I don't contact her sometimes when I want too

[Realist3]

I think a missing piece in your longterm thinking, which is what seems to be omitted when people try to cake eat/have it both ways, is that you make this gamble because you want to stay married and have a gf and you believe that you're being somewhat "responsible" and a "long term thinker" by trying to minimize not getting caught....

 

Yet, most people cannot guarantee that they won't get caught. So let's say you acknowledge this. You cannot 100% make sure you don't get caught, so IF you do, would it have been worth it?

 

I'm not trying to be self-righteous or saintly. I'm actually asking a question based on strategy and making investments and what is worth it in the long run. Cheating is usually very short-sighted. Thinking about not getting caught so that people's lives aren't ruined isn't really a solid long term plan, it's a short term bandaid based on your desire to still be in the affair. But if you were in fact thinking long term and assessing risks and benefits and the potential to get caught, the affair couldn't possibly win as a solid plan now for the long term or for the larger good. I would just admit it is selfish and leave it at that, as trying to spin it as some smart choice based on long term thoughts makes no sense. When I was in the A I wanted what I wanted and that was the end of story....I actually cannot at all relate to the need to justify and explain to everyone why what I was doing was some kind of not that bad thing. I knew how people would think of it and it was okay with me at the time because it met my need for gratification.

 

Of course it is selfish, but in the affair situation people can certainly make smart decisions and bad decisions. His decisions, which he says his MOW is on the same page with is a smart decision in terms of that relationship. Hiding stuff is easy. Hiding emotions is not.

[BlueBobby]

I've already said it was selfish. I'm not saying its not at all, just saying just because its selfish doesn't mean I'm only thinking of myself. I think about everyone involved.

[BlueBobby]

Of course it is selfish, but in the affair situation people can certainly make smart decisions and bad decisions. His decisions, which he says his MOW is on the same page with is a smart decision in terms of that relationship. Hiding stuff is easy. Hiding emotions is not.

 

Exactly. I can delete text messages but I can't hide my smile after talking to her, so sometimes I choose not to contact her, even when I want to, with that thought in mind.

[Realist3]

Exactly. I can delete text messages but I can't hide my smile after talking to her, so sometimes I choose not to contact her, even when I want to, with that thought in mind.

 

It is a huge part of the affair dynamic that many people don't seem to understand, especially single OW's. I'm glad you are on the same page with it, because just to be left guessing is hell. After a bit of time I could always tell what was going on, but it didn't make it any more pleasant, until we crossed that bridge last year.

[whichwayisup]

Maybe I missed it, but I didn't read where the OP asked for any advice/judgments on what he is currently doing. All he did was offer up his point of view on the subject of restricting contact.

 

Then why post on a forum? People are allowed to give their 2 cents worth. If he didn't want discussion or anybody to reply at all, why even bother posting to begin with? What others have said should make him at least stop and really think, it's a positive thing not a negative thing to hear what others have to say.

[whichwayisup]

I'm not drained at all by it if I keep control. It fulfills me, doesn't deplete me.

 

Of course, because it's all about you. Why not come clean and tell your wife, discuss an open marriage so she can have an OM on the side as well? Would you be okay with that if she chose to go outside of the marriage and get her needs met by someone else? Or would you feel hurt, jealous and angry?

 

You hold all the cards, you have all the information and your wife is in the dark, thinking that she is the only one in your life.

[Realist3]

Then why post on a forum? People are allowed to give their 2 cents worth. If he didn't want discussion or anybody to reply at all, why even bother posting to begin with? What others have said should make him at least stop and really think, it's a positive thing not a negative thing to hear what others have to say.

 

You know how this goes. Someone posts about an aspect of their affair, and they get a ton of responses telling them how bad they are for their decisions, etc., etc. etc..

 

People are certainly allowed to give their 2 cents worth on the topic the OP decided to post about. The OP's post was an explanation or viewpoint of why contact is limited at times, not whether he should be in the affair in the first place. The topic the OP brought up is a very common recurring issue of contention around here, and it was from a MM no less, which is rare. So instead of a discussion about the topic he posted about it turns into an attack on him about his choices to have the affair. It distracts from the topic at hand.

[tchrgrl]

I believe that people post on here to view the opinions of others and to really think about what was said whether positive or negative. I sometimes wonder if the people that comment are so impacted by what happened to them that they can't see what the OP was saying. We all know it's selfish and unfair to have an affair and not come clean to BS but to think that people don't care about the BS or their children is really not the truth at all. Those of us having an A most certainly think about the fall out and what will happen to all those we are hurting. Just like the mother that picks up the crack pipe knowing what the impact it will have on her kids....affairs are addictions and people come here for support!

[Cocochai]

The thing is there doesn't have to be a fall out. She is married too, and isn't alone. We need to enjoy the time we get together but focus on our families when we are with our families. That's actually protecting everyone.

 

Of course it would be awesome to see her everyday and talk everyday but then our families would crumble and we are left to fix that.

 

Sometimes I'm sure guys are just being dicks when they are not contacting, but sometimes they are just being careful.

 

I wish it was just that simple BlueBobby. Woman in general are emotional by nature (in most but not all cases) and, even if your OMW loves her BS, if she's emotionally connected to you and less from him, then your in trouble if all your looking for is a fling.

 

I dint understand how MM can go into an A w/out realizing that if you create an emotional bond.... Someone's feelings are going to get hurt if you as the MM is only looking for good times away from the home.

 

Unless your planning to leave your BS, you may want to think things over about having this A if you know she wants more.

[soundsfamilar]

i agree with cocochai. the emotional fallout is crushing for the OW, if she falls in love with you...

[Cocochai]

I wish it was just that simple BlueBobby. Woman in general are emotional by nature (in most but not all cases) and, even if your OMW loves her BS, if she's emotionally connected to you and less from him, then your in trouble if all your looking for is a fling.

 

I dint understand how MM can go into an A w/out realizing that if you create an emotional bond.... Someone's feelings are going to get hurt if you as the MM is only looking for good times away from the home.

 

Unless your planning to leave your BS, you may want to think things over about having this A if you know she wants more.

 

I meant how SOME MM can have an A with out thinking the OW/OMW won't want more eventually.

[Quiet Storm]

Ya it's a public service announcement lol! I just read every time I come that women question everything because of a couple days no contact.

ASK him why he's not contacting you. If you are scared to ask because you think any pressure from your side will make him crack and end the affair then that guys probably a dick anyway, and you can do better. If you don't ask you will go on wondering forever and ya things will probably end bad.

My girl has talked to me about it and we are on the same page. She still worries sometimes I'm sure but if she nagged me I'd end it, but I wouldn't end what I have with her just because she needed a little reassurance.

 

 

For single ow, however, I don't think this would be reassuring. Married ow get the routine of marriage and the risk factors, but most still want to feel connected and bonded. An explanation may provide a reason but it doesn't fill the hole.

 

People have needs in a relationship. A single ow usually doesn't have other men around to meet her needs. She needs the contact and communication to feel connected and loved.

 

Saying "I'm thinking of you but can't contact you" doesn't change the fact that her needs are neglected. I think it would just be another reminder of what his priorities are. Ow is supposed to sacrifice and tolerate whatever, to keep mms life intact. Of course most ow know and accept these limitations because the guy is married, but they may not be able to be sustained on crumbs forever. It's just not enough nourishment to continue indefinitely for most people.

 

I think your post illustrates the mindset of most cheating men, regardless of whether or not their ow is married or single. They see the affair as an extra, an indulgence and the marriage is the constant. They aren't looking to leave home, just to enhance their life. And they will put in the minimal effort required to keep both. They see their wife and the other woman as things that need to managed. Wife getting hurt, ow feeling neglected are just aggravations that will be worked around. These pesky women are always inconveniencing me with their feelings! Let me just reassure them so they go back to knowing their roles.

 

No introspection, no desire to resolve the problems, no personal integrity, no problem betraying those they claim to love....just figuring out ways to keep both as long as possible.

Edited December 30, 2013 by Quiet Storm

[tryingto]

I think your post illustrates the mindset of most cheating men, regardless of whether or not their ow is married or single. They see the affair as an extra, an indulgence and the marriage is the constant. They aren't looking to leave home, just to enhance their life. And they will put in the minimal effort required to keep both. They see their wife and the other woman as things that need to managed. Wife getting hurt, ow feeling neglected are just aggravations that will be worked around.

 

My personal experience, exactly (although I didn't know it at the time)!!! I wish I could "like" this 100 times!!

[Ruffian1]

my wife wants to stay married.

 

Then tell her about your A. Does she think you are faithfull??

 

Are you the biological father of your children? I am guess so, that there is no question.

 

How hurt would you be if you found out they were not??

 

Would you rather not know if they were not your kids??

How about she kept that a secret from you.

Oh, but no, that would be soooo wrong.

 

It is ok for you to use your W (being deceptive) but not the other way around. What is good for the goose is not good for the gander??

 

Okay, got it. Your A and your rationalizations are as common as dirt.

(Yawn)

 

Good luck with that.

[BlueBobby]

Long story short, my wife knows I want us have an open relationship. I'd be fine with her getting both sexual and emotional extras on the side.

 

And my other woman, she already loves me, and I love her too, not looking for a fling, I hope we know each other the rest of our lives, affair or not, we are great friends.

[BlueBobby]

My wife does not know I'm in an affair, she would be wild if she did, she would especially hate me for who the affair is with, I already know all that.

I more was talking about my other woman here, not my wife. That could be another thread I guess. I don't mind people thinking I'm an *******, you don't know me and I'm not sugar coating anything for you.

[violet1]

Ya it's a public service announcement lol! I just read every time I come that women question everything because of a couple days no contact.

ASK him why he's not contacting you. If you are scared to ask because you think any pressure from your side will make him crack and end the affair then that guys probably a dick anyway, and you can do better. If you don't ask you will go on wondering forever and ya things will probably end bad.

My girl has talked to me about it and we are on the same page. She still worries sometimes I'm sure but if she nagged me I'd end it, but I wouldn't end what I have with her just because she needed a little reassurance.

 

Do you see her often? I rarely saw my exMOM. If he didn't contact me daily, I would have lost interest. I told him from day one that I needed consistent communication. He always followed through because our needs matched. He loved the daily communication too. If you and your MOW are content with your arrangements that's what matters. Honestly, there's no way I could have handled not hearing from my exMOM for a month when my affair was active. The longest we went without was maybe 4 days.

 

The problem is a lot of MM do leave their OWs hanging. The communication is very high at first then drops suddenly. That's difficult to deal with, especially for a single OW. You also have to remember the affair dynamics are very different for an OW than it is for an MOW. I do think the OW's here who get upset about minimum contact have a right to feel that way.

[violet1]

My wife does not know I'm in an affair, she would be wild if she did, she would especially hate me for who the affair is with, I already know all that.

I more was talking about my other woman here, not my wife. That could be another thread I guess. I don't mind people thinking I'm an *******, you don't know me and I'm not sugar coating anything for you.

 

The only issue I have with your situation is that you all are close friends. I think double betrayals are pretty cruel. Of course your wife would be pissed if she found out you were f'in her best friend. I also do think it's cruel of your OW as well, but to each their own. Sleeping with friend's wives is just something I'll personally never understand.

[BlueBobby]

Do you see her often? I rarely saw my exMOM. If he didn't contact me daily, I would have lost interest. I told him from day one that I needed consistent communication. He always followed through because our needs matched. He loved the daily communication too. If you and your MOW are content with your arrangements that's what matters. Honestly, there's no way I could have handled not hearing from my exMOM for a month when my affair was active. The longest we went without was maybe 4 days.

 

The problem is a lot of MM do leave their OWs hanging. The communication is very high at first then drops suddenly. That's difficult to deal with, especially for a single OW. You also have to remember the affair dynamics are very different for an OW than it is for an MOW. I do think the OW's here who get upset about minimum contact have a right to feel that way.

 

Oh ya we see each other several times throughout the week. We don't get to be alone a lot but we see each other and talk to each other a lot. I dont mean I hold back on our private communications, and never for an entire month or week, we talk inbetween, just different. If she texted me, I would text back but keep it clean. She knows the drill.

I'd love the daily communication too but that seemed to make it harder on both of us. We still talk all day sometimes, but stressful times at home come up and we both back off a bit, I know it's easier for me to back off than her, but in the long run it helps both of us and she has agreed with me when I talk to her about it.

[BlueBobby]

The only issue I have with your situation is that you all are close friends. I think double betrayals are pretty cruel. Of course your wife would be pissed if she found out you were f'in her best friend. I also do think it's cruel of your OW as well, but to each their own. Sleeping with friend's wives is just something I'll personally never understand.

 

I think it's pretty easy to understand how it could happen. I am around her a lot and she's around me, we like all the same things and are intensly attracted to one another, I think it was meant to happen.

It's worse than a stranger affair of course but I've had casual affairs in the past, this is very different.

Someone asked if it was worth it, the casual ones, no, but this time? Yes. Worth it.

[violet1]

I think it's pretty easy to understand how it could happen. I am around her a lot and she's around me, we like all the same things and are intensly attracted to one another, I think it was meant to happen.

It's worse than a stranger affair of course but I've had casual affairs in the past, this is very different.

Someone asked if it was worth it, the casual ones, no, but this time? Yes. Worth it.

 

I understand how social circle affairs happen. I just don't understand how a person can sleep with a friend's spouse and not feel bad, but that's just me. No judgements, it's your life to live.

 

My H cheated on me years ago. I know for me, I would have never forgiven him if the OW was a friend or someone I knew. When I cheated, I sought out my affair. I made sure my lover was someone noone knew. I had opportunities to engage in work and social circle affairs and I avoided them like the plague. It was crazy how much my guy and I had in common. He and I used to text the same thing at the same time and finish each other's sentences. It was a very emotional affair and I do miss him like crazy. I don't regret the affair or meeting him, but it's not something I hope to ever do again. It does sound like you are more of a polyamorous individual though. If your MOW decided this is too much for her and wanted to end it, do you think you'd search for another OW?

[whichwayisup]

I think it's pretty easy to understand how it could happen. I am around her a lot and she's around me, we like all the same things and are intensly attracted to one another, I think it was meant to happen.

It's worse than a stranger affair of course but I've had casual affairs in the past, this is very different.

Someone asked if it was worth it, the casual ones, no, but this time? Yes. Worth it.

 

So it seems you have boundary issues, since you've had affairs in the past.

 

Hell, I say come clean with your wife since you really want an open marriage and doing as you please. Or are you afraid of losing all that you have? Comforts of home life, a house, your wife's love, affection and respect? I am glad you're being honest on here but please, listen to what others are trying to tell you as well. Yes I get that you know what you're doing is selfish and you want what you want and are getting your needs met by two women, and now you say that it's worth it...

 

What is your end goal? the bigger picture here? To have this continue for the rest of your life? to wait until you're busted and you lose all that you worked hard for?

[dreamingoftigers]

Little bit of both. The more we talk or text the more I think about her when I should be thinking about and doing other things. The more I keep a handle on it, and we hold back contact until we have more time, to have a fulfilling conversation and not a million other things going on the better it is.

I mean a text here or there is fine and totally doable. But one text leads to ten, leads to 100. My mind gets cloudy, I start doing the what if game, the same as she probably does too. The more contact the more chance of slipping up and not deleting something or for one of us to send a text at the wrong time too.

 

I'm not ignoring her, I do still contact her and I've told her all this too.

I don't play hot and cold as a way to **** with her head like some people think men are doing to their other women.

I love her. I just love my wife and family too and I want to keep them all.

This isn't love.

 

You get good feelings from all of them so you keep them around like drugs stashes.

 

Crack on Monday, meth on Wednesday, heroin on Friday to calm things down.

 

So Bobby, when do people stop being things for you to use?

And where were you role-modeled the idea that this was ever okay?

[dreamingoftigers]

I'm not drained at all by it if I keep control. It fulfills me, doesn't deplete me.

 

Reminds me of every addict I've ever known.

 

So, what shame are you trying to drown out?

Ever wonder why you do what you do? The real motivation beyond "it feels good in the moment."

[dreamingoftigers]

I'm not drained at all by it if I keep control. It fulfills me, doesn't deplete me.

 

In fact, you are attempting to use this forum as a method of control. Using it as an indirect way to communicate with your OW to keep quiet and underlining how important she is but that her silence is more important. Also making it clear (in an indirect way) that you hold the strong to this relationship and contact and connection happens on your time, when you feel like it. And that's it. But you'll happily string her along as an option. But only as you hold the reigns.

 

Again, this isn't love.