Painful Love

[Willinswf]

I am in love with a woman I work with and I don't want to be.

 

I have been married for over 25 years -- a marriage that has been more like a business partnership for half of those years.

 

I have been emotionally numb for many years. Then 3 years ago I started at this com

pany. Katya, was one of the first people I met. My imediate reaction to her was strange. She is attractive, but my first thought was "Oh, there you are ".

 

Although, I felt this initial connection, I put aside those thoughts and concentrated on my job. But, some how Katya always stayed in the back of my mind. She is much younger than me and even if I had the courage to end my marriage, I wouldn't pursue her because of the age difference.

 

There were times when it seemed she was attracted to me, but again, I suppressed those

thoughts.

 

But, about a year ago my feelings began to grow for her. I avoided her and tried not to think of her, but she haunted my dreams at night. She is my last thought before falling asleep and my first when I awake. Just to see her in the hall and have her smile at me filled me with hope and energy. Her effect on me is electrical.

 

I have fought these feelings --I feared I might make a fool of myself and falling in love has never been a good experience for me. Love has always been painful. I married my wife because I felt we were good for each other, but I was safely not deeply in love with her.

 

Then Katya took a new position in California still with the same company. I thought this was good. I could finally get over my feelings and this stupid infatuation.

 

But, instead, I miss her terribly. I am in constant pain and I feel her absence everyday.

 

Her computer icon still shows up on my desktop when she logs in and we have a mutual Facebook friend. I fight the temptation to send her a friend request.

 

I want this pain to end, but yet, I don't want to return to numbness. She mentioned that she might come back to Florida in a couple of years and I sometimes have to go to her plant in CA. So, I will eventually see her again.

 

I just want this torture to stop -- has anyone gotten over this kind of thing -- if so how?

[Speakingofwhich]

Willinswf, have you ever thought about getting into IC to explore why you feel you've fallen in love so deeply with a woman you have had only a superficial R with? I don't mean to be critical, please no offense, but I can't understand how a person could become this attached to someone they've only seen from afar, so to speak? Do you think IC might be a good idea for you to maybe help you move on from this obsession?

[Willinswf]

Willinswf, have you ever thought about getting into IC to explore why you feel you've fallen in love so deeply with a woman you have had only a superficial R with? I don't mean to be critical, please no offense, but I can't understand how a person could become this attached to someone they've only seen from afar, so to speak? Do you think IC might be a good idea for you to maybe help you move on from this obsession?

 

 

What is "IC"?

[QuakerOats]

I think it means intensive counseling.

[Willinswf]

I think it means intensive counseling.

 

Okay -- thanks.

 

And -- no. I don't belive counciling or talk therapy is very effective.

[Speakingofwhich]

Close to what I think of it as meaning, QuakerOats. I think of it as meaning Individual Counseling, but intensive would be a good way to term it, too!

 

But, yes, OP (original poster), how about getting into IC? There is probably a reason unrelated to this lady that you have gotten fixated on her. If you could solve that, you very well may find relief from your obsession!

[gettingstronger]

Tell your wife and this woman how you feel and see where it leads. That will pull you from fantasy to reality. My guess is that you are just fantasizing but the only way to know is to put your thoughts in to action.

[waterwoman]

IC isn't effective? Ok, so what is your plan? Clearly your life isn't working on some level. What do you want to happen with your marriage?

[TheNoBSBuddhist]

Okay -- thanks.

 

And -- no. I don't belive counciling or talk therapy is very effective.

 

Have you actually tried them ever?

to dismissed tried-and-tested effective methods of self-discovery, out of hand, is both hasty and misguided.

 

I have found that those who are so dismissive, tend to be the ones who have the most to explore, and work with.

 

The work is up to you. Not the counsellor or therapist.

You do the talking, not them....

But if you would prefer to keep wading waist-deep in the mess of your own making, with no discernible solution in sight, feel free.

 

Why come here, if you do not wish to explore the different possibilities available to you, to extricate yourself from this dilemma?

 

I just want this torture to stop -- has anyone gotten over this kind of thing -- if so how?

YOU are the infliciter of this torture.

Counselling may well be the only available way of learning to stop doing this to yourself.

[Cunning_Linguist]

What other women are there in your life? Women that satisfy your sexual desires? You said you're married but it is purely a contract?

 

My advice would be to go out and meet more women. IMO this "infatuation" with Katya was one born of proximity and convenience, something that happens often in a work place. Maybe you are just craving the intimacy of a beautiful woman and she happened to be there. I'm not saying she isn't worthy of love, but the position you're coming from is one lacking options in the intimacy department, and she fulfilled the position of that need. That position is one of weakness and thus a feeling driven by emotional need and not genuine love. How can you even truly love a woman you haven't even been intimate with? You don't even know her beyond the work façade. The scarcity mindset is what causes this to happen.

[yakamoz]

OP - google "limerence" and read about it. Someone in this site told me to do that and it was very helpful to me in getting over my over the top infatuation with my boss (not completely over but getting there). Good luck because I know how painful it is. Most people who haven't been thru it don't understand the compulsion and the pain it comes with it. It is a completely irrational obsessive feelings towards another person. Once you understand what is going on, it becomes easier.

[Willinswf]

OP - google "limerence" and read about it. Someone in this site told me to do that and it was very helpful to me in getting over my over the top infatuation with my boss (not completely over but getting there). Good luck because I know how painful it is. Most people who haven't been thru it don't understand the compulsion and the pain it comes with it. It is a completely irrational obsessive feelings towards another person. Once you understand what is going on, it becomes easier.

 

Yes, I have read about limerence and I believe that this is what I am experiencing.

 

 

How are you getting over the limerence or does just end with time? I've heard that it lasts about a year.

[Willinswf]

Have you actually tried them ever?

to dismissed tried-and-tested effective methods of self-discovery, out of hand, is both hasty and misguided.

 

I have found that those who are so dismissive, tend to be the ones who have the most to explore, and work with.

 

The work is up to you. Not the counsellor or therapist.

You do the talking, not them....

But if you would prefer to keep wading waist-deep in the mess of your own making, with no discernible solution in sight, feel free.

 

Why come here, if you do not wish to explore the different possibilities available to you, to extricate yourself from this dilemma?

 

 

YOU are the infliciter of this torture.

Counselling may well be the only available way of learning to stop doing this to yourself.

 

Why come here?

 

I want to hear from others that have experienced what I'm going through. That is valuable to me.

 

I'm not interested in psycobabble from armchair quarterbacks and self appointed experts.

[TheNoBSBuddhist]

With that kind of derogatory attitude, is it any wonder you still have such a dilemma on your hands?

To be so dismissive of those who have spent years of study in order to be of support and assistance to others is at best, short-sighted and at worst, utterly prejudiced.

Countless thousands have benefited from such therapy, and used the process to their advantage.

 

if this is your attitude, I hardly see how conversing with faceless strangers on a forum, where this disclaimer exists -

 

Please note: The suggestions and advice offered on this web site are opinions only and are not to be used in the place of professional psychological counseling or medical advice.

 

is going to be of any point or use.

In all likelihood, those participants who give you well-meaning and sound advice as how to cope with your problem, will suffer the same insulting dismissive manner.

 

And bear in mind, many people here have profited and benefited from the kind of assistance you so insultingly dismiss out of hand...

 

if your wife has to live with this kind of temperament, then indeed, the best advice would be to sever ties, liberate her and find yourself what it is you seek, when at liberty to do so.

[Willinswf]

With that kind of derogatory attitude, is it any wonder you still have such a dilemma on your hands?

To be so dismissive of those who have spent years of study in order to be of support and assistance to others is at best, short-sighted and at worst, utterly prejudiced.

Countless thousands have benefited from such therapy, and used the process to their advantage.

 

if this is your attitude, I hardly see how conversing with faceless strangers on a forum, where this disclaimer exists -

 

 

 

is going to be of any point or use.

In all likelihood, those participants who give you well-meaning and sound advice as how to cope with your problem, will suffer the same insulting dismissive manner.

 

And bear in mind, many people here have profited and benefited from the kind of assistance you so insultingly dismiss out of hand...

 

if your wife has to live with this kind of temperament, then indeed, the best advice would be to sever ties, liberate her and find yourself what it is you seek, when at liberty to do so.

 

I just wanted to nip the BS in the bud.

 

Every forum has some non-credentialed wannabe-expert that dispenses advice they are not qualified to give and then they get testy when anyone questions them.

 

Do you have the credentials? "Years of study" can mean a couple of psychology courses or you've read a lot of magazines.

 

If you are qualified -- lead with your credentials before dispensing your thoughts, that way people know if they should listen to you or not.

 

I apologize if you are qualified, but, I have a very low tolerance for phonys .

.

[Willinswf]

What other women are there in your life? Women that satisfy your sexual desires? You said you're married but it is purely a contract?

 

My advice would be to go out and meet more women. IMO this "infatuation" with Katya was one born of proximity and convenience, something that happens often in a work place. Maybe you are just craving the intimacy of a beautiful woman and she happened to be there. I'm not saying she isn't worthy of love, but the position you're coming from is one lacking options in the intimacy department, and she fulfilled the position of that need. That position is one of weakness and thus a feeling driven by emotional need and not genuine love. How can you even truly love a woman you haven't even been intimate with? You don't even know her beyond the work façade. The scarcity mindset is what causes this to happen.

 

 

There is some truth in this -- of course, my wife is beautiful and I've always been a sucker for smart and beautiful, which is Katya.

[Bootsie]

I just wanted to nip the BS in the bud.

 

Every forum has some non-credentialed wannabe-expert that dispenses advice they are not qualified to give and then they get testy when anyone questions them.

 

Do you have the credentials? "Years of study" can mean a couple of psychology courses or you've read a lot of magazines.

 

If you are qualified -- lead with your credentials before dispensing your thoughts, that way people know if they should listen to you or not.

 

I apologize if you are qualified, but, I have a very low tolerance for phonys .

.

 

Okay -- thanks.

 

And -- no. I don't belive counciling or talk therapy is very effective.

 

Why come here?

 

I want to hear from others that have experienced what I'm going through. That is valuable to me.

 

I'm not interested in psycobabble from armchair quarterbacks and self appointed experts.

 

 

I'm just a little puzzled because you don't believe in counselling or talk therapy, yet you clearly seem to have come here to discuss your situation and yet you want "qualified" people to give you their credentials before responding to you.

 

 

I doubt my qualifications are particularly relevant but I'm a lawyer, and identify as a BS (betrayed spouse) on this forum. In an earlier life I also cheated, to my regret, and have experienced attractions to other people while both single and married.

 

 

Unrequited or unexplored love is painful, but the old saying "time heals all wounds" has a lot of truth in it.

 

 

I'd recommend working out what you want to do with your marriage and doing this in collaboration and consultation with your wife, because it's her marriage too. You might find that you both agree that it's dead and you'd both be better off out of it, in which case you would be free to pursue other women. On the other hand you might find something worthwhile in staying married and decide that you are both willing to work towards having a more vibrant relationship.

 

 

Of course you may find that only one wants to work on the marriage and the other doesn't, in which case the "unhappy" one is faced with the decision of perhaps ending it without the other's agreement, or you may both make a conscious decision to stay together in a business-like arrangement with you both free to pursue others.

 

 

To me the most unfair option is if you decide to cheat on your wife without her knowledge or consent and essentially make the decisions for you both as to what type of marriage you have.

 

 

The last option is what my spouse decided to do, and did for years. I eventually discovered this on D-day (discovery day) and we were forced to confront the issues in our marriage head on. Together we decided to stay married and have built for ourselves something very different to what we had before. This was several years ago and we are now in our 50s and doing well.

[Ruffian1]

If you are qualified -- lead with your credentials before dispensing your thoughts, that way people know if they should listen to you or not.

I apologize if you are qualified, but, I have a very low tolerance for phonys .

Please understand that deep down we are all the same. College degrees and credentials do not always mean that person is intelligent or have your best interests at heart.

The infamous Ted Bundy was a psychology major and honor student who was well-regarded by his professors. Sometimes common sense and life experiences of the all-types masses you will encounter here is the truth and insightful. People that have actually been where you are.

 

How are you getting over the limerence or does just end with time?

 

Why don’t you just tell this woman how you feel about her and what you want? That will let some reality into the situation.

[Willinswf]

I'm just a little puzzled because you don't believe in counselling or talk therapy, yet you clearly seem to have come here to discuss your situation and yet you want "qualified" people to give you their credentials before responding to you.

 

 

I doubt my qualifications are particularly relevant but I'm a lawyer, and identify as a BS (betrayed spouse) on this forum. In an earlier life I also cheated, to my regret, and have experienced attractions to other people while both single and married.

 

 

Unrequited or unexplored love is painful, but the old saying "time heals all wounds" has a lot of truth in it.

 

 

I'd recommend working out what you want to do with your marriage and doing this in collaboration and consultation with your wife, because it's her marriage too. You might find that you both agree that it's dead and you'd both be better off out of it, in which case you would be free to pursue other women. On the other hand you might find something worthwhile in staying married and decide that you are both willing to work towards having a more vibrant relationship.

 

 

Of course you may find that only one wants to work on the marriage and the other doesn't, in which case the "unhappy" one is faced with the decision of perhaps ending it without the other's agreement, or you may both make a conscious decision to stay together in a business-like arrangement with you both free to pursue others.

 

 

To me the most unfair option is if you decide to cheat on your wife without her knowledge or consent and essentially make the decisions for you both as to what type of marriage you have.

 

 

The last option is what my spouse decided to do, and did for years. I eventually discovered this on D-day (discovery day) and we were forced to confront the issues in our marriage head on. Together we decided to stay married and have built for ourselves something very different to what we had before. This was several years ago and we are now in our 50s and doing well.

 

Thanks Bootsie, your experience is what is valuable to me.

 

Understand that if I wanted psychiatric advice, I wouldn't come to a forum, I'd go see an actual professional. Too often people don't realize that their life experience is more valuable than what they think they know. I also have a BS degree, it is in Engineering, but I too don't try to promote my knowledge beyond that.

 

 

Yes, it is possible that I could find new ground with my wife. There are no infidelities or anger, we are just more like business partners. We never had much in common.

 

Right now, I would like to be free. I wouldn't pursue anyone else until I was free.

 

.

[Willinswf]

Please understand that deep down we are all the same. College degrees and credentials do not always mean that person is intelligent or have your best interests at heart.

The infamous Ted Bundy was a psychology major and honor student who was well-regarded by his professors. Sometimes common sense and life experiences of the all-types masses you will encounter here is the truth and insightful. People that have actually been where you are.

 

 

 

Why don’t you just tell this woman how you feel about her and what you want? That will let some reality into the situation.

 

Yes, sometimes exceptional individuals can outshine the best credentials -- but not here.

 

I've thought about telling her, but, we both work for the same company and I think its best to keep my mouth shut.

 

I fully understand the reality of the situation that's why I find these feeling to be so frustrating -- they're not logical.

 

I think limerence offers the best explanation at this point.

 

Thanks.

 

.

[yakamoz]

Hi OP. i am certainly not over him. However, recognizing there is a problem made me self aware of how irrational my feelings are. Limerence is completely irrational and the first thing you need to know is that it is all about you. It is not about how nice or pretty or smart she is. Your love for her is really not a real love but more of a fantasy. Limerence goes in cycles. Early emotional elation you feel will be replaced by equally powerful pain. However, you are luckier than me because you now have NC with her. Do not contact her and do not tell her about your feelings. Mine lasted 18 months and still on going because he is my boss and i cant cut contact with him. Going limited contact did help and eventually more logical part of my brain started taking over more and more. But i am no where near cured just better at controlling my feelings. That comes with the recognition that there is a problem. I now know thinking about someone 24/7 is not healthy; obsessing over every look, every word, every gesture is not healthy and they are all part of being a limerent. There are good days where i only think about him half the day then there are bad days like today i am in terrible pain because he ignored me all day. You just learn live with it. Best thing you can do for yourself in the long run is no contact.

[Willinswf]

Hi OP. i am certainly not over him. However, recognizing there is a problem made me self aware of how irrational my feelings are. Limerence is completely irrational and the first thing you need to know is that it is all about you. It is not about how nice or pretty or smart she is. Your love for her is really not a real love but more of a fantasy. Limerence goes in cycles. Early emotional elation you feel will be replaced by equally powerful pain. However, you are luckier than me because you now have NC with her. Do not contact her and do not tell her about your feelings. Mine lasted 18 months and still on going because he is my boss and i cant cut contact with him. Going limited contact did help and eventually more logical part of my brain started taking over more and more. But i am no where near cured just better at controlling my feelings. That comes with the recognition that there is a problem. I now know thinking about someone 24/7 is not healthy; obsessing over every look, every word, every gesture is not healthy and they are all part of being a limerent. There are good days where i only think about him half the day then there are bad days like today i am in terrible pain because he ignored me all day. You just learn live with it. Best thing you can do for yourself in the long run is no contact.

 

 

Yes, it definitely helps that she is 2500 miles away. I would feel the same things as you when she was here. If she smiled at me, I was in heaven, if I didn't see her I would get very down.

 

There were indicators that she was attracted to me, but I stayed away from her and then it drove me crazy that I did that.

 

I'm just glad I didn't make a fool of myself.

 

What's interesting is that Katya did the same thing. I was told that she became infatuated with a guy at work from afar and then confessed her feelings right before he got married. I think it was very humiliating for her.

That made my heart go out to her.

 

I am artistic and I have used that outlet to express my feelings for her harmlessly. I've written stories, poems for her and even immersed myself in figure drawing. That has been helpful.

 

But, yes, her distance from me is helping as the limerence fades. It sounds like your proximity to your LO creates a feedback loop that recharges your limerence. I'm sure that that is a very emotionally draining difficult for you -- you have my empathy.

 

.