Question for people 35+ who have never been married

[RedRobin]

Well, it was only a matter of time before this thread became a magnet for the users...

 

 

I do get it that the world is full of effed up people. Coming to LS just makes it that much easier to avoid some of you guys IRL. Thanks!!

 

 

...and Gaius... you are spot on. It occurred to me the other day when I was driving home.

 

 

I've worked around or interacted with 1000's of men in my life. So what if a handful of them were predators, or users, or whatever? So what if LS attracts more than it's fair share of those too...

 

 

Doesn't mean that there aren't a lot of good men left.

 

 

... and all *I* need is one!!! Thank goodness

[Anela]

Why do you zero in on and obsess over the 1 out of a 1000 which isn't even accurate?

 

It isn't just one - it's all over the place. It's been my personal experience on dating sites, as well. Except for a couple of poly guys, which I have no interest in (that lifestyle). I'm mostly hit on by much older men, or youngsters who want a bit on the side to learn from, and also cheaters. Men my own age? Barely any interest. I don't know why I spend any time here now, because it always deflates me, and I don't want to give that satisfaction to the idiots who promote such ideas.

[Buzzkill]

Well, it was only a matter of time before this thread became a magnet for the users...

 

 

I do get it that the world is full of effed up people. Coming to LS just makes it that much easier to avoid some of you guys IRL. Thanks!!

 

 

...and Gaius... you are spot on. It occurred to me the other day when I was driving home.

 

 

I've worked around or interacted with 1000's of men in my life. So what if a handful of them were predators, or users, or whatever? So what if LS attracts more than it's fair share of those too...

 

 

Doesn't mean that there aren't a lot of good men left.

 

 

... and all *I* need is one!!! Thank goodness

 

 

What users? A man doesn't use a woman when he has sex with her. Nor is he a user when he uses something other than genetically valued qualities like good-looks or height to attract women.

 

I don't even see wealthy men use their money to attract women from poor Countries. The men I know who entice the woman's interest in them are with women from developed Countries, with the exception of the Russian woman.

 

One of my German lady friends is the daughter of 2 of Berlin's most in-demand surgeons and she's married to the scion of a royal European Family, but that guy ain't a user, right?

[TXGuy]

That's a good decision. I don't date. I concern myself with getting good grades, building up my body, my social circles, getting connections in the real world, and preparing my future 30-something self to date the women who I see going for the Brad Pitts and the $$$ men.

 

That is a smart strategy. If you are a guy in your teens/20s and not in that 15% of men that the same age women are chasing, concentrating on your career, health, and hobbies is the best long term play. Mid thirties and up for successful men is like early twenties are for attractive women. It isn't like men are 'coming out ahead', we just had to wait longer for what women got earlier in life.

[Buzzkill]

Men my own age? Barely any interest.

 

 

Its a matter of balance. Look how easy it is for young women to attract men. They can attract players, romantics, starving artists, rich men, famous men. The woman doesn't even need to be attractive at all. Meanwhile, most of the young men have trouble finding a woman his own age willing to give him a shot. On the other hand, if the guy doesn't grow to be a slob/obese, he can have the same sexual options that a young woman has, in his 30s and up.

 

That is a smart strategy. If you are a guy in your teens/20s and not in that 15% of men that the same age women are chasing, concentrating on your career, health, and hobbies is the best long term play. Mid thirties and up for successful men is like early twenties are for attractive women. It isn't like men are 'coming out ahead', we just had to wait longer for what women got earlier in life.

 

haha, I know. I have several young women wanting to date me, to lock me down, after they've had their fun with the elite-looking men. Some of these young women are cute enough to introduce to my parents, but I would never spend resources, time, or my youth/future on them because I don't pay in any way or shape for what some other guy had for free.

 

I'd rather increase my value as a sexual partner piece by piece until I can either have the same arrangment the Russian model has with her beau, or I can get it by being better-looking than the men who are(in the future) younger than me. Life is too short for me to be a good boyfriend or good husband when it is the players and the trust-fund babies who're having all the fun.

[RedRobin]

I don't know, I don't sense any nonsense when Red talks. And I'm usually OK at sniffing that kind of stuff out. I agree with you about the vibe thing though. Which makes me curious as to what's going on with Red and all this unwanted attention.

 

 

It's the booty. Ok. Has to be. No other explanation... lol.

 

 

Seriously. I don't know. Maybe I'm just better at remembering this crap than others. And also I just happened to be interacting closer to more men than most... during a time and maybe a place where men felt they could take liberties. I'm not letting it go to my head.

 

I remember when you talked about your experience with the doctor and that met my definition of violation. Unless I dreamed it up. I'd also say offering you good grades for sex is a bit of a violation, but I guess everyone has a different definition. Just making you feel totally creeped out, unsafe and uncomfortable makes the grade in my book.

Yes. But *I* decide what is a true violation and what was not. He did go too far that day and he violated my trust. I had the last word though.

 

Just like I did with those professors. I got what I wanted. And that was a good grade in their class without having sex with them. I shouldn't have had to put up with it... but it is what it is. Because I didn't let them sidetrack me, I'm now in a position to call the shots.... or at least... more shots than I would have been able to call had I let them intimidate me. Call it a hazing, of sorts. Men go through hazing too... Just a different kind.

 

And I meant dinner in a date kind of sense. The idea that your value to men has somehow gone down because you're older isn't true. Maybe it is to some women who have nothing going except their looks. But it really is a truth that went out when women stopped having to rely on a husband for support.

Yes, yes... Thank you. I agree. When I am tempted to focus on the yucky... I have good friends and family who remind me otherwise... I'm fortunate that way Edited April 9, 2014 by RedRobin

[TXGuy]

Well, it was only a matter of time before this thread became a magnet for the users...

 

 

#1) I have not noticed any posts where men were advocating being users. One theory is that women are the users. They just seem to get upset that their ability to use men diminshes with age. I suggested that generally men have to put in 90% of the effort between the ages of 15 to 30, but from 35 to 50, the effort ratio drops to 50/50. Assuming this is true, women are still coming out way ahead. They are simply upset that they were unable to keep their unfair advantage throughout life, it only applied to their youth.

 

#2)I have never seen you rail about how unfair it is that men (under and over 35) are expected to, and generally do, most to all of the chasing and paying for dates. Who is really using who?

 

#3) I think the last few pages of this thread was refreshing and brought a healthy balance to it. Not too many pages ago it had devolved into a man-bashing echo chamber talking about how all the fabulous 35+ women could not find any 35+ men worthy of them.

[RedRobin]

It isn't just one - it's all over the place. It's been my personal experience on dating sites, as well. Except for a couple of poly guys, which I have no interest in (that lifestyle). I'm mostly hit on by much older men, or youngsters who want a bit on the side to learn from, and also cheaters. Men my own age? Barely any interest. I don't know why I spend any time here now, because it always deflates me, and I don't want to give that satisfaction to the idiots who promote such ideas.

 

If you DO go on dating sites, do yourself a favor... make sure that the ones not in your age range get filtered out and go to a separate folder. That way, you don't even have to look at them. In your own profile, make sure you state "this is my accurate age"... If you post pics, put a date on when they were taken. You will be surprised how many losers those simple actions filter out... and how many more decent ones that attract. Decent men are tired of women fudging in their profiles too.

 

LS does deflate me at times. I've learned a TON from it though... It has made it orders of magnitude easier for me to spot a decent guy in a crowd... and sift out all the ways that the not so decent guys have to try to weasel through filters...

 

 

Please try not to internalize it so much.

Edited April 9, 2014 by RedRobin

[Esther Tester]

I've been wondering about this topic myself. I know two women from Asia who are now in their forties. They've never been married. The first one claims she was going to to a great BF, but thought something better would come along after him. It didn't.

 

The second one is also similarly out of luck. She's tried on a bunch of guys and it always didn't happen. All of her family and friends are married except her. She claims many people remain single in their fifties, sixties and even beyond at church, though.

 

And my uncle, but voluntarily. He didn't get married since he couldn't handle a nagging wife.

[Buzzkill]

#1) I have not noticed any posts where men were advocating being users. One theory is that women are the users. They just seem to get upset that their ability to use men diminshes with age. I suggested that generally men have to put in 90% of the effort between the ages of 15 to 30, but from 35 to 50, the effort ratio drops to 50/50. Assuming this is true, women are still coming out way ahead. They are simply upset that they were unable to keep their unfair advantage throughout life, it only applied to their youth.

 

#2)I have never seen you rail about how unfair it is that men (under and over 35) are expected to, and generally do, most to all of the chasing and paying for dates. Who is really using who?

 

#3) I think the last few pages of this thread was refreshing and brought a healthy balance to it. Not too many pages ago it had devolved into a man-bashing echo chamber talking about how all the fabulous 35+ women could not find any 35+ men worthy of them.

 

 

Last semester I had one class start at 8 AM. Most of the people had to wake up at 6 AM to get there in time. The guys would arrive sleepy-eyed, messy hair, wrinkly clothes. The women would show up dressed, perfurmed, with their hair worked on and looking like they were heading for the premiere of whatever it is that is famous at the time.

 

They were looking for male attention. Most of them are. Showing up to school when its raining pratically snow and they're sporting mini-skirts or shorts shorts. Flirting with the men they have no interest in sleeping with because they can compete with other women for who is the most attractive. Every text message you send to them, everyone from her social group knows what you wrote.

 

The free dates. The money the guy spends on her, the attention he provides to her, and many of the women act as if you are their boyfriend but without the benefits. I had classmates of mine expect me to entertain them during our trip back home. One of my female classmates made a scene because I didn't sit next to her. Instead I went to sit down and listen to some music.

 

This girl wasn't one of those sillicone valley blonde girls. She was raised by traditional parents, she's homely looking, but still expects to be treated like Jen, the cheerleader.

 

You want to spend time with a woman in your 20s? You gotta beat off the other guys. She's always on facebook, twitter, instagram. She always has guys sending her pics. I mean, I'm in class, sitting next to this homely girl, and I begin to see her phone receive naked pictures from this greek-like guy, but somehow I'm a user because I strive to have the same sexual options and freedom that most - if not all - women have, lol.

 

don't take this the wrong way. I think its cute when the older women complain about men their own age being only interested in younger women. Ironically, the women who complain are the ones looking for marriage and children. The older women who have gone past that are eating me with their eyes, but since I'm a man, I must be the predator and the user.

[RedRobin]

#1) #2)I have never seen you rail about how unfair it is that men (under and over 35) are expected to, and generally do, most to all of the chasing and paying for dates.

 

 

Clearly, you don't follow my posts much if you really believe the above.

[Buzzkill]

Clearly, you don't follow my posts much if you really believe the above.

 

We do. We notice you put a lot of the blame on men. ''Can't find the man I want to marry me. ''

 

''Must be men's fault.''

 

''I only meet players.''

 

''It must be men's fault! They're not working hard enough to keep players away from me!''

 

Reminds me of this one woman who got pregnant by a good-for-nothing guy and then blamed it on me because I once spoke to him when I was 15 years old.

[RedRobin]

We do. We notice you put a lot of the blame on men. ''Can't find the man I want to marry me. ''

 

''Must be men's fault.''

 

''I only meet players.''

 

''It must be men's fault! They're not working hard enough to keep players away from me!''

 

 

 

I put exactly half the blame on men.... which is exactly where it should be.

 

 

I'm taking care of my part just fine....

 

 

....and no, I never said I only meet players. I meet lots of guys who claim to want a relationship with me who are full of shyte. That's not a player. That's just some guy who thinks a few words are going to make me fall for him. They all know they have to at least SAY they are looking for a relationship to get me to go on even ONE date with them. That's ok. Maybe they ARE looking for a relationship... maybe they DID want a relationship with me. I doubt it, but who knows? Maybe their idea of a 'relationship' is different than mine. It's possible. That is what dating is all about.

 

 

... and yea, I think it is high time other men police their own ranks... I mean, the legitimate good guys. Those guys realize that the lying *******s just make their job harder in the long run... AND... also are smart and realize that those who mistreat other people are bad bets as friends. Not trustworthy.

 

 

We get it that lots of you guys don't like being responsible though. That's too bad. Really is a shame.

[TXGuy]

... and yea, I think it is high time other men police their own ranks... I mean, the legitimate good guys. Those guys realize that the lying *******s just make their job harder in the long run... AND... also are smart and realize that those who mistreat other people are bad bets as friends. Not trustworthy.

 

 

We get it that lots of you guys don't like being responsible though. That's too bad. Really is a shame.

 

I just don't understand your position here (and from earlier in the thread). It seems like the problem you perceive is that women like to have sex with players. Your solution is that non-player men should shun the players to save these women from their own decisions.

 

I think I understand where you are coming from. I know one guy that was just a heel (or your definition of player). He just did not follow any socially acceptable boundaries. However, that guy was the exception, a very unusual case. From reading your posts, it would seem like the world is crawling with them. I suspect your line is much different from mine and many other peoples.

 

Another point I don't understand..I believe you have defined a player as a man who lies and deceives to get a woman into bed. I don't think that is the commonly accepted definition of a player. The commonly accepted definition is a guy that simply gets a lot of women into bed. I don't think that deception is implicit in the definition. But, assuming your definition is correct (deception is implicit or explicit), what is your term for a guy that beds many women without deception? I'm not being snarky here, I'm genuinely curious. Because there is a surprising number of women who are willing to go to bed with charming men where absolutely no deception is required.

[Els]

It isn't just one - it's all over the place. It's been my personal experience on dating sites, as well. Except for a couple of poly guys, which I have no interest in (that lifestyle). I'm mostly hit on by much older men, or youngsters who want a bit on the side to learn from, and also cheaters. Men my own age? Barely any interest. I don't know why I spend any time here now, because it always deflates me, and I don't want to give that satisfaction to the idiots who promote such ideas.

 

Oh, Anela. Honestly, don't worry about it. A 40+ year old lady my SO worked with married a man close to her age some time ago, we visited them in their house and they seemed very happy. They have a few gorgeous dogs, too. And a 50+ yo lady in the church I used to go to also married a man close to her age. Don't worry about the people who are extrapolating their own bitterness on to you.

 

Also, I think online dating might not be the best avenue for you.

[Buzzkill]

I just don't understand your position here (and from earlier in the thread). It seems like the problem you perceive is that women like to have sex with players. Your solution is that non-player men should shun the players to save these women from their own decisions.

 

I think I understand where you are coming from. I know one guy that was just a heel (or your definition of player). He just did not follow any socially acceptable boundaries. However, that guy was the exception, a very unusual case. From reading your posts, it would seem like the world is crawling with them. I suspect your line is much different from mine and many other peoples.

 

Another point I don't understand..I believe you have defined a player as a man who lies and deceives to get a woman into bed. I don't think that is the commonly accepted definition of a player. The commonly accepted definition is a guy that simply gets a lot of women into bed. I don't think that deception is implicit in the definition. But, assuming your definition is correct (deception is implicit or explicit), what is your term for a guy that beds many women without deception? I'm not being snarky here, I'm genuinely curious. Because there is a surprising number of women who are willing to go to bed with charming men where absolutely no deception is required.

 

Women have the innate ability to perceive who is a player and who is not a player. I noticed this when I was in my early teens and I realized that a few of the guys had the majority of the women hovering them. These were the guys who due to looks, or charisma, or height, or any other physical or psychological high quality characteristic made them sexually attractive.

 

Not only were these guys noticed for what they were - the girls competed and became quite aggressive with each other for these guy's attention, and they didn't mind being part of this week's plan. It was better than nothing at all, for these girls.

 

My grandfather slept with more than 100 women. He was a mechanic with a run-down shop. I don't think he was even good at his job. Women basically offered him money. My oldest uncle had almost the same number of women. He got several of them pregnant, never payed for anything in his life. Had a drug and drink problem, women didn't mind that.

 

He ended up marrying a very attractive younger woman, the daughter of a rich old banker. He still sleeps with other women and has a happy marriage. This uncle of mine is ugly as sin, but that Bad boy charisma is timeless.

 

My other uncle, now that one looked like david, the one you can find in Rome. This guy slept with many married women. At the age of 14 he was having sex with attractive 30 year old women. He never worked a day in his life. Supported by the women he met.

 

My mother had a dozen or so sexual partners. Met my father when she was 25 and he was 27. My father was a virgin. A decent looking man of average height and build(not fat). He did the right thing and married my mother, lol. Meh, there are suckers born all the time.

 

I lost my virginity at the age of nine. To an attractive 14 year old French girl. I am not a player, I am not a cad. I'm not interested in having many girls. I enjoy casual sex when its free, and when its offered by women I am attracted to. I'm not going to work for it because there are billions of women out there and when a woman is not attracted to me for my looks, she's attracted to the ''bad boy'' personality that emerges naturally. I also have a mellow side, inherited from my father, which when sighted by women tends to make them want to make me their boyfriend. That side I kill as soon as I see it.

 

Women want players. Like men want attractive, fertile women. its pure biological. Women will keep on wanting player and players will keep on playing the game. Napoleon Bonaparte could've never become a baker. So why should players become suckers, herbs, and providers? I'm going to bed.

[TXGuy]

Women have the innate ability to perceive who is a player and who is not a player. I noticed this when I was in my early teens and I realized that a few of the guys had the majority of the women hovering them. These were the guys who due to looks, or charisma, or height, or any other physical or psychological high quality characteristic made them sexually attractive.

 

I'd agree with this. But I don't think these guys deceive women to get them into bed. The women are enthusiastic participants. I disagree with RR's definition that players are deceptive.

[RedRobin]

If you want to read my viewpoints on players... You can go to the other thread. No need to rehash it here. I see I was right about the lack of good role models. That is discussed in the other thread too.

 

But back on topic... One off my reasons for wanting to avoid those who have never married past a certain age is because I am not interested in men who are relationship renters or freeloaders... Or have a history of that.

 

Lots of the posts here are kind of backing that up... At least when it comes to the guys... All this talk of cows... And amusing oneself. Yes... That is exactly the impression you leave with me. Not someone to take seriously at all.

Edited April 9, 2014 by RedRobin

[xxoo]

If you've basically accepted that the man you seek will have been previously married, and that good men who wish to be married generally ARE married, then the thing to do IMO is just enjoy your life and exude attractive energy. When good men become available, they'll find you.

[RedRobin]

If you've basically accepted that the man you seek will have been previously married, and that good men who wish to be married generally ARE married, then the thing to do IMO is just enjoy your life and exude attractive energy. When good men become available, they'll find you.

 

Thanks xoxo. That is what I am trying to do. It is hard sometimes. I can't help but be sad at what I have lost... And be angry at having to start over again at a time of my life where finding a good partner is that much harder.

 

I know it doesn't help to feel that way. I try to feel happy for the good times I did have. Thanks again.