Are you sorry you didn't reach out to an abusive parent before they died?

[VeronicaRoss]

Long history short, my father is a charming, wealthy, narcissistic, alcoholic, sex addicted man. Being a father gave him expected social cred, but he had no real interest in us or parenting.

 

About 15 years ago he said one sentence in front of his most recent wife: "Sorry for the past, kid". I knew he wasn't, and he actually wouldn't acknowledge any wrong doing so I said nothing. This 'apology' infuriated me though, once more I had to let him showboat, that was my job.

 

Years later I wrote him a letter of the things I would want the apology to be about. In return, he wrote a letter to me copying all my siblings that eviscerated me. I knew not to read it beyond the first line and saw where it was going so I just wrote back and said, "I'm taking the high road. I'm just tired of the emotional violence in this family." My brother told me later the letter was written clearly to humiliate me. One sister said "It isn't true!" but I didn't ask what it was. My brother also said Dad said he wasn't sorry for anything I wrote about, shocked my brother but not me.

 

I had a blissful four years of no contact with any of them, most healthy, growing years I had experienced in my life. Everything improved by my staying away.

 

Dad is feeling his age now, he's close to 80, his friends are dying. Now he says when I see him at weddings and such "I love you" I just say "You too" and leave it at that. There are things I love him for, but he's too messed up to interact with and he has never offered any apology for the letter or anything else.

 

I'd really like advice from people who had similar experiences with their parents and the parents are now gone.

 

For those of you who have suffered at the hands of your parents and had to make the decision, what did you do and do you regret it?

[amaysngrace]

I'm not in your position at all but was just wondering if you regret not having him in your life all these years?

 

Is there anything you want to thank him for or say to him?

 

Do you think you owe him anything right now?

 

Honestly it may appear that you're just sucking up to him for the inheritance. I'm not saying that you are at all because I understand you're more concerned with your own peace of mind. I get that.

 

But you may come off that way to other people.

 

You have to do what's right for you though. That is the most important thing.

 

Can you live with not reaching out to this man who put you through emotional violence, as you call it?

[pink_sugar]

My husband's mom died of cancer and she only made an attempt to reconcile when she thought she was dying at first. Went into remission and stopped speaking to us over something trivial. When the cancer came back, there she was again. His stepfather told him he should see his mom just weeks from her passing. (They otherwise rarely had us over) by this time she was incoherant and couldn't speak anymore. Too late for any

heartfelt goodbyes. However, despite only being in their lives when it was convenient for them, his stepfather basically wanted my husband to stop his life all of a sudden and cancel our anniversary plans. We went anyways. No regrets. He already said his goodbyes and didn't want to mope around waiting for his mom to pass. Especially considering they have hardly been involved in his life and his mother never showed remorse over that. IMO, you don't owe a thing to anyone who has never been there for you. Parents included.

[Tayla]

I lost both my parents, so this subject is both tender and bitter.

Just as you experienced, my father was a man who never admitted fault. that is, til a year before his last breath, he took efforts to amend for his wrongs. I had forgiven him long before that though, so his efforts meant alot for him to simply say it. we never rekindled the father daughter relations, yet we both came to peace with our past. He was by no means a loveable man, he was though..a man who led a life of hardships...So I learned through that he wasn't perfect. I would ask that at the very least you gain some level of peace in simply moving on and letting your fathers actions be in the past. He deserves to have some level of peace too. Until you have understand that persons entire upbringing and life challenges its hard to show compassion.

 

As to my mother- we had a tremulous few years in my teens and thru my 20's. It would take life circumstances to bring us to a new level...that of best friends and family. Losing her has been and continues to be the most heart wrenching loss. perhaps its because we did forgive one another and we did grow as persons. Even upon her death I regreted soo very many things ....So if regret can be removed ....then peace can reside. May you gain that before its too late. People, even til their last breath deserve a level of consideration.

[preraph]

Your dad probably loves you as much as he's capable of loving anyone. Narcissistic people are sometimes also people without empathy. Not sure how he got that way, but he just may not know how to love.

 

I think it's terrible that he retaliated on you the way he did just for speaking your mind, so I wouldn't expect any better reception if you began now speaking to him about what was on your mind. But you may feel you need to do it. If so, do it, regardless how he takes it.

 

I think it would be out of the question to absolve him for anything just because he's old. We play the hand we're dealt, and it's usually the parents doing the dealing, so they picked the game. When he says he loves you, you're saying "me, too," and I would just leave it at that. If there's anything special you can think of that you did love him for and are grateful for, then it wouldn't hurt to just tell him that in a simple way: I still remember how much fun we had when you took us out on the boat. Or: When you weren't being a complete bastard, you used to make me laugh. Do try to think of any good things and be sure they get as much weight as the bad things, that's all.

 

Remember, the real restitution comes from within you because you are able to rise above the obstacles you grew up with and succeed in happiness.

[pink_sugar]

Your dad probably loves you as much as he's capable of loving anyone. Narcissistic people are sometimes also people without empathy. Not sure how he got that way, but he just may not know how to love.

 

I think it's terrible that he retaliated on you the way he did just for speaking your mind, so I wouldn't expect any better reception if you began now speaking to him about what was on your mind. But you may feel you need to do it. If so, do it, regardless how he takes it.

 

I think it would be out of the question to absolve him for anything just because he's old. We play the hand we're dealt, and it's usually the parents doing the dealing, so they picked the game. When he says he loves you, you're saying "me, too," and I would just leave it at that. If there's anything special you can think of that you did love him for and are grateful for, then it wouldn't hurt to just tell him that in a simple way: I still remember how much fun we had when you took us out on the boat. Or: When you weren't being a complete bastard, you used to make me laugh. Do try to think of any good things and be sure they get as much weight as the bad things, that's all.

 

Remember, the real restitution comes from within you because you are able to rise above the obstacles you grew up with and succeed in happiness.

 

This speaks volumes. My dad and I haven't had the most wonderful relationship and it has only improved in recent years...though sometimes he still treats me like I'm 12 and not 25. For many years I wondered what I did wrong for him to treat me the way he did. I always thought it was something wrong with me until I became an adult and spent several years in therapy. I realized it was him and not me. He is a narcassist and I honestly believe in his mind he thought he was doing his best to parent my brother and I. He doesn't admit to being wrong about anything, but he had changed a little to be more understanding and not quick to condemn me. There are still things that drive me nuts about him...such as his obsession with weight making me self conscious about my body or making stupid comments about my life choices. However, when I am firm with him that those topics aren't up for discussion, he changes the subject. He can be negative, so I keep my distance and limit long periods of time with him. I'm not holding any grudges, but I simply don't need the negativity.

[VeronicaRoss]

I'm not in your position at all but was just wondering if you regret not having him in your life all these years?

 

No. Not having to play his king game was absolutely liberating, I wish I had done it decades before.

 

Is there anything you want to thank him for or say to him?

I'd already had those conversations with him. It's important to show gratitude because you never know. By focusing on that, I was able to keep in touch with him all those years.

 

Do you think you owe him anything right now?

I know I for sure don't.

 

Honestly it may appear that you're just sucking up to him for the inheritance. I'm not saying that you are at all because I understand you're more concerned with your own peace of mind. I get that.

But you may come off that way to other people.

 

No, I don't worry about that, people don't think that about me. I make very good money on my own. I take care of my mentally ill mom and disabled sister financially. It's not who I am.

 

Waiting for someone to die to get money or sucking up to them for it probably means you're not doing what you can with your own life, choices and resources from what I've seen in others. It's just not worth it.

 

Can you live with not reaching out to this man who put you through emotional violence, as you call it?

 

And physical, I call that too. Sure. I just want to make sure I've turned every stone as there is no going back when he's finally gone.

[VeronicaRoss]

I lost both my parents, so this subject is both tender and bitter.

 

 

Really sorry for your losses Tayla, both of them? Wow.

 

he took efforts to amend for his wrongs. I had forgiven him long before that though, so his efforts meant alot for him to simply say it.

 

That's amazing and very cool he did that at all. Congrats to you both.

 

He deserves to have some level of peace too. Until you have understand that persons entire upbringing and life challenges its hard to show compassion.

 

He does, and he has to find that for himself. I am not going to lie anymore to make him feel ok.

 

I think you mean unless you know their past well it's easier to not to have compassion, right? I was his captive confidant as a kid, and his mother and I were very close. He had a great childhood and adulthood. I think it's physical, and he was just born without the ability to connect in a family way.

 

Even upon her death I regreted soo very many things ....So if regret can be removed ....then peace can reside. May you gain that before its too late. People, even til their last breath deserve a level of consideration.

 

I'm glad you were able to get to that place with her and I'm sorry there is still stuff to process but you are doing that work and that truly is a spiritual destination unto itself. Personally I think they live on after death and can see things in a better light. My gram starting seeing her husband and mother before she died (she wasn't a mystical person at all before then) and she said all their old grievances were gone, they were just happy to see her.

 

I don't know of anything I haven't made amends for. My letter to him was even handed and respectful, but searingly honest too -- any honesty like that with him would be. The only time he heard me complain about him before I was 13, he found a letter I wrote to a friend, he read my rant about hating working for him so much and his reaction was to go on a bender and end up sleeping in a ditch. And he told me this because obviously that was a horrible thing for me to do to such a sensitive person such as him. That's the level of insanity.

 

My behavior as his daughter, I definitely screwed up in major ways at times but I had time to realize that and said I was sorry when I realized my error, I really don't find it hard to do, I always feel closer and better so I don't get the reluctance.

 

Thanks for responding, I realize I might sound defensive but you've given me a list of things to check off, and it's really helping me think this through.

[VeronicaRoss]

Your dad probably loves you as much as he's capable of loving anyone. Narcissistic people are sometimes also people without empathy. Not sure how he got that way, but he just may not know how to love.

 

I agree, he just doesn't know how.

 

I think it's terrible that he retaliated on you the way he did just for speaking your mind, so I wouldn't expect any better reception if you began now speaking to him about what was on your mind.

 

Thank you so much for saying that, I really appreciate it.

 

But you may feel you need to do it. If so, do it, regardless how he takes it.

 

I do love him very much for a lot of reasons. At the same time he did something intentionally to hurt and humiliate me and was hoping to turn the others against me and support him. It only worked with the oldest, who is a bully too. The others were just appalled. In a big way, it just showed everyone who he is, and who they are as family members too.

 

If there's anything special you can think of that you did love him for and are grateful for, then it wouldn't hurt to just tell him that in a simple way: I still remember how much fun we had when you took us out on the boat.

 

Or: When you weren't being a complete bastard, you used to make me laugh. Do try to think of any good things and be sure they get as much weight as the bad things, that's all.

 

Remember, the real restitution comes from within you because you are able to rise above the obstacles you grew up with and succeed in happiness.

 

That is freaky you said that of all possible things! Sailing and racing for money and for winning is his passion. Good intuition!! However it's an environment I hated being with him in as he was Captain Bly. But I get the point!

 

I think what I need to do is wrap it all up and say "Dad, these are the things you gave me .... I'm so grateful for those gifts. I know you feel a lot of love for me [he has a lot of emotion, that is for sure]. It's just there is a lack of mutuality and respect. I just am not interested in that kind of relationship anymore. If you're interested in offering an apology tied to real identifiable behavior, I'd really appreciate it. If there is something you think I need to apologize for, I'd find it interesting to hear.

 

I know you're proud of what I've accomplished, and I will always remember the fun and the good too. I really do wish you well. Peace!"

 

Thanks preraph, you have been a real angel, much appreciated!

[pie2]

Long history short, my father is a charming, wealthy, narcissistic, alcoholic, sex addicted man. Being a father gave him expected social cred, but he had no real interest in us or parenting.

 

For those of you who have suffered at the hands of your parents and had to make the decision, what did you do and do you regret it?

 

 

You've definitely been through a lot, Veronica. It's just so hard for me to understand why parents do these things. I'm not a parent myself, so I guess I don't have enough perspective. But why do some parents have SUCH a hard time with humility (in relation to their kids)? Is this extremely common? Because your post spoke loud and clear to me, reflecting in some similar ways my own experience. And the other posters here have such painful stories as well

 

 

Anyway, my dad died much younger (mid 50s). It was not unexpected, but it was pretty sudden. There's no doubt that I wish some things had been different. Our relationship was very...complex. Yeah, I would probably say I have regret about some things.

 

 

The loss of a parent is probably always very painful, no matter how estranged the relationship. Your dad is a part of you...physically, relationally, emotionally. And when he passes, it will impact your life forever.

 

 

I would keep the door open. I think it will help you down the road, as yes, regret can impact you later in life. So, it is really partially about your own self-preservation (as well as hopefully making a positive impact on him as well ).

[preraph]

Veronica, when you said that about that he is very emotional, I have a friend who is diagnosed narcissitic, but she is very emotional and selectively emotional. If she loves someone and there's drama, she might cry and not quite always for herself. But she is also bipolar, so there's even a chance he could be bipolar. My friend goes from honestly thinking everyone should make the world revolve around her to tearing up if a friend is unhappy.

 

Funny about the boat thing. I took it from my own history, but ski boats, not sailboats!

 

When your dad was sailing he was in ultimate control and he liked that. Best of luck with this. I know it's so hard.

[preraph]

I realized it was him and not me. He is a narcassist and I honestly believe in his mind he thought he was doing his best to parent my brother and I.

 

Their whole approach to life is different. I am actually high on the narcissistic scale but what saves me is I have enough empathy (though there's a lot of people I don't think about at all -- but the ones on my radar, I'm interested and empathetic). If they have no empathy, they're closer to being a sociopath! Narcissitic people can be genuinely puzzled why you wouldn't put their needs first over your own, on the extreme end. With me, it's more like, I'm taking care of me and unless I'm hurting someone I care about, I represent myself and everyone can fend for themselves! And if I get mad because someone's wasting my time, which happens constantly in everyday life, I can really get nasty to get my needs taken care of.

 

There are people who are just plain bad and enjoy being bad and have no empathy and/or enjoy controlling others or enjoy creating chaos. But your garden variety narcissist isn't that extreme. A way I think I'm different from my friends is that in order for me to CARE about some story they might tell me about someone else (not the friends, I care about them), I have to think back in my own life and find something to compare it to in order to relate to it. You'll see that's obvious in my posts. Always starts out talking about them, but ends up talking about me. While I realize that may annoy some, it's not coming from an evil place. It's just the only way I can pull up feelings or interest for some things is to find some point of reference within myself. That's narcissism at work.

 

If you get a narcissist at the high end without empathy, they're like sociopaths. But they may love those they consider part of them, you know, their kids, etc. In their own way. Get a narcissist with other issues, like bipolar, and they can be the light of your life when they're up and like holding onto a rabid wildabeast when they're down.

[d0nnivain]

I had a rocky relationship with my mother. I won't characterize it as abusive but both my parents were alcoholics.

 

 

At the end of their lives I sacrificed a lot to keep them comfortable. I'm glad I did it but I never got the absolution or love / acceptance I wanted.

 

 

Ironically, a few weeks ago I was talking to a friend about his problems. He adored my parents & often said he wanted to be just like them. Then he said something that blew me away. We were talking about how my parents bragged to everyone about how great I am but they never did anything except criticize me to my face, or at least downplay my accomplishments. My friend said that it broke his heart that I tried so hard to win their approval but it never came. I didn't know people could see that.

 

 

I know I honored my parents through their deaths & I was a good daughter but I am having all sorts of psychological problems -- including anxiety & depression -- because I knew believed they thought I was good enough.

 

 

If there was physical or sexual abuse in your backstory, unless that person is coming to you with proof of rehabilitation, I'd walk away & not look back. Otherwise, I'd at least hear them out because once they pass, you don't get another shot at this.

[Betterthanthis13]

Long history short, my father is a charming, wealthy, narcissistic, alcoholic, sex addicted man. Being a father gave him expected social cred, but he had no real interest in us or parenting.

 

About 15 years ago he said one sentence in front of his most recent wife: "Sorry for the past, kid". I knew he wasn't, and he actually wouldn't acknowledge any wrong doing so I said nothing. This 'apology' infuriated me though, once more I had to let him showboat, that was my job.

 

Years later I wrote him a letter of the things I would want the apology to be about. In return, he wrote a letter to me copying all my siblings that eviscerated me. I knew not to read it beyond the first line and saw where it was going so I just wrote back and said, "I'm taking the high road. I'm just tired of the emotional violence in this family." My brother told me later the letter was written clearly to humiliate me. One sister said "It isn't true!" but I didn't ask what it was. My brother also said Dad said he wasn't sorry for anything I wrote about, shocked my brother but not me.

 

I had a blissful four years of no contact with any of them, most healthy, growing years I had experienced in my life. Everything improved by my staying away.

 

Dad is feeling his age now, he's close to 80, his friends are dying. Now he says when I see him at weddings and such "I love you" I just say "You too" and leave it at that. There are things I love him for, but he's too messed up to interact with and he has never offered any apology for the letter or anything else.

 

I'd really like advice from people who had similar experiences with their parents and the parents are now gone.

 

For those of you who have suffered at the hands of your parents and had to make the decision, what did you do and do you regret it?

 

I was just struggling with thinking about this exact same thing over the weekend. I've been estranged from my mother for almost 4 years now, and my life is definitely much better without her in it. She is not sorry for anything she has ever done to me as far as I know. I don't think she is capable of empathy or remorse. But there will come a day when she gets older and sick and close to death (she's not quite 70 yet so it may be awhile) and may reach out to me, I don't know. One of my brothers is still in contact with her and I will want to be there for him when he has to start dealing with caring for a dying mother. If it will make his life easier I will do whatever he needs me to, up to and including "making amends" with her or telling her whatever she wants to hear to make it less stressful for my brother.

 

I already forgive her to the best of my ability, not for her sake or because she wants me to, but for my own peace of mind. I have no interest in maintaining a relationship with someone who has no interest in me aside from attempting to abuse me, and I can't think of any good reason to interact with such a person. I wish I had a mom who cared about me, but I just never did and never will. It's upsetting and depressing no matter what I do. There is no good answer.

 

I think if you anticipate feeling guilty if you don't reach out, you might want to just do it and get it over with, but look at it as something you are doing for yourself so you can live your life without regrets, with no expectation of it having a positive effect on your relationship or how your dad feels, just something you are doing because it seems like the right thing to do in this type of situation.

[preraph]

We were talking about how my parents bragged to everyone about how great I am but they never did anything except criticize me to my face, or at least downplay my accomplishments.

 

A lot of time parents pretty much just take credit for how their kid turned out as their own accomplishment, even when the child turned out well despite them. This makes them think, Well, I wasn't such a bad parent after all. It's just lame and irresponsible they didn't pass those compliments on down to you, the person who earned them. Sorry.

[VeronicaRoss]

This is one wise group of people. Thanks all!