KissMyTiara Posted January 4, 2005 Share Posted January 4, 2005 I've been reading a ton of posts lately where the betrayed spouse is getting advice from others where it is suggested that the BS demand that the wayward spouse eliminate all contact with the OW/OM before beginning to repair the damage done to the marriage by the affair. This seems so odd to me. Really, what effect will this have? Sometimes, because of work/family/etc., absolute NC just isn't possible anyhow. And besides, by demanding NC, aren't you just treating a symptom, and not the root cause of the affair? It's not the OW/OM's fault all on her/his own that your spouse cheated...if it wasn't with THIS OW/OM, your spouse would have found another OW/OM... So, why not focus on what's going on inside your marriage instead of on the OW/OM? Link to post Share on other sites
Barby Posted January 4, 2005 Share Posted January 4, 2005 Maybe the "W" thinks that if the "temptress OW" isn't around the husband will be more apt to focusing fully on repairing their marriage. Maybe this is what he tells her. I'm sure anyone would feel the same..why would she want to be okay with him contacting someone he cheated on her with? What sense does that make? I'm neither a "scorned Wife" or an "OW" so I'm not really qualified to say anything other than my opinion but I'm interested in hearing from other's on this as well. Link to post Share on other sites
Debster Posted January 4, 2005 Share Posted January 4, 2005 My husband (reading over my shoulder) blurted out that it would be the first step to earning trust. I agree. Not only is my husband sexy but he is also smart. Link to post Share on other sites
michelangelo Posted January 4, 2005 Share Posted January 4, 2005 Ok, it's like this. A spouse is a boozer. So you refuse to keep beer in the fridge even though you know they can stop off for a pint on the way home. Part of insisting they have no contact is in them agreeing to do something for you, not the other person or themself. Link to post Share on other sites
LucreziaBorgia Posted January 4, 2005 Share Posted January 4, 2005 It is hard to focus attention on fixing the problems in the marriage when the OW or OM is still in the picture. As long as the attention is divided, it cannot be fully focused in the way that it needs to be in order to repair the marriage. Link to post Share on other sites
Author KissMyTiara Posted January 4, 2005 Author Share Posted January 4, 2005 Analogous to boozing... First step to earning back trust... Got it. Link to post Share on other sites
StillHurtin Posted January 4, 2005 Share Posted January 4, 2005 I have to agree. It's easier to get the M back and the trust back if the spouse has NC w/ the OP. In my situation things didn't actually get better (trust wise) until my H was no longer working w/ the OW. Having him see her and be around her 10 hours a day, 5 days a week was hard. I was always worried what they were saying or doing w/ one another. It was hard to trust him even though he was trying hard to proove to me that it was over between them. I guess I didn't trust the OW more than dh b/c I knew her, I seen how she acted towards H and even other MM. She had no morals. Didn't care if a man was M or not (her words and I know I am repeating this to you KMT, sorry). Link to post Share on other sites
Owl Posted January 4, 2005 Share Posted January 4, 2005 While I may be stereotyping, its usually darned hard for most people to truly "love" more than one person at a time. By love I mean a SO. It's hard to invest that much intimacy in more than one person...so they usually spend most of their time investing it in one or the other...usually the OM/OW. That's normally the first indicator that a betrayed spouse has....the loss or lessening of intimacy with their spouse. So it makes sense that the OM/OW has to be out of the picture for the intimacy to return back to the spouse. You hear a lot of the people who've had the affair comment how they couldn't see how much they loved their spouse while they were concentrating on their OM/OW. This is why. And you'll hear people talking about affairs being an addiction. It's true...look at how many people we've seen on LS time and time again re-involve themselves with someone after they've given the affair up. From what I saw of my wife's affair ( I know you don't agree it was an affair, KMT), that was certainly the case. For about three weeks after it ended, she was in withdrawl. Wanted contact with him...crying every nite...it was hell for all of us. But, she got over it, and things turned around immediately. They say it takes 3-4 weeks to break a habit at least... So of course we're going to want the WS to steer clear of the addiction...that same "alcohol" comment earlier... And the comment about trust is right on. How else could the betrayed spouse begin to rebuild trust? If they're in constant contact with the OM, of course the BS is going to constantly fear that they're going to give in to that "temptation" again. After all, the WS did so once, did they not? What better way to prove your intentions than to sever all ties with that one person. Link to post Share on other sites
blind_otter Posted January 4, 2005 Share Posted January 4, 2005 Originally posted by KissMyTiara I've been reading a ton of posts lately where the betrayed spouse is getting advice from others where it is suggested that the BS demand that the wayward spouse eliminate all contact with the OW/OM before beginning to repair the damage done to the marriage by the affair. This seems so odd to me. Really, what effect will this have? Sometimes, because of work/family/etc., absolute NC just isn't possible anyhow. And besides, by demanding NC, aren't you just treating a symptom, and not the root cause of the affair? It's not the OW/OM's fault all on her/his own that your spouse cheated...if it wasn't with THIS OW/OM, your spouse would have found another OW/OM... So, why not focus on what's going on inside your marriage instead of on the OW/OM? Circular logic. When I was trying to get clean from my drug problem, my therapist advised that I cut off all contact with every person that I associated with when I used drugs. You can't get clean unless you stop the lifestyle. Period. Link to post Share on other sites
Adunaphel Posted January 4, 2005 Share Posted January 4, 2005 What michelangelo and debster's husband said. Also, I think that whenever the H sees the OW (even if the affair is over) he re-opens a fresh wound for the wife. (I think many women would feel like the affair happened *yesterday* whenever their H sees the OW) If you keep re-opening wounds, they won't heal. Link to post Share on other sites
reservoirdog1 Posted January 4, 2005 Share Posted January 4, 2005 As long as the OP is in a WS's life when he/she is trying to reconcile, the OP is a cancer on the marriage. Getting rid of the OP from their life is the most basic demonstration of respect for the BS that the WS can do. If the WS is serious about reconciliation, shouldn't they be willing to make some sacrifices? Where I come from, you don't let a cancer hang around in your body in the hopes that everyone will get used to it. You cut it out. Link to post Share on other sites
MWC_LifeBeginsAt40 Posted January 4, 2005 Share Posted January 4, 2005 What if the marriage is beyond repair and we've already decided to part ways, only I had a couple of months before my new place of residence was ready? He wanted me to have no contact with the OM until I moved out. I thought that was dumb because we weren't trying to repair anything. I agreed, but couldn't do it and had contact a few times, but not like it was prior to agreeing to the split. Link to post Share on other sites
Owl Posted January 4, 2005 Share Posted January 4, 2005 Well... I can't think of a good reason that he'd want you to do that if you're not going to get back together unless it was to keep his own pain from knowing what you're doing to a minimum. Or maybe he was hoping that by you NOT having contact with the OM that it would cause you to pause and reflect on what you were doing. Link to post Share on other sites
sylviaguardian Posted January 5, 2005 Share Posted January 5, 2005 Originally posted by KissMyTiara I've been reading a ton of posts lately where the betrayed spouse is getting advice from others where it is suggested that the BS demand that the wayward spouse eliminate all contact with the OW/OM before beginning to repair the damage done to the marriage by the affair. This seems so odd to me. Really, what effect will this have? Sometimes, because of work/family/etc., absolute NC just isn't possible anyhow. And besides, by demanding NC, aren't you just treating a symptom, and not the root cause of the affair? It's not the OW/OM's fault all on her/his own that your spouse cheated...if it wasn't with THIS OW/OM, your spouse would have found another OW/OM... So, why not focus on what's going on inside your marriage instead of on the OW/OM? Ok - this is a very personal take on the whole thing but it's very pertinent to me at the moment. My h and I have been arguing non-stop for 6 months, although it has naturally tapered down. Our last big argument was the 24th of December. Throughout the holiday period we have not argued once. It was so lovely to be together with one another and not have any doubts about what he was doing etc. This is his first day back at work (beside the OW) and I woke up with my stomach churning and felt sick. Pretty much the same as I have felt right throught the last 6 months. When he was not at work I felt safe, when he is, I don't . It's as simple as that. We have taken steps to improve our marriage and are getting along much better etc but this still hangs over me like a black cloud when he is in the same building as this person. I don't think it's as simple as to say that you need to work on the things that caused the affair. Even if you do that, he had feelings for this person, he cared for her, he probably still does at some level. If he never saw her again, those feelings would probably die off. Just knowing that he cared for her a lot and that they are together at some points in the day still kills me. It's all about feeling safe enough to let the A become a thing of the past. Sylvia Link to post Share on other sites
StillHurtin Posted January 5, 2005 Share Posted January 5, 2005 QUOTE from KMT "It's not the OW/OM's fault all on her/his own that your spouse cheated...if it wasn't with THIS OW/OM, your spouse would have found another OW/OM... So, why not focus on what's going on inside your marriage instead of on the OW/OM? " In my own situation this is not true. H had friends who were women BUT these women were also my friends. We hung out as couples as they were married, living 2gether, or engaged. As long as H and I have been married and 2gehter he has never had a female friendship that didn't involve me being friends w/ her too. Granted, the OW tried to be friends w/ me but I knew from the start what type or person she was and I didn't want to be her friend. IMO, if H would of never met this backstabbing slut, b!tch, c@nt, homewrecking whore, he would of never had an A. She was the one who showed interest in him first, paid attention to him, blah, blah, blah, his stupid reasons why he strayed. Yes, women did flirt w/ him b4 the A, he would always tell me. I never seen a women flirt w/ him when I was around though. I think the women who did flirt w/ him were doing it out of fun, while the OW he had the A w/ had the intentions of getting him in bed. Link to post Share on other sites
Author KissMyTiara Posted January 6, 2005 Author Share Posted January 6, 2005 Originally posted by StillHurtin QUOTE from KMT "It's not the OW/OM's fault all on her/his own that your spouse cheated...if it wasn't with THIS OW/OM, your spouse would have found another OW/OM... So, why not focus on what's going on inside your marriage instead of on the OW/OM? " In my own situation this is not true. H had friends who were women BUT these women were also my friends. We hung out as couples as they were married, living 2gether, or engaged. As long as H and I have been married and 2gehter he has never had a female friendship that didn't involve me being friends w/ her too. Granted, the OW tried to be friends w/ me but I knew from the start what type or person she was and I didn't want to be her friend. IMO, if H would of never met this backstabbing slut, b!tch, c@nt, homewrecking whore, he would of never had an A. She was the one who showed interest in him first, paid attention to him, blah, blah, blah, his stupid reasons why he strayed. Yes, women did flirt w/ him b4 the A, he would always tell me. I never seen a women flirt w/ him when I was around though. I think the women who did flirt w/ him were doing it out of fun, while the OW he had the A w/ had the intentions of getting him in bed. Actually, in your situation, yes, my quote DOES apply. It is not that [your choice of explitives'] fault all on her own that your H cheated. It ALWAYS takes two to tango, does it not? It it wasn't this [again, your choice of explitives] that your H was going to cheat with, it was going to be with another OW who showed interest in him, paid attention, etc.. It sounds like you are explaining away your husband's cheating by focusing on how this woman flirted with him and paid attention to him. If that's all it takes, then watch your back. Link to post Share on other sites
michelangelo Posted January 6, 2005 Share Posted January 6, 2005 Well, in the perfect world spouses don't cheat and you can rely on their inner compass to guide them away from temptation. But since this is the real world, you can remind your spouse of the playground rules and kick out any tempresses there for whatever jollies they are after. There are people that enjoy dragging married people down for sport. They dress it up in "love" and other crap excuses, but they are intruding on a couple's life. If your spouse consistently cannot stand straight and to the narrow, then that is something to deal with for sure. But in the meantime, if there are flies on the plate, flick 'em off! Link to post Share on other sites
StillHurtin Posted January 7, 2005 Share Posted January 7, 2005 Originally posted by KissMyTiara Actually, in your situation, yes, my quote DOES apply. It is not that [your choice of explitives'] fault all on her own that your H cheated. It ALWAYS takes two to tango, does it not? It it wasn't this [again, your choice of explitives] that your H was going to cheat with, it was going to be with another OW who showed interest in him, paid attention, etc.. It sounds like you are explaining away your husband's cheating by focusing on how this woman flirted with him and paid attention to him. If that's all it takes, then watch your back. I agree, KMT, that it wasn't ALL the OW fault, it takes two. Seems funny though that she was the only one H chose to have an A w/ out of all the women that have flirted w/ H. She was the one that took it too far. She is the one who told him she was attracted to him, she was the one that kissed him first. She admitted to me that she doesn't care who she flirts w/ MM or single. If she wants something she will go after it. You may have seen me post this b4 but she said she can't go into a store and some women is glaring at her b/c she thinks she tried to take her H away from her and she laughed! I told her it wasn't funny. I think this gal is the way she is b/c of her self-esteem. She admitted that in the past she was shy, not outgoing and she has now changed and she is going to do whatever she feels like, going to be happy, ect. I think her flirting w/ MM (or single) boost up her self-esteem and she takes it too far. She was caught rubbing her boss's leg (b4 dh was her boss) one time. She was rubbing it clear up by his crotch. She has been seen by other co-workers grabbing men's crotches while working (and yes, they were MM) Women flirt w/ H and I have seen it w/ my own eyes, and if I am not around, he tells me. He never got involved w/ any of these women b/c they didn't go past the stage of flirting. It is hard to explain what I am trying to say. Hope it makes sense. H is a good looking man and I am not just saying that b/c I am his W. When my mother introduced him to her new minister at her church he said "Good lookin young man." My sil friends have told me how good lookin he is. When he met some old friends from school at my HS reunion some of the women said how good lookin he was. Anyhow, the OW didn't help him decide what he wanted to do w/ our M. She admitted to me that he didn't know what he wanted to do. She said he was confused. He wasn't happy, I wasn't happy, but yet deep down he couldn't decide whether or not he moved to fast about the D. He was trying to make a decision on what he was going to do w/ the rest of his life and the OW clouded his judgement by flirting, paying attention to him, showing him she was attracted to him. Yes, I blame both, she made the first move, and no she does not deny that one b/c I talked to her about it. She did all the running after him. If she wouldn't of maybe H didn't feel like he could get something out of her that was missing in his M. Wrong of him, yes, but she should of NEVER been hitting on a MM, even if he was happily married or not. And I am not saying KMT that every time a woman flirts w/ him he'll jump into the sack w/ her. I think he realized the hard way that he lost something (me and the kids) and didn't realize how much he loved and wanted us around until he screwed around. I don't think he will make that mistake again. And if he does, it will be the last time. And I wont be the nice stbxw like I was last time either. Link to post Share on other sites
blind_otter Posted January 7, 2005 Share Posted January 7, 2005 Seek validation, it's fine, but don't disguise it as an attempt at an effort to reach a logical conclusion. If you want to quit your addiction, you remove yourself from the lifestyle. Period. I was talking to my buddy last night, he was telling me about a past GF found out about his most recent ex. I said, why is it you always tell the one you're cheating with but not the one you're cheating on....he said, simple - it's a manipulative tool for him. He makes OW feel special by confiding in her, parts of the truth, or whatever he feels like, so that she'll "understand" when he has to spend time with his GF. Gawd, he is such a dog. All men are, of course. Having male friends definatley makes me paranoid. Link to post Share on other sites
Owl Posted January 7, 2005 Share Posted January 7, 2005 Originally posted by blind_otter Gawd, he is such a dog. All men are, of course. AM NOT!!!!!!!!!!!!! Link to post Share on other sites
qhadirach Posted May 26, 2005 Share Posted May 26, 2005 i wasn't in a marriage when it happened to me, but it was pretty serious, the talk of kids and marriage and such. in the end she was still hanging out with this guy. he was a 'friend' and her friends were like family. and all kinds of rationalizations, such as "nothing bad came of this except between us". granted her main excuse was always being drunk. and for the longest time i was paranoid. eventually i found out i was right. and even from a guys perspective........if it was just sex then it really didn't matter, there should be no problem removing the other person from contact. completely. cause it does hurt and when its there trust will be impossible to rebuild. if they are keeping them around it is for a reason. Link to post Share on other sites
Sal Paradise Posted May 26, 2005 Share Posted May 26, 2005 Originally posted by KissMyTiara I've been reading a ton of posts lately where the betrayed spouse is getting advice from others where it is suggested that the BS demand that the wayward spouse eliminate all contact with the OW/OM before beginning to repair the damage done to the marriage by the affair. This seems so odd to me. Really, what effect will this have? Sometimes, because of work/family/etc., absolute NC just isn't possible anyhow. And besides, by demanding NC, aren't you just treating a symptom, and not the root cause of the affair? It's not the OW/OM's fault all on her/his own that your spouse cheated...if it wasn't with THIS OW/OM, your spouse would have found another OW/OM... So, why not focus on what's going on inside your marriage instead of on the OW/OM? Whether of not it was the OW/OM fault is irrelevant. This isn't about punishing the OW/OM (even if it was who gives a crap about their feelings? Their feelings are irrelevant). The reason for the NC is trust. The person who was cheated on will have a much easier time rebuilding trust if they know their SO isn't still seeing the OW/OM. Furthermore it is often the only way to bring the SO out of the fog of the affair and break the cycle of addiction. And there are very few instances where NC cannot be achieved. Even in most cases where it is work related, if your SO really cares about you they should be willing to find another job in order to repair the damage they caused. Link to post Share on other sites
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