Would like perspective from WSs

[Fury]

I am just trying and struggling to understand many different why's. And I realize that every person is different, variety of circumstances and personalities, but please explain to me what goes on in WS's mind/heart when you chose to cheat.

 

It has been 2 months since my D-Day. Very recently I discovered more details about boyfriend's affair. I found notes that he wrote to other woman back in November, 3 weeks before I busted him. He professed his love for her, was telling what an amazing person she was (yeah, she had her own boyfriend and knew that he and I were living together) and how she and her kids were the most amazing thing that happened to him.

 

What makes me mad is the lying. If he came out and told me "I'm in love with someone else", I would be furious but could at least understand. But when I was still suspicious and didn't know anything, I asked and he lied.

 

So, if you are ever so in love with another person, why not just leave? I cannot get over feeling of being used, demeaned, devalued. Is it possible to love two people at once?

 

Sorry for the rambly post, but I am really confused and want to have at least a bit of clarity or basic understanding.

[sidney2718]

It is hard answering your question without more information. But I will offer one possibility. He wanted to have sex with her. To do that he had to make himself appear as something other than just a player. So he has problems in his relationship with you and of course she's about the best ever. Who hates being told that?

 

I don't know if you two are married. You refer to him as a WS (wandering spouse) but also as a boyfriend. It doesn't make a difference. You'll need to dump him in the end. Why? Because of the fact that your bedwarmer is on the lookout for another bed to warm.

 

As for lying, he's likely not lying. If he can't have the other woman, he'll take you. After all, he likes you or he'd have already dumped you. And don't forget, he may only get a trial bedwarming contract from the other woman, so why would he dump you?

[Fury]

As for lying, he's likely not lying. If he can't have the other woman, he'll take you. After all, he likes you or he'd have already dumped you. And don't forget, he may only get a trial bedwarming contract from the other woman, so why would he dump you?

 

Oh, this makes me nauseous, really, really nauseous to think that he might feel that way about me (or anyone about their partner, for that matter). But I am grateful for honesty. It's what I crave at the moment. Brutal it may be, it is better than trying to sugar-coat it or justify it in my mind. As for our status, he is my boyfriend, but we have been living together for 2 years, dated for a year before that.

[Furious]

I am just trying and struggling to understand many different why's. And I realize that every person is different, variety of circumstances and personalities, but please explain to me what goes on in WS's mind/heart when you chose to cheat.

 

It has been 2 months since my D-Day. Very recently I discovered more details about boyfriend's affair. I found notes that he wrote to other woman back in November, 3 weeks before I busted him. He professed his love for her, was telling what an amazing person she was (yeah, she had her own boyfriend and knew that he and I were living together) and how she and her kids were the most amazing thing that happened to him.

 

What makes me mad is the lying. If he came out and told me "I'm in love with someone else", I would be furious but could at least understand. But when I was still suspicious and didn't know anything, I asked and he lied.

 

So, if you are ever so in love with another person, why not just leave? I cannot get over feeling of being used, demeaned, devalued. Is it possible to love two people at once?

 

Sorry for the rambly post, but I am really confused and want to have at least a bit of clarity or basic understanding.

 

 

I like your user name...it's similar to mine...:D:D

 

I'm no way "furious" anymore as i have learned a great deal in the past couple of years. In the early days and months after discovering I had been cheated on and been lied to, there was an overwhelming urge to understand the cheater and how they could lie to your face day in and day out while living a double life.

 

I learned and realized through time that cheaters are not as complex as we may imagine them to be. Cheating is quite simple, it's easier to cheat than it is to not to cheat. Cheating requires only a couple of elements....#1...the ability to deceive and a sense of entitlement. Whereas....fidelity and authenticity requires courage, empathy, sacrifice , honesty and most importantly respect.

 

Too often a betrayed person devotes too much emphasis on untangling the ball of knots a cheater creates.

 

Trust...that a cheater doesn't even understand themselves, never mind that you are desperate to figure them out....they're a mystery to you as much as they are a mystery to themselves.

 

It's not your job to figure them out or even fix them....that's something they must do for themselves. Some dig deep and are remorseful....some do not.

 

At this point...the only thing you should do is deflect the energy you're spending on a cheater and focus on yourself. Divert your resources and energy in reinvesting in your self esteem.

 

Being cheated on is not about you.....and your value is not determined by a cheater.

 

People can fall out of love...but only those that are character disturbed fall out of love and respect and are usually those that cheat.

 

Basically, most cheaters do not have the courage to be honest with themselves much less the person they claim to love.

[experiencethedevine]

I like your user name...it's similar to mine...:D:D

 

I'm no way "furious" anymore as i have learned a great deal in the past couple of years. In the early days and months after discovering I had been cheated on and been lied to, there was an overwhelming urge to understand the cheater and how they could lie to your face day in and day out while living a double life.

 

I learned and realized through time that cheaters are not as complex as we may imagine them to be. Cheating is quite simple, it's easier to cheat than it is to not to cheat. Cheating requires only a couple of elements....#1...the ability to deceive and a sense of entitlement. Whereas....fidelity and authenticity requires courage, empathy, sacrifice , honesty and most importantly respect.

 

Too often a betrayed person devotes too much emphasis on untangling the ball of knots a cheater creates.

 

Trust...that a cheater doesn't even understand themselves, never mind that you are desperate to figure them out....they're a mystery to you as much as they are a mystery to themselves.

 

It's not your job to figure them out or even fix them....that's something they must do for themselves. Some dig deep and are remorseful....some do not.

 

At this point...the only thing you should do is deflect the energy you're spending on a cheater and focus on yourself. Divert your resources and energy in reinvesting in your self esteem.

 

Being cheated on is not about you.....and your value is not determined by a cheater.

 

People can fall out of love...but only those that are character disturbed fall out of love and respect and are usually those that cheat.

 

Basically, most cheaters do not have the courage to be honest with themselves much less the person they claim to love.

 

 

 

 

Bravo Furious!

 

 

Jolly good post and spot on old bean!

[janedoe67]

I must have misread the thread title. Never mind.

[Fluttershy]

I must have misread the thread title. Never mind.

 

Your reply would have been welcomed by some.

 

I am not a WS but I would say. Some people are creeps and some people have conflicting emotions that cause them to say one thing because at the moment they mean it. BUt with some time and distance there head clears and they realize they were not talking with their heart like they thought but rather just out of the fantasy they created.

 

As to the why not leave thing it isn't really as simple as some people want to believe. I mean it is when your own emotions are involved or the ones confused. It is like telling someone who is being abused to just leave their partner. Sounds good and is the right thing to say but if it was really that easy or simple people wouldn't do it.

 

I agree in a case of just dating leaving would be simple. But people defend it all sorts of ways. We love to call it excuses but to the person who feels it at the time it is there reason. Maybe not a good reason but one none the less.

 

People may stay not to rock the boat. People may stay because they fear the unknown and know they have a relationship already. People may be waiting for the person they are involved with to leave. Sort of a chicken situation. People may actually love to people at once and be in a stage of choosing and don't want to do anything until they figure it out. OR want to keep them at all. Or they don't want to hurt their current person. I know many BS don't by this last one but I get it. So long as the person you are with doesn't know they don't feel they are hurting them. But when you break up you are hurting the person directly. IT could be just sex and all the things to get sex without meaning it. There are so many reasons and possibilities. I am not defending any of them. I believe cheating is wrong. But that doesn't mean I don't get the sometimes twisted thought process or have a desire to paint every situation with a broad brush and not delve into the circumstances.

[cozycottagelg]

I like your user name...it's similar to mine...:D:D

 

I'm no way "furious" anymore as i have learned a great deal in the past couple of years. In the early days and months after discovering I had been cheated on and been lied to, there was an overwhelming urge to understand the cheater and how they could lie to your face day in and day out while living a double life.

 

I learned and realized through time that cheaters are not as complex as we may imagine them to be. Cheating is quite simple, it's easier to cheat than it is to not to cheat. Cheating requires only a couple of elements....#1...the ability to deceive and a sense of entitlement. Whereas....fidelity and authenticity requires courage, empathy, sacrifice , honesty and most importantly respect.

 

Too often a betrayed person devotes too much emphasis on untangling the ball of knots a cheater creates.

 

Trust...that a cheater doesn't even understand themselves, never mind that you are desperate to figure them out....they're a mystery to you as much as they are a mystery to themselves.

 

It's not your job to figure them out or even fix them....that's something they must do for themselves. Some dig deep and are remorseful....some do not.

 

At this point...the only thing you should do is deflect the energy you're spending on a cheater and focus on yourself. Divert your resources and energy in reinvesting in your self esteem.

 

Being cheated on is not about you.....and your value is not determined by a cheater.

 

People can fall out of love...but only those that are character disturbed fall out of love and respect and are usually those that cheat.

 

Basically, most cheaters do not have the courage to be honest with themselves much less the person they claim to love.

 

Fantastic post.

[carhill]

Man encounters attractive women; man pulls out 'seduce woman' box, examines content, inserts relevant updates from successful current relationship, stirs and applies.

 

It's really no more complex than that. Men are pragmatists. They do what works. A man who is successful with women knows how to be successful with women and can be successful with a wide variety of women. All that remains is choice.

 

Why does he lie? He knows how to be successful with women. He's been doing it for a long time, probably since sitting at dad's knee. Such behavioral aspects are learned and reinforced early. When found out, he simply moves on to the next dynamic if the contents of the 'how to save relationship' box fail in one particular circumstance. Men are risk takers; warriors; winners. Yes, sometimes they fail but they're always looking to win.

 

Sorry for your pain. Is fBF with this woman he's so in love with? My initial read was typical seduction patter. Heard it a million times. Watched men seduce other men's wives right in front of me. It's what men do. However, it's possible that he is 'so in love' with her. On a positive note, at least there's no marriage to unwind/decide. Small gifts. Good luck.

[oldshirt]

I've never cheated on my spouse so technically I'm not a cheating spouse but I did cheat on a long time GF of several years in my past so I have experience with cheating in a dating scenario which is what you are in.

 

You won't like to hear this but the reason I did it was because I didn't want to commit to one person and wanted to bang other chicks. I wanted my cake and to eat it too. I wanted a steady GF to do things with and to copy t on being there and to be a steady supply of sex. But I also wanted the fun and excitement of banging other chicks as the opportunity arose.

 

I also wanted to keep my options open if a bigger and better deal came along. Eventually one did. I was engaged with her in less than a year.

 

The fact your BF has been living with you without engagement (no proposal, no ring, no date of marriage) means that he is not committed to a life and family with you. Period.

 

He was/is keeping his options open while enjoying the stability and safety of having you at the house.

 

As there was no proposal, no ring, and no date set for marriage, this is simply a dating situation even though you collaborated. Dating is an interview and tryout process to determine if someone is the one that you want to marry and raise a family with or not. Either party is free to exit the process at will for any or for no reason.

 

He has shown you through his actions and behaviors that he does not see you as "the one" which he wishes to commit to, marry and raise a family with. If he did he would hav proposed marriage, bought a ring and sat down with a calendar and picked out a date.

 

As this was a tryout or audition for marriage, he has shown you his qualifications (or in this case, the lack thereof) as a husband and father.

 

Instead of viewing this in terms of 'why?', you should be viewing this as him doubling his interview and tryout.

 

I am sorry this has happened to you. But it's a million times better to learn this now than after you are married and with minor children.

[Fury]

Thanks guys. I do appreciate all replies. Some great insights there. What Furious said really resonated with me because at the moment I am stuck and cannot move on, focusing on him, her, everything else but myself! Let's face it, I cannot control other people's behaviors, but I could and should start with my own.

 

As for marriage, I had one of those. A 10-year-long one that ended in a very nasty divorce. My boyfriend (feels weird to call him that now) brought up the subject of marriage multiple times, and I let him know that I didn't not even want to consider it and just living together was just fine with me. Now after reading Oldshirt's post, I am starting to wonder if I gave him a reason to be more frivolous with our relationship...

 

Affair seems to have ended just before I confronted him. He insisted it was emotional affair and from what I read in the texts, it might have been, but then it might not. Makes me ill either way. Now he wants to move on with our relationship, but I can't seem to be able to. I read Shirley Glass's book, this forum, other articles. I read them, I feel better, but then back to square one. He says he is suffering too because he has caused me such pain. But I bounce between believing him and thinking he is just being manipulative. This whole thing really started affecting my health, my sleep, my functionality.

 

As I wrote in my original post, my initial decision was to leave the evening of D-Day, but he had a real nervous breakdown after I told him that I'd pack my stuff and leave once I am back from work. I stayed. Now I wonder if I should have gone through with it. Probably would have started healing by now...

 

Once again, I really appreciate you guys sharing your thought and opinions. Maybe eventually I will feel more calm and on a steadier ground regarding all this. In the meantime I will keep reading and trying to get better.

[Furious]

Thanks guys. I do appreciate all replies. Some great insights there. What Furious said really resonated with me because at the moment I am stuck and cannot move on, focusing on him, her, everything else but myself! Let's face it, I cannot control other people's behaviors, but I could and should start with my own.

 

As for marriage, I had one of those. A 10-year-long one that ended in a very nasty divorce. My boyfriend (feels weird to call him that now) brought up the subject of marriage multiple times, and I let him know that I didn't not even want to consider it and just living together was just fine with me. Now after reading Oldshirt's post, I am starting to wonder if I gave him a reason to be more frivolous with our relationship...

 

Affair seems to have ended just before I confronted him. He insisted it was emotional affair and from what I read in the texts, it might have been, but then it might not. Makes me ill either way. Now he wants to move on with our relationship, but I can't seem to be able to. I read Shirley Glass's book, this forum, other articles. I read them, I feel better, but then back to square one. He says he is suffering too because he has caused me such pain. But I bounce between believing him and thinking he is just being manipulative. This whole thing really started affecting my health, my sleep, my functionality.

 

As I wrote in my original post, my initial decision was to leave the evening of D-Day, but he had a real nervous breakdown after I told him that I'd pack my stuff and leave once I am back from work. I stayed. Now I wonder if I should have gone through with it. Probably would have started healing by now...

 

Once again, I really appreciate you guys sharing your thought and opinions. Maybe eventually I will feel more calm and on a steadier ground regarding all this. In the meantime I will keep reading and trying to get better.

 

 

Hang in there Fury....it's only been a couple of months since your d-day. So early on, it's normal to feel like your head is spinning and dealing with so many contradictory emotions.

 

You seem strong and know yourself. Trust that you are smart and with time and introspection you will know what is right for you.

[bv120]

I think most cheaters don't want to upset the apple cart. They chose to remain in their primary relationship and struggle to keep the status quo. For most the adultery or cheating is strictly a sexual outlet and not a pathway to a long term relationship. I know that has been the case for me and a number of my closest GFs.

[HPrynne]

please explain to me what goes on in WS's mind/heart when you chose to cheat.

 

So, if you are ever so in love with another person, why not just leave? I cannot get over feeling of being used, demeaned, devalued. Is it possible to love two people at once?

 

After years of encouraging, pushing, cajoling, begging my spouse to get help for his problems, and seeing nothing change, I finally gave up. My A was not a moment of weakness. It was a conscious choice, to try to make my life bearable. I see how misguided that was, now (should have insisted on the D), but at the time, in that desperate and lonely place, I didn't.

 

It sounds like that is probably not the case for you. Examine your relationship and your boyfriend. Try to figure out where the two of you were, and what happened. It could simply be that he was tempted and failed to hold himself back and safeguard his primary relationship (you). It's easy to fall for someone; doesn't mean it's real. It doesn't mean he didn't love you, while he was falling in love with this other woman. It does mean he had serious issues he needed to address - unclear from what you've said as to whether that's serial cheating, personal weakness, problems in the relationship with you, an attempt to get out of the relationship with you, or all of the above.

 

Don't assume you aren't loved because he cheated. Just that, almost certainly, the love he has to offer is unworthy of you.

[3blindmice]

I like your user name...it's similar to mine...:D:D

 

I'm no way "furious" anymore as i have learned a great deal in the past couple of years. In the early days and months after discovering I had been cheated on and been lied to, there was an overwhelming urge to understand the cheater and how they could lie to your face day in and day out while living a double life.

 

I learned and realized through time that cheaters are not as complex as we may imagine them to be. Cheating is quite simple, it's easier to cheat than it is to not to cheat. Cheating requires only a couple of elements....#1...the ability to deceive and a sense of entitlement. Whereas....fidelity and authenticity requires courage, empathy, sacrifice , honesty and most importantly respect.

 

Too often a betrayed person devotes too much emphasis on untangling the ball of knots a cheater creates.

 

Trust...that a cheater doesn't even understand themselves, never mind that you are desperate to figure them out....they're a mystery to you as much as they are a mystery to themselves.

 

It's not your job to figure them out or even fix them....that's something they must do for themselves. Some dig deep and are remorseful....some do not.

 

At this point...the only thing you should do is deflect the energy you're spending on a cheater and focus on yourself. Divert your resources and energy in reinvesting in your self esteem.

 

Being cheated on is not about you.....and your value is not determined by a cheater.

 

People can fall out of love...but only those that are character disturbed fall out of love and respect and are usually those that cheat.

 

Basically, most cheaters do not have the courage to be honest with themselves much less the person they claim to love.

 

This is one very great post!

[goodyblue]

There is no proper answer to this thread. Even if a WS answered, it still would only be that person's experience. Nobody knows what is going on in anothers thought processes and even if they tell you, it's still not the entire picture.

[janedoe67]

I learned and realized through time that cheaters are not as complex as we may imagine them to be. Cheating is quite simple, it's easier to cheat than it is to not to cheat. Cheating requires only a couple of elements....#1...the ability to deceive and a sense of entitlement. Whereas....fidelity and authenticity requires courage, empathy, sacrifice , honesty and most importantly respect.

 

I think this is also too simplisitic. Cheating requires only a couple of elements if you have actually been a cheater, and that's the only reason you chose to cheat. Otherwise it smacks of a BS analysing a WS, which you go on to saidy there is no point in wasting time doing...that even they don't know... so it's kinda contradictory. If I want to REALLY KNOW why people cheat, I think Im going to have to sort out BS's POV from WS POV. But more importantly, a BS telling us what is going on in the MIND of a WS is just not going to work. For obvious reasons.

 

I agree it is simplistic. But it has to be. It is the reason that requires zero self-evaluation. If we WS's are not just fundamentally damaged people, end of story, then some of our pain might be legitimate, and we can't have that.

 

It's not your job to figure them out or even fix them....that's something they must do for themselves. Some dig deep and are remorseful....some do not.

 

 

I think as a BS we do need to figure them out, but correct, not fix them. I think it is naive to believe that a long drawn out affair has no secondary effects in terms of your relationship with the WS. I think you do need to figure out some things about them, for example, did the EA and PA take them too far down the road? What is their new concept of "love"? An A changes BOTH partners, not just the BS. One consequence of the A is that your partner may not hold you up to the same standard they once did, having sampled more. I think you might want to know that before moving forward. Digging deep, and being remorseful HAS NOTHING SPECIFICALLY to do with the kind of relationship they might now be interested in, and it might be one that as a BS you are not it! The same can occur on a ONS! Your WS might be thinking sex is better anywhere but HERE.

 

I agree, and I would add to this that a WS being remorseful and digging deep and that alone will not determine the success of a post A marriage. If there were two-person problems in the marriage (and sorry folks, there ARE a lot of times), then the WS living a life of "mea culpa" alone is not going to fix the marriage....unless one is saying that once an A happens, it is the WS's job and penance to live a life of mea cupla while the BS looks on with satisfaction.

 

They are being TOTALLY honest with themselves. They found themselves in a marriage, they expected their S to meet ALL 100% of their needs and its not possible.

 

This I do not agree with. I NEVER expected my H to meet 100% of my needs. I'm not an idiot. I DID expect him to meet my needs for touch/sex/affection (because he was the only one who ethically could), I DID expect him to keep a job, I DID NOT expect him to look at porn and spend thousands of dollars on gaming so that we could not pay our bills.

 

My choice to cheat was unequivocally wrong. My husband's issues DID exist, and he DID commit betrayals of his own.

 

So now, for the first time on this thread asking for a WS's perspective....you have one. The fact that the ratio is 1-16 should tell you something.

[harrybrown]

Jane-

 

Thank you for your post.

[cocorico]

 

So now, for the first time on this thread asking for a WS's perspective....you have one. The fact that the ratio is 1-16 should tell you something.

 

Second - this post on the previous page also qualifies:

 

After years of encouraging, pushing, cajoling, begging my spouse to get help for his problems, and seeing nothing change, I finally gave up. My A was not a moment of weakness. It was a conscious choice, to try to make my life bearable. I see how misguided that was, now (should have insisted on the D), but at the time, in that desperate and lonely place, I didn't.

 

[William]

As it appears the thread starter logged off over a week ago and hasn't returned, we'll close this up and invite them to alert us if any updates/requests are forthcoming. Thanks for your participation!