Difficulty in Dealing with the Sex Issue

[oldshirt]

I couldn't disagree more as a woman and someone who has been involved in many sex talks. Men and women fear that the other person WANTS then to be amazing in bed the firsr time and therefore think the other person wants it to be instinctive. I don't doubt there are men and women who want perfection on demand. But prefrences and sexual fantasies are often something that ends up being discussed. IME it is the spoiled personalities that want someone to just know. The people who are in touch with reality and not brainwashed by fiction, media, porn or whatnot realize communication is the key.

 

Some like it hot, some like it cold, and some like ot nine days in a row.

 

I was making an attempt to see if I was getting what Iquana was concerned about. I was saying what I think HER concerns are. Not necessarily how I think things should be.

[Iguanna]

I agree ^^^^^^^

 

 

But I also think I understand where Iguana is coming from as well.

 

I think what Iguana is saying is that one of women's deepest fears is of being judged slurry and of being treated as slurry by a current man based on her sexual history with previous men/man.

 

In otherwords what is bothering her is that SD1000 is bumping up his sexuality and treating her in a more sexual manner based her her sexual response to the OM instead of following his own sexual paradigms.

 

This is something men can't really grasp and have no frame of reference for but is something women feel very strongly about - women want men to just instinctively "know" what turns them on and just naturally do it. It is a major DLV for women when men try to calibrate or adjust their sexuality based on what they think the woman will like and especially if it is something based on her prior sexual history.

 

Women have strong desire for couples to just "click" and naturally and instinctively know and deliver what the other likes.

 

I don't want to speak for Iguana and she can correct me if I am wrong but I believe what is making her so uncomfortable with this is it appears to her that SD 1000 is changing his his sexual repertoire based on finding out about how she responded to OM.

 

To the female brain, him changing his sexual approach based on the OM' s dynamics with her is setting the GF up to potentially feel sultry and used at some point as well as being a big DLV for SD1000 since it kind of appears he is trying to reproduce the OM' s path of success rather than them just naturally clicking based on his own sexual style.

 

I am somewhat close to describing your concerns Iguana?

 

Totally. Thank God there is a native english speaker here to put what I think in words wayyy better than me Thank you

[oldshirt]

Totally. Thank God there is a native english speaker here to put what I thinfn words wayyy better than me Thank you

 

Ok good, now I think we can address your concerns a little more clearly.

 

Your concerns DO have some validity and cause to keep an eye on things. However Keep in mind that these two are full grown adults and have been involved with each other for awhile and both are wanting continue the relationship and have it develop. This is part of getting to know each other and part of the process of developing trust and comfort with each other and finding out what the other likes and responds to.

 

Everyone always says to "communicate" but people are rarely able to just come out and spell out an explicit playbook of everything they like and don't like.

 

When it comes to the topic of sexuality many women can barely even say the word sex let alone describe how they like to have their butt tickled with a finger while having their clitoris licked in a fairly firm, semi-circular fashion. Those are things you just have to find out by trial and error.

 

Men had their own hang ups too. Men that were brought up to respect and honor women and not treat them as sex objects have a deep fear of upsetting or offending women and fear being judged as a bad guy for his sexual interests.

 

So what happens is you get two people that do have sexual tastes and interests but neither is really able to discuss it and even if they did discuss it, it wouldn't really matter much because 90% of what you like, you only like it in the moment. It's not really something you like talking beforehand or much afterwards.

 

In the case of SD1000 and his GF, both of them were somewhat reserved and holding themselves back sexually. Both were wanting more chemistry and fireworks but each was waiting for the other to move things forward.

 

Him finding the texts with the OM just simply happened to be the catalyst that got the ball rolling. It could have been a million other things that got the ball rolling, it just happened to be this at this time.

 

Was it the ideal situation that guarentees perfect success and living conflict and discomfort free forever and ever and ever? Of course not but these are full grown adults and realize there are never any guarentees and know that there is no perfect world.

 

They are still getting to know each other and the relationship is still developing. The fact that both of them seem to be responding positively to each other and seem to be moving forward is very very encouraging.

[Speakingofwhich]

I would encourage you, SD, to take it slow and ease into the changes you're making so as to be sure they are authentic to you. This will allow the two of you to grow as a couple rather than each of you growing singularly into your new sexual expressions. Don't try to be someone you're not and don't become gamey or it'll backfire on you.

 

Nothing wrong with replying that you love her when she asks you to. Withholding affection and affirmation to gain her respect sexually or emotionally seems gamey to me.

 

Emotional security in an R, contrary to what some folks think, is a gateway to intimacy. And true sexual intimacy is what you want. That's the place where it's safe to experiment and to be oneself without fear of rejection or feeling foolish.

[road]

Men want a wild woman in bed. One that will leave him too exhausted to get up the next morning.

 

 

Now a man can be happy in a relationship with a woman that is not extroverted in the bed. She appears to enjoy him and he enjoys her love making.

 

 

The problem is after the woman has an affair with the OM and she became the wild woman for the OM.

 

 

We have a BH that wants what the OM got. Though his WW will try to give him what she gave the OM. And most likely will not. Though if she can there is no guarantee that it will elevate her BH to the same level that it did the OM.

 

 

However the BH can not give what the OM did. He can attempt though he will never be the same.

 

 

Thus the ghost of the OM will be between the WW and the BH.

 

 

Very hard for the BH in that situation to get rid of the OM's ghost.

 

 

Sex is the response between a man and a woman. When one of the partners change a new response is the result because the chemistry between will always be based on the individuals involved.

 

 

Example: WW had anal with the OM. She never gave it to her BH before the affair.

 

 

Now after D day and recovery is in process and WW no longer refuses to now gives anal to her BH.

 

 

You would think that things are even now. Well yes the BH now gets anal when he wants it as did the OM.

 

 

Though what chemistry that was between the WW and the OM made the WW want to give it up and liked it. The chemistry for anal is not there between the WW and BH so she does anal to make amends she does not enjoy it with her BH.

 

 

Or she could enjoy anal now though she can not get her BH to do it in a manner for her to enjoy it now.

 

 

So many issues. Does the WW lay there and not respond to anal with her BH because he is not getting it done?

 

 

Or does the WW pretend that her BH is a god at anal and pretend her BH is getting her off that way?

 

 

If there is a technique problem how does the WW say when it comes to anal BH you are not getting it done. I would like you to do it this way.

 

 

As you see the WW did not say do it like the OM. Though the BH will know this is what the WW wants.

 

 

Or if the BH notices that the WW is not enjoying anal. So he asks her why. How does the WW say it is because the OM had better equipment?

 

 

When people meet and begin a relationship a man will think he hit the bedroom lottery. He will be smiling fro ear to ear. When he gets a woman that is great in bed. He will not worry about past BF's because they were before him. She was done with them. She is now his exclusive. He is the victor.

 

 

However the baggage from an affair. Is that the BH lost to the OM. The OM was the victor. Even though it was temporary the WW chose the OM over the BH.

 

 

This is why after an affair recovery takes two to five years. This is why hysterical bonding does not last.

[oldshirt]

Men want a wild woman in bed. One that will leave him too exhausted to get up the next morning.

 

 

Now a man can be happy in a relationship with a woman that is not extroverted in the bed. She appears to enjoy him and he enjoys her love making.

 

 

The problem is after the woman has an affair with the OM and she became the wild woman for the OM.

 

 

We have a BH that wants what the OM got. Though his WW will try to give him what she gave the OM. And most likely will not. Though if she can there is no guarantee that it will elevate her BH to the same level that it did the OM.

 

 

However the BH can not give what the OM did. He can attempt though he will never be the same.

 

 

Thus the ghost of the OM will be between the WW and the BH.

 

 

Very hard for the BH in that situation to get rid of the OM's ghost.

 

 

Sex is the response between a man and a woman. When one of the partners change a new response is the result because the chemistry between will always be based on the individuals involved.

 

 

Example: WW had anal with the OM. She never gave it to her BH before the affair.

 

 

Now after D day and recovery is in process and WW no longer refuses to now gives anal to her BH.

 

 

You would think that things are even now. Well yes the BH now gets anal when he wants it as did the OM.

 

 

Though what chemistry that was between the WW and the OM made the WW want to give it up and liked it. The chemistry for anal is not there between the WW and BH so she does anal to make amends she does not enjoy it with her BH.

 

 

Or she could enjoy anal now though she can not get her BH to do it in a manner for her to enjoy it now.

 

 

So many issues. Does the WW lay there and not respond to anal with her BH because he is not getting it done?

 

 

Or does the WW pretend that her BH is a god at anal and pretend her BH is getting her off that way?

 

 

If there is a technique problem how does the WW say when it comes to anal BH you are not getting it done. I would like you to do it this way.

 

 

As you see the WW did not say do it like the OM. Though the BH will know this is what the WW wants.

 

 

Or if the BH notices that the WW is not enjoying anal. So he asks her why. How does the WW say it is because the OM had better equipment?

 

 

When people meet and begin a relationship a man will think he hit the bedroom lottery. He will be smiling fro ear to ear. When he gets a woman that is great in bed. He will not worry about past BF's because they were before him. She was done with them. She is now his exclusive. He is the victor.

 

 

However the baggage from an affair. Is that the BH lost to the OM. The OM was the victor. Even though it was temporary the WW chose the OM over the BH.

 

 

This is why after an affair recovery takes two to five years. This is why hysterical bonding does not last.

 

 

These people are single and neither the OP nor the OM were in serious developed relationships. If I read correctly the OM actually came along first and the OP is the one that came along after.

 

Also no reference had been made to any specific sex acts being performed nor that the OM was better or that she enjoyed the OM more. She simply texted him that she liked having sex with him and she hadn't texted that to th OP.

[road]

These people are single and neither the OP nor the OM were in serious developed relationships. If I read correctly the OM actually came along first and the OP is the one that came along after.

 

Also no reference had been made to any specific sex acts being performed nor that the OM was better or that she enjoyed the OM more. She simply texted him that she liked having sex with him and she hadn't texted that to th OP.

 

 

 

 

 

You missed the word

 

 

 

 

EXAMPLE:

 

 

 

 

So you did not realized a hypothetical situation was being laid out for discussion.

[The Samurai]

I do think she loves me in one important way and often tells me that. Today she sent me a long text message. Here it is:

 

 

The way I show my love is a traditional way and it shows my love and passion. Cooking and cleaning are things that I have always disliked very much. When we lived together last summer I tried my best to learn how to do those things because in my eyes, these are the most romantic things to do for your man and shows the determination to be his woman.

 

I still hate to do these things back in my own home. It always reminds me of the time spent living with you and why I enjoyed doing these things so much when I was with you. It was the time in which I most felt very feminine and soft. These changes automatically happened when I was with you. Why? The only reason is you and the love for you.

 

What else you need to prove that she loves you?!

 

In my opinion, "enjoy" doing things she normally hate just for you is the highest form of love.

Did she do these things to OM?! Of course not. She did it only for you.

[Iguanna]

This thread is not about love but sexual compatibility.

 

Men don't get that most of the time one leads to another and one can't exist to its fullest unless there is the other.

[Iguanna]

Except the woman we're discussing didn't love for sexual compatibility.

 

The man who treated her like trash, she was sexually compatible with him. The man who loved her, not so much.

 

1. We don't know that for sure, just from the messages she sent him.

2. Even if that were true, she still chose the man she loves, putting aside the sexual compatibility. This shows us that she cares more for love than amazing sex. A fact that men don't accept or know that women do, cause they would never do it themselves.

[janedoe67]

Exactly.

 

The reason his fiance' was more experimental with the other man is because him forgetting her name, treating her like crap, and being sexually aggressive made them more emotionally attached to each other through true love.

 

Sarcasm is always helpful to recovery.....

 

I have thought all along that the reason she - in the end - dumped 57 year old meanie and is with the OP is because she discovered that ANY sex, no matter how "wild", when it is just sex, is ultimately empty and almost degrading. She might have explored this whole "just crazy sex" thing....but when it comes down to what really matters, she wanted a man who loves her, who she could love and respect, and with whom she could BUILD a life, including a sex life.

 

A sex life is not set in stone on the wedding day. In good marriages it evolves. Just because you aren't swinging from chandeliers and wearing blindfolds TODAY does not meant you won't ever be.

 

For a woman with depth, crazy sex eventually becomes overrated. It is real intimacy and love and respect that counts.

[Iguanna]

Love is a choice, not just a feeling. Giving your "love" emotional, sexual or romantic leftovers is not evidence of "love".

 

What do you mean by "leftovers"? Sex is not measured and distributed to sexual partners (I have 100 times to do anal, I'll distribute it to man 1, man 2, man 3 and man 4 by 25 each, etc). A woman reacts to what the man offers her sexually and so does the man. There are things you want to do only with someone you don't care about and things you want to do only with someone you love. It drives you crazy the thought that your gf/wife may have done something wilder with another man in the past and you don't get this wild thing, doesn't it? That's just self centered behavior. She has the right to choose what she will share with her partner sexually. Having done once something wild does not give the right to her present partner to demand this from her. Does this mean her present partner is getting leftovers? No. It means she is now more mature, she may feel she is not ready yet to share this experience with her partner or she didn't even like this thing when she did it and she doesn't want to repeat it. Whichever reason she has, she has the right to choose. If her partner gets so frustrated that she doesn't do this wild thing with him, then I guess HE has the problem and he can leave anytime.

 

This couple does not have less acts of sex necessarily rather than different sex than the one she had with the old man. In men's eyes this may mean that the less wild sex is worse, but that's rarely right for a woman.

 

Sex is the strongest way to show love for a man, regardless of what women feel, that is the reality.

 

I can't disagree more cause when a man is in a relationship with a woman cause he loves her he asks for more than just sex, and when a man wants just sex from a woman he doesn't love her. If what you just said is true, then all one night stands would lead to crazy love from the man's part, but we all know that one night stands are only done once.

[janedoe67]

Again, relationships are not just about women. A man is going to want crazy sex in his marriage because it makes him feel loved, desirable and happy.

 

Would women be comfortable in a marriage where all your husband wanted was crazy sex, but never was romantic, sensual and did things to make you feel attractive? And what if you found out he enjoyed doing these things for other women he was in relationships with, but he doesn't want to do them for you?

 

That is how it is for a man in a relationship with a woman who gives him sexual leftovers. That is how the OP feels.

 

You're in a relationship with a man who only wants crazy sex even though you want romance, poems, etc. And someone tells you that you should get over it because guys feel loved when their wife is wild with them. And that is how he shows his love. And romance, sensuality, cuddling, etc. shouldn't matter and have nothing to do with love and respect.

 

Do you see how ridiculous that sounds from your perspective? That is how it sounds to men when women say "For a woman with depth, crazy sex eventually becomes overrated. It is real intimacy and love and respect that counts." in relation to a woman that doesn't give her husband the sex that can make him feel happy in a relationship.

 

For the record, I love crazy sex and have a very high sex drive. I'm just saying that just because he isn't having it right off the bat doesn't mean he never will. Heck, if he was that into crazy sex, why didn't he try for it before? And yes, I DO understand that the idea that someone would do something with a person other than me hurts badly.

 

I'm just saying that relationships evolve, and this is something that CAN be incorporated into their sex lives.

 

And unless someone has a serious dysfunction, I don't know ANYONE who would feel real committed love and intimacy with someone who ONLY ever drove them crazy in the sack and ignored them otherwise. Let's get real...you're going to marry, have kids, and build a life with someone who can't remember your name just because the sex is good? Not a healthy person.

 

What I see here is a relationship that was fine until he found some old texts. Then, in addition to the fact that the relationships overlapped in the beginning (which is understandably painful), he sees this side of her that he didn't know was there. And he wants that side too. Again, understandable. So work into it. Experiment. Lay the needs on the table. Go toy shopping. Order 9 1/2 weeks on netflix.

 

But to toss an entire relationship away because you can't be Christian Grey RIGHT NOW?

 

That is not what a grownup does OR advises.

[oldshirt]

OK one thing I've been wanting to address from the opening post but didn't want to detract from the rest of the dialog -

 

 

I simply do not and will not believe that this OM literally could not remember her name.

 

 

Someone along this chain of dialog is exaggerating or embellishing to make a point. It's not literal. If he came back for seconds and thirds etc and they were having txt exchanges etc, he knows her name.

 

 

He may have treated her dismissive in some ways. She may have felt that he was the kind of guy that would pick a chick up in a bar and not remember her name. She may have told SD that he didn't put much effort into getting to know her beyond her name and he may have interpreted it as literal but at the end of the day, he did know her name.

 

 

We can assume that their relationship was based primarily on sexual chemistry but let's not take the whole name thing as literal fact.

[oldshirt]

Interesting exchange between Moonie, Janedoe and Iguana.

 

 

All three are correct in their own way. Only difference is Moonie is describing it from the boy's perspective and the ladies are describing it from the girl's.

 

 

Maybe there's a middle ground that we can at least understand if an actual agreement can be reached.

 

 

Let's look at it in terms of value and priority.

 

 

We value that which is rare and which we have to work for. We place lesser value and priority on that which is abundant and which comes easy (ie sand in the desert does not cost much and it is not is high on people's priority list or values)

 

 

For women, sex is a very cheap and abundant commodity that doesn't cost them anything. they can get it any minute of any hour of any day. It's not something they have to work at or sacrifice for and since it is always something that will be there waiting for them, it does not carry a big priority or value for them. They may enjoy it and appreciate good sex, but deep down they know that sex can be found anywhere at any time.

 

 

(yes yes, they'll all jump up and down and say that they can't get the exact person they want at any time, but the fact remains that they can get something at any time they want)

 

 

BUT while an actual penis in their vagina is the easiest thing in the world for them to find and achieve, having that penis attached to a person who they find attractive and desirable and who sincerely cares for them and treats them well and will improve their lifestyle and status in the community and provide them safety and shelter and provide them with a home and family and will not leave them for someone younger and prettier and sexier - that becomes a whole other reality.

 

 

finding a man who will love, honor, respect and provide them with a home and family and who will not abandon them when they are fat and stretchmarked and having a screaming, pooping, puking baby on their hands is actually quite difficult and that which requires a lot of work and sacrifice.

 

 

It adds a whole other element to that which they value and prioritize.

 

 

Now lets contrast that with men -

 

 

For the average man (ie the regular guys who are not rock stars, celebrities, pro athletes, male models, exceptionally rich or politically powerful ) sex is actually pretty scarce and takes a lot of work. Finding a woman that is sincerely sexually attracted to you and desires you because you truly turn her on sexually and not just because you offer her support and security is a very very special thing.

 

 

If a guy were to offer up his home, support, resources and assistance to any woman to help her raise her children and he offered to be a good friend to her and treat her nicely but not ask for anything in return - there would lonely, desperate, single mothers and lonely women lined up down the street and around the corner.

 

 

In otherwords, women wanting assistance, support, security, comfort and companionship are a very cheap and abundant resource. A guy can find one of those anywhere and he doesn't have to work for it.

 

 

So let's add this all up. for the men- a woman who is fit, healthy, pretty and has a sincere sexual attraction for him is a very rare resource that he has to put in effort to find. She is going to be very special to him and the sexual chemistry and more specifically HER DESIRE are going to be very high on his priority list and value system.

It's not that he doesn't want the other elements that come with a relationship and it's not that they don't carry any importance. it's that her desire for him is a very high priority and value.

 

 

A woman that basically wants him to provide and support her and give her a home and family and wants his companionship and him to help her status but doesn't have a very high sincere desire for him is of much much less value and priority.

 

 

 

 

For a woman, basically ALL(I'm exaggerating to make a point, but it's pretty much true) men want to have sex with her and want wild monkey sex with her. but only a very very very few are going to want to put forth the effort to give her the full package.

 

 

Therefor her value and priority on the sexual desire and the wild monkey sex is much much lower than it is for a comparable man. and her value and priority are higher on the other elements of the relationship.

[oldshirt]

...... So when Iguana and JaneDoe are saying that women are perfectly willing to sacrifice some sexual chemistry for a good solid guy that loves them, supports them and treats them well, they are being sincere and well-meaning and don't think they are saying anything that should upset or worry anyone. It's normal and natural for them to forgo some sexual chemistry for some sincere love and nurturing and support and security.

 

 

BUT

 

 

When men hear a woman say that, all it does is conjur up deep insecurities and anxieties of being "2nd choice" and "getting leftovers" etc etc.

 

 

Men value and prioritize the sexual chemistry and desire. No man wants to be supporting beta boy that provides the security and support while her actual desire and attraction is with someone else just as no woman wants to be used as the sperm-depository while his love and devotion and support goes to someone else.

 

 

The whole key to all of these situations like this is particular case is to find that happy sweet spot where the lady's sexual desire and attraction for him is sincere and real and where his love and devotion to her is sincere and real.

 

 

I many cases that simply can't be achieved for a wide variety of reasons.

 

 

In this particular case I and several others believe it can. Some don't.

 

 

Time will tell.

[janedoe67]

I may not have expressed myself very well. Believe me, I may be female, but as far as the perspective on sex goes, I tend to relate more to the man's point of view than the woman's. Just take a look at the "in a marriage without sex" thread and you'll see I'm one of those "shallow" people who wouldn't (and couldn't) stay in a marriage without sex. I don't just like sex, I NEED it (yeah yeah, save your breath).

 

My point was that it sounds like the OP and his GF have BOTH been holding back, possibly for fear of what the other will think, possibly wondering if it's "okay." Maybe the reason - in the beginning - that the GF was able to cut loose without caring with old dude is because she didn't care about him or what he thought of her. If he was so shocked he walked away, who cares? She hasn't really lost anything. But shocking OP so that he might walk away? THAT scared her.

 

Now they have an established (up to now) tame, somewhat "vanilla" sex life. He knows she is up for more, and she knows he knows she had more. She probably feels embarrassed that she did that with someone else, and even though he may be making it clear that he wants it, she may still be tentative.

 

That is why I suggested taking time and letting things evolve. NOT because I buy the BS that women only give sex for love and men only give love for sex. I am a walking proof that that is NOT always the case. But because he only recently found out about this, last I read he tried to be aggressive once, and then gave up when she didn't immediately respond the way he hoped.

 

To me, ending a relationship without putting in some real effort is throwing out the baby with the bathwater.

[oldshirt]

I may not have expressed myself very well. Believe me, I may be female, but as far as the perspective on sex goes, I tend to relate more to the man's point of view than the woman's. Just take a look at the "in a marriage without sex" thread and you'll see I'm one of those "shallow" people who wouldn't (and couldn't) stay in a marriage without sex. I don't just like sex, I NEED it (yeah yeah, save your breath).

 

My point was that it sounds like the OP and his GF have BOTH been holding back, possibly for fear of what the other will think, possibly wondering if it's "okay." Maybe the reason - in the beginning - that the GF was able to cut loose without caring with old dude is because she didn't care about him or what he thought of her. If he was so shocked he walked away, who cares? She hasn't really lost anything. But shocking OP so that he might walk away? THAT scared her.

 

Now they have an established (up to now) tame, somewhat "vanilla" sex life. He knows she is up for more, and she knows he knows she had more. She probably feels embarrassed that she did that with someone else, and even though he may be making it clear that he wants it, she may still be tentative.

 

That is why I suggested taking time and letting things evolve. NOT because I buy the BS that women only give sex for love and men only give love for sex. I am a walking proof that that is NOT always the case. But because he only recently found out about this, last I read he tried to be aggressive once, and then gave up when she didn't immediately respond the way he hoped.

 

To me, ending a relationship without putting in some real effort is throwing out the baby with the bathwater.

 

 

 

I agree with much of what you have said, including that it won't (and shouldn't ) happen overnight.

 

 

They are both nonvirginal adults and both seem motivated to work this out so I'm sure they understand that will work within their own comfort zones at their own pace.

[oldshirt]

Here is your biggest problem. Expecting men to feel like women. Sorry, but most men are not effeminate. Trying to impose the way women feel on men is stupid. Men are going to respond favorably to wild sex. Nothing you do can change that. It's reality, learn to accept it.

 

And sex is important in marriage, the #1 thing that makes men feel loved when in a serious relationship. Accept reality.

 

 

 

English isn't Iguana's primary language so a little latitude is needed in both how she assimilates our posts as well as how we interpret her's. I can tell she is also a bit of a romantic so I'm not sure how much reality she even wants to accept LOL

 

 

Perhaps this is another way to word it - sexuality is the pathway through which men give and receive romantic love and intimacy.

 

 

Sexuality is what makes a man's special someone "special". Without it, someone is simply another friend or fishing buddy at best, or more likely just another woman on the street.

 

 

along with that, if a man doesn't feel like he has her full sexual desire and attraction, he does not feel like he is "special" to her and does not feel like they have a "special" relationship if she does not desire him.

 

 

He will also feel that he is less "special" and just another face in the crowd if he believes that she has more sexual desire and attraction for another man, EVEN IF she has more warm feelings and love and affection etc for him and has a better relationship with him.

 

 

A woman may not feel that way about her own feelings and may not put as much priority on her own sexual feelings, but that is how a man feels about it regardless of it is a woman's reality or not.

 

 

Does that help either of you?

 

 

You have each expressed yourselves well but neither of you are going to change the other one's perspective on it. Neither of you are going to "win." the best you can achieve here is to understand where the other is coming from.

[janedoe67]

In my marriage, I was the one who viewed sex as the thing that made him "special." without it HE was just MY fishing buddy lol

 

I'll put it out there. I was very destructive in my method of dealing with sex-starvation. I made a horrible choice, and part of that choice included being with people "just for crazy sex." Yeah, you can let your hair down with a stranger. But do you know what it feels like when you leave?

 

Well, for me, it felt like dirty, empty, lonely NOTHING. I may very well be projecting, but from the way he has described things, I see his GF as someone who did the "crazy stranger" thing and found it empty. She wants MORE. What she will need to realize is that she can have BOTH with the OP. The crazy sex AND the more.

 

Personally, I think she hit the jackpot.

[road]

A woman reacts to what the man offers her sexually and so does the man. There are things you want to do only with someone you don't care about and things you want to do only with someone you love. It drives you crazy the thought that your gf/wife may have done something wilder with another man in the past and you don't get this wild thing, doesn't it? ...... She has the right to choose what she will share with her partner sexually. Having done once something wild does not give the right to her present partner to demand this from her. Does this mean her present partner is getting leftovers? No. It means she is now more mature, she may feel she is not ready yet to share this experience with her partner or she didn't even like this thing when she did it and she doesn't want to repeat it. Whichever reason she has, she has the right to choose. If her partner gets so frustrated that she doesn't do this wild thing with him.

 

 

How is a BH to not think and feel that he comes in second place to the OM when the WW will not give her BH what she gave her OM?

 

This couple does not have less acts of sex necessarily rather than different sex than the one she had with the old man. In men's eyes this may mean that the less wild sex is worse, but that's rarely right for a woman.

 

If the WW did a,b,c,d,f with the OM and will now only do a,b,c,d with her BH. The WW has limited the sex acts that she will do with her BH. The BH is getting less quantity and maybe even quality.

[Iguanna]

road,

 

We have already accepted (and so has the OP) that this 4 months thing she had with the old man was not an affair cause they had just started dating, so we are not talking about a BH here, rather than a bf who happened to find out some of the past sexual acts of his gf an he is not even sure that she enjoyed it, regardless what the messages were saying. The facts are that shehe chose OP rather than the old man and she chose to love him and be in a serious relationship with him. Whether she settled or whether she will become wilder in the future or not, we don't know. The fact is that she has the choice to not do the same things she did in her past with her bf, for whatever valid or stupid reasons she has.

 

Moonie,

 

I can't argue about what a man wants from a relationship. I'm sure you know better, being a man. I guess it's the harsh reality that through sex men feel special for a woman. I guess as oldshirt said I'm too romantic to accept this. In fact I find it kind of shallow but I guess that's the truth. But does this mean a woman is obliged to do wild things in sex just to keep a man? I don't know. Everyone has their own limits and everyone makes their own compromises. It's all about what you get and what you give. We are all more or less settling. I'm not scared to settle cause there is no perfect relationship. So I guess I'll try to settle for things that are less important for me, isn't it logical? If my husband thinks that he can't settle for what he considers important, then I'll deal with it.

[SD1000]

Emotional security in an R, contrary to what some folks think, is a gateway to intimacy. And true sexual intimacy is what you want. That's the place where it's safe to experiment and to be oneself without fear of rejection or feeling foolish.

 

 

 

Yes, I agree. I am first looking for emotional intimacy and then the more expressive sexual passion to follow.

[SD1000]

However the baggage from an affair. Is that the BH lost to the OM. The OM was the victor. Even though it was temporary the WW chose the OM over the BH.

 

 

 

 

From the text messages, I can see that they had sex a total of four times during the first summer. Once in May and three times in July. In mid July, she sent him a message that the relationship is not what she is looking for. His reply was "Ok, no problem". However, on July 21 they started meeting again three more times. They did not contact again from early August until mid September. In mid September, he sent her a message that said he misses her. She replied to him that while he is attractive, this is not the kind of relationship she wants. After that, there are no messages between the two until five months later when he contacted her and said that he misses her. She did not reply.

 

 

Also as a reminder, I am not a BH because we are not married. During that summer 2012, we were apart for four months. Before those four months, we had only spent 12 days together before I had to leave for four months.

 

 

She told me last night that she was dishonest with me because she was selfish and didn't want to lose the opportunity with me. However, she had been cheated before and wasn't sure that she could trust me until we spent more time together later.

[SD1000]

What else you need to prove that she loves you?!

 

In my opinion, "enjoy" doing things she normally hate just for you is the highest form of love.

Did she do these things to OM?! Of course not. She did it only for you.

 

 

 

Yes, I agree that that type of love is also very important. I know that she did not have any kind of love like that for the OM. However, I also think that a passionate part of love is also important and that is what I have been not confident about. That is what I also need and will try to determine if it is there and just needs to grow.