Serial short term lover!

[L1ght]

You can not even see how in asking the question, I was addressing your main point throughout this whole entire thread?

 

It had nothing to do with me or my self-esteem. I really don't care, in and of myself, who the peanut gallery thinks is the better "lover" as you put it.

 

I was, however, making a fundamental point regarding the main topic of this whole entire thread. Surely your brilliance can see the point I was making.

anything else to add Anya in your glorious quest to act as if you didn't completely disregard what I said about not picking one type of woman to enter into a relationship with then dragging it out into a competition to see who is the better lover out of me and you here in front of all the other people in this forum? Lol

[AnyaNova]

Respect. I like the fact that you have left us to debate it alone. There's nothing worse than other people jumping in and picking sides when you're debating with someone. It just ends up becoming a case of whoever has the most people agreeing with them wins....but like I say its not a competition between me and Anya like she seems to believe it is.

 

Again you prove that you don't understand me at all. The competition was never between us.

 

The competition is between ideas.

 

However. Your choice to cruelly dig about Tim certainly betrays your view of what the competition was truly between.

 

You are truly unbelievable.. You, the elevated guy with such a good heart who then kicks a woman in a very sore spot because he is at a loss for an argument. I will not be crying myself to sleep tonight thankfully, not over Tim anyway.

 

If I do, it will only be for mourning the cold desiccated remains of that thing you used to call a heart.

 

Good night.

[AnyaNova]

anything else to add Anya in your glorious quest to act as if you didn't completely disregard what I said about not picking one type of woman to enter into a relationship with then dragging it out into a competition to see who is the better lover out of me and you here in front of all the other people in this forum? Lol

 

Only to point out that reduction ad absurdism is truly unbecoming.

[L1ght]

Again you prove that you don't understand me at all. The competition was never between us.

 

The competition is between ideas.

 

However. Your choice to cruelly dig about Tim certainly betrays your view of what the competition was truly between.

 

You are truly unbelievable.. You, the elevated guy with such a good heart who then kicks a woman in a very sore spot because he is at a loss for an argument. I will not be crying myself to sleep tonight thankfully, not over Tim anyway.

 

If I do, it will only be for mourning the cold desiccated remains of that thing you used to call a heart.

 

Good night.

I was not at a loss in the argument. I simply lost interest in it with you when you disregarded what I had to say and you used your own line of thinking to inflate your own opinion. It lost all credibility and meaning to me, it really did. and FYI bringing up Tim was completely relevant as using him as an example highlights that you go for men who don't know how to think for themselves and be independent.....so what does that say about you?

You know what don't answer that cos your love life is of no importance to me.

[AnyaNova]

I was not at a loss in the argument. I simply lost interest in it with you when you disregarded what I had to say and you used your own line of thinking to inflate your own opinion. It lost all credibility and meaning to me, it really did. and FYI bringing up Tim was completely relevant as using him as an example highlights that you go for men who don't know how to think for themselves and be independent.....so what does that say about you?

You know what don't answer that cos your love life is of no importance to me.

 

Pointing out that I went for one man who lacked assertive abilities IS NOT the same thing as saying and I quote, "I hope you do t cry yourself to sleep while he is out banging another girl". Case closed. And you are not the only one who has dated many different types.

 

And if you had truly lost interest you wouldn't have bothered with the cruel coup de grace.

[L1ght]

Pointing out that I went for one man who lacked assertive abilities IS NOT the same thing as saying and I quote, "I hope you do t cry yourself to sleep while he is out banging another girl". Case closed. And you are not the only one who has dated many different types.

 

And if you had truly lost interest you wouldn't have bothered with the cruel coup de grace.

Thank you for finally accepting the fact that I have been with more than one type of women. Was that really so hard? Lol all that nonsense and bickering just because you couldn't do it but I'm glad you have come to your senses and are willing to admit you were wrong.

 

Oh and of course I don't believe you only attract one type of man....that would be kinda short sighted and ignorant of me now don't you think?

[Woggle]

I think a man should always have his self respect and never give it up for anybody because nobody who cares about you will ever want you to give it up.

 

That being said it's wrong to mistreat and use innocent people as some sort of revenge for what your exes put you through. You might end up hurting a woman that doesn't deserve it. There are a number of women out there who want no strings attached sex so find them and leave the ones looking for something else alone.

[AnyaNova]

a few pages back i was going to intervene & say to L1ght that his aggression on this point betrayed a 'doth protest too much', a kind of desperation to set up a re-enactment to manifest his confirmation bias about women. but 1) it was between you two, & 2) i'm not sure it's the case. it's possible he's reaching for an understanding that this is not a gender issue, & exposure to the light of truth about some men as emotionally draining could inform him.

 

I kind of wish you'd said something. I got so involved in the apparent argument, I did not see the confirmation bias set up until it was far too late. Although I do understand why you did.

 

I suspect that he is far from a place to be able to understand that men can be emotionally draining too.

 

maybe, but at this point pursuing the types argument may be a matter of whose pyrrhic victory. if L1ght is in as much pain as it seems, it's possible his faculties are at a comparable disadvantage.

 

Yes. When I went for the inferential statistics argument, I actually had already dropped that particular thread (trying to clarify the difference between types and emotional issues etc), and had decided for arguments sake, to go ahead and accept his premise that they were not alike in any way or in a significant enough way to be worthwhile. Which ultimately, means that he can't extrapolate anything, but to understand how that works, you would have to have an understanding of inferential statistics. Though, to be fair, only a basic one, as that is all I have:-)

 

you both would work with someone on their issues, if you cared about them you wouldn't leave them just for having issues. at this time in my life that is most important, & i'm still new to LS (i don't know either one of you, so to speak, more than the other), so it's a tie for me.

 

j

 

I meant that more as a rhetorical question to address the issue in the opening post.

[AnyaNova]

i couldn't resist

 

it's significant we both came to the same conclusion. my interference may have muddied the waters. this is what i love about forum discussions, i can sense our (many people's, anyway lol) mental muscles working. it's awesome.

 

Agreed. I doubt your contributions muddied the waters at all. It is fun to stretch the gray matter.

 

well that's where he doubled down on his aggressive demands about types, isn't it? cognitive dissonance, perhaps. i think he respects our stories, though we should ask him again. it counts for a lot that he says he would stay with a woman & help her if she was working on her issues & honest about needing help.

 

this is really interesting & somehow i came away not understanding this part, so some elaboration would help.

 

I get the sense that that answer is an echo from the past, since he has made his intention clear to not stay in the future. But, it sounds like past Light may have had a shot at being a decent guy, as long as he didn't previously descend to the sort of goads and jibes that he did in the conversation late last night.

 

when i got into asking L1ght about his willingness to stay with a woman with issues, i wondered if i was conflating type & emotional issues.

 

might there be a way to neutralize the types bias with the emotional issues concept (is that what you were doing & i messed it up by interfering?)? for example, the foo issues i speculated may be more complicated for men may reveal my own bias. might it be personality types more, or emotional issues more, which determine these things?

 

Well, I kept trying to say over and over that types and issues weren't the same thing, and he kept saying that he had dated different types, conflating the two concepts. Finally, after quite a while, he clarified that he had dated women with different emotional issues as well.

 

I think it is an individual issue which aspect affects more in a particuar relationship. I mean, in my own failed relationship over the summer, I at the beginning thought that personality type was going to be our biggest issue since he is an ISFJ and I am an N type, but instead it really seems more and more like FOO issues were the strongest force in its dissolution. With a strong second to emotional issues on both our parts.

[AnyaNova]

me too. i was trying to reunite him with salvageable parts of his core self. like i said about my trying to date extroverts after my failed relationship with an introvert: i detached from my core self, & from that point i really messed myself up. very badly. so i was projecting in a way i thought may be of some insight for L1ght, & i think he gets it. i sense he doesn't want to do a full 180°. just my view.

 

That is an admirable strategy, I hope it works. Given some of the OP's behavior, I suspect he is getting farther and father from his core self to the point where it might be barely recognizable. If he doesn't want to do it, why is he trying to persuade himself to, by hoping to garner the support of others to ratify his position?

 

relationships are a beautiful means to learning about such existential intricacies, & fine-tuning our love compass. it seems you did an excellent job, taking the most insight you could from the experience. that's the way to find the love of one's life. at least, that's what i keep telling myself.

 

I did. I analyzed the thing up one side, down the other, diagonally, across, metaphorically, ironically, sardonically and to-my-self anyway sadistically (as in, it was sadistic to continue hurting myself for so long analyzing every piece of it).

 

But yes, I have quite a lot of intricate insights, however the most pertinent were also the easiest to spot quickly.

 

a) Have a much better idea of how he interacts with the parentals and what kind of self-differentiation he has going on before going exclusive

 

and

 

b) Though by today's standards we were positively turtle-esque in the pace that we advanced things physically, I still need to go slower. Where my touch goes, there my heart goes also. This seems to be a stupid law that no amount of bearing down by my intellect seems to be able to change.

[AnyaNova]

and apparently humorously, however dry your wit. personally, i reflect on my use of tarot cards to create a series of insights i thought were leading me somewhere, when i don't subscribe to such tactics & had not a clue what i was doing -- as a kind of rock-bottom moment for me. but there was value in it, i know.

 

i find forums helpful for that while i'm prone to get lost in details.

 

would it were i could change my username. in my current situationm & joining LS, turtle-esque is a new & welcome pace.

 

my rock-bottom moment was a consequence of my intellect taking over. it was so painful, but i'm glad my intellect took control. not sure i could go through that pain again, so hopefully my intellect not only ended the situation but stored away insights that will prevent it happening again.

 

 

j

 

Dry? Perhaps.

 

 

Because you lost all hope when you're intellect took over and told you there was none?

 

The thing is, is that usually for me, falling in love is 100 percent completely a choice. Unless, of course, I sabotage my natural process by doing too much kissing/making out/cuddling too soon (I love kissing/making out/cuddling dammit! ) but if I do too much too soon, then my feelings follow whether I like it or not.

 

Turtle-esque, however, seems to be too fast for me. To what image can I compare the speed I need to go at? I am at a loss.

[L1ght]

I think a man should always have his self respect and never give it up for anybody because nobody who cares about you will ever want you to give it up.

 

That being said it's wrong to mistreat and use innocent people as some sort of revenge for what your exes put you through. You might end up hurting a woman that doesn't deserve it. There are a number of women out there who want no strings attached sex so find them and leave the ones looking for something else alone.

I think a man should realise the right time to walk away and look towards other things in his life instead of blindly hoping/believing that things are gonna work out just fine. I'm human, I feel when things shift in relationships and I'm guessing anybody who has a heartbeat feels exactly the same things. It's not rocket science. We feel what's up yet for some reason we choose to ignore even the most miniscule warning signs because we want to keep the love alive.

No. No. No.

I'm done pal....and I'm not any less of a man because I'm standing by my convictions.

....and to talk about self respect? Lol guys get left looking like complete losers the longer they believe in something they should have walked away from while women delight in telling their friends how much of a loser their ex bf was. It's even in popular culture. We make movies about this kind of scenario all the time....its just the way modern society is.

I'm in it to win it from now on and I couldn't care less who gets hurt.

Some girls will have the same attitude as me and will move on with no problems....good for them.

The ones who get devastated by my approach will just have to learn from it and move on. Simple

Edited December 1, 2013 by L1ght

[esteem-jam]

L1ght, you talk like all women are yours, or will be. Like you so irresistably attracting.

I heard this quote and I like it:

"When it comes to relationships, all women are smart."

 

 

When you come to people with trickery, they can feel it. Even pickup artists say after a time the real them get exposed and things start to get more serious. So are you for real or are you an artist. Its on you to decide.

 

 

But I know you wont alter your view, cause it will make you a lesser man, right? 7 pages of (non)sense must be worth something; not backing off.

[L1ght]

L1ght, you talk like all women are yours, or will be. Like you so irresistably attracting.

I heard this quote and I like it:

"When it comes to relationships, all women are smart."

 

 

When you come to people with trickery, they can feel it. Even pickup artists say after a time the real them get exposed and things start to get more serious. So are you for real or are you an artist. Its on you to decide.

 

 

But I know you wont alter your view, cause it will make you a lesser man, right? 7 pages of (non)sense must be worth something; not backing off.

If all women were mine I'd be sleeping with your girlfriend right now would I not?(assuming you're a heterosexual guy that is) Don't be a hater pal. I just have confidence in my ability to attract women and it's not my problem if you feel threatened by this. Also I am not super good looking....I'm average, my appeal comes from a few things......firstly I have been successful at something in my life which obviously is a very good thing to add to my resume when I'm trying to attract the opposite sex, secondly I have a very outgoing personality which when I hit the right notes at the right time appeals to many women who want a guy who is confident in himself and who he is. The success I have had in my endeavours has given me a huge amount of confidence over the years and believe me when I tell you that this kind of confidence funnels into every aspect of a persons life....Maybe you have never been successful at anything so you don't know how to relate to the confidence I have when it comes to attracting women? If so all I can say is to you is get good at something and you will see the women come flocking in their droves since it really is true that woman are mightily impressed by success and power.

 

Now anyway,back on topic. Like I say I have no problem getting women when I pursue them....the problems as I have already stated arise when I have to deal with their ever fluctuating emotional issues the deeper and further I go down the road with them. You talk about women being "smart" and "trickery"?.....lol well I intend to be smarter and I absolutely intend to get out before I'm tricked into believing I should stay with them once the buzz is gone. See that's always been my problem....I guess I've hung on in the past because I just thought that's what a guy is meant to do but I see clearly now. GTFO as soon as your gut tells you to which is something I always ignored in the past. Not anymore.

I come first and I look out for my own best interests.

Edited December 2, 2013 by L1ght

[L1ght]

Oh and just to clarify. Of course I am not successful in every attempt to gain a woman's interest. It's 50/50. Some women are into me and others aren't.....but I believe that's the same for everyone.

The more a person puts themselves out there the more chance they have of being successful. Of course other factors like intellect, fitness and appearance give a person a greater chance of success of failure depending on the effort they make or lack therof.

[JourneyLady]

a different approach to relationships and love is what I need.

 

What you've been talking about doing though is pretty much the opposite of love. It's toxic.

 

Buyers, Renters and Freeloaders. Pretty much you're buying into Freeloader mentality in which you are just out for whatever you can get from a (obviously temporary) relationship. Sex, Pleasure, companionship, whatever. All relationships take work and you're obviously not into that. Because you don't want the risk.

 

Life is risk. You get into a car, it's risky. Work on your home, risky. Stay with a job for a long period of time, risky (you might get laid off or fired). But you don't get the really good jobs by job hopping, right? You don't get the really good relationships by relationship hopping either.

 

Doesn't sound like good role models are available and you have serious issues.

Either that or you've become a troll. You've insulted several participants here already.

[JourneyLady]

I will be real as long as I feel like she is being real then I'm out.

 

Ha! But doesn't that mean you'll have to be on your toes all the time looking for "signs" and not really relax in the relationship? She'll feel that anxiety for certain and it will cause uncertainty in her.

 

It will also cause you to be highly judgmental of everything she does that isn't "normal", which - in a way - seems to be exactly the behavior in women you complain about.

[JourneyLady]

I think a man should always have his self respect and never give it up for anybody because nobody who cares about you will ever want you to give it up.

 

That being said it's wrong to mistreat and use innocent people as some sort of revenge for what your exes put you through. You might end up hurting a woman that doesn't deserve it. There are a number of women out there who want no strings attached sex so find them and leave the ones looking for something else alone.

 

And in doing so, risks that those women come to the exact same conclusions he did and go play that same game with other men after being with him - and then those men get hurt. And in a way, how I was with my ex-husband has to do with the immaturity of the husband of my childhood (I married young) was to me and abandoned me. So this is -exactly- how it played out in my life so far.

 

Plainly: hurt people (who are dishonest) hurt people.

[AnyaNova]

I think the best strategy for this thread at this point, is to let it sink to the bottom of the sea where all unreplied to threads go to die!

 

Let this terrible idea float there for all time.

[L1ght]

I think the best strategy for this thread at this point, is to let it sink to the bottom of the sea where all unreplied to threads go to die!

 

Let this terrible idea float there for all time.

Not exactly a clever strategy to post a comment that might make the OP feel inspired t carry it on when you personally want it to disappear to the bottom of the sea is it? Lol

[L1ght]

What you've been talking about doing though is pretty much the opposite of love. It's toxic.

 

Buyers, Renters and Freeloaders. Pretty much you're buying into Freeloader mentality in which you are just out for whatever you can get from a (obviously temporary) relationship. Sex, Pleasure, companionship, whatever. All relationships take work and you're obviously not into that. Because you don't want the risk.

 

Life is risk. You get into a car, it's risky. Work on your home, risky. Stay with a job for a long period of time, risky (you might get laid off or fired). But you don't get the really good jobs by job hopping, right? You don't get the really good relationships by relationship hopping either.

 

Doesn't sound like good role models are available and you have serious issues.

Either that or you've become a troll. You've insulted several participants here already.

Toxic is a good word. I can honestly say that I have always entered into a relationship with a positive mind but the toxicity always starts when My partners fluctuating emotional state gets in the way of healthy progression. I'm really not good at dealing with it and why the hell should I be? I'm done being understanding and patient and basically leaving myself vulnerable while my partners status in the relationship with respect to mine grows.

I never really thought I would end up being this kind of guy....hard and strict when it comes to intimacy and love but I have no choice if I want to maintain my sanity while I'm dealing with women.

[MoooOinkBaaa]

LOL! OP you can't escape it, you're either in a relationship or you're not. Why not just go to a brothel then?

 

Once you get in a relationship it'll be too late for this method of thinking, it'll all go straight out the window once you care about someone you love.

 

They WILL **** up sooner or later and then you'll abandon the relationship but will you?

 

That's the golden question isn't it because even you can't answer that in the present. You might know what you want now but you won't know once you are in love with someone and realize not everyone is perfect.

 

You'll have to choose between giving up on someone you love or risking them giving up on you.

All your relationships will never get the chance to grow and strengthen because all great relationships have bad times. You'll go through a lot of women and it'll always be the same result because everyone changes during a relationship, there are always bad times.

 

The person you are attract the women you get. If you keep getting ****ty women my friend you need to look at yourself because I doubt it's them.

Edited December 7, 2013 by MoooOinkBaaa

[L1ght]

What you've been talking about doing though is pretty much the opposite of love. It's toxic.

 

Buyers, Renters and Freeloaders. Pretty much you're buying into Freeloader mentality in which you are just out for whatever you can get from a (obviously temporary) relationship. Sex, Pleasure, companionship, whatever. All relationships take work and you're obviously not into that. Because you don't want the risk.

 

Life is risk. You get into a car, it's risky. Work on your home, risky. Stay with a job for a long period of time, risky (you might get laid off or fired). But you don't get the really good jobs by job hopping, right? You don't get the really good relationships by relationship hopping either.

 

Doesn't sound like good role models are available and you have serious issues.

Either that or you've become a troll. You've insulted several participants here already.

Getting into a car and going to work is not the same kind of risk as giving your heart/mind/soul to somebody on the deepest level is it?.....but you already know this I'm sure.

It really is a funny thing....the connection, the intimacy, the grip that another human being can have on your very inner being and core. It's not that I'm not gonna risk getting deep with someone.....it's that I absolutely am willing to walk away as soon as I feel that my position in the relationship comes under threat when I female partner inevitably expects me too start making exceptions for inconsiderate emotional fluctuations.

If it makes you feel better then view my new approach as a quest to find the ideal woman for me personally. The ones who don't live up to my expectations will get left behind

[MoooOinkBaaa]

But I guess that's what you want, short term love. But can you define it as love if you're willing to walk away and give up on someone who wouldn't give up on you?

 

That's not love and this is a paradox because you don't give up on someone you love and you don't fall in love with someone short term.

 

No such thing as a short term lover. It's more like an extended date.

[Woggle]

Getting into a car and going to work is not the same kind of risk as giving your heart/mind/soul to somebody on the deepest level is it?.....but you already know this I'm sure.

It really is a funny thing....the connection, the intimacy, the grip that another human being can have on your very inner being and core. It's not that I'm not gonna risk getting deep with someone.....it's that I absolutely am willing to walk away as soon as I feel that my position in the relationship comes under threat when I female partner inevitably expects me too start making exceptions for inconsiderate emotional fluctuations.

If it makes you feel better then view my new approach as a quest to find the ideal woman for me personally. The ones who don't live up to my expectations will get left behind

 

I can support that. I had a certain standard for women I would commit to and I found a woman that lives up to that standard so she gets me all. If they don't live up to that standard why invest a lot.