Do Nice Guys Finish Last?

[GoodOnPaper]

Well, jerks are aggressive but nice guys are passive aggresive then flat out aggressive when things dont go their way. The average nice guy is controlling, manipulative, and sometimes just flat out MEAN.

 

Nice guys are some of the worst guys to date!

 

Which makes it pretty much impossible to win if you are not naturally jerkish. Any signs of being reserved, sensitive, etc. gets you pegged as weak (at best) or as putting on a front to be manipulative (at worst).

[Imported]

Yes OP, nice guys finish last all the time. Please turn off the lights before you leave.

[Beatles4]

Yes, I feel like am a nice guy yet I havent had a gf for ages, yet I see all the dickheads with girls, and there girls moaning how they are treated...girls must love it really!

[MrCastle]

No one wants to date someone spineless. "Nice guys," if I am using the term correctly, typically let people walk all over them. They don't speak up for themselves. Bending over backwards for a shot at the pussy. It's pathetic.

 

Tell a girl no once in a while. Disagree with her. Have a mind and life of your own. See how your dating live improves as a result.

[happydate]

I was watching a video the other day and one girl said that the biggest turn off was if the guy was too nice. She was early 20s (20-22). It disappointed me because I would consider myself a nice guy. I know that there are some a-holes that do get girls and don't treat them right and that works for them, but thats not me. When I do meet new people, I try to be nice and then once I get to know them and are comfortable then I start to tease them and start to push their buttons a little (all in good fun with good intent). Ive always thought that I might not be the guy for them right now, but rather a long term investment that will pay off later down the road. I am curious as I start to go out into the dating world how things look for nice guys, especially someone in their early 20s. I anticipate that it might be a struggle, but I would like some feedback from those who are out there and experience it to give their thoughts.

 

Here is your problem already..

 

When I do meet new people, "I TRY TO BE NICE". Why do you need to manipulate yourself to be nice to meet people? Why can't you be authentic and be yourself and be who you are?

 

Perhaps you want to manipulate people you meet so you can manipulate them to give you favourable responses? This is known as a people pleaser syndrome. Nice guys or nice girls for that matter are people pleasers.

 

Nice guys are fakes. They fake themselves, their persona and their attitude that nothing coming out of them are real. They fear rejection, so they fake themselves to manipulate others. Sadly because they try to manipulate others into exacting a favourable response, what do nice guys attract? Manipulative girls who use them as meal tickets, doormats, chauffeurs etc and sometimes sex if the conditions are right (you've got a thick toy down she likes to ride etc..), because women aren't dumb. The ones that are secure won't bother to waste their time even replying to your phone call, text or emails.

 

There are no such things as jerks. Nice guys call guys who are authentic, who can be themselves as jerks because we do not please everyone. It's impossible to please 7 billion human beings in this planet. When nice guys see these authentic guys, they hate them because they're not nice. But girls LIKE AUTHENTIC males, Alpha males who can stand up for themselves.

 

If you are authentic, you are NOT afraid to say what you feel and do what you like. You are not afraid of loosing pussy if you see your woman behave badly, because if your woman does not treat you right, what do you do? You tell her to stop it or shut up. That's not being a jerk. That's being who you really are and nice guys do not do this. Because they fear if they speak the truth, they'll loose any sign of possible pussies they can get which is pathetic really, but that's really what will get you pussies. Women respect men with a spine.

 

There are bad guys out there, but they are bad because they mistreat girls. Girls want authentic guys who can speak up and be themselves and treat them like princesses. It is not that hard really, but people are afraid; afraid of being who they really are. And being nice to all people IS NOT who you really are. That's not realistic.

Edited December 7, 2013 by happydate

[happydate]

Nice guys manipulate their actions to exact a favourable response from others. So basically, they are not real. But think for a moment that if like attracts like, then it is safe to say that as a woman attracted to a nice guy, you can also be as manipulative as the nice guy. You use him for things that jerks don't tolerate for, but you don't like him because he's not nice to you.

 

Why do you think jerks have to be nice to you? Does 7 billion human beings on the planet really have to be nice to you? If people are not nice to you, then you call them jerks.

 

I think the reason why some nice guys and girls call guys or gals who behave authentically as jerks, because they are truly straight forward people. They say the truth and don't play these political correctness B.S. They call what they see and say what they want, because they see you as a fake. So of course, nice guys or gals call people who are straight forward and not play nice as jerks when in fact they are not.

 

Now, there are people who are truly bad and those people are the real jerks. They cheat, lie, steal, abuse etc.. Straight forward people do not do this and yet they are labeled as a jerk.

[melell]

Nice guys are nice.

[FrostBlaze]

If you are a walk-over, yes.

The hatefull, spitefull kind, "look i am NICE ! Look at all the jerks who get women !

God damn women!!"

 

I've never blamed women for my problems, when it's more than likely, me. xD

 

off:topic maybe?

What's with all the hate on nice guys, you people must of met the fake ones that...act for the sake of it. xD

 

I am nice, people always tell me that, it irks me sometimes. But not because i want people to think good of me, it's just how i am, very sympathetic. I will help random people on the street without them even asking, if i see a problem a try to interfere.

My friends find me weird as to why i do it.

I always bug in my friends problems to try and get them out of it.

I get angry pretty hard because i tolerate 1-3 mistakes, so it may sometimes seem to people that i let them walk over me.

But i can't tolerate bs, bs me i will snap at you immediately, always have problems with my boss at work, he is gonna kick me out one day xD.

Edited December 7, 2013 by FrostBlaze

[Zeroes]

You have to use the air quotes. It's a lot easier saying "nice guy" than "shy, introverted, nerdy, approval-seeking, overly-sensitive, overly-analytical, unassertive, awkward, feminized".

Minus "feminised", that description matches pretty much every guy I've known who has defined himself as a "nice guy".

 

This is simply a misunderstanding where he sees a "connection" and she doesn't. Guys don't open up easily, and "nice guys" REALLY don't open up easily, so it's natural to think that being really comfortable with a woman will lead to something romantic. It's a cruel lesson for young "nice guys" to learn that women compartmentalize friendship and attraction just as guys compartmentalize sex and love.

 

Again, the compartmentalization of friendship and attraction just doesn't make sense. Plus, it's emasculating when a woman who supposedly likes you and wants to spend time with you thinks that any woman would be crazy to want anything physical with you.

Both men and women separate friendships and relationships. What makes a friendship a relationship is the romantic and sexual attraction, and if that's not there, it's simply a friendship. Common sense no?

 

Men do the exact same thing. There's women they'll work with and hang out with, drink with, play video games, and whatever - but as long as they're not attracted sexually, that's the way it'll remain. There isn't a movement out there of women who define themselves as "nice girls" or whatever swarming the internet and demanding that their hot male friends should fall in love with them just because they're friends and both enjoy playing Call of Duty or FIFA in their spare time is there?

 

 

 

Of course we're jealous!! Again, the air quotes are critical. "Bad boy" is just a shorthand way of describing that elusive excitement factor that "nice guys" just won't ever have.

So.. how much of a "nice guy" would you be if you were either A) Very good looking or B) Had the charisma/traits/etc. of a so called "bad boy"?

 

 

 

So . . . we're not supposed to want an attractive partner?? There are dozens of threads on LS started by women who won't give an inch when it comes to attraction. From a more practical standpoint, when we're young, we notice what's on the surface. It's the extroverted girls that are sending out the signals that everyone can see. We think validation from those girls will solve all our self-esteem problems. Yes, it's likely a mistake to be going after these kind of girls but the "nice girls" either don't send out signals of interest or, if they are, they are directing them toward very different guys.

I don't actually care who's attracted to who - but what I do find annoying is "nice guys" whine that women are "shallow" for preferring to date or f*ck hot, "bad boys" - yet the only reason they like said women is, surprise surprise, because they're good looking! That's my point and that's why it's hard to have sympathy for them. Hence the "shallow" card.

 

Back in my day, there WAS a shortage of geeky girls and most of them were intentionally looking for opposites-attract pairings with "bad boys" as discussed earlier. Fortunately, science and technology are now much more mainstream. My students' social lives -- I'm a university science professor -- seem to be MUCH more "normal" than what I and my fellow science nerds experienced.

I'm not saying you're lying, but I've never known a "geeky girl" to throw herself at the feet of the sort of guys who are stereotyped as "bad boys". Have a crush on him? Maybe. Usually "geeky" sort of girls like guys that are into the same stuff they are.

 

Your advice has tones of "just stay in your own league" but won't that lead to settling? According to LS, that seems to be the biggest sin of all.

Not exactly related, but leagues do exist, though. People like to pretend they don't - or they like to assure other people they don't, but they do.

 

Go out into town and look at couples. Most of them will be roughly similar in attractiveness level and will probably have a similar social class, professional background, interests and social interests. There's exceptions, but that's all they are, exceptions.

 

My own philosophy is by all means go for what you like, give it a shot, even if a girl/guy is out of your league because you never know, but be realistic about your expectations. If you can't meet your own standards, then it's time to re-evaluate or accept that you're gonna stay single unless and until you do something that can make yourself more attractive to the kind of girl/guy you're after. Whining and trying to change human nature will achieve zilch.

[Beatles4]

So, is this the reason why I cant get a gf because I am "nice"?

[TheGuard13]

I don't so much agree that "nice guys" are fake. I think they're more along the lines of authentic, but socially awkward in that authenticity. EVERYONE manipulates events and situations to get the results they want on some level. Where this becomes an issue with "nice guys" is they don't know HOW to manipulate to get the result they want without making it obvious what they're doing. In a social interaction, there are some complex things going on. Nice Guys tend to have a method of interaction that screams "I am doing social interaction complexity number X". When you do that, you destroy the illusion of an easy social interaction, and people tend to get annoyed/freaked out by that stuff for some reason.

[Beatles4]

I don't so much agree that "nice guys" are fake. I think they're more along the lines of authentic, but socially awkward in that authenticity. EVERYONE manipulates events and situations to get the results they want on some level. Where this becomes an issue with "nice guys" is they don't know HOW to manipulate to get the result they want without making it obvious what they're doing. In a social interaction, there are some complex things going on. Nice Guys tend to have a method of interaction that screams "I am doing social interaction complexity number X". When you do that, you destroy the illusion of an easy social interaction, and people tend to get annoyed/freaked out by that stuff for some reason.

 

Wow I really am a simpleton in a complex world!

[gabgab]

Nice girls finish last too. Unless they look like a model.

[joystickd]

The only problem with nice guys is that they listen to the women in their life when it comes to dating. The main thing that ticks me off about the conversation about nice guys is the attempts to demonize them. Most of the time these guys are nice in their everyday life and not some evil manipulative guy that is only nice because he wants one thing.

 

Women how would you feel if every man you were interested in rejected you even when you did everything for them? Would you feel frustrated eventually at some point? How would you feel after all of this you see a woman with a little effort date the people you were interested in?

[FrankieFrank]

I don't so much agree that "nice guys" are fake. I think they're more along the lines of authentic, but socially awkward in that authenticity. EVERYONE manipulates events and situations to get the results they want on some level. Where this becomes an issue with "nice guys" is they don't know HOW to manipulate to get the result they want without making it obvious what they're doing. In a social interaction, there are some complex things going on. Nice Guys tend to have a method of interaction that screams "I am doing social interaction complexity number X". When you do that, you destroy the illusion of an easy social interaction, and people tend to get annoyed/freaked out by that stuff for some reason.

 

Ain't that the truth?

 

Many girls go out of their way to label quiet, socially awkward guy a creep and think those guys would hurt them physically. Yet it's often the life of the party super charmer that turns into a beast behind closed doors...

[hotpotato]

The only problem with nice guys is that they listen to the women in their life when it comes to dating. The main thing that ticks me off about the conversation about nice guys is the attempts to demonize them. Most of the time these guys are nice in their everyday life and not some evil manipulative guy that is only nice because he wants one thing.

 

Women how would you feel if every man you were interested in rejected you even when you did everything for them? Would you feel frustrated eventually at some point? How would you feel after all of this you see a woman with a little effort date the people you were interested in?

 

I would take a hint and move on.

 

At this point I realize it's not always best to jump through hoops for people who you scarcely know or who don't reciprocate interest.

[joystickd]

I would take a hint and move on.

 

At this point I realize it's not always best to jump through hoops for people who you scarcely know or who don't reciprocate interest.

 

How would you feel if it happened consistently? Wouldnt you feel frustrated?

[jeremy2125]

I think it's okay to be the nice guy, just as long as you're not a pushover and a butler/servant instead of a potential.

[gaius]

Being nice to a woman will never turn her on sexually, so if that's all you have to offer then you're doomed.

 

If you have an urge to be nice then you should! But don't expect anything in return. And only do it to the women you aren't sexually attracted to.

[ltjg45]

Sure, but we're talking about guys who are likely aware that they aren't going to generate instant attraction from anyone.

 

That's basically me in a nutshell and I am aware of that. I just don't have the body language necessary to make a woman sexually attracted. Even if I do have the body and face, I don't have the skills necessary to finish the job.

 

Even though a lot of people call me "nice" (which, by the way, I wish they didn't say that because of all of the negative stereotypes that goes along with it), I'm def. not a push over, do things just to try and get the woman in a sneaky way, or anything of that nature.

 

In fact, if I can't tell if she is interested in me or not, I typically don't bother and just let her go. Sure explains why I never had a girlfriend yet at my age of 27.

 

I even got interest in one of my female co-workers that I went out to the club with along with her boyfriend last week. Since she has a boyfriend (at least in her eyes, anyway), I didn't bother making any moves on her......but even her "boyfriend" mentioned about her and I getting together at the club. I was considering it but, considering we have worked together for over 5 months, I'm sure if she has any interest, it was long since gone so no point going down that path.

 

I even gave her a small amount of money to thank her for spending her time to get me to the club and using her gas as a result. I certainly didn't want to sound ungrateful for it esp. since I was planning to go there alone that night.

 

Oh well. Such is life, I suppose.

[Under The Radar]

Being nice to a woman will never turn her on sexually, so if that's all you have to offer then you're doomed.

 

If you have an urge to be nice then you should! But don't expect anything in return. And only do it to the women you aren't sexually attracted to.

 

 

This is simply not true. Your comments are only relevant to guys who sole interest is to get laid, and even then, it will only attract certain types of women. If the goal is a meaningful long term relationship, then being nice (if it's genuine) will be an important factor. The key is in not being a doormat.

[hotpotato]

How would you feel if it happened consistently? Wouldnt you feel frustrated?

 

I would feel frustrated, especially if I were expecting someone to behave how I want because I was 'nice.' If the only thong someone is offering is nice, they are gking to have a hard time in the dating world.

[M30USA]

I don't so much agree that "nice guys" are fake. I think they're more along the lines of authentic, but socially awkward in that authenticity. EVERYONE manipulates events and situations to get the results they want on some level. Where this becomes an issue with "nice guys" is they don't know HOW to manipulate to get the result they want without making it obvious what they're doing. In a social interaction, there are some complex things going on. Nice Guys tend to have a method of interaction that screams "I am doing social interaction complexity number X". When you do that, you destroy the illusion of an easy social interaction, and people tend to get annoyed/freaked out by that stuff for some reason.

 

I can agree with this. It wasn't until I got to know my ex's family that I realized you can be a bully underneath and have the appearance of being gracious and "nice" on the outside. I have no time for these games and nuances. It may help you succeed in business, but count me out.

[mrnova66]

Yes nice is not good enough, But the typical drama king(drunk,drug addict,jailbird,bum,drug dealer abuser) has no problems. He is not the one complaining. This type of a winner is never single. Most are married.. Then you read on these forums about the alfa male. Where everyone is suppose to pull out the red carpet because he is special. Then about six months down the road he blows a fuse and is back in jail. Meanwhile back at the ranch after Mr. Alfa is in jail the woman is asking everyone where are all the good guys?. This type of a woman usually ends up playing games with the good guy until the next drama king comes in the picture. Then she drops the good guy like a hot potatoe. Does she care who she hurts? NOPE!!!It is all about her. And she deserves every bit of what Mr. Drama king gives her. So I suggest to any self respecting good guy to run for the hills if a woman cannot respect a good guy. She has issues. Remember opposites do not attract in the long term. When these women turn in their 40s they become man haters or border line lesbians. Do not walk. RUN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[gabgab]

You all are cray. I no longer date men that aren't nice. Having compassion and empathy (towards people other than me) are must haves for me now, I've raised my standards and wont accept anything less. So few men genuinely have these qualities the ones that do stand out.

Edited December 11, 2013 by gabgab