BW & H laughing at the OW?

[Sub]

Oh I get that you think As are wrong. I just happen to disagree.

 

Your rationale is sometimes hard to follow, but I actually don't think you do disagree. Your feelings about your H's xWW serves as proof of that. I get the sense you think A's are justified in the case where someone's been abused and neglected for years. (I don't necessarily agree, but this has some basis in logic. Though this is more the exception than the rule.) But in your case, a good deal of that abuse was manifested in the form of A's. Am I correct? So if the WW's behavior - which included A's - is considered abuse, how can you make the sweeping generalization that A's aren't wrong? Couple that with your own feelings about living your life in an honest way, and there's a real disconnect here.

[gettingstronger]

And our wonderful "changing world" is getting closer and closer to a world of narcissism every day.

 

 

Totally! I am a teacher and believe in whole child education but even that has changed from whole child to whatever the child wants rather than what will enable a child to be a productive adult- sorry off topic-

[BHsigh]

Oh I get that you think As are wrong. I just happen to disagree.

 

And yes, I can explain for ages what led to him having an A rather than simply leaving - I have done so many times on these boards - but you'll never understand that. You'll never understand that when someone has been abused for decades, they're not in a position to step back and think logically about a situation in the same way that someone who has never been abused can do. Look up "gas lighting" and you might start to understand. An abused person simply does not realise the options they have, because the abuser has worked so hard over years - or decades - to convince them that they have no options, that they are unlovable, that they are lucky to have the abuser and that only the abuser will ever be able to love them. But you don't want to understand that because it opens the door to thinking that perhaps to someone in that position, simply walking away isn't that easy, and perhaps other options that might present a glimmer of hope might make sense. You don't want to understand that to someone who is so desperate that "right and wrong" have paled against the daily issue of how to survive this day, that bludgeoning them over the head with the simplistic mantra "As are wrong" shuts down understanding rather than helping them to understand how and why they landed up where they landed up, and how to move on sustainably from there.

 

I think that is the big difference between us. I'm about understanding, and then changing the world, whereas you're about sticking your flag in the ground proclaiming wrong from right, and expecting change to happen from that. Good luck, I hope it works for you as well as my choices work for me.

 

I'm agreeing with what Sub stated.

 

I can definitely see your point in this situation, I still wouldn't call having an affair the right thing to do, but I could agree with your point that it was one of their better options, I'm willing to concede in situations like that.

 

But it does seem like you take your stance from that affair and then apply it to every affair.

 

Most people speak in general terms, and because the situation that you outlined is such a small number compared, it often goes overlooked. The majority that we've seen are cases like mine, or jane's, or Sophie's, or Fluttershy's etc, where the WS is remorseful afterwords and work to save the marriage that they almost or did destroy.

 

What are you trying to change the world into exactly?

[Raena]

Oh I get that you think As are wrong. I just happen to disagree.

 

And yes, I can explain for ages what led to him having an A rather than simply leaving - I have done so many times on these boards - but you'll never understand that. You'll never understand that when someone has been abused for decades, they're not in a position to step back and think logically about a situation in the same way that someone who has never been abused can do. Look up "gas lighting" and you might start to understand. An abused person simply does not realise the options they have, because the abuser has worked so hard over years - or decades - to convince them that they have no options, that they are unlovable, that they are lucky to have the abuser and that only the abuser will ever be able to love them. But you don't want to understand that because it opens the door to thinking that perhaps to someone in that position, simply walking away isn't that easy, and perhaps other options that might present a glimmer of hope might make sense. You don't want to understand that to someone who is so desperate that "right and wrong" have paled against the daily issue of how to survive this day, that bludgeoning them over the head with the simplistic mantra "As are wrong" shuts down understanding rather than helping them to understand how and why they landed up where they landed up, and how to move on sustainably from there.

 

I think that is the big difference between us. I'm about understanding, and then changing the world, whereas you're about sticking your flag in the ground proclaiming wrong from right, and expecting change to happen from that. Good luck, I hope it works for you as well as my choices work for me.

 

I understand a whole lot better than you think I do about what it's like to be in an abusive relationship. I was in one myself for 11 years. Did I cheat to get out of it? Hell no! Did I need to drag someone else into my crazy world to "save me"?? Hell no! I decided what I would accept and what I wouldn't and I went from there. I stuck that flag in the ground, yes, and decided that I wasn't going to take the abuse any longer and got the heck out of dodge when he chose to cheat yet again. Had I gotten into an affair during that time it would have only made the situation worse, not better.

 

So even after your long explanation of how your affair supposedly saved him what you've completely missed is that if he really was in an abusive relationship, the LAST thing he needed was for someone to come along and "save him" by having an affair with him. (that doesn't even make sense) That limits his own personal growth. To walk from an abusive relationship into the arms of another severely limits that persons ability to self-reflect and move forward into a healthier state. I can't imagine being in a relationship with someone even now because I'm not ready yet. I need this time to reflect on who I am and what I want out of life and any future relationship. If I got involved either while I was still with my ex or shortly after then I would not be addressing the problems that got me there to begin with.

 

Your explanation still doesn't make sense. It never will to me. I know all about gaslighting and abuse and I know the toll it takes on a person's mental well being, I was there and lived it for many years. I also know that I wouldn't be fully addressing the effects it had on me if I fell straight into the arms of another person without doing some work to fix my own problems first. I don't need some "Knight in Shining Armor" to come along and "save me" and if I did, then I would never really address the problems I managed to get myself into in the first place. I want to move on to a healthy relationship with someone else where I don't really NEED him and he doesn't NEED me, but instead we CHOOSE to be together in a healthier state.

 

I don't think you fully realize that your involvement with him has more than likely, not really helped him.

 

And yet again.... affairs are WRONG. There is no right about it.

[janedoe67]

[What are you trying to change the world into exactly?/QUOTE]

 

That is a question I'd like to ask quite a few people

[KaliLove]

Eek..my friend's brother in law's wife found out tonight he was cheating because he left social media signed in. She took screen shots and posted them on his Facebook page. Then she hid his computer so he couldn't remove it.

 

There are 84 comments already and it's only been up for an hour. Lots of people are laughing at that OW.

[eye of the storm]

My M was never physically abusive. But mentally and emotionally yes. I never cheated. I took it, dealt with it, and then did it all over again the next day. When he left me I had storage lockers of baggage (figurative). So I understand when you say being in an abusive relationship causes you to do "odd" things. But if you are strong enough to have an affair, and hide it, then I don't understand why someone is not strong enough to leave the bad marriage. (each person is different and each person deals with things in the, hopefully, best way they can)

 

It took me a long long time to start to heal. And while I would not recommend doing what I did to others, I am now on a much healthier path than I have been on in years.

 

The main thing I learned is after a bad relationship, you need to take time to grieve, heal, and learn. That takes a lot of time. Jumping from one relationship to another keeps you from doing that. And with most people they tend to repeat behaviors (good and bad) unless they took the time to recognize behaviors, triggers, and thought patterns. You can't change something you do not realize you do. Lots and lots of self reflections. Not on their behavior, on yours.

 

I also understand that one size does not fit all. Just because something worked for you (or me) does not mean it is the smart, healthy, or right thing for someone else.

 

I know that some of the things I did to heal, while they worked for me, was wrong and should not be recommended to others. They could just as easily blown up in my face and it would have been completely my fault.

 

And KaliLove, too funny!!!!!!!

[cocorico]

I don't think you fully realize that your involvement with him has more than likely, not really helped him.

 

 

I'm not a social worker. My "involvement" with him was not with the intention of "helping" him. It was, and is, a R. The intention was, and is, for both of us to enjoy each other and being together, and to provide the space for each of us to self-actualise as best as we each see fit.

 

He chose to use the space to get IC, and to work on the issues which had led him to where he had found himself at the point of the A. His "involvement" in IC was intended to help him, and by all indications, clearly has.

 

I am his lover, his friend, his playmate, his intellectual sparring partner, his confidante, his colleague, his co-parent, his roommate, his companion, his dance partner and his DIY consultant. I am not his therapist.

[KaliLove]

Well clearly you've given your husband carte blanche to cheat, lucky him, but most of the rest of the world doesn't feel the way you do.