Iguanna Posted February 5, 2014 Share Posted February 5, 2014 Of course we all have the choice to do whatever we want without of course hurting others. But our choices define us to the eyes of our beloved and to the society. We also have the choice to not care for what others think of us, so in the end no harm done. But the fact that I understand that someone has the right to spend their life having fun and not have kids does not make me not view this someone as a selfish person and act towards them accordingly. Link to post Share on other sites
TaraMaiden Posted February 5, 2014 Share Posted February 5, 2014 How about just viewing, accepting and not making any judgements either way? 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Iguanna Posted February 5, 2014 Share Posted February 5, 2014 How about just viewing, accepting and not making any judgements either way? Me saying that you have the right to do whatever you want is accepting, but you can't refuse me the right to create opinions about people according to their actions - judging is a strong word, I prefer to say I create opinion. You can't persuade me you have never created opinions for people based on their lifestyle or the way they behave etc? Link to post Share on other sites
TaraMaiden Posted February 5, 2014 Share Posted February 5, 2014 I'm not refusing you the right - nobody can do that. I'm merely suggesting we look at the wisdom of forming concrete opinions about something when we have not walked a mile in their shoes yet. And I include myself in this critique by the way, I hasten to add..... Link to post Share on other sites
Iguanna Posted February 5, 2014 Share Posted February 5, 2014 I'm not refusing you the right - nobody can do that. I'm merely suggesting we look at the wisdom of forming concrete opinions about something when we have not walked a mile in their shoes yet. And I include myself in this critique by the way, I hasten to add..... Living the life without kids at 32? I've done that, I've had my fun, I've done many fun things, many serious things, now I feel that if I don't have a kid in my life I will feel forever useless. Link to post Share on other sites
TaraMaiden Posted February 5, 2014 Share Posted February 5, 2014 Do you need to have a child biologically? Could you perhaps investigate a good charity to sponsor a child, say charities that are active against recruiting children into armies, or charities that help you sponsor a child in a 3rd-world location, to give them a chance to be educated and have work that will fulfil them? There's more than one way to not be 'childless', and sponsoring/supporting a child is extremely rewarding. Just noodling..... 1 Link to post Share on other sites
TaraMaiden Posted February 5, 2014 Share Posted February 5, 2014 Living the life without kids at 32? I've done that, I've had my fun, I've done many fun things, many serious things, now I feel that if I don't have a kid in my life I will feel forever useless. THis is possibly the saddest thing I've come across all week. Bearing or not bearing a child, has no bearing on what you are. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Iguanna Posted February 5, 2014 Share Posted February 5, 2014 THis is possibly the saddest thing I've come across all week. Bearing or not bearing a child, has no bearing on what you are. See? You judge (or create opinions) about my life decisions as well. It's human. Anyway I've done various things in my life and I've come to the conclusion that everything was worthless, the only thing that will count in my life is to have and raise a kid to become a good person, then I'll say I'm satisfied with myself and useful. Link to post Share on other sites
TaraMaiden Posted February 5, 2014 Share Posted February 5, 2014 See? You judge (or create opinions) about my life decisions as well. It's human. I wasn't judging you actually. It was said more to conmfort and reassure you. Anyway I've done various things in my life and I've come to the conclusion that everything was worthless, the only thing that will count in my life is to have and raise a kid to become a good person, then I'll say I'm satisfied with myself and useful. If you really believe this, it's possible you have too many emotional hang-ups to look at bringing a child into the world, lucidly. if everything else is valueless, having a child does not validate you - and that's a general fact. Remember that our children never, ever turn out the way we idealise the result to be.... 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Iguanna Posted February 5, 2014 Share Posted February 5, 2014 I wasn't judging you actually. It was said more to conmfort and reassure you. Ah thank you, I've come to this conclusion and decision maturely enough and I'm 99% sure this will only make me happy. But thanks for the effort If you really believe this, it's possible you have too many emotional hang-ups to look at bringing a child into the world, lucidly. if everything else is valueless, having a child does not validate you - and that's a general fact. Remember that our children never, ever turn out the way we idealise the result to be.... Isn't the urge to have kids and the certainty that I will raise them in the best possible way and love them unconditionally not good enough base to have kids? Why am I considered to have emotional hang-ups for being sure that this will make me happy? I mean, it's something millions of women do every day in their lives and most of them didn't even ask for it and they were not even prepared for it. Why am I considered to have something wrong while I've taken the time and thought to come to the conclusion I'm ready to have kids? Yes, the money, the jobs, the boyfriends, the friends even, everything else seems valueless to me compared to having a kid that needs me and I will put all my effort and energy to raise it to be a good person. I don't want validation. I just know that this will make me happy. Why is it so weird to hear? We hear women saying "I love my job, I feel complete with it" and we accept it. Why don't we accept a woman saying that she will be happy only with having and raising a kid? I'm not attacking you, I am just wondering cause I often hear what you just said and I am getting tired of hearing it. I don't want my kids to be the way I want them, never, ever.I just want them to be healthy and happy, whatever their decisions may be. (I'm not sure if this conversation should be moved to another, more appropriate thread ) Link to post Share on other sites
TaraMaiden Posted February 5, 2014 Share Posted February 5, 2014 Isn't the urge to have kids and the certainty that I will raise them in the best possible way and love them unconditionally not good enough base to have kids? Not really, no. It's idealism, but it's flawed... Why am I considered to have emotional hang-ups for being sure that this will make me happy? because it won't, not constantly. It will bring exhaustion, impecunity, at times, frustration and distress, and occasionally even a great deal of dissatisfaction. As has been said, looking for happiness through external validations, no matter what they be - animal, vegetable or mineral - is futile, until and unless you have that inner peace and serenity FIRST. I mean, it's something millions of women do every day in their lives and most of them didn't even ask for it and they were not even prepared for it. Why am I considered to have something wrong while I've taken the time and thought to come to the conclusion I'm ready to have kids? because - and this may shock you - even the very best-prepared women who like you want children - aren't ready for what happens or fully prepared for it. I felt precisely as you do now, 32 years ago.... Yes, the money, the jobs, the boyfriends, the friends even, everything else seems valueless to me compared to having a kid that needs me and I will put all my effort and energy to raise it to be a good person. You can and will do that. You can and may fail. You think Jack the Ripper's parents, wanted that future for him? The only certain thing is, when a child is born, is that those immediately surrounding it care for it, and its mother 100%. Everything after that, is for us to try to engineer, but there are no guarantees... I don't want validation. I just know that this will make me happy. Why is it so weird to hear? I suggest you see what you can do about minding a friend's baby for a whole weekend, on your own, with no visible means of support. We hear women saying "I love my job, I feel complete with it" and we accept it. Why don't we accept a woman saying that she will be happy only with having and raising a kid? Because the job is an existing entity with regular reward, Parenthood is a complete unknown, with no pay and usually, the effort is one-sided. I'm not attacking you, I am just wondering cause I often hear what you just said and I am getting tired of hearing it. Well, if you hear it said often - why do you doubt its veracity? You're being told by people 'in the know'. Listen to them, they have a tale to tell. It's not necessarily said to discourage you, but it sure is as hell intended to help you see things as they really are! I don't want my kids to be the way I want them, never, ever.I just want them to be healthy and happy, whatever their decisions may be. Ah. Yes, that famous word. 'Healthy'. Every single parent wants that....What makes you think that every child born will be? What are you going to do if your child isn't 'healthy'? I know you'll say 'love it just as much' and of course, that is true. But you've just exposed another ideology which takes you away from reality..... 2 Link to post Share on other sites
BJP56 Posted February 5, 2014 Share Posted February 5, 2014 We can't spend a life only with having fun and focusing on ourselves. We are made this way so that we need to create life and take care of it. What you say seems to me selfish. Thats what I meant by focusing on yourself first. Yes we need to create life but also love yourself while your doing it. Many people seem to forget that. If you dont love yourself how are you going to love a person? 2 Link to post Share on other sites
pink_sugar Posted February 8, 2014 Share Posted February 8, 2014 I wasn't judging you actually. It was said more to conmfort and reassure you. If you really believe this, it's possible you have too many emotional hang-ups to look at bringing a child into the world, lucidly. if everything else is valueless, having a child does not validate you - and that's a general fact. Remember that our children never, ever turn out the way we idealise the result to be.... I agree 100%. You should not have children for the purpose of self-fulfillment or improvement of self esteem. This really puts a lot of pressure on the child. You have to live for you and have your own life outside of your child, otherwise your child will want to run the moment they turn 18. Link to post Share on other sites
burningashes Posted February 8, 2014 Share Posted February 8, 2014 I just turned 30 on the first of February and am rocking it! I really feel like the best years are ahead of me now, with all the doubts of the 20's behind me. Sure, I haven't gotten married, bought my dream house, pooped out three kids and all that before I was 30. In hindsight, I'm glad I didn't. I was completely free to pursue education, travel and meet people around the world. Being childfree does not make our lives less meaningful than those who have children. If people think children will make them happy, they are seriously deluded because it comes within. I know because I learned this the hard way when my ex left me after 10 years and I was convinced I would never be happy because he made me happy. I'm the one who has to live this life, and I discovered it was really ME who I have to be happy with. When I figured this out, life has become very good to me. I've been through a lot of crap over the years, but here I am, happy as a peach and no one can ever tell me otherwise just because I don't base my sole existence on having children (or relationships) in this life. No one is responsible for your happiness. You might draw some inspiration and joy from raising a family, but certainly, it cannot be your only source of happiness, or be the reason for your existence. I've never heard of anyone go, "Yeah, it's my goal in life to become a SAHM and raise five children no matter what, because it's the ONLY thing that will make me happy. Otherwise, life's not worth living." It sounds ridiculous to say that in the same breath of saying childfree people are miserable. I'm pretty sure they're doing just fine 2 Link to post Share on other sites
kiss_andmakeup Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 I'm glad my fiancé was single and childless at age 30, 'cause that's when I met him! Seriously, OP...this is no big deal. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Allumere Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 Interesting post. Understand the desire but at 30 you still have plenty of time. I'm 45 and that ship has sailed (and I'm fine with....can love the kids of others which is cool for me). One thing I will say though is that I do get it. Not saying the advise here isn't good. This may be my own sticking point. I hear often "you have to be happy with yourself, you are your only source of happiness". I certainly see validity in that...BUT...when one long or desires something it is part of that happiness. Whether it's the satisfaction from a career, getting fit, a great spiritual relationship...these things are all part of the puzzle in which a person can find their own happiness. Desiring a child or a relationship is no less part of that puzzle. No, one should not think that any of those things will magically turn their world into rainbows and unicorns but without them I would agree you feel incomplete. Does that make sense....lil sleepy and the eyeballs are a bit cross. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
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