I hate that he's doing this to her.

[TranslucentThoughts]

My best friends boyfriend broke up with her about 2 weeks ago. She's taken it really hard and is still very upset. She wanted to be friends right away... and they tried... and things went okay for awhile... but he's being a total ass to her now. He was supposed to go over to her house tonight to study but he blew her off to hang out with the girl that he cheated on her with and his other friends. He didn't even bother calling her and she had to phone him and ask what was going on for the night. She told him she was upset that he would just blow her off like that and his reply was "well, i dont want to have to feel guilty" Then he starts telling her all about how he had an amazing night with that girl and his other friends and they all stayed up until 5am drinking and that it was soooo much fun... and how he did coke. He was totally bragging about all this and not even caring about it would make her feel.

 

I am so angry at him right now. How can he be such an a**h***!? She's the nicest person you will ever meet and she has never ever done anything to him to deserve this kind of treatment.

 

I want to give her some advice... good advice... but it's hard. I know her heart is broken and I know how that feels. It's horrible... and it's like nothing anyone says or does will help. I just cant stand hearing her cry and knowing how hurt she is.

[midori]

Situations like this are so hurtful for the person in your friend's position, and so confusing. But it's actually pretty easy to sort out.

 

Contrary to what some people believe, not everyone who cheats does so because their needs weren't being met by their partner, at least not in a way that the partner has any responsibility for (or ability to address). And when the cheater soon leaves his/her partner after the infidelity, you can be pretty sure that they used the infidelity as a means to get out of the relationship. Especially if there was no discussion with their partner about problems, no attempts to improve their relationship. The cheater is someone who needed to get out of the relationship, might not have even been fully conscious of that need, and so they forced the issue by engaging in behavior that led to breaking up.

 

My guess is that your friend's ex knew on some level that he needed to get out of their relationship, but didn't know why, and therefore couldn't articulate any problems to her. So he just sabotaged things. The need was real -- my first guess, especially since your post indicates that you're fairly young, is just general immaturity on his part. Maybe he wasn't ready to be in a committed relationship with someone as wonderful as your friend. Because when your partner is a terrific person, you know it, everyone knows it, you'd be a fool to leave them... this puts someone who's not ready for long-term commitment in a hard position.

 

So he forced a break-up, but he knows she's fantastic. At a minimum of course he wants to keep her as a friend. And I'd guess that somewhere in the back of his mind, even though he probably hasn't acknowledged it even to himself, is the idea that in six months, or a year from now, he might be feeling ready to commit. So staying friends with her is definitely something he wants.

 

BUT that starts to send mixed signals -- does he want her back? Easy to see that she might be given that impression, and I'm sure that's why she wanted to be friends with him. But this may have the opposite effect from what she's hoping for. Staying in touch with her may well make it more difficult for him to remain convinced that he doesn't want to be with her. He probably never was fully convinced that he didn't want to be with her, and that's why he had to engage in dishonest sabotage rather than just saying, "hey I'm not feeling it anymore." So what to do? Your friend has probably been hoping that upon realizing he was torn, he would want to reconcile. But his response seems to be to reinforce the idea that he's not attached to her by blowing her off, hanging out with the girl he used to destroy their relationship.

 

My guess is that most of this is being done somewhat subconsciously on his part. I doubt he has articulated a plan of action that says, "I'm going to mess with my ex's mind and keep her guessing." He's just going on instinct -- things were getting too close for comfort when they were together, so he sabotaged the relationship -- but not entirely. Then he kept her in his orbit by keeping in touch, making plans, etc. But that interaction made him uncomfortable, so he resorted to more hurtful distancing tactics.

 

There's one thing that he's right about, and your friend must recognize this: he cannot be in a relationship with her right now. The reasons might well be all internal to him. It's probably not at all a reflection of how much he valued her, or of how wonderful she is in general. Regardless of how great she is, he cannot be in a relationship with her. She needs to recognize and accept this.

 

My advice to your friend would be to withdraw completely from this guy. Getting him to explain himself, or to acknowledge how hurtful and inconsistent his behavior is will be an impossible task. This guy doesn't know what he wants, and he doesn't want to think about what he has done.

 

He didn't cheat on your friend because she wasn't good enough. The girl he cheated on her with probably is, even in his mind on some level, a tool he used to extricate himself from the relationship. Little good will come out of it in the long run, I'll bet. But your friend shouldn't stick around hoping to witness people getting their comeuppances. She should acknowledge that she loved someone who has some very fine qualities, but who wasn't ready or able to be in a relationship with her, and that further interaction with this person will be hurtful to her.

 

She should not take or return his calls. She should set up her email so that messages from him are automatically deleted. She should do this not to get any kind of reaction from him, but to protect herself. She needs to recognize that this guy isn't able to provide the answers she needs, and he's not capable of having her best interests at heart. That doesn't make him a completely bad person. But he's a toxic presence in her life. He doesn't know how to benefit from her wonderful qualities, so to expend any energy on him would be a waste for her.

 

She needs to get herself to see how inexcusable and hurtful his behavior has been. She needs to let herself get as angry on her own behalf as you are about the way he has behaved. Even if he didn't mean to hurt her, he did. People like that need to be kept at arm's length, if not further.

[moon]

I think the hardest part is that when you really love somebody your reflex is to keep feeding that love (no matter what). When somebody cheats on you (at least if your only dating) the relationship should be over. I say this because there are many other people out there you can go try and have a good relationship with instead of staying with that cheater. I don't know many relationships that have withstood cheating. At the very least the two should break up for a while until the cheater realizes (REALLY REALIZES) what a jerk he or she is.

 

Your friend is having withdrawl symtoms. She's wants to stay in this guy's life even though he's totally making a fool of her. He's treating her like garbage. As a friend to her, I would completely advise her to stay away from him. I would not tell her over and over how awful her ex is, but I would focus on the fact that the cheating ruined the relationship and she should have enough respect for herself to get away from a guy who did that to her. He's not even apologizing. He is rubbing it all in by telling her about his new interest. Sign up for some yoga classes with the girl, help her find some new hobbies, whatever. Try to get her to focus on the fact that she's been cheated on and lied to. Does she really want to remain friends with a person who holds her in such low esteem? I have noticed sometimes the nicest people find jerky boyfriends (this happens to nice guys too). I think in the beginning the guys are really nice and then once the girls get attached (very easy to do), they show their true colors. It sounds like your friend found one of these losers.

 

Tell your friend the most important thing is to stay away from this guy---she should have no contact at all. And who is this tart that he ran into the arms of? I'd say this guy makes very poor choices. I think, yes, he's either just very immature or setting himself up for a life with the devil (or acting like him). Try to keep your friend's mind off of this guy. It sounds like you're being a good friend to her. I wouldn't get too involved with the actual discussions with the guy. Stay on your friend's side and let her handle the ex. You could turn into the middle man and you don't want that. You'll probably be resented at some point for it. Just be a good friend to your friend. Maybe she could also benefit from some therapy. Remember sometimes bad things happen to good people. It's life. Hopefully your friend will not make the same mistake twice.

[TranslucentThoughts]

Well, my friend is still talking to the ex a lot... and trying to be best buddies with him. I just don't how to tell her that it's going to hurt her more being friends with him... especially when he can't even treat her properly.

 

I see the way he talks to her now... with total disrespect... but he says things in a "joking" kind of way to make it seem like it's okay for him to talk to her like that and just get away with it. She doesn't even really seemed phased by it though... she just lets him because she's still so attached and she doesn't want to lose him completely...it's like she thinks that if she just lets him walk all over her he'll be more likely to stick around.

 

I don't know... he leads her on though still... and sends her mixed messages. The other day they had a talk and he said he couldn't be friends with her and that no, they wouldn't get back together. But then he also says the reason he can't hang out with her is because it's too hard for him... and because he will be too tempted to be all cuddley with her and act the way they did when they were together. And... now apparently they're going to hang out tonight or something? I don't get it.

 

I just really don't want her to get hurt... but I don't want her to get mad at me either by telling her she should stay away from him... I really don't know how to even tell her that. It's hard for her because she really loves him still.

[WantanS4]

Sounds a lot like my ex..... but no so close... she still manages to throw in a phonecall to my mother, asking how 'things' are and what she's been up to. And I'll tell you, it's a roller coaster for me. I would have been better off if she had died (I know that sounds wrong.. but still). Watch... if she ever decides to reconcile, she'll object to my biggest question...... "Who you been with? What have you done?" because I have no right to ask that....... BULLs***..... remember that a relationship leads to sex.. which leads to family.. whicih leads to building a life together....... 50/50... and if one of the 50 percents doesn't get whole story.... then in my humblest of the opinions... they're getting the s*** end of the st!ck. And i don't think she'll want to answer that... or in fact... answer it completely.

 

I want to thank her for the nightmare that she has shoved me into........ and although ever so slightly... the one she has placed herself in.

 

Moron!

 

I guess this is something your friend should consider........ once the trust is shattered... it needs to be earned again... and it's going to be 10x harder for the both of them.

[sweet-oooh]

midori, i am going through the same thing as this girl and i would like to say that you gave some wonderful advice and you have really helped me to understand and see the whole picture. Since reading what you wrote i have been able to step back and look at my own situation, my ex treated me like this and i have blamed myself and been really confused, wondering why he treated me bad, still wanting to be friends with me, then coming back to me and every time he splits with me he gets more hurtful. I can see now that he just wants me hanging on there, for his convenience, not letting me go completely. Now i can see that its not my fault and i do deserve better.

Thankyou midori for your good advice, you have helped me see what a prat this guy is!

[ex]

Midori,

 

I also want to thank you for your insightful post. It's really a rather brilliant reading of these types of situations, and it has given me a lot of comfort in my own process of coping.

 

I am wondering if you have been through a similar situation yourself?

[midori]

Originally posted by ex

Midori,

 

I also want to thank you for your insightful post. It's really a rather brilliant reading of these types of situations, and it has given me a lot of comfort in my own process of coping.

 

I am wondering if you have been through a similar situation yourself?

 

I'm glad my perspective on situations like this one has been helpful. I've not been in a situation exactly like the one described here, but I have unfortunately been in situations that are similar enough to feel like I've got a good idea of what was going on. It took a lot of time and pain to get to the point where I felt like I understood what happened! A few weeks ago some of us were discussing some other situations that have common elements with this one, you might find it's relevant to your own situation: http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t54631/

 

As for the situation described by Translucent Thoughts, one of the things that makes this particuarly difficult for the person who was dumped is the mixed signals being sent by the ex. It's not just wishful thinking on TT's friend's part, chances are very good that some part of the ex really does want to be with her. And she picks up on that, which gives her hope that they'll get back together. What she's overlooking is that there's a difference between wanting to be with someone, and having the capacity to be with someone. Her ex is obviously stupid, weak, and selfish on several levels ... but some part of him was wise enough to recognize that he's not able to be in the relationship right now. He's probably got things to sort out for himself before he'll be mature enough to be in a long-term committed relationship with someone he respects and loves. No matter how much he wishes he were with TT's friend, his unreadiness is very much a part of his reality. He can't change that, and neither can TT's friend. TT's friend is stuck because she's ignoring the unreadiness and paying attention only to the ex's indications that he still wants to be with her.

[NewMe]

Thanks for the link, Midori...

 

But there was no need, because as I was so impressed with your post above, I just did a search for all your posts. Won't get through them tonight, but whew lady, you are very, very good.

 

I think I've developed a crush on you, kind of like the kind people supposedly develop on their therapists. Okay, not really, but just can't emphasize enough how good you are.

 

I am curious as to what you're going to grad school for, though, if you don't mind telling. Don't want to stalk you, just would like to know what kind of field a brain like yours decided to be engage.

 

NewMe (formerly known as "ex" - I registered because I saw that you had asked another guest to do that.)