WS- truth, lies and spying.

[dichotomy]

Tough times again right now. Major job stress, abusive environment at work, lots of overtime over the holidays, and I am desperately applying and interviewing for a new job to get out by end of January ....and I have pulled back in the last month from being "super husband/dad" and let wife handle home and kids more than she is used to - not fair to her when she has two weeks off - and she resents it.

 

But the real issue facing us over the years, from dDay till now. I have struggled to understand my WW, from spying, to two different therapists. I have tried to understand her past with OM and other men, her sexuality, her beliefs, her joys and needs, what she was in the past and what she is....and it eludes me. I think it eludes her. If I did not know any better I would say she suffers from some personality disorder. I know some of her past better then she does - and often I find her saying something happened years ago ....that I know did not happen that way....but she really believes what she says.

 

Two therapist have been unable to "pin her down" on anything. She contradicts herself form session to session and seems unable to explain to them. Its not just the old EA - all WS deny and minimize that stuff - but its more who she is ....and they seem puzzled as I do.

 

With a recent nose dive in our sex life, and this being a "trigger time" historically one of two special times a year OM would interact or call her...I ramped up spying. Sorry but I did it.

 

No..my spying did not find any trace of OM - but I did find she is hiding her feelings and thoughts again and is unhappy with me, our sex life, and other things. It was harsh and mean ....what she is thinking and saying - i am hurt to have heard this...and yes maybe I just caught her venting ...but we have been in extensive MC this last year...why not be honest, why not put it out there? Face it, deal with it.

 

I still struggle all these years to know who and what she is....and I sometimes wonder if she knows - if she understands who she is and was. Sometimes when someone lies, hides, denies, they themselves seem to be unclear about things.

 

and so the latest - she came back from a solo session with MC (i thought it might help for her to be honest without me there)...and she comes back saying MC told her she needs "an adventure" so she plans a two week road trip to her old part of the country where she used to live. She wants me and the kids with her for part of the trip but not the rest.

 

We have connected - in loving ways - for notable periods of our marriage and for this I have remained committed, but it seems to have been such a roller coaster ....and so much work I have poured into this. I just don;t know anymore - and sounds like my wife now feels the same. I will try to address - fix - what I found out is bothering her - IF it really is whats bothering her (but again is what she says when I am not around really the truth?).

 

I am not sure I am looking for any advice, I pay a highly qualified therapist for that, but I just need to vent I guess. This recent month, and really 2013 has been a tough year. I am worried about loss now on both job and marriage.

Edited December 31, 2013 by dichotomy

[road]

and so the latest - she came back from a solo session with MC (i thought it might help for her to be honest without me there)...and she comes back saying MC told her she needs "an adventure" so she plans a two week road trip to her old part of the country where she used to live. She wants me and the kids with her for part of the trip but not the rest.

 

 

I am not sure I am looking for any advice, I pay a highly qualified therapist for that, but I just need to vent I guess. This recent month, and really 2013 has been a tough year. I am worried about loss now on both job and marriage.

 

 

 

Having a certificate may make her qualified therapist though it does not make her competent.

 

 

Your WW is showing all kinds of red flags that she is in an affair or about to restart one. And your highly qualified therapist told her to go off alone to find herself.

 

 

Your WW got her HQT to give her a hall pass so she can go bang the brains out of some OM.

 

 

WW is withdrawing, sex down the toilet, and you know there is an affair on the horizon because you snooped.

 

 

You found nothing because your WW knows how you snooped in the past so she is not using her old ways to contact OM.

 

 

This is why a BH must never ever reveal how they caught their WW. Even if they recover the marriage because too many WW's back slide years later.

[lilmisscantbewrong]

Having a certificate may make her qualified therapist though it does not make her competent.

 

 

Your WW is showing all kinds of red flags that she is in an affair or about to restart one. And your highly qualified therapist told her to go off alone to find herself.

 

 

Your WW got her HQT to give her a hall pass so she can go bang the brains out of some OM.

 

 

WW is withdrawing, sex down the toilet, and you know there is an affair on the horizon because you snooped.

 

 

You found nothing because your WW knows how you snooped in the past so she is not using her old ways to contact OM.

 

 

This is why a BH must never ever reveal how they caught their WW. Even if they recover the marriage because too many WW's back slide years later.

 

This is not necessarily true. During the first year of recovery for me I needed space - and I wasn't contacting my ap! I went with my sister to Florida for a few days and also to visit her with my brother. My husband was very kind and allowed me that - I needed it - and it really did provide perspective for me.

 

I am a huge believer that our childhood experiences very much create who we are and why we make the choices we make. Some of us are pretty messed up because of it. And I don't know if we all completely recover from it. We have to discover the "whys" - why we had the affair - otherwise it will happen again. And it is not always about constant monitoring - that solves nothing.

 

For you to say that she is in an affair is wrong - you don't know that. It sounds like she is dealing with some major stuff and is doing the best she can.

 

Just because a therapist doesn't follow the Harley way of doing things doesn't mean they aren't qualified. Not all of us subscribe to Harley's thoughts and ideas.

 

Dichotomy - I think for you, you have to decide how much you can take. You have really tried recovery and it appears you really do love your wife, however it also seems like you are getting lost in all of this - weary and tired. If you decided enough is enough, then I'm not sure anyone would blame you. Maybe your constant monitoring is not helping anymore make you feel safe and you have to let that go? I don't know - it appears it's making you more paranoid than if you didn't do it?

 

I hate this time of year - I really, really do. It is so hard for many people.

 

I feel for you and I hope you find some relief and hope in the new year.

Edited December 31, 2013 by lilmisscantbewrong

[dichotomy]

Road,

 

Thanks for looking out for me - I know this is the point of your reply. My wife is aware from long ago dDay that I monitored the computer (FB, Emails). This is part of how I busted her.

 

However she is unaware of the all the methods I have - which his how I caught her complaining about our sex life and marriage and me. I have more things I can or will do if necessary to confirm she is not sliding back or about to slide back into seeing OM or other past men. I will not reveal these methods.

 

I know this therapist failry well after a year and she has said and done some very wonderful things to my wife about her old affair and about her getting her sex drive back for me. She has been farily hard on my wife to get her act in gear. On this point, I believe while my wife wanted safe stable and secure in marrying me - she feels has become managed, controlled and domesticated - after several years of wild times and freedom between her first marriage and mine. I suspect, but do not know that the therapist wishes my wife to find her passion in general and feel empowered again. I would never think this therapist would encourage an affair, in fact it would be against her religious and professional beliefs. She wants my wife to get her grove back.

 

The road trip does take her to one spot where OM resides (her old home town), but many good people and freinds are there too, and that is the one part of the road trip she said she would really like me and the kids to come - to see her good friends - and then she would move on to other states and end up in DC for rally.

 

This could be her slidding back to cheating, or divorce...or it could be another down period in our marriage. I will keep an eye on it very closely.

Edited December 31, 2013 by dichotomy

[harrybrown]

So when is your big trip without her?

 

If she gets a big trip, I think you are entitled to a big trip.

 

With her history, I would tell her that she can go on her big trip, if she never comes back. Sounds like she never did come back to you and show you real remorse.

 

So she ripped your heart out and now she is throwing it into the fire again.

 

Have you talked to your counselor and that is what the counselor really told her? I would be triggering all over this and I would be done. Tell her to sign the divorce papers and go on her trip without the family. Be single.

[dichotomy]

This is not necessarily true. During the first year of recovery for me I needed space - and I wasn't contacting my ap! I went with my sister to Florida for a few days and also to visit her with my brother. My husband was very kind and allowed me that - I needed it - and it really did provide perspective for me.

 

I am a huge believer that our childhood experiences very much create who we are and why we make the choices we make. Some of us are pretty messed up because of it. And I don't know if we all completely recover from it. We have to discover the "whys" - why we had the affair - otherwise it will happen again. And it is not always about constant monitoring - that solves nothing.

 

For you to say that she is in an affair is wrong - you don't know that. It sounds like she is dealing with some major stuff and is doing the best she can.

 

Just because a therapist doesn't follow the Harley way of doing things doesn't mean they aren't qualified. Not all of us subscribe to Harley's thoughts and ideas.

 

Dichotomy - I think for you, you have to decide how much you can take. You have really tried recovery and it appears you really do love your wife, however it also seems like you are getting lost in all of this - weary and tired. If you decided enough is enough, then I'm not sure anyone would blame you. Maybe your constant monitoring is not helping anymore make you feel safe and you have to let that go? I don't know - it appears it's making you more paranoid than if you didn't do it?

 

I hate this time of year - I really, really do. It is so hard for many people.

 

I feel for you and I hope you find some relief and hope in the new year.

 

You have touched on some very key and insightful things here. Perceptive.

[dichotomy]

So when is your big trip without her?

 

If she gets a big trip, I think you are entitled to a big trip.

I travel on business, she does not. Actually I am very much a home body and not a big fan of traveling by myself - although nice to see all the big cities and have a night out by myself. She actually loves to travel by herself or with others, or did until she married me. By mutual agreement her traveling - mainly back east to her old home state was put aside to avoid issues with OM there. She has been sad and hurt to have spent many years away from visiting there due to one or two men she messed up with. There are many good friends there I have met in the past, that I have no worries about .

With her history, I would tell her that she can go on her big trip, if she never comes back. Sounds like she never did come back to you and show you real remorse.

 

Well since we have children, don't think she wishes to move back there. You have a point - remorse was slow to come over EA and her past with OM/MM, but it did come much later - in moderation - after the therapists pushed her to face what she did and appologise. The new therpist in particular has been hard on her about her betrayals and about pulling back sexually.

 

So she ripped your heart out and now she is throwing it into the fire again.

 

I am not sure ripped is right - but lied, hid so she could get me - pretended to be the type of woman I would want to marry - while keep connections to OM/MM in an emotional and sick way. It was certainly selfish and cruel, but she never actually sexually cheated on me - just could not give up a hidden and strong emotional connection to OM/MM and another guy or two. She could not break from her past crazy time and her bond to OM - until I broke it for her. It was cake eating for sure and keeping one foot in one old life.

 

Have you talked to your counselor and that is what the counselor really told her? I would be triggering all over this and I would be done. Tell her to sign the divorce papers and go on her trip without the family. Be single.

 

I will followup with the counselor as we have regular couples work on going every other week. I am triggering. More so that my wife has hit a new low in her feelings for me and sexual interest, which I though had been getting better this year in therapy.

 

 

10 Characters.

Edited December 31, 2013 by dichotomy

[tired girl]

I don't know about this business of her getting to go on a big road trip. Almost seems like a reward for what she screwed up. The business of reconciliation is hard work, and at this point it seems like you are doing the lion's share of it. The biggest part of it should lay on the WS shoulders and if she can't handle it, I think you have your answer as to whether this marriage can be put back together or not. This stuff is hard work, everyday. My husband and I have both cheated and we work everyday on fixing ourselves and communication.

[Steen719]

No..my spying did not find any trace of OM - but I did find she is hiding her feelings and thoughts again and is unhappy with me, our sex life, and other things. It was harsh and mean ....what she is thinking and saying - i am hurt to have heard this...and yes maybe I just caught her venting ...but we have been in extensive MC this last year...why not be honest, why not put it out there? Face it, deal with it.

 

This, to me, is the indication that something is wrong. Hiding, unhappy with you and unhappy with your sex life. What could make any of those things OK? Venting might be about how you don't wash the dishes or something like that. Being unhappy with your sex life with your husband is pretty important - important enough to tell him, or at least your counselor about. While it isn't the only thing that matters in a marriage, I think it often indicates how the connections are working and if she is not feeling that connection you need for that, oh oh....things can progress to looking for the connection elsewhere.

 

The trip - who knows? I like seeing my friends, but that would be when I would ask for a little time to myself, not the other way around and honestly, would probably rather have my H with me.

 

I hope it gets better for you. Hope it isn't a lifetime challenge to keep it together. I would get tired.

[lilmisscantbewrong]

Just a question for you. How do you know she is hiding that she is unhappy? Is she journaling or something and you have access to it?

 

Journaling is a way to get out your thoughts onto paper and somehow deal with them - is this something the therapist suggested she do?

 

And then how long since the affair ended? It does take time....

[Fluttershy]

First:

 

For those saying a trip is reward. Umm do you keep WS in shackles forever? Seriously people, OP is not a few months past DDay. People have rough patches in their marriage. If affairs hand't happened in the past OP probably wouldn't have snooped and wouldn't have known how bad things were inside of her. She would have got herself together and either told him or got to the bottom of what was off in her. Their marriage would have taken a turn for the good.

 

Her ventin all this id it was to another female friend is NORMAL. Some people might not agree or like it but sometimes a close friend is who we want to talk to not a therapist. Or a journal.

 

Without giving info on your snooping, OP, have you sat her down and talked, just the two of you about everything for as long as it takes? Those emotions you snooped may have been just a passing emotion she doesn't feel at the time. How old is your wife? Is she menapausel? I have a friend heading in and she is on a roller coaster ride like you wouldn't believe.

 

As to the memory thing. There are actual studies on false memories. Lots of people have them. It is a common problem withthe human brain and has nothing to do with lying (though pathological liars implant their own false memories) it is frustrating to say the least but maybe it is time for your wife to stop looking back and start being right now. A new lease on life might to that. Actually looking back and rehashing too much are one reason that I don't thibk IC i always helpful. It can get you stuck in the past when really u should only visit breifly

[dichotomy]

My wife broke down in tears. She wants me and our daughter to come on the road trip after all. She says that when she went to MC alone - the therapist started in on her loss of her sexual passion - and then moved to generally asking if there was anything in her life she was passionate about. This is were wife confessed no - she is depressed and has no interest or passion for anything in her life right now. She is tired, over worked and sad.

 

Therapist then suggested she get away on an adult adventure - but did not say it was to be without me - just something that would ignite my wife's joy and passion in life. Besides the road trip (family now) in the summer, we are searching for a couples only vacation in the next week. I am also asking my wife to maybe spend a weekend in the big city (near us), by herself, or with a GF and have some fun.

 

We also talked about her maybe spending a few weeks abroad (third world) doing charity work which is something she did as a younger woman and was life changing for her. I am not sure I want her going to India or Africa or something again as a middle aged gal with health issues - for a month to feed the poor - leaving me and kids - but if thats something that would ignite her spirit...so be it. She seemed happy I would allow or support her in this kind of adventure.

 

My wife has a good life, home, community, and is pursuing her graduate degree in a field she loves. But I get that her work is dredge, being a mom two two kids, cleaning and chores, trying to be sexy and passionate for me, getting older, health issues, and lastly putting her old affairs with MM's behind her all those years ago. And menopause is not that far away either,so this may be some midlife thing for her.

 

Again I am not sure what is really going on in her head - or heart...lies and truth have been in short order over the years. I think there something therapist and I has not gotten to the bottom of with her ... but I support these adventures if they will truly help her, me and the family in the long run.

 

I dunno - I am tired and sad too, but I know what my real needs are and they are fairly simple.

Edited January 1, 2014 by dichotomy

[lilmisscantbewrong]

My wife broke down in tears. She wants me and our daughter to come on the road trip after all. She says that when she went to MC alone - the therapist started in on her loss of her sexual passion - and then moved to generally asking if there was anything in her life she was passionate about. This is were wife confessed no - she is depressed and has no interest or passion for anything in her life right now. She is tired, over worked and sad.

 

Therapist then suggested she get away on an adult adventure - but did not say it was to be without me - just something that would ignite my wife's joy and passion in life. Besides the road trip (family now) in the summer, we are searching for a couples only vacation in the next week. I am also asking my wife to maybe spend a weekend in the big city (near us), by herself, or with a GF and have some fun.

 

We also talked about her maybe spending a few weeks abroad (third world) doing charity work which is something she did as a younger woman and was life changing for her. I am not sure I want her going to India or Africa or something again as a middle aged gal with health issues - for a month to feed the poor - leaving me and kids - but if thats something that would ignite her spirit...so be it. She seemed happy I would allow or support her in this kind of adventure.

 

My wife has a good life, home, community, and is pursuing her graduate degree in a field she loves. But I get that her work is dredge, being a mom two two kids, cleaning and chores, trying to be sexy and passionate for me, getting older, health issues, and lastly putting her old affairs with MM's behind her all those years ago. And menopause is not that far away either,so this may be some midlife thing for her.

 

Again I am not sure what is really going on in her head - or heart...lies and truth have been in short order over the years. I think there something therapist and I has not gotten to the bottom of with her ... but I support these adventures if they will truly help her, me and the family in the long run.

 

I dunno - I am tired and sad too, but I know what my real needs are and they are fairly simple.

 

You sound like you really have a pretty good handle on all of this and I think you are wonderful for allowing her to explore these new things - sometimes the creation of new memories really does help. The charity work might be something that really helps rekindle a spark for life - when you help and serve people who have far less than you do it tends to create thankfulness for what you have. This is a good thing.

 

I think a lot of women, in this day and age, are depressed - some of it is hormonal for certain, but the other part is our fast paced lifestyles and the constant pursuit of things - the next thing that is newer, faster and better and shinier. We forget what is important. So much of it is self esteem as well.

 

You guys seem like you are on the right path - you really do.

 

I am so sorry you are sad....

 

Antidepressants for awhile maybe? Until spring?

[lilmisscantbewrong]

Therapist then suggested she get away on an adult adventure - but did not say it was to be without me - just something that would ignite my wife's joy and passion in life.

 

The above is from Dichotomy's post. - the therapist did not say it was to be without him.

 

Pajama - you are making a lot of assumptions here. People in general are selfish - all people. But his wife is broken - she really is. And she is taking steps to try to fix it or she wouldn't still be there.

 

Your parody of that song is downright cruel - this is not what this forum is for - it is not to hurl insults - you didn't offer any encouragement or even any constructive ways for him to deal with this situation.

[beach]

I see your wife totally lying by not admitting how she really feels.

 

How are you supposed to "know her" when the real her never presents herself?

 

And I see her being extremely self absorbed and selfish - yet you bow down to her and work harder to find her truth (which she continues to hide).

 

It's fruitless! She does it on purpose - it works for her - because you overcompensate by being a huge giver while she takes.

 

There's no obvious balance to your M.

 

Keep giving - she will keep taking.

 

If you want it to change - how do you plan to change it? How will you participate differently to invoke change?

 

How will you stop giving so much so that she is forced to balance out her selfish tendency?

 

You may never know her - because she may never get honest - and she may never intend to tell her truth. There's no foundation for your M since she's not honest.

[BetrayedH]

Dichotomy-

 

You're a hell of a nice guy and so whatever happens, I hope it goes well for you.

 

Just a few thoughts.

 

First, I have long been a bit dismayed at how slow your wife has been to embrace remorse and how much of the heavy lifting you've had to do. Your wife sounds like my exwife and there's probably some real truth to pajama's synopsis regarding selfishness; she does seem very entitled (especially compared to you) and that imbalance bothers me.

 

Second, I'm also very concerned about her conflict-avoidance, as another poster also mentioned. Has she learned nothing? Conflict-avoidance leads to resentment and unresolved resentment will kill a relationship. When people avoid conflict (even with the best of intentions), they eventually get resentful and that resentment is going to come out, usually in a much less controlled fashion than if they had just dealt with the conflict in the first place. Your wife should be TALKING to you and she should already know this.

 

Third, I respect your efforts. There are ups and downs in a marriage and I think you're doing your best to address them. Your wife does sound depressed (mid-life crisis version) and you're taking some good steps to try to help (and I like some of the ideas, like charity work). This is what a good husband does and I don't think her past affairs should have much bearing on it.

 

All that said, I really just have to wonder how much more you want to invest in this marriage. You get so few returns after so much effort. I wouldn't blame you for throwing in the towel. Another woman would value what you bring to a relationship. I just hate to see you virtually dragging your wife thru reconciliation. If you have it in you to stay patient, more power to you. But if you don't, I really think you can let go and say you did the best you could. I don't know. I guess what I am trying to say is that I really see what you're doing as noble but if it gets to being too tiring, there's no shame in you calling it quits either. After what you've been through, you do deserve to be happy. Keep yourself in mind through all of this.

[beach]

Do you respect yourself?

[beach]

She moves her truth every time it may show her pattern.

 

It's convenient for her because she manipulates and that way you never get close enough to hurt her.

 

 

I think you're too dang nice to her - and she's just not nice to you at all.

 

You can continue to ALLOW it - or make a decision that shows you value yourself.

 

She will continue to walk all over you as long as you allow it.

Edited January 2, 2014 by beach

[dichotomy]

Dragging her to MC is my way of not allowing her to short me. I pay another pretty and smart woman to argue with her about getting her act together in sex, and other areas. Believe me this therapist has more than once given her heck - even being very graphic and blunt on sexual acts she needs to get back to.

 

However that said, I stay in the marriage because it is better for me, for the here an now, then for me to be out of it. I have very carefully imagined what me leaving the marriage would mean from me - and it is much worse than what I deal with now. Out of the frying pan and into the fire thing. That may not be the case in several years, but it is now.

 

She gave some very important things to me that I wanted for decades. The issue ....is what will I put up with, what I have put up with, what losses, for the things I want.

 

When I discuss my marriage - I don't often say what I am getting or have gotten out of it, what she has done for me. We tend post negative things her on LS. There are a few big things she has done for me. Giving me a child was huge deal for me, and this time as a dad is amazing.

 

And yes i do respect myself more than ever in my whole life right now. Perhaps this has increased my unhappiness. It was not the case when we got married. I had self esteem issues over man/women sexuality stuff. I am frankly feeling the best as a man/sexual being I have ever felt. Wish I was like this 10-15 years ago. Though all this crap -I have improved myself notably. Only recently in the last month have I had a downturn due to work distress and other things. Which is why I posted - to just cope.

[beach]

Please correct me if I'm reading it wrong -

 

It looks like your stating that you have to force her to address problems. Then hand those issues to a counselor to fix them for you.

 

You didn't address the lack of balance in the M.

 

You were unclear about the issue of her playing the princess (entitled) role and you being a doormat.

 

 

It looks like you would think more sex will fix all these other issues - is that what you're insinuating?

[atreides]

First:

 

For those saying a trip is reward. Umm do you keep WS in shackles forever? Seriously people, OP is not a few months past DDay. People have rough patches in their marriage.

 

I agree, one cannot be in shackles forever... however...

 

If affairs hand't happened in the past OP probably wouldn't have snooped and wouldn't have known how bad things were inside of her. She would have got herself together and either told him or got to the bottom of what was off in her. Their marriage would have taken a turn for the good.

 

whoa.... talk about clairvoyant. I would say just the opposite, based on what we know empirically, her coping or out for perceived life issues previously was an A. We also know empirically that she has yet to get to the bottom of anything. So as for the "shackles", one earns release and it has to do with credibility earned, not time served.

 

Empirically dichotomy has little to base any credibility and that is the travesty, she may never earn credibility and he needs to decide on what to do. What he should not do is delay, delay and acquiesce and keep her in chains for his own in decisions and reluctance.

[dichotomy]

It looks like your stating that you have to force her to address problems. Then hand those issues to a counselor to fix them for you.

 

You can call it leadership or you can call if forcing her to face her issues - both are valid ways of looking at it. Demanding a WS go to counseling is not unheard of by a BH. But her problems with love and sex and marriage beyond just the one affair with OM/MM there was much more. She is a stubborn and strong willed woman who was married to a controlling violent man - using a woman therapist MC (and one who shares certain spiritual beliefs as she does) - was a way to remove male/female conflict in our discussion on what is needed in a good marriage. She needs a good woman's influence and teachings.

 

You didn't address the lack of balance in the M.

 

We have in therapy discussed her being more involved and active. In the last year she has stepped up in non-sexual ways. I am pleased in general that she is frankly a better partner and wife. Again with nothing but poor examples (her dad, her first husband, her OM/MM) she has not understood what a balanced and healthy marriage is. She has grown notably in this area.

 

You were unclear about the issue of her playing the princess (entitled) role and you being a doormat.

 

Well you have point that she has reveled in having a married "a prince of a guy" instead of a frogs and bad knights. My first wife thought I was the frog so I kind enjoyed the change - kind of. My wife thinks highly of me. There has been no doormat exactly. NC was issued and boundaries established early in the marriage as soon as I understood what was going on with OM and others. She has not been to her home town in 4 years because of my instance and she gave up a GF - thats not a dormat thats me saying no more. However, getting someone to stop doing something destructive is one thing - getting them to a healthy perspective and accountability over their behavior is another. I have avoided going into her abuse in her first marriage, or her issues with her sex addicted father and cheating on her mom, and more. She hid her damage well.

 

 

 

 

It looks like you would think more sex will fix all these other issues - is that what you're insinuating?

 

No, but loving good sex can do alot in a marriage and it appears the one area in the last year we have yet to get consistantly going again. We have been working on the other issues and making more progress then the sex. Her sexuality has been up and down like roller coaster with our marriage (not to mention her past), she goes from wild passion to frigid for periods - months - within the marriage. It is not tied to anything I do or say, I think she has not faced some issues from her past and does not know what sex should be in a loving marriage. Hence the female MC being also a sex therapist (I got a trifecta with this therapist). I tried to pick a good female teacher for her. I think having a very intimate and healthy sex (love making) with my wife would do wonders for both of us and our MC aggress completely.

 

 

Let me say again I had issues before and in the marriage too. Sexual/masculine self esteme (some real reasons), retoactive jealousy, and also understanding control vs leadership and punsihment vs boundaires as a husband. I have had as many IC sessions with my own therapist. No matter the marriage issues - I got to make myself a healthier and stronger man. If the marriage ends or does not end - I feel I have made if very far in this goal for myself.

Edited January 2, 2014 by dichotomy

[beach]

My wife thinks highly of me. There has been no doormat exactly.

 

 

Here's a huge part of the problem. You think she thinks highly of you - yet she's cheated. Those two don't align.

 

And you didn't divorce her or set down severe a harsh consequences - or she wouldn't be sitting the like the spoiled princess complaining while you work your a$$ off to "try" and make her happy.

 

You keep giving and she keeps taking -- that is a sign for a doormat.

 

But you've allowed it - so she expects you to do more while she does less.

 

She's trained you - and you're used to being at the mercy of her.

 

 

Retraining her may be a better suggestion.

[lilmisscantbewrong]

Here's a huge part of the problem. You think she thinks highly of you - yet she's cheated. Those two don't align.

 

And you didn't divorce her or set down severe a harsh consequences - or she wouldn't be sitting the like the spoiled princess complaining while you work your a$$ off to "try" and make her happy.

 

You keep giving and she keeps taking -- that is a sign for a doormat.

 

But you've allowed it - so she expects you to do more while she does less.

 

She's trained you - and you're used to being at the mercy of her.

 

 

Retraining her may be a better suggestion.

 

Most of the time I like your posts, but humans are not dogs. I think that she is doing what she can through counseling to address her issues. And this is extremely important whether the marriage survives or not. What Dichotomy has to decide (for himself) is if he wants to continue this path. it appears that is what he has chosen for now.

[Spark1111]

I think you are working waaaaay too hard on all of it.

 

Do less, try less and focus on you.

 

Plan a weekend here and there, an adventure, a break, a getaway with her and see if fun and adventure stimulate her libido. Change things up a bit, KWIM?

 

I know it's hard to afford but it's silly not to afford it. female libido is a mystery and it is very hard to switch from the mommy hat to the lover hat. Throw in a job and graduate school and that lumps in sheer exhaustion.

 

What your wife needs to work on is identifying her feelings and communicating them to you....not her friends or her therapist....you.

 

yes, boredom and complacency kills more marriages than anything else. Start creating new experiences together.

 

We not only have to heal from the affair, we must also create new and exciting as we move into the future.