Leigh 87 Posted July 12, 2014 Share Posted July 12, 2014 Bonnie! He IS not in love with you. He IS in love with HER. Men who are madly in love do not do the things this man has done to you. He is only with you because you have children together. Sorry. He is NOT trying to make this work with you because he is head over heels in love with you. Why can't you see that? Why can't you see that your partner is more on love with HER than he is with YOU? If the man WAS genuinly in love with you, he would not have fallen in love with another woman in the first place. Men who are deeply in love don't fall for other woman. Why can't you see the obvious He will leave you anyway so you will soon see that we were all right, sadly 2 Link to post Share on other sites
BC1980 Posted July 12, 2014 Share Posted July 12, 2014 My point is more that he should have nothing to do with her, not doing her favours and not writing references for her when he's not even her manager...she said it was because he knows her a lot better Also, she has caused a lot of trouble for him, she went to HR about me and me/him If he really wanted to be with you, he would avoid this woman like the plague. I almost wonder if he is forcing you to leave him, so he won't be the man who leaves his girlfriend and children. Society looks harshly upon a man who leaves a woman with two young children for another woman. That would be a hard burden to bear, and I'm also sure he has a conscience and would feel terrible guilt over breaking up his family. Still, it doesn't mean he is completely happy with you or that he loves you in the way he should. Here's the harsh truth. If you didn't have kids together, he probably would have left you for her by now. This situation is so sad, and I feel for you. You deserve so much better than this guy. 4 Link to post Share on other sites
Zahara Posted July 12, 2014 Share Posted July 12, 2014 ^^^ This ^^^ It almost seems as if he's doing things to provoke you to leave. Passively pushing you to do what he cannot do. What you think a man should be doing to try and save his family and his behind, he's doing the very opposite. I don't think he's being openly honest to foster trust, I think he's blatantly provoking you -- giving you signs in a passive aggressive manner. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Jaaded Posted July 12, 2014 Share Posted July 12, 2014 Bonnie I don't think we can help you at this point. You consistently choose to ignore all the major issues and continue to point he finger at this other woman. SHE ISNT THE PROBLEM. Your relationship is screwed up because your boyfriend betrayed your trust and strayed. Now you are stuck in this crappy situation where you are over-analyzing every little interaction between them. And your boyfriend continues to entertain the idea of being civil and kind to her because....he still has feelings for her. Not because he doesn't want her to go to HR again....that's a load if crap. Right now he's trying to be a nice guy to her and also trying to appease you as well. If he really love you and wanted to make this work...he would avoid her. He could tell her to reach out to someone else in management if she needs assistance but he doesn't. Why? I also agree with other posters that he is just biding his time now. He's waiting for you to leave him. He doesn't have the balls to leave you so he wants you to make that decision for him. He probably feels trapped in his life with you....is that how you want to live? With a partner who is dishonest with how they feel....dishonest in their actions? 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Leigh 87 Posted July 12, 2014 Share Posted July 12, 2014 Bonnie, There are plenty of relationships where the man is in love with his partner, far too much so for him to fall for another woman. Why do you insist on staying with this low grade type of love from a man? The type of "love" where he falls in love with another woman? I am SURE this man loves you as a person and as the mother of his children! You seem very ignorant as to the types of ways a man can love a woman! Your partner is IN love with this woman; he likely thought about her all the time, looked forward to seeing her. He felt passionate. With you? Sorry but your partner loves you as the mother of his children and that is it - if he felt a romantic, IN love feeling towards you he would not have been able to fall in love with another. When a man is genuinely in love he doesn't fall in love with more than one person, unless he is naturally polyamarous by nature. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Space Ritual Posted July 12, 2014 Share Posted July 12, 2014 Hello, Bonnie!! On Page 16 of this thread I told you I would be back in 2 months to check how you were doing. I also challenged you at that time to prove me wrong when I said that little would change unless you decided to show this doofus some real world consequence. I'm sorry to see that 2 months hence you are still basically in the same place you were. with a couple of added headaches. I don't like being right in situations like this but I would urge you to reread this entire thread and every response you have gotten from everyone. I logged on hoping to see good news from you on how you had taken control of the situation and acted in a decisive manner that most of us have been advocating. To say I am sad for you would be an understatement, So I am going to just ask one time.....at a thread consisting of well over 20 pages and a situation that has done nothing but deteriorate from page 1 to present, exactly what are you gaining from continuing it? If anything you now for all intents and purposes have an open relationship with a man whose actions constantly indicate he could give a damn what you think. Please get into some sort of Individual Counseling and find out why you continue to allow yourself to be treated like a doormat. I'm very sorry you are still at the same spot:( 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Bonnie27 Posted July 14, 2014 Share Posted July 14, 2014 That’s a real eye opener regarding the forcing me to leave him thing. BC1980, you are right about him having a conscience…it would destroy him (and me). And also he’d definitely be avoiding her like the plague, wouldn’t he? A few friends said maybe he’s just talking to her to keep a better atmosphere at work, but he doesn’t even work with her now so they have no NEED to talk, therefore………..? He can be a little dumb about stuff, but still, he’d stay well away no matter what…even though he said it was a work issue, he hadn’t spoken to her in five months, so WHY now? (yes, I asked him this and he said it was his responsibility to find out the answer, so he did) If he really love you and wanted to make this work...he would avoid her. He could tell her to reach out to someone else in management if she needs assistance but he doesn't. Why? I don’t want to say because he has feelings for her still…but is that what EVERYONE here thinks? Is there ANYthing else it could be? Space Ritual – I don’t know if I’ll leave him, but this board has helped me so much especially with stuff my friends won’t say to me or stuff I won’t share with real life people Link to post Share on other sites
Keke1 Posted July 14, 2014 Share Posted July 14, 2014 That’s a real eye opener regarding the forcing me to leave him thing. BC1980, you are right about him having a conscience…it would destroy him (and me). And also he’d definitely be avoiding her like the plague, wouldn’t he? A few friends said maybe he’s just talking to her to keep a better atmosphere at work, but he doesn’t even work with her now so they have no NEED to talk, therefore………..? He can be a little dumb about stuff, but still, he’d stay well away no matter what…even though he said it was a work issue, he hadn’t spoken to her in five months, so WHY now? (yes, I asked him this and he said it was his responsibility to find out the answer, so he did) I don’t want to say because he has feelings for her still…but is that what EVERYONE here thinks? Is there ANYthing else it could be? Space Ritual – I don’t know if I’ll leave him, but this board has helped me so much especially with stuff my friends won’t say to me or stuff I won’t share with real life people Is it really helping you? The questions you are asking are leading to circular advice. You want to hear it may be something else? Well from what you have posted it seems like he has emotionally checked out of your relationship. It does not look good. You should not be having this **** on your mind towards a loved one. Link to post Share on other sites
Jaaded Posted July 14, 2014 Share Posted July 14, 2014 (edited) Bonnie - bottom line if he truly wanted to make this relationship work with you: 1. He would've left his job. Or, if it's not possible to quit he tells her to deal with another manager when she needs assistance...not him. But yet he continues to keep the path to communication open with her.... 2. He wouldn't blame the fact he can't talk to her on the fact his girlfriend - who may or may not flip out again. That's bs that he said that and a cowards way out! 3. HE WOULDNT HAVE CHEATED IN THE FIRST PLACE. A side note on the incident at your kids swim lesson. How do we know that your husband didn't tell her during casual conversation that his kid had a lesson and that he would be there on that day and time?? Maybe she did come there on purpose just to get a rise out of both of you. If I were a young 20 something with a chip on my shoulder about this guy.....I may have purposefully showed up. Maybe to rub it in his face and make him feel sad. Or maybe to aggravate the betrayed girlfriend who screamed in my face. Just a thought. Edited July 14, 2014 by Jaaded Autocorrect :( Link to post Share on other sites
Bonnie27 Posted July 14, 2014 Share Posted July 14, 2014 I'll reply properly to those actually trying to help but just wanted to say - Stillafool, if you don't want to read this, don't. The choice is yours. I'm not personally asking you for help. Others are stillreplying and for that I am so grateful. As I've already said, this board is my sounding board. I don't andhaven't told anyone in real life bar the one friend I've mentioned, the whole story. This is my lifeline regarding this situation...but I'm sorry that it's not entertaining enough for you and you've reduced me to tears when I'm fragile enough as it is...and no, I won't 'give it a rest', others have replied of their own free will and nobdy has the right to tell anyone else to stop talking about a situation that is affecting their life Link to post Share on other sites
William Posted July 14, 2014 Share Posted July 14, 2014 Thread starter, moderation has taken care of this issue, we apologize and I will leave your response intact so we know exactly who it was and what resulted. In the future, in any circumstance, simply press the 'alert us' button on a post like this and alert us. We have the tools to handle such situations. Thank you and please continue. Link to post Share on other sites
BC1980 Posted July 15, 2014 Share Posted July 15, 2014 That’s a real eye opener regarding the forcing me to leave him thing. BC1980, you are right about him having a conscience…it would destroy him (and me). And also he’d definitely be avoiding her like the plague, wouldn’t he? A few friends said maybe he’s just talking to her to keep a better atmosphere at work, but he doesn’t even work with her now so they have no NEED to talk, therefore………..? He can be a little dumb about stuff, but still, he’d stay well away no matter what…even though he said it was a work issue, he hadn’t spoken to her in five months, so WHY now? (yes, I asked him this and he said it was his responsibility to find out the answer, so he did) I don’t want to say because he has feelings for her still…but is that what EVERYONE here thinks? Is there ANYthing else it could be? Space Ritual – I don’t know if I’ll leave him, but this board has helped me so much especially with stuff my friends won’t say to me or stuff I won’t share with real life people I don't know if he consciously wants you to leave him, but he seems to be ambivalent at the very least. He's not doing much to make you stay is what I'm getting at. Sometimes, the ambivalency is worse because it festers until someone else comes along, which is exactly what happened here. Link to post Share on other sites
Bonnie27 Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 Oh I see what you mean... :/ He finally said he understands he should have said no to the reference though he also told me she’d sent him an email asking if he’d sent it off yet. He’s said to me that he wished he’d said no but doesn’t see how he can say no to her now and feels he has to do it He said she’d also recommended a job she’d seen when looking for herself and he was considering applying for it as ‘she was right, it would make him happier than’ the one he didn’t get Link to post Share on other sites
ExpatInItaly Posted July 18, 2014 Share Posted July 18, 2014 Well, they've found a way to get back in each other's life. These two are in love, Bonnie. They will continue finding ways to get closer, and there you are just watching it all happen. This is going to get worse for you than it already is. I could not in a million years imagine living that kind of life. It's sad for you but you apparently are willing to accept crappy treatment and a man who doesn't love you. Yikes. 4 Link to post Share on other sites
hoping2heal Posted July 18, 2014 Share Posted July 18, 2014 Oh I see what you mean... :/ He finally said he understands he should have said no to the reference though he also told me she’d sent him an email asking if he’d sent it off yet. He’s said to me that he wished he’d said no but doesn’t see how he can say no to her now and feels he has to do it He said she’d also recommended a job she’d seen when looking for herself and he was considering applying for it as ‘she was right, it would make him happier than’ the one he didn’t get And there you have it, the writing on the wall (if it were not clear enough). The fact is, he very much CAN still say no. There is no gun to his head. He is choosing to KEEP an obligation to her, at the cost of hurting you. In other words, it's down to her or you. One of you will get hurt and one can be spared and who does he pick? Not you. I don't envy you in any way. Having a new baby to take care of while your partner loves someone else is no doubt an utter pile of *****. Leaving is no doubt easier said than done, even in the case that he does love someone else. But, there's nothing now you can do about what's already been done. He's already cheated, he's already fallen in love with another woman, and there's nothing to be resolved. What you can do something about is your future. You don't deserve to live like this and you deserve to be in love and be loved back. You're not going to get that from this guy because his heart belongs to someone else. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Leigh 87 Posted July 18, 2014 Share Posted July 18, 2014 I have a friend that is not in love with her husband. She is great! However, she admits she is only with her husband because of her kids. She wants to wait until her kids are out of the house before she files for divorce. I understand that some mothers want to remain with their children's father. But personally, I think it is foolish to remained married purely because of "the kids". Why not go and find true love with a man who loves you back? Your kids can still have a good shot at growing up unto well adjusted and healthy adults! Separating from your children's father doesn't have to make your children's lives any less fulfilling. We all go through traumas, you never know what is around the corner, something far worse than separating could happen and your kids can pretty much recover from anything if they have love, support and they are positive little people who want to lead a productive and happy life. You can be "that women", like the woman your partner is so blatantly in love with; wouldn't you LOVE to be with a partner who felt THAT way about you? While still raising your children to be independent and healthy adults? You can have it all, just not with your current partner. You CAN have it all Bonnie, true love and a happy home life with your kids! Just not with THIS man! Link to post Share on other sites
Bonnie27 Posted July 18, 2014 Share Posted July 18, 2014 Thank you for your posts, i am listening and digesting but I'm reeling from the conversation we just had He was honest, I think, I don't really knowwhat to think. He said she's trying to talk to him more and when she's around he's doing everything he can not to look at her or interact with her but she doesn't seem to leave him be I saw her name flash up on his phone today as we had this conversation...she'd sent him a text to 'warn' him she'll be in tomorrow after what he said to her last week. She said that she'd protect our children from anything and it's not her he has to worry about. She said he hurt her too and that out of choosing what she has of whenever she gets to use the facility and what I have, him, she knows what she'd choose He sat there looking genuinely thrown/puzzled...I don't know WTF I just walked out and left the house for now WTF Link to post Share on other sites
2sunny Posted July 18, 2014 Share Posted July 18, 2014 He's still communicating with her? He's still focused on her? What about you? Do you even think he cares at all about you and your feelings? Link to post Share on other sites
Leigh 87 Posted July 19, 2014 Share Posted July 19, 2014 Bonnie, these are not the actions of a man who is in love with you. Im so sorry you have to deal with all this.. She cannot keep away from him and he cannot just cut all contact because they are in love.. When people are in love, they fight for every little chance to communicate..whether it is a glance, a text message or asking for a reference. If your partner was adamant that you were the love of his life and you were the woman he truly wanted to wage up next to, he would have cut all contact with this woman. Look, you do not seem to believe that he is not in love with you. You say that you do still think there is hope that he is in love with you because he is so good with the children, and he is holding your hand and being a " good partner " You need to understand that your partners actions are not that of a man who is in love WOTH YOU. His actions clearly demonstrate that she is who he loves, not you. You shouldnt have to deal with all this! You have done nothing to deserve this, this man needs to start doing the right thing: he either needs to leave you and let you free to be with a man who is in love with you and who wont full in love with another woman OR, he needs to make the decision that you are the woman he loves above all else. He needs to put you out of your misery. Or better still, you need to get up some real courage and leave your partner so that he can go and be with the woman he does truly want to be with.. Let her have him, he is no prize! Just look at how he handled this! Instead of coming snd being honest with you, he loved and made you look like a lunatic in public when you confronted her. Something has gotta give, Bonnie. You cannot live like this. Enough already. Tell him you've had enough and wish to either get serious about being together or of he would be happier with her, so please leave. Link to post Share on other sites
ExpatInItaly Posted July 19, 2014 Share Posted July 19, 2014 Thank you for your posts, i am listening and digesting but I'm reeling from the conversation we just had He was honest, I think, I don't really knowwhat to think. He said she's trying to talk to him more and when she's around he's doing everything he can not to look at her or interact with her but she doesn't seem to leave him be I saw her name flash up on his phone today as we had this conversation...she'd sent him a text to 'warn' him she'll be in tomorrow after what he said to her last week. She said that she'd protect our children from anything and it's not her he has to worry about. She said he hurt her too and that out of choosing what she has of whenever she gets to use the facility and what I have, him, she knows what she'd choose He sat there looking genuinely thrown/puzzled...I don't know WTF I just walked out and left the house for now WTF What a complete and utter crock of BS That is not true whatsosever and I hope you're bright enough not to believe that. There is zero reason for them to be texting, emailing, etc. You know it and he knows it. But he doesn't give a crap. He keeps her around and you know exactly why. Months on and nothing has changed. You're still taking crap from him and I suspect you will continue to do so. It's completely cringe-worthy to read about; I'm sorry you're in this position, Bonnie...I don't know how you put up with a such a loser of a "boyfriend." Link to post Share on other sites
Jaaded Posted July 19, 2014 Share Posted July 19, 2014 (edited) She is trying to talk to him and texting him because he is still putting out vibes that it's ok. He wants to have contact with her still Bonnie. And now, he is only telling you what he wants to. There are probably many more conversations and glances that have occurred than you know about. But because you are choosing to stay with a liar and a cheat....this is what your future holds for you. You just said yourself "I think he's being honest with me..." - why do you want to live your life continuously wondering if your partner is telling you the truth??? It's madness! Also if he was remorseful and didn't want any contact with her he would make it crystal clear. He should change his number and not give it to her. He should be forceful when stating she can't approach him anymore. Instead he is allowing her to text, allowing her to converse with him. Sorry but he's not concerned about making things right with you at all. He is more concerned over how she feels than you. And did I read correctly earlier that she gave him a job suggestion?? wtf Bonnie. If he had been clear and direct with her about not approaching him....she would never had made comments like that. In fact, she would probably hate him, avoid him and maybe try to make him miserable. She would not be telling him about a new job she saw available. Again...WTF?! Edited July 19, 2014 by Jaaded 1 Link to post Share on other sites
blueskyday Posted July 19, 2014 Share Posted July 19, 2014 (edited) Bonnie, my friend, I have been where you are. You are rationalizing because you want to stay with a man you love. It's understandable. You are living on hope. Maybe you are even living on wishful thinking, which has no basis in reality. As long as you have hope, you will stay. Because you love him. When the pain of staying becomes greater than the pain of leaving, you will go. Of course he may leave before then, taking away your choice but still creating the opportunity for change. Everyone here has given you amazing insight and advice. I think it has helped you to begin to see. I know when I was in my own situation, I had to hear it over and over again to crack the shield of denial. So, think about what kind of man you want . Kind? Honest? Loyal? Write down the qualities of your ideal man. Then think about the guy you have. Write down next to those ideal qualities, his actual behavior. For instance , next to "honest" write down "lied repeatedly." Next to " loyal " write down "fell in love with another woman. " Repeat for whole list. What kind of guy do you ACTUALLY have at the moment? It's a reality check. Tell yourself the truth about him. Start there. Then set some boundaries. If he wants to stay with you, that he cuts off all contact from her and get a new phone number. List out a few more. What would make you feel safe? He should do things in order to stay. Or kick him out for a few months while he works on this stuff. Either way you need boundaries. Now. Close your heart down to him. You are pissed and have every right to be. Don't let him paint you as crazy or any part of a contributing factor in this mess. Anger is good, and keeps you sharp. Be careful not to act out of anger, however. Just use it as energy to enforce your boundaries. Get some in place now! Also, focus on you. You focus on him too much. Let him focus on you. Listen, when you build your life, you will discover your choices. Start with getting what you want and need in this situation. If he won't do it, then let him bugger off! Get tough. Stop talking to him about your feelings. He knows. You don't have to explain disrespect. Ok? For now, don't worry about leaving. Create a boundary. It's a fence to keep you safe. When you are strong, you will most likely not want to deal with this crap, and you will leave. It's hard now because you are vulnerable. Take care of you! Now. Stop trying to fix him. What do you need today to feel better? Hug Edited July 19, 2014 by blueskyday 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Space Ritual Posted July 19, 2014 Share Posted July 19, 2014 I saw her name flash up on his phone today as we had this conversation...she'd sent him a text to 'warn' him she'll be in tomorrow after what he said to her last week. She said that she'd protect our children from anything and it's not her he has to worry about. She said he hurt her too and that out of choosing what she has of whenever she gets to use the facility and what I have, him, she knows what she'd choose He sat there looking genuinely thrown/puzzled...I don't know WTF I just walked out and left the house for now WTF And you should just have kept on walking. You do realize that still do this day you have not given him one single actual concrete consequence for any of this, don't you? I know it sucks to know you will always be Plan B for somebody you love. But he does not love you...Oh he can tell you he does with his puppy dog eyes, but can you seriously say by ANY of his actions he possibly really. Truly could? I'm very sorry to sound like I am being insensitive here, and it s not my intention, but I am afraid you are going to have to accept that by his constant foolhardy actions that you and your child are nothing more than an impediment to him at this point in his messed up mind. Honey, please save yourself and get some legal help and get him out of your life. There are so many guys on the planet that would give their right arm to be with someone like you. Don't waste anther tear on this jackwagon. ACT!!! 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Bonnie27 Posted July 20, 2014 Share Posted July 20, 2014 I actually believe that he never replies…but my friend pointed out that he probably just responds in person so there’s no paper trail Devils advocate for a moment – if he was telling the truth about her, even though they are on a ‘friendly’/civil basis, rather than not replying and avoiding her that way, you would go down some official channel…otherwise that would just encourage her?? She is trying to talk to him and texting him because he is still putting out vibes that it's ok. He wants to have contact with her still Bonnie. Do you think, playing devils advocate, that he is just allowing it as he’s being cowardly and is scared if he tells her to stay away? You did read correctly that she emailed about him doing her reference and pointed out a job that would make him ‘happier’……………………… Blueskyday…thank you for the post, it resonated with me. I don’t want to get too deep, so I’ll keep it as a genuine thank you Link to post Share on other sites
2sunny Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 Your man isn't doing enough to protect your relationship. How does that make you feel? He's allowed another woman in and isn't planning to get rid of her. You shouldn't have to lead him around by the nose. He's doing this purposely. It hurts you. That's not loving behavior. I can't see any good reason yo stay with him. Are you willing to leave him? Link to post Share on other sites
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