only then bothers to express themselves fully (to a perfect stranger, who is at times riveted to the very vulnerability deemed too difficult to expose in front of one's spouse).

 

And presto... the foundation of internet affairs.

Edited November 25, 2013 by SincereOnlineGuy

[MaryFrancine]

Affair, internet started affair. Illusions that are kind of doomed to hit a thick wall.

Yup, that's me

[Finally Settled]

I have a question for men/women who letf their SO for the OW/OM. Are you a different man now? Can you say that the new relationship made you change the views on life and the ways you acted even before the marriage/relationship?

 

To put a light on my question, my commited guy left his LT gf for me, i found out a lot of bad stuff about his past and his past relationships (i wasn't the first affair and this wasn't the first relationship he cheated on), and a lot of traits of his personality that were involved in the destruction of those relationship. We've had the affair for 6 months and now we live together for 4 months.

 

So i was just wondering if there is any truth when he says he is a different man now with me because i am "special" or is just the honeymoon phase of our relationship.

 

This could be answered by women who left for their AP too.

 

Thanks

 

It is entirely possible to be a different person, but I would be hesitant of any changes appear out of thin air. I have been with my other woman for over a year now and I truly believe I am a different man to the one I was in my marriage.

 

Make no mistake, I have worked incredibly hard to become a better man. I have learned from mistakes and hurts that I both caused and suffered. I worked tirelessly with a therapist from the time I left my marriage, and my other woman and I continued therapy until very recently. I am working as a volunteer in an organization that works with cheating spouses, whether it is to reconcile, move on, or simply make a decision. I have learned much about myself and I know I am a better man, and partner, because of it. I will say simply that I do not believe I would have reached this place if I had not worked so hard at making the changes in myself.

 

If your partner is not working to be a better man then you are wise to be wary. I would not say he could not change without help, but I would say it would be highly unlikely. Your post suggests that you think the same. Take care of yourself and make sure that your needs are met for how you two proceed into the future.

[cocorico]

I have a question for men/women who letf their SO for the OW/OM. Are you a different man now? Can you say that the new relationship made you change the views on life and the ways you acted even before the marriage/relationship?

 

 

I am not someone who left their M for their AP, but I am M to one such. I can only report on feedback I have heard from long time friends of his, who knew him before and during his M, and his family, and colleagues who work with him every day.

 

Yes, he has changed, but according to his friends, he has become once again the man he used to be, before he got so "strange" during the M (depressed, withdrawn, submissive, reactive.) His family described it to me as "getting their son / brother back" and his colleagues say that he has returned to the lightness he had during his year-long separation (before we met.) so yes, he has changed - but it has been a reversion to what those who have known him the longest consider his "true nature", rather than some new, adopted role.

 

Looking at old photos of him (before the M, during the M, during the separation) many things have changed. During the M he didn't smile, his body language was hunched and drawn in, his clothes were dull and very fuddy-duddy and he looked at least 20 years older than he was. Now he dresses differently, his body language is open and expansive, he laughs and smiles and is often photographed hugging people or sharing moments of closeness. His taste in music has broadened and the range of activities he enjoys and participates in has increased significantly. He is discovering new talents and rediscovering old, suppressed ones.

 

Radical changes are possible - as his first M showed - but not really sustainable unless the person making the changes has more to lose by not making the change. If the pain of staying "as you are" outweighs the pain of change, change is more likely to stick. Otherwise, it's easier to stick to the familiar.

[MaryFrancine]

It is entirely possible to be a different person, but I would be hesitant of any changes appear out of thin air. I have been with my other woman for over a year now and I truly believe I am a different man to the one I was in my marriage.

 

Make no mistake, I have worked incredibly hard to become a better man. I have learned from mistakes and hurts that I both caused and suffered. I worked tirelessly with a therapist from the time I left my marriage, and my other woman and I continued therapy until very recently. I am working as a volunteer in an organization that works with cheating spouses, whether it is to reconcile, move on, or simply make a decision. I have learned much about myself and I know I am a better man, and partner, because of it. I will say simply that I do not believe I would have reached this place if I had not worked so hard at making the changes in myself.

 

If your partner is not working to be a better man then you are wise to be wary. I would not say he could not change without help, but I would say it would be highly unlikely. Your post suggests that you think the same. Take care of yourself and make sure that your needs are met for how you two proceed into the future.

 

 

i spoke to him about this. And i did not get an answer i was hoping for. He says now he is different , that he sees life in a different light because of me, because how natural our relationship goes. Thathe found his soulmate (me) ad that is all he needed.

As happy as those words made me for few minutes, my concerns grew as i was thinking it through. His saddness, his cheating behaviour were not just in one relationship prior to ours, but in most of them.

And i am happy now, today, i was happy yesterday, but i have doubts about the future. When things might get tougher. When we might have tougher times, when we will hit a wall of something that is not as good as things happening in the honey moon phase. What then?

 

Me being his soulmate ...will it be enough? Or if we get there and i, as his soulmate, offer my support and love through that come back saddness, will carry a lot f weight on my shouldrs because he didn't want to deal with his own issues.

 

And another thing that scares me was that he told me that he could never stand being alone, single. He has to have any kind of relationship. Someone to be there for him. And i am that kind of person too, and it scares me. Because i am aware of how bad this is, being afraid to be alone. I am aware of how clingy i can get. And the thought of 2 of us in a relationship like this, scares me, because none of us has the chance of evolving and growing out of it.

[Got it]

Yeah I am going to call bs on that. That, my dear lady, is a pat answer that shows now actual deep diving, accountability or mental or emotional growth.

 

Relationship aren't "natural" or "easy" all the time and knowing how to dig deep is a learned skill. This is where he needs to focus. Right now you have legitimate reason to be concerned that when things get tough he isn't going to have the tools in his toolbox he will need.

 

It is one thing to try and figure out if the cheating was a one time occurrence and another when you see a trend in all of his relationships. I strongly recommend you push him into couple counseling or steel your heart for a repeat performance.

 

((((((MF)))))))

[MaryFrancine]

Yeah I am going to call bs on that. That, my dear lady, is a pat answer that shows now actual deep diving, accountability or mental or emotional growth.

 

Relationship aren't "natural" or "easy" all the time and knowing how to dig deep is a learned skill. This is where he needs to focus. Right now you have legitimate reason to be concerned that when things get tough he isn't going to have the tools in his toolbox he will need.

 

It is one thing to try and figure out if the cheating was a one time occurrence and another when you see a trend in all of his relationships. I strongly recommend you push him into couple counseling or steel your heart for a repeat performance.

 

((((((MF)))))))

 

I guess that is why they say "once a cheater always a cheater", then? Because most men who cheat don't accept working through their cheating issues, getting to the root of their own "evil", just hoping it will pass on it's own?

 

He also said that us talking about it sometimes and moving past it will help a lot more.

So i guess i need to start steeling my heart until i can get some independence and break it off. He already noticed something different about me, and he is even nicer sometimes . But sometimes still goes into this state of "i need space, time of my own, leave me alone with my thoughts".

Like now....we're both in the apartment, Saturday evening, and i am here, on the forum, and listening to love songs on youtube.