Maybe making progress, or not.

[nickjd]

So after a horrible long distance break up and 2 of the LONGEST months of my life of emotional ruin through my ex cheating on me because of my depression, work, etc... she's talking to me on skype again, emailing and generally hanging around on facebook. It doesn't help we live 10,000 miles apart.

 

For nearly 4 years we lived together in Oz. I left this February due to stress and not being able to deal with a cheater, naturally.

 

She tells me now she has made a terrible mistake and doesn't want to lose me, and can I ever forgive her. I try and be nice and say hi on facebook, but she's always got it set to offline so she doesn't have to talk to her step sister or other friends, but she seems happy to talk to me for periods of time. We spoke on skype for nearly an hour yesterday and there was no mention of the afair-ee.

 

It's like a niggling thing in the back of my mind, but I always want to just talk and keep in touch, at least most mornings when we are both around. Yesterday we talked for hours.

 

We decided to write a list of 10 things we didn't like about the relationship and each other, and it was good because it was quite diplomatic and un tainted by personality etc. Now she says she is writing out a list of 10 things she loves about me, so far she has outlined this;

 

1. Same taste in food, music, interests, sports (or lack of)

2. Helpful and knowledgeable ie. fixing cars, bikes, technology etc

3. Fits in, well liked and gets along with all family members

4. Similar sense of humor and outlook on life

5. Physically attractive and good looking

6. Hard worker/resourceful

7. Supportive of my nutrition and exercise choices etc.

8. Good manners, etiquette, respectful of me and others

9. Future together

10. Moved to the other side of the world for me

 

That's a pretty obvious list I suppose, she's still into me big time. My problem is she is telling me she is desperately unhappy with her self and her self esteem. She keeps saying things like "you think I am horrible, you will never forgive me". She tells me now it's all over, she often thinks about just walking infront of a train. She talks about how she wants to improve herself before she can work on a relationship. My gut is telling me she is still talking to / seeing her lover just from doubt as she will always be on facebook chat and keeping me as a door mat. I was doing really well at first with just LC, then NC but still a friend on facebook. Sure enough, whenever I got busy for a week, she'd send an email.

 

I can't tell if she has super repressed issues, or if she is pushing me away, or what. I don't want to just ignore her, I still love her too much. She has been the 'one' for nearly 8 years.

 

Does she just need space to get her stuff together, or is she really that much of an indecisive hussy she has to go to great lengths to keep me interested. I mean, on skype she was playing with OUR dog and showing me round the house, it's like torture because she won't tell me whats on her mind.

 

argh, relationships

[TaraMaiden]

Split, go No Contact, get therapy/counselling and agree to touch base in a year.

 

That goes for both of you.

 

 

This is so dysfunctional it hurts my eyes to read it.

[nickjd]

I'm making positive steps for myself. I am eating better, exercising, walking my parents dog, talking to people about my situation.

 

I now have a job lined up for running a mobile espresso van, ironically my ex was a barista. I have been talking about going back to uni to study ICT to better myself.

 

I really just want the sweet young caring lady I knew back. We had great family, friends and everything. She HAD to cheat with a big hairy guy who swills beer and chips, and now she's telling me shes having regrets? Only 3 months ago we were talking about marriage and looking at a bigger house. Do you help someone like this, or ignore them?. I told her she would be fine and meet someone new, but she says she only wants me. Personally, I don't really want to be dragged into her BS, she made her bed.

[TaraMaiden]

Split, go No Contact, get therapy/counselling and agree to touch base in a year.

 

That goes for both of you.

 

 

This is so dysfunctional it hurts my eyes to read it.

 

Quoted, because i can't be asked to type it again.

 

Do as advised.

Read the No Contact Guide in my signature.

It's the only way to stop asking questions and endlessly churning this round and round in your brain until it resembles scrambled eggs....

 

Quit 'thinking'.

 

Start 'acting'.

 

Go No Contact.

You know it makes sense.

And when you read the Guide, you'll be utterly convinced of it.

[nickjd]

Ok, thanks Tara.

 

It's just so disappointing it has got to this, I honestly thought she had moved on in life and I was beginning to. I suppose it's only bad news, I will end up the same rut in life.

[TaraMaiden]

Yup:

As they say, "Insanity is doing the same thing, over and over again, and expecting a different result."

 

Lather, rinse repeat.

Grab a towel, dry it off and quit, for goodness' sake!

[learning_slowly]

How old are you? I'm sure I'm a lot older and it scares me too. I'm asking her once, if there's a chance, otherwise I'm out and trying to change my rut. Whatever happens I'm doing a parachute jump. I've joined a club. Luckily I was doing irregular gym, which has now turned into regular gym and drink less alcohol.

 

Once you stop trying, you may as well be dead. Don't give up, change & live. I see plenty of people who have given up and you really don't want to be them.

[Simon Phoenix]

It just boggles my mind that people are just so willing and eager to take someone back who has cheated on them. I truly do not get it. Short of physical abuse, cheating is the worst thing a person can do to their partner. The sheer lack of loyalty that comes from cheating pisses me off so much that there is no way on this Earth I'd be able to be friends with a person like that, much less be begging and pleading for them to take me back. I mean, you aren't alone OP, there are a ton of people like you on this site with problems setting boundaries and with little self-esteem, but that's the one thing I just could not forgive and forget. You cheat, you're done.

 

/rant

Edited April 17, 2014 by Simon Phoenix

[mangetout]

It just boggles my mind that people are just so willing and eager to take someone back who has cheated on them. I truly do not get it. Short of physical abuse, cheating is the worst thing a person can do to their partner. The sheer lack of loyalty that comes from cheating pisses me off so much that there is no way on this Earth I'd be able to be friends with a person like that, much less be begging and pleading for them to take me back. I mean, you aren't alone OP, there are a ton of people like you on this site with problems setting boundaries and with little self-esteem, but that's the one thing I just could not forgive and forget. You cheat, you're done.

 

/rant

 

That's because it's very black and white for you. Sometimes cheating happens because it was a genuine mistake. These cheaters should be given a second chance. If they cheat again then yeah.. Forget it and move on, it really depends how remorseful the cheater is.

 

OP My story is a long one but my ex fiancé cheated on me two years ago. We have suffered a lot from this. Bit I see that it was a genuine stupid mistake on his part.

 

Whether she regrets it or not.. I personally don't see how you can work on this if she is miles away from you anyway. Will you be seeing her again?

[learning_slowly]

It just boggles my mind that people are just so willing and eager to take someone back who has cheated on them. I truly do not get it. Short of physical abuse, cheating is the worst thing a person can do to their partner. The sheer lack of loyalty that comes from cheating pisses me off so much that there is no way on this Earth I'd be able to be friends with a person like that, much less be begging and pleading for them to take me back. I mean, you aren't alone OP, there are a ton of people like you on this site with problems setting boundaries and with little self-esteem, but that's the one thing I just could not forgive and forget. You cheat, you're done.

 

/rant

 

I have cheated on people and the guilt if you care about the other person is tremendous. So why do it? One drink too many, I thought I loved somebody else, there's loads of reasons. Men don't always associate sex with love and I know girls that are like that too. It seems here his gf did it when he was at his lowest. I know it's not great, but maybe she does love him. Or are you telling me you've never made a mistake? I make them all the time and I'm proud that I'm not a robot yet!

[Simon Phoenix]

I have cheated on people and the guilt if you care about the other person is tremendous. So why do it? One drink too many, I thought I loved somebody else, there's loads of reasons. Men don't always associate sex with love and I know girls that are like that too. It seems here his gf did it when he was at his lowest. I know it's not great, but maybe she does love him. Or are you telling me you've never made a mistake? I make them all the time and I'm proud that I'm not a robot yet!

 

A mistake is not taking out the trash or forgetting to pay the electric bill on time, not sticking your d--k into someone else when you are in a romantic relationship (or letting someone stick their d--k into you). That's betrayal, disloyal and shows no character.

 

You don't have to love everyone you have sex with, but you should love and respect the person you are in a relationship enough not to have sex with other people. It's common courtesy, if nothing else. I can't believe you just white-knighted cheaters. And if not cheating makes me a robot, then call me Johnny 5.

[nickjd]

It's hard for me to tell if she is true in being remorseful for cheating, or if she is just feeding her ego by reeling off this stuff. We haven't spoken about a week now, I just turn my laptop off most nights so I am not tempted to check to see if she's online.

 

We spoke briefly last tuesday and she said she was busy getting ready for her exercise class.

 

What gets me is she says she is frightened she'll lose me etc, but makes no effort now to send an email or just be social. I don't know if shes testing out my feelings or is trying to move on herself without feeling the guilt of what she has done.

 

I wish I could wave a magic wand and be back working things out like we had talked about in our emails, giving her family a return hug and seeing our little dog run around the garden with his favourite toys. I'm sure everyone would wish for such a wand too, but it's life.

 

They say that often the way we feel is how the other feels. At the minute I feel anger, but some days I just stare into space thinking about her little quirks and miss her deeply.

 

The guy she is with I suspect is a rebound as he is the polar opposite of me, but if she really had feelings for him other than casual sex why would she tell me she has never been unhappier in her life?

 

I'm so confused because as this stage if I go total NC, it will look immature and impatient for her to 'work on her self esteem' - or so she says. I mentioned that we should get back together in may and she said that wasn't fair to put a time frame on this. She said give it a couple of months and she would be back in shape again.

 

The other element is luckily I have very supportive parents, and I am living with them at the minute until I can find my feet, obviously I help them out a lot. She lives with our rental house, our cars, her family, friends, social clique over there in Oz. She is still active and coping, I am however down in the dumps love sick and confused. A lot of friends have said just move and forget her as she's only going to be bad news in the future.

 

Is there anything other to do than cut her out of my life, part of me is frightened she will move on and forget, part of me is frightened I will never move on and forget, even after serious NC.

[TaraMaiden]

You just don't get it, do you?

 

So you spoke on Tuesday?

So you've been in NC for only 6 days now.

 

She is keeping you on as an option; on a back-burner until SHE is ready to either commit, or kick you to the base-line for good.

You are an option.

For goodness' sake, either go total, complete No Contact, or quit giving highlights and updates because she is your ex, and frankly you are doing yourself no favours at all!!

 

It's over.

Look upon it as history.

Move on, leave it be and get your own life back on track.

She is out of the picture - and that is all you should be thinking!

 

Either pee or get off the pot - stop fence-sitting and do something concrete!

[nickjd]

I did it Tara, I just deleted her facebook. It was the only tie we have, I just need to do the same with skype. It was really weird clicking the unfriend button, suddenly my head felt like someone pressed the reset button.

 

I spoke to my sister on the phone before and she said what she was doing is totally unfair (back burner). I won't be anyones second choice, especially if they can make claims about being suicidal yet still go to the gym and keep a straight face on webcam. I just wish there wasn't the distance, and secondly done this sooner.

 

I feel so desperate for her love again, but I suppose that went out of the window when she cheated. No doubt she will already have a plan B, C and D lined up after her current man.

 

Maybe one day she will come back like the old saying, but at this point I am certainly not emotionally secure enough, and neither her apparently. From what was a secure flowering connection has just turned into a ****ty game of cat and mouse.

 

Thanks for smacking some sense into me, MAN THE F*** UP as my father has said.

[learning_slowly]

I don't think life's that black and white. I've cheated on people ( and not proud of it), before and still thought I would end up being with them forever.

 

I think people can cheat and then change for the better.

Sometimes people do grow up. I know it's more unlikely and they remain as they are, but it does happen.

 

Mostly people are neither good or bad, but somewhere in between. They can make mistakes and change. But I agree it is far easier to put your energy into somebody that has not done this to you.

[TaraMaiden]

I don't think life's that black and white. I've cheated on people ( and not proud of it), before and still thought I would end up being with them forever.

Really? You think someone who's been cheated on can happily, comfortably see 'forever' with you?

 

I think people can cheat and then change for the better.

It's not up to you to judge that from someone else's perspective. That's for you to prove. And for them to let you.

 

Sometimes people do grow up. I know it's more unlikely and they remain as they are, but it does happen.

That's the problem. proving it to others. And once the trust has been destroyed, a lot of people don't want to wait for 'you' to grow up.

 

Mostly people are neither good or bad, but somewhere in between.

Nobody is either good or bad. The choices they make - are good or bad.

 

They can make mistakes and change. But I agree it is far easier to put your energy into somebody that has not done this to you.

Yes, because if you don't trust them, then it's an uphill struggle.

[learning_slowly]

Really? You think someone who's been cheated on can happily, comfortably see 'forever' with you?

 

It's not up to you to judge that from someone else's perspective. That's for you to prove. And for them to let you.

 

 

That's the problem. proving it to others. And once the trust has been destroyed, a lot of people don't want to wait for 'you' to grow up.

 

 

Nobody is either good or bad. The choices they make - are good or bad.

 

 

Yes, because if you don't trust them, then it's an uphill struggle.

 

Do you think people would cheat if the relationship was good?

 

A relationship takes 2 people. Yes, the cheater is not behaving correctly, but would they have cheated if both parties had recognised the problems and dealt with them.

 

Sometimes you have to forget your own experiences to be objective.

[mangetout]

You CAN recover from cheating. It takes work and a lot of time to pass but it IS possible.

I know many couples who have recovered from cheating. Not been easy but normality can come back.

 

 

Its taken me nearly two years and some serious ups and downs but I have forgiven my partner and I do trust him again.

 

 

OP you need to give yourself some space from this. It hurts like mad but the feelings will lessen as time goes by. Let your ex work on her self esteem.

 

 

Concentrate on yourself for now.

[conf]

Do you think people would cheat if the relationship was good?

 

A relationship takes 2 people. Yes, the cheater is not behaving correctly, but would they have cheated if both parties had recognised the problems and dealt with them.

 

Sometimes you have to forget your own experiences to be objective.

 

Don't try to justify cheating. If the relationship was not good it was not good for their spouse also but they did not cheat. Cheating is a choice... It does not happen by accident... Some people are just weak and they don't have boundaries...

 

Also many people cheat because spark has gone aka honeymoon period is over... Does it mean that the relationship was not good?

[learning_slowly]

Don't try to justify cheating. If the relationship was not good it was not good for their spouse also but they did not cheat. Cheating is a choice... It does not happen by accident... Some people are just weak and they don't have boundaries...

 

Also many people cheat because spark has gone aka honeymoon period is over... Does it mean that the relationship was not good?

 

I feel that a lot of people on here have been cheated on and cannot forgive that.

 

I have been cheated on and yet I wish her the best as I loved her once. She made a mistake, but she didn't kill anybody.

 

The only harm was to me and yes it could have been dealt with differently, but humans often take the easiest route in life, otherwise we'd all be trying to figure out this alone.

 

What you really need to do is get over the negativity and try to support rather than dictate?

 

Maybe people do get addicted to the honeymoon period, but is that so bad? Are they selling drugs to kids? Are they buying clothes made by children that have to work horrendous hours?

[Simon Phoenix]

More white-knighting of cheating I see. Whatever. I guess it comes down to how important you consider loyalty to be. I consider loyalty and respect to be two of the most important things in life. Therefore I would never cheat (I haven't) and the one person who did cheat on me was gone from my life completely the second I found out about it.

 

Cheating on someone isn't just stabbing them in the back. It's stabbing them in the heart. It's a deplorable act and the only thing worse in my mind is physical abuse.

[learning_slowly]

More white-knighting of cheating I see. Whatever. I guess it comes down to how important you consider loyalty to be. I consider loyalty and respect to be two of the most important things in life. Therefore I would never cheat (I haven't) and the one person who did cheat on me was gone from my life completely the second I found out about it.

 

Cheating on someone isn't just stabbing them in the back. It's stabbing them in the heart. It's a deplorable act and the only thing worse in my mind is physical abuse.

 

Have you ever forgiven her?

 

Have you moved on?

 

"White knighting" would imply I'm championing it! That's far from what I'm doing. It happens and I'm sure it will continue to occur as long as humans exist.

And I assume it occurs mostly due to peoples' insecurities.

 

But do you really think that somebody who put time and effort in to having a relationship with you, wanted to have an affair with somebody else if there wasn't something lacking on your part. They may have changed and wanted something you didn't possess. Who's fault is that?

Is it better that they remain with you but not loving you? I can't imagine that would have been great for you?

 

But not everybody wants the same things, so a new partner could find you perfect, even without change.

 

Hopefully, you will overcome your anger, as although it's good to be passionate, I think you're wasting yours.

[conf]

Have you ever forgiven her?

 

Have you moved on?

 

"White knighting" would imply I'm championing it! That's far from what I'm doing. It happens and I'm sure it will continue to occur as long as humans exist.

And I assume it occurs mostly due to peoples' insecurities.

 

But do you really think that somebody who put time and effort in to having a relationship with you, wanted to have an affair with somebody else if there wasn't something lacking on your part. They may have changed and wanted something you didn't possess. Who's fault is that?

Is it better that they remain with you but not loving you? I can't imagine that would have been great for you?

 

But not everybody wants the same things, so a new partner could find you perfect, even without change.

 

Hopefully, you will overcome your anger, as although it's good to be passionate, I think you're wasting yours.

 

It is obvious why you are justifying the cheating. As you said you cheated in the past. You don't want people to be hard on someone who had cheated because in a subconscious level you don't want people to judge you.

 

Also you support my belief by stating that "But do you really think that somebody who put time and effort in to having a relationship with you, wanted to have an affair with somebody else if there wasn't something lacking on your part". Ok! We got it! You were forced to cheat... Shame on the monster who lead you to do that... Have you ever thought that maybe the lacking thing is inside the cheater?

 

Face reality and take responsibility of your actions. Fact is that not all people cheat.

[Simon Phoenix]

Have you ever forgiven her?

 

Have you moved on?

 

"White knighting" would imply I'm championing it! That's far from what I'm doing. It happens and I'm sure it will continue to occur as long as humans exist.

And I assume it occurs mostly due to peoples' insecurities.

 

But do you really think that somebody who put time and effort in to having a relationship with you, wanted to have an affair with somebody else if there wasn't something lacking on your part. They may have changed and wanted something you didn't possess. Who's fault is that?

Is it better that they remain with you but not loving you? I can't imagine that would have been great for you?

 

But not everybody wants the same things, so a new partner could find you perfect, even without change.

 

Hopefully, you will overcome your anger, as although it's good to be passionate, I think you're wasting yours.

 

Yeah, it was years ago. If I saw her I wouldn't say a thing about it (already have done that), but I'd never take her back in a million years and I wouldn't go out of my way to be her friend. There are certain lines you don't cross and she crossed it. And spare me the stupid "there's something you did wrong" thing. Nothing I did justified her stabbing me in the back. She should have just broken up with me like an adult, then started up with the new guy.

 

All you are doing is championing and excusing cheating. I'm sorry dude, all I read from you is complete herp derp that I will never agree with. While you might think manipulating the people you've cheated on and blaming them for your indiscretions is a positive way to spend your time, I think it just makes you look like a jerk. We'll just agree to disagree because the stuff you are saying ITT is completely ridiculous. I hope it's more of devil's advocate and trolling, but you are definitely "white-knighting" cheating.

[learning_slowly]

You're reading me the wrong way. A relationship has 2 parties. To work or fail both have to have something to do with it.

 

Not everybody is in a position to cheat.

 

Do you really think I care if people judge me? I have bigger worries than what others think.

 

I live my life so that I can look back on it and hopefully think I did the best I could given my environment. I have made mistakes and will undoubtedly make more.

 

If you haven't then I believe your lying. And if you can't forgive the people you supposedly loved, did you really love them?