It's been a year and I'm Still Lost...

[theothersully]

So, I was married for 10 years, in a relationship for 12.

 

I do not want my ex back in any way, but that is the only thing I'm certain of at this point.

 

I have been sort of on and off seeing a girl i find irresistible from Miami. I'm 18 years older than her. She likes the older guys, I like the younger girls. We have been dating, but this week, did something pretty huge. We went on a road trip together from Miami to NYC, then spent a couple of nights partying until dawn at Pacha and on a sort of self done bar crawl. We had a blast. An amazing connection. We got thrown out of a bar for having sex in the bathroom, then did it again in the cab on the way back to the hotel and again in the hotel.

 

Aside from being the definition of beauty in my mind, girl is a free spirit. You know how getting a girl is a lot like getting a cat to come over? It takes finesse, calm, caring, etc? Well, getting this girl is more like getting a damn bird on the branch of a tree to come to you! Very, very difficult. Any slight disturbance and she flutters off to the next branch.

 

But I managed to get her. At least as well as one can with a free spirit.

 

I love spending time with her. She lights my soul on fire... but... I know she will flutter off eventually. It's her nature and with her looks, it's no big deal for her to find new people. But, she has my heart.

 

So the main problem is I know there won't be a future. I'm struggling to keep her interest even now. But, i feel more strongly for her than I did for my ex wife when I was dating her. I was dizzy with endorphins just holding her in bed in the morning.

 

The issue is.... i have no idea if I'm ready for a real relationship. I can choose girls like this, who are just amazing to be with, or i can choose girls i don't feel the fire with, who are easy to get and looking for real relationships. These are my choices. I could also just stay single forever and do meaningless sex.

 

How do you cope with not knowing what you are even looking for from a partner in life?

 

After marriage, after your entire life's plans are lost, how do you find new plans? How do you figure out what you want?

[theothersully]

Say a prayer to God.

 

Tell him you're lost, and you need help.

 

Ha ha ha...

 

Spill over from the atheist thread?

 

There is no god.

 

More into being responsible for myself than hoping a magical bearded dude in the sky can hear me begging for his help.

 

But, i could use some advice on how to figure out what to look for in another person. Obviously, I'm clueless.

Edited November 26, 2013 by theothersully

[camillalev]

You'll figure it out when your mid-life crisis is over.

[theothersully]

You'll figure it out when your mid-life crisis is over.

 

Not sure that's what it is. I was happily married. I just reverted to bachelor days again to fond someone or at least have some fun while not finding the right ones.

 

I don't really feel like i'm too old, missed out on anything, or different in any way. I would have done the same stuff with the ex wife if we were in similar circumstances. Ex wife was 8 years younger... more a good match.

 

So I have not changed.... only my life plans have vanished and I feel like I'm adrift.

[theothersully]

Don't sell yourself short, Jan. This is excellent advice. Just hearing what someone in the same place is experiencing and thinking helps a lot.

 

The theory of just going along, meeting the people and looking for what you like and don't like is is also something for me to consider.

 

Yikes... your point about the challenge is well taken. My ex wife was miss teen ny, a model, on a few tv commercials, etc... and also chock full of borderline personality disorder. I seem to go for the best looking, most difficult ones. I have no idea why.... but maybe it's the challenge?

 

I'm kind of a super type A, Scorpio guy. I am always working on something....

 

hi theothersully,

 

it seems what you enjoy even more than great chemistry is actually the challenge of finding what makes her tick, how you could make yourself indispensable to her.

 

curiosity is what makes chemistry.

 

so you've established you can have chemistry with an amazing much younger woman, but you know that's a no-brainer, so...

 

after being committed for 12 years, dating for me is totally fascinating. i savor each new thing i learn about someone, because i realize there's a whole life of experience inside of them.

 

so as far as what to look for in the other person, i say a lot of people have many different things to offer, so it's not so much what to look for as to recognize qualities you like & don't like.

 

even in someone you see no future with you may see qualities you like: being a foodie, knowing a lot of languages, any little traits & quirks we all have can be fascinating after being so close to just one other person for so long & not much mystery for many years, it's like going from black & white to full color.

 

personally, being single after so many years committed, i've found i have chemistry with a lot of people because i find their company interesting & new.

 

i have a feeling this isn't very helpful, but it's all i have to offer you in the way of advice.

 

good luck.

 

j

Edited November 27, 2013 by theothersully

[FitChick]

Enjoy it while it lasts, learn the lesson and move on.

[crederer]

I'm in a similar spot. I have had plenty of dates with plenty of girls, but my head simply isn't in it. I've realized I have no desire for dating at this point. She's the only one I want but at the same time even if she came back begging for me I still wouldn't take her back.

 

Doesn't really make sense, I don't know why I feel this way.

[theothersully]

I'm in a similar spot. I have had plenty of dates with plenty of girls, but my head simply isn't in it. I've realized I have no desire for dating at this point. She's the only one I want but at the same time even if she came back begging for me I still wouldn't take her back.

 

Doesn't really make sense, I don't know why I feel this way.

 

Thanks, dude. That's kind of it. It's like being numb to the whole process. It's only been exciting with this one girl from the week/weekend. All the rest? No desire to see them again.

 

Naturally, the one I am actually feeling is too young.

 

Very confusing though, isn't it?

 

How to get the desire for an emotional connection back... no clue. I wonder how long that takes? I could have that with the girl from the week/weekend, but it's going to be a huge crushing end if i go down that path....lol

[Outsider77]

The issue is.... i have no idea if I'm ready for a real relationship. I can choose girls like this, who are just amazing to be with, or i can choose girls i don't feel the fire with, who are easy to get and looking for real relationships. These are my choices. I could also just stay single forever and do meaningless sex.

 

How do you cope with not knowing what you are even looking for from a partner in life?

 

After marriage, after your entire life's plans are lost, how do you find new plans? How do you figure out what you want?

 

First of all, you don't need to hurry up and find new plans. You don't even need to know what you want right now. It really hasn't been that long.

 

Second, I don't know why it needs to be a choice between girls that excite you and ones that want real relationships. I'm sure there are exciting, attractive girls that want real relationships, too.

 

Now, if you want an attractive college-aged girl who is looking for a real relationship, that's going to be harder. People that age are not looking to get serious, unless you go to another country where the culture is different.

[theothersully]

First of all, you don't need to hurry up and find new plans. You don't even need to know what you want right now. It really hasn't been that long.

 

Second, I don't know why it needs to be a choice between girls that excite you and ones that want real relationships. I'm sure there are exciting, attractive girls that want real relationships, too.

 

Now, if you want an attractive college-aged girl who is looking for a real relationship, that's going to be harder. People that age are not looking to get serious, unless you go to another country where the culture is different.

 

I feel like i need to hurry it because I'm getting a little more gray, a little more bald, a little more wrinkled all the time. Like I should get moving on it while I still have some sort of chance. This is where the urgency comes from. So maybe I shouldn't worry so much about this?

 

I guess I seem to meet only exciting party girls or unattractive ones (no spark) that are nicer,more serious, etc. I haven't found any middle ground ones. zero. none. Ideally,someone around 8 or 10 years younger is the right match for me, I've found, but these girls seem to be missing. Where are the available 30 yr olds? I get college girls or ones my own age that are just too old minded for me, personally, or way wrinkled and stuff. I would have no issue aging with someone i love, of course and was ready to do so with the ex wife, but i need that initial time together to be one of attraction/chemistry.

 

I have a slow few days of work coming up. Maybe it's time to dust off the old internet dating sites and see what happens?

[theothersully]

Awesome perspective, Jan!

 

I see we really are in a similar situation here. Yet, I feel younger and younger with the girls I have dated in their 20's. I do not have that projection feeling you have. Actually, since we have so much in common usually, they don't notice my age so much. But... I feel one of the reasons I look so much younger than my age is not completely genetic. I spent years before and my entire marriage eating nothing but home cooked local, natural and organic foods. No drinking really, no smoking, no drugs. Tons of exercise. If it wasn't for baldness making me have to shave my head, I'd be doing well. At one show i was at (R3hab) this summer, there was a 26 yo doctor complaining about he felt so old there. I was with 21yo and 18 yo girls. The doctor guessed my age to be 27. I was shocked, but my wife was like 8 years younger than me, so I had been at her age level the whole way.

 

Anyway, the short story here is i feel very young with these people, but I think the unhealthy life style of keeping up with them is starting to negate all the healthy living... which is why I look younger.

 

Since this is an anonymous board, I will also admit that I picked up two products that have helped a lot, which my ex wife used. First, Sea Buckthorn. Second, moisturizer with Argireline, Matryxl and Hyaluronic Acid. Gotta help nature a little! ha ha ha

 

I long to find someone on the attractiveness scale of the younger girls (meaning in shape, petite, brunette, cute/sexy) that wants to live a healthy, intellectual lifestyle of travel, reading, amazing food, etc... There are plenty of Miss Right Now's around, but not so many Miss Rights.

 

In retrospect, this girl I'm looking for is my ex wife, but without the severe mental illness. This is why I stuck it out with her for 12 total years through all the mental illness flare ups, meds, abuse, etc... because other than those major things, she was perfect.

Edited November 27, 2013 by theothersully

[theothersully]

well said, that's what i was trying to get at in my wordy way. lol

 

so true, i'll look into these. what happened to me? from my teens through my 20's i was all over these treatments, then i stopped caring, likely when my acne went away, i had to take antibiotics, retin-a & cleocin for years to keep it under control. upshot is that oily complexion preserves my skin

 

it's great to be around someone younger. but i miss the deep intensity i had with my lost love of my own age. we shared a focused intensity, ninja-like, that i don't find with the younger man i'm dating now. i'm hoping we can develop that, because i now realize it's not age-related & it's great you & i know we can date a wide age range because our chances are better of finding a good partner.

 

locating those who are well-preserved: maybe places where things are done in moderation, weeding out the overindulging or extreme types.

 

swimming is a moderate type of exercise that preserves the body by not wearing down joints. i've always been a swimmer & it never ceases to amaze me to see the 80 year olds still out there doing laps, they look awesome.

 

dance classes probably the same.

 

wine tasting is something alcoholics don't generally do, it's for those with moderate tastes who have restraint.

 

an art class, maybe a figure-drawing class lol, would have the patient, focused & deliberate types.

 

j

 

 

Ah!!!! Same here! Had terrible acne, backne, etc... as a teen. Did retin-a, no result. Tetracycline - no result. Accutane was the only thing to kick it. I guess some youthfulness is the upside of horrific teen acne. ha ha ha

 

 

There is a conflict on my side when looking for those moderate types. I'm very, very extreme, rather than moderate. I took diet and exercise to the extreme. Natural/organic to the extreme. Obviously from my original post, sex to the extreme. I live a very unconventional life filled with adventure and excitement. So... I find the moderate boring. This younger girl sets my soul on fire not only because she is my definition of beauty, but because she is an extremist and a legendary badass. Like a female Jack Kerouac and Hunter S Thompson mixed with friggin' Aphrodite herself. Completely irresistible to me! lolol

 

But... I like taming/bonding with these types and this is probably my downfall. Trying to find one of these just like her that it's a little older, that can handle the unconventional lifestyle i live and flourish in it. I like free thinkers. Girls who know how to function on a plane outside of normal society. Also into living a straight edge life with maybe a little drinking thrown in here or there.

 

Not easy to find. Anarchist meetings? Strippers? Don't laugh... I've dated some and they are actually often exactly the type of person I'm describing... lol.

 

It's tough to find....

[theothersully]

oh dear, you are missing out. the ability to hold tension is what makes the moderates superior. moderates know how to hold the tension of peak pleasure without going overboard. extreme living leaves unexplored areas very weak. moderation covers all areas & thus life is experienced more fully. it's like breathing: hyperventilating creates a head-rush. deep, focused breathing relaxes & enlivens the entire body. extremists aren't truly pleasure-seekers, they are adrenaline junkies. junkies don't age well.

 

there are different grades of fire. overexposure turns the skin to leather. not a good look. i'm speaking literally & metaphorically.

 

Wow... a fascinating response.

 

Maybe my definition of moderate is off... holding tension of peak pleasure is something I consider very extreme and very enjoyable. The best there is!

 

I was equating moderation to less adventurous. I may have to re think my entire definition of moderate here. ha ha ha

[theothersully]

Ha ha ha...

[Outsider77]

I guess I seem to meet only exciting party girls or unattractive ones (no spark) that are nicer,more serious, etc. I haven't found any middle ground ones. zero. none. Ideally,someone around 8 or 10 years younger is the right match for me, I've found, but these girls seem to be missing. Where are the available 30 yr olds? I get college girls or ones my own age that are just too old minded for me, personally, or way wrinkled and stuff. I would have no issue aging with someone i love, of course and was ready to do so with the ex wife, but i need that initial time together to be one of attraction/chemistry.

 

Maybe you are looking in the wrong places. Where are you trying to meet girls?

 

I also think people my age are boring (actually I find people in general to be boring), but I think people a lot younger than me are plain stupid and irresponsible. Maybe you just need to find somebody that never grew up. I don't mean this in a negative way, I just mean somebody that is still playful and likes to have fun.

 

Also you sound like an adrenaline junkie. Do you have ADHD?

[theothersully]

Maybe you are looking in the wrong places. Where are you trying to meet girls?

 

I also think people my age are boring (actually I find people in general to be boring), but I think people a lot younger than me are plain stupid and irresponsible. Maybe you just need to find somebody that never grew up. I don't mean this in a negative way, I just mean somebody that is still playful and likes to have fun.

 

Also you sound like an adrenaline junkie. Do you have ADHD?

 

Another insightful response. Thanks!

 

I would love to find someone that never grew up... and by that I mean: does not have excessive responsibilities, a house, kids living with them, a job in one place they cannot leave, and someone just as you said, who is playful and fun. So... looking for myself in female form.

 

I wouldn't even mind stupid and irresponsible. Those are things that can be worked on if there is a will.

 

And yes...I do enjoy adrenaline from time to time. I like a stable life, but an exciting one. Used to do all sorts of extreme sports. I like adrenaline within known safe boundaries without actual danger ( as i perceive it).

 

I think I do have ADHD,or at least a touch of it, but I wouldn't trade it for the world. I am able to focus and stick to long, difficult projects, but... have some kind of ability in the area of unique, original thoughts and problem solving, inventing, building things, creating. With no touch of ADHD or whatever, I'd lose that ability, which is my main advantage in life...

 

But yeah, maybe meeting people elsewhere... no idea where. Where do 30 yo, free thinking, in shape women hang out? Yoga? Whole Foods? I go to Whole Foods all the time but never have looked at people in the grocery store as potentials. I shop and get out.

 

I've been meeting girls at bars or other social type things, through friends and online.

[Emilia]

Another insightful response. Thanks!

 

I would love to find someone that never grew up... and by that I mean: does not have excessive responsibilities, a house, kids living with them, a job in one place they cannot leave, and someone just as you said, who is playful and fun. So... looking for myself in female form.

 

I wouldn't even mind stupid and irresponsible. Those are things that can be worked on if there is a will.

 

And yes...I do enjoy adrenaline from time to time. I like a stable life, but an exciting one. Used to do all sorts of extreme sports. I like adrenaline within known safe boundaries without actual danger ( as i perceive it).

 

I think I do have ADHD,or at least a touch of it, but I wouldn't trade it for the world. I am able to focus and stick to long, difficult projects, but... have some kind of ability in the area of unique, original thoughts and problem solving, inventing, building things, creating. With no touch of ADHD or whatever, I'd lose that ability, which is my main advantage in life...

 

But yeah, maybe meeting people elsewhere... no idea where. Where do 30 yo, free thinking, in shape women hang out? Yoga? Whole Foods? I go to Whole Foods all the time but never have looked at people in the grocery store as potentials. I shop and get out.

 

I've been meeting girls at bars or other social type things, through friends and online.

You sound like someone I dated recently. You are chasing dopamine.

[theothersully]

You sound like someone I dated recently. You are chasing dopamine.

 

Yeah, but there has to be a match out there... you and I may be different in our needs/wants, but there should be another dopamine chaser out there to have a fun life with me, no?

[Emilia]

Yeah, but there has to be a match out there... you and I may be different in our needs/wants, but there should be another dopamine chaser out there to have a fun life with me, no?

Pulling Away After Sex

 

If you are after a rollercoaster ride then yes if you are looking for stability (which the guy I was with was) then it will become a problem.

[FitChick]

I long to find someone on the attractiveness scale of the younger girls (meaning in shape, petite, brunette, cute/sexy) that wants to live a healthy, intellectual lifestyle of travel, reading, amazing food, etc...

There are plenty of women your own age who are like that. Except they are dating much younger men.

[Outsider77]

I think maybe you need to do things that interest you, and try to meet girls in those places. I really don't think bars and online dating is going to find you what you want. You're probably only going to meet really young women and older desperate women there.

 

If you are into outdoors kind of activities, try to meet people there. Maybe you could take a yoga class,a nutrition class or a cooking class. You need to find like-minded people. Decide on doing something you find interesting and join a group that gets together every once in awhile.

 

I'm afraid if you keep dating really young girls, you are going to eventually be disappointed because they are going to lose interest in you fairly quickly and move onto the next thing. You need to find somebody who is more than just fun if you want something a little more long-term.

 

Based on the way you write and some things you've said about yourself, you might have at least mild ADHD. Might be why you need someone who is more free-spirited and why you choose the lifestyle you have. Nothing wrong with that, I know quite a few people who have it.

[theothersully]

There are plenty of women your own age who are like that. Except they are dating much younger men.

 

Odd. I guess these mythical women are exactly like me in all respects then? I'm dating a 22 yo and since she might be a little too crazy, have a 21 yo flying up from FL later this week to visit me in Manhattan. So these 38 year old women, full of adventure and independence are doing the same thing, you say?

 

That's funny and ironic in a way.... ha ha ha

 

So for real, you actually know people like this? I've only met about 10 in my life and they were all younger.

[theothersully]

I think maybe you need to do things that interest you, and try to meet girls in those places. I really don't think bars and online dating is going to find you what you want. You're probably only going to meet really young women and older desperate women there.

 

If you are into outdoors kind of activities, try to meet people there. Maybe you could take a yoga class,a nutrition class or a cooking class. You need to find like-minded people. Decide on doing something you find interesting and join a group that gets together every once in awhile.

 

I'm afraid if you keep dating really young girls, you are going to eventually be disappointed because they are going to lose interest in you fairly quickly and move onto the next thing. You need to find somebody who is more than just fun if you want something a little more long-term.

 

Based on the way you write and some things you've said about yourself, you might have at least mild ADHD. Might be why you need someone who is more free-spirited and why you choose the lifestyle you have. Nothing wrong with that, I know quite a few people who have it.

 

Wow... you nailed it.

 

I definitely have a touch of ADHD. I like it. It helps me think of creative things, but I can still focus on long term projects. A perfect balance. It's probably also why my borderline ex and i lasted so long. She was nuts too, so we were able to do this stuff. Together. Fun, varied stuff.

 

I think you are right about the younger girls too. I had been thinking younger girls might be good because they are more apt to be free like that. Looking for interesting experiences before they settle down. So, a good match.

 

However, this one i have been seeing is definitely affecting me now. I feel terrible today after seeing her thanksgiving pics go by. The guy she left behind in Miami is in the pics, with her family, staying there, after both me and a 3rd dude had sex with her this week. I think the Miami guy is the one getting f'd over the worst. I have known her longer, but they lived together. We have been on and off with other people in between. The Miami guy is fighting for her. I think i was a little too, though not really sure why. The random dude from this week was a single hookup from high school that she never even got back to. So... this guy from Miami is at her parent's house for the weekend with her. That puts me and the other guy out of the picture. She did have sex with 3 dudes in all this week ( so far... lol)

 

So I have had feelings for her, but I don't know why when she is so wrong for me on so many levels.

 

Then, there is the harsh ptsd of getting screwed over exactly a year ago by the ex wife. I can't go to family holiday stuff because I'm too upset and don't need questions and judgments.

 

What a terrible, terrible time of year. Massive depression all of a sudden ( it will pass quickly thanks to adhd), but i feel horrible today. Nobody to talk to. No work to lose myself in.

 

Thanks for listening....

[theothersully]

hi theothersully,

 

my not-so-humble opine:

 

so you got yourself into a situation that's exacerbating your break up pain.

 

this brief dark period is a chance to relive that experience with the new information you've gathered from this experience incorporated, to get some greater perspective on what's going wrong, because you are the common denominator in both situations.

 

you seem like a great guy underneath all this production. give your real self a chance to speak now. listen. & give some accommodation to your real needs.

 

j

 

In my humble opinion, every poster on here has figured me out while I continue to flail.

 

You are, of course, correct. Maybe next time I'll at least try for a good person, rather than a bad ass of this caliber. The girl is using all three of us guys and nit just for sex. The Miami guy is in the worst position of all, though. I feel for him. I have like a crush, but he's deeply in love and will be living with this kind of hell for a long time to come.

 

Thank you for the compliment. You guys aren't meeting the real me because I'm sharing all this inner turmoil. I'm all over the place, partially because my thoughts are all over the place still. Somehow, when someone you have been with for 12 years vanished with nothing more than a 3 min phone call, with no warning or sign anything is wrong, saying, "i love you and can't wait to spend time together at christmas" just the day before... it screws you up pretty bad. Then this year, I lose my crush/fun girl at the exact same holiday period. I mean i could continue with her, but even I'm a little grossed out at 3 dudes (so far) this week. Add smoking and drug use in and... yuck. I'm too turned off to do anything with her no matter how hot she is.

 

Well, there are more fun girls out there who are at least nicer human beings, don't do drugs,etc... Still not ready for a real relationship, I don't think. I have trust issues at this point. I feel like I can't trust women in a relationship, after my ex wife and now this girl.I man look at that poor guy in Miami who thinks she is his serious girlfriend. She jumps in a car with me, good away for a few days, then we have sex...very good sex. Two nights later, she's having seed with a different dude. Now this Miami guy is at Thanksgiving, thinking he's visiting his sweetheart of a girlfriend? Ouch. At least i knew it wasn't serious (but i still crushed on her, which was a mistake) .

 

I thought I was playing it cool too... that the little feelings could be brushed aside.

 

And... now I get to work with her. Yay. :/

 

I do have a much nicer girl flying in to see me in Manhattan later this week. So... time to just keep on getting out there and enjoying without getting too attached.This one is a little younger...lol.. not the best idea probably, but she is at least a very nice person. I won't get as emotionally involved though....hopefully. Still looking for fun, but yes... fun on my terms as well, exactly how you said.

 

Thankfully, that depression from seeing I wasn't the top dude at the Thanksgiving dinner is already gone. And people take meds for ADHD???? lol

[theothersully]

coincidence? i think not.

 

he's part of your story too. i'd think about myself in all three roles & gather whatever insight i could so as not to open myself up to unnecessary hurt again. maybe you couldn't have prevented the wife's actions, but you could have prevented yourself from getting into this situation. you chose not to, & i think this 'poor guy in miami' is the re-enactment you were looking for, to make sense of things. this way, you got to be in the less vulnerable role of the triad. & what does that do? it gives you more objectivity on the situation. well done.

 

fire her.

 

j

 

 

You have such deep, meaningful perspective, Jan...

 

What do you mean, not a coincidence? That somehow, I went into the same situation of change? Like a pattern of behavior? That's hard to imagine, since I was largely out of control of the other people's actions. I had no clue on the ex wife, then this girl accepted my invite for the 1000 mile road trip and weekend in nyc out of the blue. It was on the table for weeks before. Just today, i realized i had some feelings that were hard to brush aside. Before, I had thought it was a fling type thing.

 

No, I really feel bad for that guy, because this girl is magic. Black, devil magic. Probably the most addictive girl I've ever known. Also, the definition of beauty. Every detail, head to toe, is perfect. And with all the practice, she's ridiculously good in bed ... or should I say in bar bathrooms, cabs and hotels...ha ha ha He's hooked in hard. She told me they were done. That she moved out. Apparently, that may not be the case. I don't like that through me, she hurt that guy, using us both. Triad...? this is a quad... or maybe pentagon by the end of the week... still a couple days and a high school reunion for her left! ha ha ha

 

I can't fire her. That's the emotionally satisfying thing to do, but not the right, or business savvy thing to do in this case. She is doing a pretty good job... I'm just going to have to suck it up. A new distraction will take her place...