DaisyLeigh1967 Posted January 18, 2014 Share Posted January 18, 2014 So, if you don't want to have kids, don't. If you do want them, have them. I have known people who regretted it and those who would never regret having kids. I have also known some happy childfree and unhappy childfree. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Haydn Posted January 18, 2014 Share Posted January 18, 2014 Thats funny. Born in East Acton, the only way was up i guess. Got fed up of living opposite the Scrubs. Mums still there though. A Guardian reader in Holland Park? Link to post Share on other sites
dichotomy Posted January 19, 2014 Share Posted January 19, 2014 (edited) I don't disagree with this study - in general. But then marriages (child or no child) come and go sometimes. Having a child is something else. Something permanent -a link across the generations of my family - and also the only time I understood what it was to love unconditionally. Also to be pushed to my limits and beyond... Meh - so my marriage is not as happy as it could be because of children.... Happiness is over rated, life is difficult, making a difference in the life of a child, my child, is a gift that brings a sense of meaning for me. But to each their own journey. Edited January 19, 2014 by dichotomy 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Shepp Posted January 19, 2014 Share Posted January 19, 2014 I find it hard to take these things seriously to be honest. The energy and effort has to be split when you have kids, but the happiness I get from my kid, the fulfilment and the, frankly, joy, just can't be measured against a relationship/marriage survey in my view. I'd happily sacrifice some of my relationship happiness to 'buy' some parental happiness. As a whole person, it suits me better. Based on what I know. I fell pregnant at 19 so can't compare an adult life as a non-parent... Totally agree! Plus the fact that no one can do both so couples without kids wouldn't necessarily know what they were missing out on. I would never change having kids though, i made a choice to do it, i made a choice to sign a birth certificate and be a dad. Best choice i've ever made. But id wanted to have my own family one day since i was 15 - teaching them to ride bikes, coaching the footie team, fixing up karts. Of course some guys kids would be there worst nightmare! Its just different strokes for different folks! 2 Link to post Share on other sites
SolG Posted January 20, 2014 Share Posted January 20, 2014 Becoming parents is a HUGE transition for the couple involved and their relationship. If the relationship does not also transition and expectations adjust in concert with the change, then unhappiness ensues. This is not new. There has been recognition of and research into this area for a long time. But it's worth recognising that couples that had the goods to start with and put the work into understanding and accommodating the new relationship dimension rise to the challenge and remain largely fulfilled by their relationship and experience great joy in parenthood - we all know these couples :-) So unhappiness after children is not an inevitability! In some respects unhappiness can be a choice through ignorance and inertia. Albeit an unconscious choice in some cases. This blog post is relevant and interesting: Relationship and Marriage Advice | The Gottman Relationship Blog: Bringing Baby Home: The Research 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Turtles Posted January 20, 2014 Share Posted January 20, 2014 This is a flawed survey (like most survey) because it does not prove a cause / effect relationship. Is the unhappiness caused by the child... or is it that a childless unhappy couple would have already separated? Take this line from the survey as well: "unmarried parents reported being happier than those that tied the knot" Well duh... if they were not married and unhappy they are much more likely to not remain in the relationship! Link to post Share on other sites
KathyM Posted January 20, 2014 Share Posted January 20, 2014 Of course, having kids puts more stress on a marriage, and there is less time for your partner when it is being divided between your partner and your kids. That is a given. There will also be more income available to spend on just the couple if there are no kids to have to support. There will also be more freedom to do what you want together, when you want, since children's needs will not have to be taken into consideration. There will also be fewer disagreements between the parents, since there will be no disputes about how to raise or discipline the kids. Of course, there's a trade off. By not having kids, you will not experience the negative aspects of having children, but you will also not experience the positives either. And the positives are many. Many/most people find it enjoyable and fulfilling to have a close relationship with their children, have the love of their children, teach them, play with them, enjoy their company, enjoy and celebrate their successes, raise them to be good, caring, successful adults. That is a very fulfilling experience for many parents. The relationship between a parent and child is a life-long bond, which can be very loving if the relationship is fostered and cared for. Personally, I find it very fulfilling and rewarding. My children are very important to me, and I don't regret for a minute having them. It is a challenge for sure, and not for the weak or those who prefer very independent lives. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
newmoon Posted January 21, 2014 Share Posted January 21, 2014 I agree with the article(s) and have found in the past 5 years or so a willingness on the part of my girlfriends who have children to admit their 'mistake.' when I was younger (20s, early 30s) my friends with kids would never admit that kids were making their marriages/lives suffer, but now I see more and more women admitting that their husband comes first and the children second, or that they made a huge mistake. most of my girlfriends complain about all the things people would have you believe are so wonderful, like the birth experience itself, and the growing stages, etc. most of my married friends with kids are very jealous of my ability to travel anywhere and anytime, and go out late at night and just ... have an independent and free lifestyle. I think children would have really added to my life (they still can, i could still try @ 38), but I'd be giving up so much, and i am already fulfilled. my bf had a vasectomy when he was 26 (he's 44 now), so he knew back then that children for him were a huge no. we're very happy and when i see how miserable my girlfriends and my brother are... NO THANKS! Link to post Share on other sites
lollipopspot Posted January 21, 2014 Share Posted January 21, 2014 now I see more and more women admitting that their husband comes first and the children second, or that they made a huge mistake. You've found that? I think twice I've heard someone IRL say they made a mistake by having kids. I think it's very taboo to say that, and generally people adjust to their lives with kids and have a hard time imagining not having them, once they're here. I have definitely heard that the spouse "comes first" though. I don't really like that hierarchy of affection though, especially since young kids have greater needs than spouses. Can you say more about your friends who have said this? 1 Link to post Share on other sites
KathyM Posted January 21, 2014 Share Posted January 21, 2014 Well, I very much wanted my children, and planned and anticipated their arrival. I've never regretted the decision, even when times were tough and the kids were difficult. As far as the hierarchy, the primary relationship, which is the marriage, is the most important relationship, and should be given priority. I know that's not always possible, but it is important. Too often, a parent makes the mistake of catering too much to children at the expense of the primary relationship, or becoming so overinvolved in their kids that they totally neglect their spouse. That should never happen. People need to foster the relationship with their spouse and not neglect it. Link to post Share on other sites
newmoon Posted January 25, 2014 Share Posted January 25, 2014 You've found that? I think twice I've heard someone IRL say they made a mistake by having kids. I think it's very taboo to say that, and generally people adjust to their lives with kids and have a hard time imagining not having them, once they're here. I have definitely heard that the spouse "comes first" though. I don't really like that hierarchy of affection though, especially since young kids have greater needs than spouses. Can you say more about your friends who have said this? I have - perhaps it is linked with age? The 4 gf's who have told me this are in the upper 30s, they had kids at either 38 or 39. I think (by that age) they were perhaps too set in their lives and careers already and didn't realize the impact having a kid would have on them and their ability to travel, promote at work, go out, etc. - they likely thought they were mature enough to handle the changes and then later realized it wasn't all they thought. Every one of them has warned me to think really long and hard about it and advise me against having kids. Of course they don't dislike their children or wish them gone, but I certainly can see that they want their former lives back, no question. And, while I have always somewhat envied them - because they are all married and (seemingly) happy, they now envy me - my thin body, my trips all the tims, the nice clothes I can afford, etc. - the tables have turned a bit. Link to post Share on other sites
janedoe67 Posted January 25, 2014 Share Posted January 25, 2014 I guess for those who want life to be all about what is easy and all about them this survey would make perfect sense. Kids are too inconvenient to allow that thinking to continue. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Bittersweetie Posted January 26, 2014 Share Posted January 26, 2014 My H and I were married 12 years (together 6 before that) before having a kid. My thoughts? Before my son, there were times when we were really happy. We went on huge vacations. We had nice cars. Went out to eat a lot, or to get a couple of drinks in the evening. Before my son, there were times when we were really unhappy. My H had a lot of stress at work and I never saw him. His father passed. We moved to where we knew no one. I had an A. After my son was born, there have been times when we were really happy. The day he was born. Afternoons when he won't stop laughing. Yesterday when he kissed my nose all open-mouthed and bit it. After my son was born, there have been times when we were really unhappy. He was in NICU for ten days. He had to have a couple of surgeries. He didn't sleep through the night for a year. When he vomited all over me. So I think that there is happiness and sadness in relationships regardless of whether one has a kid or not. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Haydn Posted January 26, 2014 Share Posted January 26, 2014 (edited) I still have a great body (Kind of) and great clothes! My daughter added a better aspect to my life. Never stopped us from traveling and careers etc... Her mother is the same. Her Body didn`t change. Maybe its more of how you see parenting? If people think of it as some chore then thats what it will be. For me, my little girl never ceases to amaze me. I have - perhaps it is linked with age? The 4 gf's who have told me this are in the upper 30s, they had kids at either 38 or 39. I think (by that age) they were perhaps too set in their lives and careers already and didn't realize the impact having a kid would have on them and their ability to travel, promote at work, go out, etc. - Edited June 13, 2019 by a LoveShack.org Moderator Link to post Share on other sites
newmoon Posted January 26, 2014 Share Posted January 26, 2014 (edited) I still have a great body (Kind of) and great clothes!... you're male? because there are lots of studies and statistics that show children actually do improve the lives of men moreso than women. perhaps because there is still the burden on the women the do most of the caretaking?? personally I don't see it as a 'chore' but as something that would dramatically shift my life in a way that I suppose I just don't care to have it shifted. in the same way many women *know* they are meant to be mothers many others *know* they are not. it's whatever makes us happy, ultimately! Edited June 13, 2019 by a LoveShack.org Moderator Link to post Share on other sites
Haydn Posted January 27, 2014 Share Posted January 27, 2014 I agree. Very fair point. We never planned to have a child. But its worked for us. Its like she was always here, cannot imagine a time without her. She has enhanced my life and her mothers but i can see how it would not be so good for others. Link to post Share on other sites
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