OLD: Do you think women are overlooking men too much?

[NGC1300]

That's quite true.

 

As long as there exist girls who will sleep with d-bags with shirtless pics, those d-bags will stay d-bags with shirtless pics. I mean, it works for them, why should they change?

 

I don't quite understand how having a shirtless pic automatically means the person is a "d-bag"???

 

If they're in shape, then yes maybe it's a touch of gloating and conceit, but "d-bag", really?

[PinkInTheLimo]

What "kind of guy" rides a motorcycle???

 

Really confused on your thought process here.

 

It's fun, and you can save gas.

 

Guys who ride a motorcycle are guys who find pleasure in a dangerous activity. Which means that every time my guy would be out on his motorcycle I would be afraid that he will have an accident. I don't want to live like that.

And yes they all say that they are careful and that there are other things that are more dangerous. Yet from the few people I know who ride a motorcycle almost all of them have had accidents which left them with serious injuries.

 

I am not a risk taker and I could not be together with a risk taker. So motorcycle riders, parachute or bungee jumpers are not my kind of guy.

 

If you are together with a guy who gets involved with activities which can get him injured or dead, it can have a very serious impact on your life. Not a risk I am willing to take.

[Copelandsanity]

Personally, I wouldn't sweat it too much. If you do, it'll just drive you crazy.

 

You may think to yourself, "Hey, I'm intelligent, attractive enough, sane, have good character, have purpose in life, and are looking for the right things. All I want is the same." But how many people out there are actually good catches or quality people to date? It's only a small percentage - whether it be in IRL or OLD - and naturally, it's going to be lower on OLD. It's extremely difficult to find someone who doesn't have a monumental dealbreaker and by dealbreaker, I'm talking about basic necessities for a LTR.

[Copelandsanity]

I don't quite understand how having a shirtless pic automatically means the person is a "d-bag"???

 

If they're in shape, then yes maybe it's a touch of gloating and conceit, but "d-bag", really?

 

Generally, guys who post shirtless pics for a reason. The reason is that they are looking for girls who are "DTF."

[PinkInTheLimo]

I prefer to not come off as "anything" in a profile and keep it pretty basic (like most women I keep seeing).

 

Well maybe that's the problem? That your profile is so neutral that your personality does not shine through at all.

I don't expect a guy to engage in some originality contest but it is nice to read something personal, like the last book you read or where you spend your last holiday. Personally I am more inclined to react to a profile in which there are some concrete things I can react to, then you have a conversation starter.

[PinkInTheLimo]

I usually don't mind somewhat "thicker" women, there was this one that lived locally, I actually liked her cute smile and eyes...she' was a bit thicker than I'm used to dating....most men I know wouldn't give someone like yourself a second look , but what she had written in her profile got my attention andI contacted her...she was a science teacher, a big sci-fi geek, and pretty much a carbon copy of me when it comes to belief systems....but get this, she did reply, but was like "Sorry, I don't think we'd make a good match" and I was like "Huh?? How can THAT be?"

 

So that woman was totally "second choice" for you because she was thicker than you like and then you are annoyed because you expect her to know that she is "second choice" and therefore should accept that all she can ever "get" is a "second choice" guy like herself.

 

I think we all want to feel as if we are "first choice" for someone...

[NGC1300]

If you are together with a guy who gets involved with activities which can get him injured or dead, it can have a very serious impact on your life. Not a risk I am willing to take.

 

 

I'll grant you that crashing a motorcycle is more dangerous than crashing a car, however I don't think that classifies someone as a "risk taker".

 

3,000 die every year choking on food, and many more die in automobile crashes.

 

Life isn't forever, no matter how careful you are.

[William]

Our hydra with a thousand heads showed up in this thread so moderation had to do a little cleanup.

 

Please continue discussing whether women are overlooking men in online dating. Thanks!

[PinkInTheLimo]

I'll grant you that crashing a motorcycle is more dangerous than crashing a car, however I don't think that classifies someone as a "risk taker".

 

3,000 die every year choking on food, and many more die in automobile crashes.

 

Life isn't forever, no matter how careful you are.

 

NGC1300, now that is typical masculine behaviour: trying to convince me of your view. What makes you think I will change my mind about this?

 

I just don't want a guy who rides a motocycle. Like I don't want a guy who smokes. Or a guy who is overweight. Or a guy who has unsafe sex.

 

You are right, life is not forever but some activities risk bringing the end of it faster.

 

The fact is that I would have no problem supporting my partner if he had an accident for which he was not responsible or was seriously ill. However if my partner would end up in hospital because he could not resist riding his motocycle, I would abandon him because I would blame him for having done this to himself and to me.

[NGC1300]

The fact is that I would have no problem supporting my partner if he had an accident for which he was not responsible or was seriously ill. However if my partner would end up in hospital because he could not resist riding his motocycle, I would abandon him because I would blame him for having done this to himself and to me.

 

 

First, I am not trying to change your mind.

 

But lets say he was riding a bike, and someone hit him. You would claim it was still his fault, and abandon him.

 

That's not love.

[PinkInTheLimo]

First, I am not trying to change your mind.

 

But lets say he was riding a bike, and someone hit him. You would claim it was still his fault, and abandon him.

 

That's not love.

 

If the guy goes riding his motorcycle when he knows I hate that, he does not love me either.

 

That's why I don't want a guy with a motocycle because... I could not love such a guy (so my example is hypothetical because we would never have started a relationship in the first place).

 

I can only love a guy who makes me happy, and if he has hobbies which I perceive as dangerous, he would make me unhappy.

 

It's as simple as that: will my life with him be pleasant or unpleasant...

[irc333]

That's why I actually reveal more of myself in my initial email to the person, I take their interests, beliefs, hobbies, and whatever else I said into consideration and expound upon that, so that way they are more inclined to react, which some actually have.

 

 

 

 

 

Well maybe that's the problem? That your profile is so neutral that your personality does not shine through at all.

I don't expect a guy to engage in some originality contest but it is nice to read something personal, like the last book you read or where you spend your last holiday. Personally I am more inclined to react to a profile in which there are some concrete things I can react to, then you have a conversation starter.

[PinkInTheLimo]

Very interesting video on the market for sex and love:

 

Scientific evidence that women have no intention of lowering their standards...

[Under The Radar]

This is why I target the 9.5's with low self-esteem .

[AnyaNova]

This is why I target the 9.5's with low self-esteem .

 

Care to elaborate on that one? And what constitutes a 9.5 to you?

[Thegreatestthing]

I don't understand why human beings don't want to know other human beings,it's really strange to me.

 

Just ticking people off,as if there worth nothing because they don't meet your internal criteria in some way,what about what you have to offer them in terms love,kindness or any number of things.

[verhrzn]

I think women may have given you a shot in person, but that's only because it would have taken to the 2nd or 3rd date to discover the dealbreaker that's plain as day in your profile or questions.

 

I am amazed how guys answer questions and yet never seem to pay attention to a girl's answers when sending her a message. I've run across quite a few profiles where I liked the look of the guy, enjoyed his profile, then read his answers and went "NOPE."

 

Or my biggest pet peeve-when guys message me who clearly don't want kids, when it is spelled out quite clearly on my profile and in my questions that I do. I mean, what the hell buddy?

 

I'd bet good money that despite the common interests there was something in the way you answered certain questions, or even the answers themselves, that told her you weren't a match. I've come across guys who had similar hobbies to me, who came across as very pretentious and arrogant.... no thank you.

 

Point is, women are pretty good at sussing out what personality traits are going to rub them the wrong way. It has nothing to do with them overlooking a "good man." They just know if you went on a date, you'd be wasting both of your time. Thank them for being honest and move on.

[irc333]

Well, your theory suggests an actual correspondence you had with them, mines don't. Some don't even answer. ...so it is moot.

 

Chances are, just as an example, they probably saw the height parameter and hit the "delete" button.

 

I'm always attentive to details when I am addressing a woman's profile and use them within the context of my initial email (if it ever gets a reply). I pretty much tailor them to the specific profile of the woman of whom I'm writing.

 

I think women may have given you a shot in person, but that's only because it would have taken to the 2nd or 3rd date to discover the dealbreaker that's plain as day in your profile or questions.

 

I am amazed how guys answer questions and yet never seem to pay attention to a girl's answers when sending her a message. I've run across quite a few profiles where I liked the look of the guy, enjoyed his profile, then read his answers and went "NOPE."

 

Or my biggest pet peeve-when guys message me who clearly don't want kids, when it is spelled out quite clearly on my profile and in my questions that I do. I mean, what the hell buddy?

 

I'd bet good money that despite the common interests there was something in the way you answered certain questions, or even the answers themselves, that told her you weren't a match. I've come across guys who had similar hobbies to me, who came across as very pretentious and arrogant.... no thank you.

 

Point is, women are pretty good at sussing out what personality traits are going to rub them the wrong way. It has nothing to do with them overlooking a "good man." They just know if you went on a date, you'd be wasting both of your time. Thank them for being honest and move on.

[soccerrprp]

The latter two have extremely small injury and mortality rates. Thrill and danger are not synonymous.

 

And while motorcycles unquestionably have higher mortality rates per mile ridden associated with them, weekend riders (or trackday guys, for that matter) are FAR better off than daily commuters in automobiles, especially if you're racking up the miles. Much like skin cancer, transportation deaths are inexplicably tied to exposure amounts.

 

All I've got to say is I'd literally have no friends whatsoever if I lived by the rules espoused on here. No bodybuiders, no motorcycle riders, no fat people, no smokers, no skydivers. You're like the oppressive government in a dystopian sci-fi movie... LOL!

 

There are people on here who already know that life is uncertain and to add behaviors and activities that CLEARLY increase the chance of injury or harm, just doesn't and frankly, isn't prudent. I've sky-dived, bungee jumped, scuba, skied off cliffs b/c of the thrill of it. I knew there was nothing courageous about any these things I did and certainly nothing smart about them. Now that I have a family and loved ones, I stay away from doing what amounts to are "fooling", "wreckless" things.

 

But for the question are women overlooking men too much? Well, that question can to directed at men too. Are men overlooking women too much?

[irc333]

Back to the OP- OKCupid did an analysis on their community and found that women find 80% of men to be below average. Men were actually closer to reasonable in their assessment of women.

 

This flies in the face of the conventional wisdom that men are superficial - the opposite is actually true

 

blog. okcupid.com/ index.php/your-looks-and-online-dating/

 

Funny how you mentioned this, Hellineaux, there's a few women I had seen profiles of...one of them recently on OK Cupid , another I am a real life acquaintance of.

 

One is on POF

 

She is a big city socialite, a major participant in some of Social Meetup groups, and so on. In her profile she states, "I have no problem getting dates, no I have problem meeting men or even receiving offers for dates, I just come to this site in order to meet quality men or men that I have an interest in"

 

Then she rather snobbishly adds:

 

"If you already know me, there's no need to say hello to me here".

 

This pretty much states that out of TONS of single men she's met at the Meetup Singles Mixers, and other REAL LIFE events, she had to resort to the online dating realm.

 

Ironically, like most women, they like to "Play it off" as if they didn't "resort" to cyber dating as they already have opportunities in real life to meet men as it is.

 

Another on OK Cupid is of the same situation. No problem having men approach her, no problem with receiving offers, etc. But she found online dating to be the better option as it increases her options.

 

I mean, if you're so superficial that you have no interest in the dating pool locally, then you're just better off staying unattached and staying home if you're not open to ANY men you meet at REAL LIFE social gatherings.

[Antares]

Personally I'm about to give up on OLD.

 

I've had a profile on Match and Okc off and on over the years. I've gone on, oh jeez, I dunno...50 dates in the last 3 years from them alone. (I reactivate my profile when I'm not seeing anyone) At first I was pretty bad at it. I went on a few dates here and there. And was stood up - with out any word from them - about 5 times that first year.

 

I typically message them on experiences, travels, passions, career choice. I don't really ever ask questions regarding things they like, such as music, movies, or things they've read...as those topics can be loved by anyone in life. Just because two people like the same band, doesn't really mean they would be a good match. Although...sharing those things are always a great thing.

 

But to get real responses, I typically ask for things about them, things that have happened to them, the experiences they've had and how it's shaped their lives. Because I'm ultimately looking for someone to share my life with, I figure that's important. Sounds deep, but I keep it light & friendly, very short and to the point. And the messages are a little templated, so I don't have to rewrite a 100 new original messages every month.

 

And so...I get a fair amount of message responses. Some lead to dates, some just one response, some...just say how much they liked reading my message and wish they got more like it...but unfortunately don't think we're much of a match. (LOL)

 

After a round of messages, to make sure that they're not crazy or fakes or have red flags (And I've met a few of those too, lol) I ask for their number, and ask them to meet for drinks. Or sometimes a day date to walk around the museum, or something similar.

 

And with all of that...I'm about to give it all up. I've had far more dates from Okc than Match. In fact, I rarely get responses from Match at all, and it sucks because it's a pay site. In fact, I really hate their entire pay structure. You never know if the person you're messaging is a paid subscriber, and most likely they're not. So what happens is Match uses your message to invite them to become a real member. Nice Trick, huh? I pay Match to be a sales tool for them. But to the ones that I do know read my message and still do not respond, I dunno...my overall feeling from Match is that it's very PICKY. Perhaps because people are paying for it, they feel they're allowed to be picky. (Not to knock pickiness. We have picky attributes. Just that Match, seems overly so)

 

That said, my longest relationship from OLD, and the one that brought me to this site and the woman that I still think about, came from Match. Go figure.

 

Lately..I've just been bored to tears with the entire process. And perhaps, because I'm still thinking about the ex a bit, I'm tired of it all. Tired of sitting there searching thru profiles. Tired of feeling like I'm 'shopping online' Tired of the single-serving dates that, that seem great during the date - where a connection is made, and end with a kiss/a little make-out, but I never hear from them again. And I'm fine with rejection, I'm realistic, but damn...all that process just to get no where. Haha. It's tiring.

 

I've always had a tough time getting to know new people. I'm in my early 30s, introverted and OLD was a great way to get over that and meet new people. But I done with it. Last weekend I just deleted my Match profile and I'm about to do the same with OKc.

 

My other observances:

• Women get bombarded with messages - A good majority of them seem to be copy/paste, creepy, crude, misspelled, sexual, and boring. And to be honest, it's the last one there, boring, that's the real sin. That said, the girls I've spoken to have mentioned being very creeped out by the others as well and that makes them leave the site very quickly.

• That said, some women can be just as weird and creepy when writing a new message as men. (I've gotten loads of messages from woman, trying to initiate a conversation, that are horrible at it, in all the same ways that men sometimes are. Probably from lack of practice at initiating a conversation)

• Some women aren't really looking to date from OLD - they're just there for the ego boost and to see what happens, or just not taking it seriously at all.

• Some profiles are complete fakes, or for spam sites.

• The crazies are usually easy to identify. Trust your gut.

• Don't waste time, ask them out sooner rather than later. Make your move. Don't spend weeks writing to them back and forth.

 

• Lastly...I know 3 separate people who met from both of these sites and are now married or will be soon. So I guess it works.

[ZipperZapper]

Funny how you mentioned this, Hellineaux, there's a few women I had seen profiles of...one of them recently on OK Cupid , another I am a real life acquaintance of.

 

One is on POF

 

She is a big city socialite, a major participant in some of Social Meetup groups, and so on. In her profile she states, "I have no problem getting dates, no I have problem meeting men or even receiving offers for dates, I just come to this site in order to meet quality men or men that I have an interest in"

 

Then she rather snobbishly adds:

 

"If you already know me, there's no need to say hello to me here".

 

This pretty much states that out of TONS of single men she's met at the Meetup Singles Mixers, and other REAL LIFE events, she had to resort to the online dating realm.

 

Ironically, like most women, they like to "Play it off" as if they didn't "resort" to cyber dating as they already have opportunities in real life to meet men as it is.

 

Another on OK Cupid is of the same situation. No problem having men approach her, no problem with receiving offers, etc. But she found online dating to be the better option as it increases her options.

 

I mean, if you're so superficial that you have no interest in the dating pool locally, then you're just better off staying unattached and staying home if you're not open to ANY men you meet at REAL LIFE social gatherings.

 

 

Same old story, a lot of women are only interested in the top 20% of the male population, but wouldn't have anything to offer such men in the first place. This is why I stand by my assertion that most women use OLD as a tool to try and get the partners they could never get in real life.

 

It's a big reason why they have a profile up forever and endlessly search, and will someday wonder why they never found anyone. The answer to that 'never found anyone' question is that he was always standing right in front of her but she didn't think he was sufficiently perfect enough to bother with.

 

Further, OLD creates a horribly lopsided situation where the women sometimes get the man they want, or not at all, while the guys either go without, or have to take what little they can get instead of a partner who is really well suited to them.

 

In other words, OLD means lots of losers and very few winners. And by 'losers' I mean losers in the sense of people who lose out due to circumstances beyond their control, not people who actually are losers.

 

I got lucky a few days ago and met someone online who seems to be very nice and have her head screwed on reasonably well, and we've made plans to meet up in a couple of days. Time will tell if my first impressions were accurate or not and whether my hopes were misplaced.

[MrCastle]

OLD rarely works because it tries to put a logical spin on something totally illogical. Love/dating.

 

People are obviously only agreeing to dates with people they think are a match on paper, but often times, it doesn't work out. Despite the person they decided giving a chance to checking off all or most of the qualities they looked for. Because the most important factor in dating is the x factor, the "it" factor, if you will. The factor that make us fall in love with people who may not even be our usual type.

 

I don't blame men or women for handling OLD the way they do. They are doing what's logical. But it doesn't mean it will work. It often doesn't.

[irc333]

Don't get me wrong, I think I had some success in receiving responses and dates (first dates) THIS year than previous years.

 

 

Anyhow, I used to find it remarkable how I'd get a bit more excited than usual when I'd see a woman who shares the same hobbies that aren't entirely popular with women in the first place....like Sci-Fi and Geeky stuff....only to have them be unresponsive.

 

I met a few women that what I was looking for that matched me in interests, moral standing/values, belief systems, religion, etc....that I'd actually get excited to repsonding to them specificallly as opposed to the typical, "Life's to short to sweat the small stuff" or "LIfe life to the fullest" cliche'd profiles I'm used to seeing.

 

Only to STILL not get a response.

 

I mean, if you understand some small, obscure Monty Python reference they've written in their profile....and they end it with, "You get brownie points if you get that line from that movie"...and you actually get it right....and still no response or "Sorry I don't think we'd make a good match".

 

It kind of boggles your mind, because you KNOW she would've liked you and dated you if you met her at a Comic Con. LOL

 

THat's just an extreme example, but you know what I mean.

 

OLD rarely works because it tries to put a logical spin on something totally illogical. Love/dating.

 

People are obviously only agreeing to dates with people they think are a match on paper, but often times, it doesn't work out. Despite the person they decided giving a chance to checking off all or most of the qualities they looked for. Because the most important factor in dating is the x factor, the "it" factor, if you will. The factor that make us fall in love with people who may not even be our usual type.

 

I don't blame men or women for handling OLD the way they do. They are doing what's logical. But it doesn't mean it will work. It often doesn't.

[Kate9292]

80% below average? What?

 

It's possible.

 

If you have numbers like 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 2 10, their average is 2 and 80% of numbers are below it, 10% is average and 10% is above average. Count yourself if you don't believe it.

 

And no, I don't think women are overlooking men too much. If they aren't attracted to said men, it's best not to force anything and look for a proper match.