Divorce someone you love? And loves you? How do you know you've tried *everything*?

[checkoutat10]

There is a post here somewhere that goes into detail about my marriage.

 

Basically we are floundering have tentatively decided divorce is the best option. I am struggling to figure out where to go next...we both love each other very much, are attracted to each other, and can even occasionally get along.

 

Occasionally.

 

We argue. A LOT. We argue over everything from how to raise our kids to bills and money to who left the kitchen cupboard open. These arguments ALWAYS lead us to not speak to each other for days. Weeks. No communication whatsoever. I live upstairs and he lives downstairs. We are like roommates who hate each other.

 

We can't go more than about 4-5 days without getting into these arguments. When we aren't arguing things are wonderful....we laugh, joke, cuddle, kiss, show affection in public and at random times...the sex is amazing...it's all great, how I envisioned my marriage to be ALL of the time (or at least most of the time).

 

Every holiday is an argument. I don't even remember the last Christmas he had at home (he's military) where we had a wonderful time together. We didn't speak at all this past Christmas, except to argue. Our anniversary was the 31st. Didn't speak then either.

 

We have gone to marriage retreats, tried talking out our differences, I have suggested counseling over and over but he's resistant to it and won't commit. He does not believe a 3rd party can magically "fix" out marriage.

 

To me, this is all so childish and stupid. We argue over the dumbest things. We are both extremely stubborn though and 9 times out of 10 we let our stubbornness get the best of us. It has been slowly destroying us for the past 2-3 years.

 

We are at a point where we can't see it getting any better. But we both still love each other very much. The thought of divorce makes me feel ill inside, my heart hurts. He says the same.

 

We are both mid-30's. We have four children.

 

Are we just being immature and stupid? Has anyone here actually divorced someone they loved because it was for the best? We stay hostile toward each other 98% of the time. We have nothing in common. We don't share any interests or hobbies. We disagree on the number of children we want (I want another child, he wants a vasectomy), we don't even like the same kind of movies, music, etc. It's really frustrating and disheartening sometimes.

 

I don't want to be married to some guy who lives in the basement.

 

Sorry for the length of this post. I don't really have anyone I can vent to atm.

[RightThere]

If he's opposed to marriage counselling, then it sounds like she's opposed to trying what it takes to fix things. I would bet that the two of you have terrible communication skills with each other and causes a lot of your issues.

 

There is no magical fix, but it is possible. The problem is you both need to be committed to working on the fix, not just one of you.

 

And to answer your question, yes, sometimes people who do love each other need to get divorced. Maybe just going through the process will open up both your eyes, but sounds like the hostility will only further damage everyone.

[d0nnivain]

If he's military he understands teamwork. Come at him from that angle. Tell him how much you love him but that the fighting is wrecking the good order & discipline of your family. Assure him that a third party is not a magic bullet but it's like training on a new system. You need to learn some skills that you two haven't mastered as a couple & this person will help you.

 

 

Speak his language.

 

 

I think you have a marriage worth fighting for. You just need some better tools.

 

 

My husband is military also. When we first got married, I struggled. Finally he said that I needed to respect the chain of command & because I wasn't I was making everybody nuts. What I didn't understand at that point was that in his mind I outranked him. When I settled into my role as "leader" with him getting veto of course, because this is a marriage not a platoon, things got better. Military likes structure, order & consistency.

 

 

As much as I don't understand the military, they do have a system for everything & if you reach out on post / base you will find somebody with a protocol to help you.

 

 

Good luck.

[RedHawk08]

Sounds like two Type A personalities here.

You have the capacity to have a good marriage here. There are as many positives as negatives.

 

Sometimes, you just have to look at a potential disagreement in a different way.

So you win an argument, but you don't talk for days. No sense in that.

It's like dropping a nuclear bomb on a country and wanting to move in the next day.

Ain't gonna happen!

 

Bottom line is, can you ever say you disagree with each other 100%?

Even if you don't agree with someone, you can still sorta see where they're coming from or understand why they think like that.

[oldshirt]

A few thoughts in no particular order -

 

 

-Whenever anyone would write in to Ann Landers asking if he/she should divorce, her reply was always, "would you be better off with them or on your own?"

 

- you haven't, "tried everything" if you haven't been through professional counseling. The reason people refuse counseling is because they don't want someone with a master's degree in human relationships pointing a finger at them saying, "you are 'F'ing this up!" Some times both people need to have that happen to them before they can straighten up and fly right. You haven't given it your all untill you've had a professional do that to you and you have made an honest, good faith effort to do what the counselor says.

 

- If you have minor children the court may order you to do counseling anyway so if he flat out refuses, go ahead and file anyway.

 

- If you are fighting squabbling that much, but there is no abuse, addictions, adultry or abandonment, then you are fighting for control and leadership of the marriage. In other words it's not about which way the roll of toilet paper lays, it's about who gets to dictate which way the toilet paper lays. It's all just a power trip and a play for power and control.

 

As a couple you need to come up with leadership roles and responsibilities for each of you. Ships operate much better when there is a captain and a first officer and each has clearly defined roles and responsibilities. You are both trying to steer the helm and run the ship in conflict with each other instead of working together.

 

Counseling can help with that.

[Mr. Lucky]

We are both mid-30's. We have four children.

 

Are we just being immature and stupid?

With 4 kids involved, rather than immature and stupid, I'd characterize your joint actions as careless and short-sighted. You both have a moral obligation to your children to do the work necessary to keep your family unit together absent abuse or infidelity.

 

Personally, I'd have a hard time looking my kids in the eye and saying "Mommy and Daddy bicker and are stubborn so we're letting you suffer the consequences as we break up our home". I'd also guess that, left unchecked and unaddressed, the personality traits that trouble this relationship would doom any future ones...

 

Mr. Lucky

[BlametheIrish]

You can go to.counseling alone to.work on how you react to the issues that arise in your marriage. You cant make him do anything he doesnt want to but you can certainly work on yourself.

[pteromom]

Counseling aside, it takes two to argue.

 

You can absolutely change YOUR part in the patterns of your marriage.

 

You can choose not to argue. To just stop needing to "win".

 

You can choose to stop engaging in stupid arguments like leaving the cabinet open. If he says "You left the cabinet open again!" and you DON'T argue back, what have you lost really? Does it matter if he believes you left the cabinet open, even if you didn't? Who cares?

 

You can choose to listen instead of get defensive. When he says something that you would normally argue back against, you can choose to say "I'm sorry you feel that way" or "I understand how you feel." or "Hmmm, never thought of things that way." instead of getting defensive and arguing back.

 

You can walk away and take a deep breath and gather your thoughts and decide if a battle is worth fighting.

 

You can approach more serious arguments in a different way. When it comes to raising the kids and bills and money, you have to approach those things on a fully rational level - no emotion. Figure out together:

 

What is the problem?

What are your options?

How do each of the options affect each of you and other members of your family?

Can you agree on one of the options presented?

If not, can you agree to try one of the options for a set time and then re-evaluate to see if it is working?

 

You have to approach issues as something you work through together as a TEAM. It's you and him vs. the world, not you vs. him.

 

And you can probably get him on board with this too, because I am sure he is sick of all the arguing too.