StillHurtin Posted February 3, 2005 Posted February 3, 2005 We were out shopping the other day and we stopped in the aisle to look for body wash. H picks up a bottle of body wash and says "This is what the skank (what I have always called her) likes." I asked him why he had to bring her up. He told me he didn't know. Maybe it was innocent but sometimes I feel like he still has feelings for her when he brings her up on his own. He has said some awful things about her, things I would never even say about her, but yet he brings her name up occassionally. I wonder if this awful things aren't just cover up for how he really feels. I realize he is back w/ me, says and does things to show how much he loves me, and he has changed but when he brings her name up bugs me. We were going somewhere the other day and I seen my ex BF (someone I went out w/ years b4 I even met H) and mentioned it to H. I probably shouldn't of said anything. Maybe that is why he said it, to make me jealous, I don't know. Coming here and reading OP post brings me right back to the A. Sometimes I wonder if this isn't the best place to come to heal even though I get great advice.
Pocky Posted February 3, 2005 Posted February 3, 2005 I'd tell him it bothers you. Explain to him that it's a part of your life together that you'd prefer not to be reminded of.
Cecelius Posted February 3, 2005 Posted February 3, 2005 He either felt he was helping you hate her (by calling her what you call her), felt he was not hiding something (maybe he feels really guilty about the fact that he knows what body wash she uses and didn't want to hide it) or lastly, he has that evil little snide barb in him where he just likes to jump out and bash people a little. Sometimes its called being b----hy. It could be the last thing and that doesn't have anything to do with the fact that it was an affair. My g/f, when she was a little less mature, would come out with some obnoxious one liners once in a while. When it comes down to it, isn't it just that he knows what body wash she uses, and why he knows this, that irritates you? And aren't you completely justified in being irritated? You could bust him out ("well, knowing that is what you get for ------g a skank"). You could let him know straightout that you don't care what she uses, and he shouldn't either and that comments like that don't really show that he's putting it in the past. ANd you could say that any possibility that he says these things to make you jealous is off base, you assume is not the case and that if it is, he knows where that leads.
StrawberryGirl Posted February 3, 2005 Posted February 3, 2005 I think he is fronting by calling her a skank yet remembering the skank's body wash. I realize most men front when they go back to the "wife". They feel they have to pretend to hate the other woman in order to reassure their wives. They have to hide their true feeling of the other woman behind tiny bashes on the other woman but in the back of their mind they are really thinking about times and moments of the other woman.
Sharmaine Posted February 3, 2005 Posted February 3, 2005 Agree with you strawberrygirl. She's obviously still on his mind, even tho he's bitching her. Not exactly gonna say anything nice about her is he? A bit hypocritical of him to be slagging her off and referring to her as 'skank' I think. Even tho she may be a 'skank', it takes two to tango and if she's a 'skank', then what does that make him? Laughable......LOL
Author StillHurtin Posted February 4, 2005 Author Posted February 4, 2005 Originally posted by Sharmaine Agree with you strawberrygirl. She's obviously still on his mind, even tho he's bitching her. Not exactly gonna say anything nice about her is he? A bit hypocritical of him to be slagging her off and referring to her as 'skank' I think. Even tho she may be a 'skank', it takes two to tango and if she's a 'skank', then what does that make him? Laughable......LOL Are you the OW by any chance? Just curious. I don't know if you know my story but H had his A w/ the OW when we were going through a pending D and separation. At the time we thought the M was over but after he realized she wasn't who he really wanted he came back to me wanting me back. Ya know the saying, you never knew what you had until you loose it? Anyhow, the "skank" was the first one to make the moves on him. She was flirting w/ him constantly as soon as he started working w/ her. She was the one who told him she was attracted to him, she was the one who kissed him (b4 he filed for a D). She knew he was married, had kids, ect. And I have talked to her on the phone several times when the A was going on. Of course she denied it. Said H was confused at what he wanted to do w/ his life, stay in the M or get the D. She said she would talk to him for me, tell him I still love him, blah, blah, blah. She made it sound like she was my friend (which she tried very hard to be since I met her 4 years ago) and wanted the M to work out. But as soon as she had the chance she opened her legs for him. BOTH of them could of respected my wishes ( I told her that I didn't care if they screwed eachother but wait until the D was final). But she didn't. I agree, this is kind of the "We were on a break!" on Friends w/ Ross and Racheal. I guess what ticks me off is that she knew he was having doubts about the M, whether he really wanted to end it or not. Any respectful woman would of told him until he is positive what he wanted then no relationship. But the OW has no respect for other ppl's feelings (she in fact told me that. If she wants something, she is going to go after it.) H was confused and she was just there to cloud his judgement.
_Saffy_ Posted February 4, 2005 Posted February 4, 2005 Originally posted by Sharmaine Agree with you strawberrygirl. She's obviously still on his mind, even tho he's bitching her. Not exactly gonna say anything nice about her is he? A bit hypocritical of him to be slagging her off and referring to her as 'skank' I think. Even tho she may be a 'skank', it takes two to tango and if she's a 'skank', then what does that make him? Laughable......LOL sharmaine and strawberrygirl............do you not find it totally unfair that someone has come here asking for advice and you both took it upon yaselves to bitch about someone else's husband? just out of interest...........what do you think that makes you two??
Ladyjane14 Posted February 4, 2005 Posted February 4, 2005 Not every MM remembers the OW with fondness. It may be a bit of a childish reaction since he's equally culpable, but sometimes he'll remember her as someone who "got him in trouble". I think it may come down to feeling emotionally vulnerable at whatever point in their lives, and feeling somewhat preyed upon. Not necessarily true in every case mind you, but the memory can play tricks on a person, particularly when they are highly motivated to repair the relationship that really matters to them. I don't see your husband's comment as a bad thing at all. I think it was an indicator that he has brought you back into his inner circle, and is now capable on sharing nonsense thoughts with you. You know, stuff that justs flits across your brain and doesn't have any particular meaning. That's why when you asked him why he brought her up, he didn't know. It wasn't really important is my guess. Just a nonsense thought. You missed a good opportunity to normalize your relations here though. Diffusing with humor would have cemented his ability to trust you with small details like that one. You might have said something like, "Gee, I'll have to remember not to use THAT one. I don't want you to get confused about where you're supposed to be again!" A humorous statement presented with bright smile and a quick hug, would've gone a long way toward making him feel accepted and forgiven. Try not to let your opportunities get by you.
a chick Posted February 4, 2005 Posted February 4, 2005 LadyJane is right on, IMO. He's comfortable enough with you to talk about the skank in light conversation. My H won't speak a word about her. I think your H talking this way to you is positive! However, I do understand how it would make you feel. You wish she never ever entered his mind at all. Its hard for BS to accept that OW was not a bad person to him. To him, it was fun and exciting. He cared for her. He is ashamed of the resulting pain of it, perhaps he can now see how insincere, reckless, childish, plastic and stupid it was of him to get involved with another woman while married. When we talk about it, he appears very distraught, remorseful and ashamed and so we can't speak of it any longer. I believe him when he says it wasn't worth the damage to our relationship and the hurt it caused our children who witnessed everything we went through because of it. But he doesn't dislike her like I do and he never will. I wish I could make him hate her, but I know in my heart he never could, despite what small thing he might say to try to make me feel better. It's hard to admit all of that and live with it.
Sharmaine Posted February 4, 2005 Posted February 4, 2005 Originally posted by StillHurtin Are you the OW by any chance? Just curious. I don't know if you know my story but H had his A w/ the OW when we were going through a pending D and separation. At the time we thought the M was over but after he realized she wasn't who he really wanted he came back to me wanting me back. Ya know the saying, you never knew what you had until you loose it? Anyhow, the "skank" was the first one to make the moves on him. She was flirting w/ him constantly as soon as he started working w/ her. She was the one who told him she was attracted to him, she was the one who kissed him (b4 he filed for a D). She knew he was married, had kids, ect. And I have talked to her on the phone several times when the A was going on. Of course she denied it. Said H was confused at what he wanted to do w/ his life, stay in the M or get the D. She said she would talk to him for me, tell him I still love him, blah, blah, blah. She made it sound like she was my friend (which she tried very hard to be since I met her 4 years ago) and wanted the M to work out. But as soon as she had the chance she opened her legs for him. BOTH of them could of respected my wishes ( I told her that I didn't care if they screwed eachother but wait until the D was final). But she didn't. I agree, this is kind of the "We were on a break!" on Friends w/ Ross and Racheal. I guess what ticks me off is that she knew he was having doubts about the M, whether he really wanted to end it or not. Any respectful woman would of told him until he is positive what he wanted then no relationship. But the OW has no respect for other ppl's feelings (she in fact told me that. If she wants something, she is going to go after it.) H was confused and she was just there to cloud his judgement. No I'm not an OW, I'm a BS whose H left for the OW. Guess that is maybe why I was harsh in regard to your H, I have no time for those ppl who are cheaters/have cheated before. Sorry didn't know your situation, (that he met her during your seperation), so I do apologise for just jumping straight in.
StrawberryGirl Posted February 4, 2005 Posted February 4, 2005 I think he is fronting by calling her a skank STILLHURTIN asked for an opinion and being a member of this board I simply gave mine, I believe he is FRONTING but I do agree that it was a nonsense thought. I realize most men front when they go back to the "wife". They feel they have to pretend to hate the other woman in order to reassure their wives. After an affair most wives are insecure and having trouble trusting again, so I guess some men (not all) feel in order to instill trust and security with in their wives again they must FRONT or pretend to hate or be mad at the OW, or gang up with the wife (kinda like he is on her side against the OW and the OW is the enemy now) in order to make it all work again. soooooo......STILLHURTIN I don't doubt your husband love's you or is trying to work on your marriage but the skank comment I feel was a front, in your view the OW was a skank and that is true to the role she played in this affair, but she was your husband's lover and unless she did HIM wrong there was no reason for him to call her a skank other than fronting and if SHE DID do him wrong then he called her a skank due to being mad @ her or butt hurt that she did him wrong. Again this is my OPINION due to alot of research on affairs and also my own personal experiences with myself, friends and family who have gone through an affair either being the OW, wife, MM, or OM! Do no take my opinion as I am tryng to make you feel bad, it is just my view.....
Barby Posted February 4, 2005 Posted February 4, 2005 Originally posted by Lonestar What does a BS refer to in this situation? Doesn't it mean Betrayed Spouse???
Sharmaine Posted February 4, 2005 Posted February 4, 2005 Originally posted by Barby Doesn't it mean Betrayed Spouse??? Yes it does.
Sharmaine Posted February 4, 2005 Posted February 4, 2005 Originally posted by StrawberryGirl STILLHURTIN asked for an opinion and being a member of this board I simply gave mine, I believe he is FRONTING but I do agree that it was a nonsense thought. After an affair most wives are insecure and having trouble trusting again, so I guess some men (not all) feel in order to instill trust and security with in their wives again they must FRONT or pretend to hate or be mad at the OW, or gang up with the wife (kinda like he is on her side against the OW and the OW is the enemy now) in order to make it all work again. soooooo......STILLHURTIN I don't doubt your husband love's you or is trying to work on your marriage but the skank comment I feel was a front, in your view the OW was a skank and that is true to the role she played in this affair, but she was your husband's lover and unless she did HIM wrong there was no reason for him to call her a skank other than fronting and if SHE DID do him wrong then he called her a skank due to being mad @ her or butt hurt that she did him wrong. Again this is my OPINION due to alot of research on affairs and also my own personal experiences with myself, friends and family who have gone through an affair either being the OW, wife, MM, or OM! Do no take my opinion as I am tryng to make you feel bad, it is just my view..... Just curious SG, are you an OW or betrayed spouse? I'm kinda new here and don't know who is who or what u all are as of yet... Just jumped in......lol
Mr Spock Posted February 4, 2005 Posted February 4, 2005 Coming here and reading OP post brings me right back to the A. Sometimes I wonder if this isn't the best place to come to heal even though I get great advice. Good point. I ponder that sometimes too. But as soon as she had the chance she opened her legs for him. BOTH of them could of respected my wishes ( I told her that I didn't care if they screwed eachother but wait until the D was final). But she didn't This is something you're going to have to let go of. You don't own either of these people , although you were married to one of them. You are still harbouring TOO much resentment towards her and not enough towards your husband. I think you're afraid to-you've got him back and behaving now. Hating her makes it EASIER for him to be with you so he does it. You're forgetting who responded to her advances. And you're in denial about the flirting......take it from someone who didn't pay ANY attention to the man until he indicated flirtatious interest-and chances are I'd make your OW look like a weeny in terms of sexual agression. I don't think ladyjane and the other poster are quite on the ball on this one, affairs are NEVER light, fluffy conversations between married couples. He pointed out the bodywash most likely because he liked the smell of it. Or was worried you'd try it. When it all comes down to it, we do what we need to do to get thru the day. Your husband is back with you, and seems to be expressing genuine remorse. I feel your anger is misplaced but if that's what you need to do to move on in your marriage do it. But eventually you'll need to let that anger go (towards her)or it's going to fester. You also need to be careful that you don't shift the blame entirely on her in the future, or he'll get the impression he can get away with anything. I just worry, because in MY situation I'm pretty sure my MM's spouse would believe anything he told her just to not break up the family and lose his income. Sigh.
Owl Posted February 4, 2005 Posted February 4, 2005 Wow...I actually agree with SPOCK about something....sorta! LOL At some point, you do have to let the anger go. I had to...and have reached that point where I'm not angry anymore...even at the OM in my case. Now...if he showed up on the door, and I was faced with the possibility of this happening again, he may wanna hope he wore his kevlar skivvies.... Seriously, it's in the past friend. You should try to get to a point where you can talk about it without being angry someday. That DOESN'T mean you won't be hurt by the conversation...but it does mean that you won't get mad everytime the subject comes up. It takes work. You just have to remind yourself that it's IN THE PAST. When he mentions something like this...use it to be able to COMMUNICATE about what went on. I recently learned that the OM in our case was an ex-marine...and I was friends with this guy for a while. If you're like a lot of others who have tons of questions about what happened...use these kinds of times as a chance to calmly ask the question and GET your answers. And let the anger go. It's over. Your husband made his choice....and it was you. Don't forget that!
Ladyjane14 Posted February 4, 2005 Posted February 4, 2005 Originally posted by Mr Spock I don't think ladyjane and the other poster are quite on the ball on this one, affairs are NEVER light, fluffy conversations between married couples. There comes a time, when the healing is well in progress, that a couple can find both humor and the ability to make small talk about a previous indescretion. In my own marriage, we've been past that time for a while. (And moved on to actively making fun of the OW behind her back. ) Admittedly, we're talking EA and not PA here. However, if there is NEVER a time when the heat is off of the subject, what's the point of going on? There shouldn't be a big white elephant in the room all the time.
KellyBean18 Posted February 4, 2005 Posted February 4, 2005 Originally posted by StillHurtin We were out shopping the other day and we stopped in the aisle to look for body wash. H picks up a bottle of body wash and says "This is what the skank (what I have always called her) likes." I asked him why he had to bring her up. He told me he didn't know. Next time you are in Kroger stop be he Zuccinni's and pick up a 10 incher and say ,, "This reminds me of , oh nevermind " Just a thought
StrawberryGirl Posted February 4, 2005 Posted February 4, 2005 Hating her makes it EASIER for him to be with you so he does it. I totally agree with that!!! I do not agree with ladyjane it is her opinion however, on how she would personally handle this situation and her view on this situation. When it all comes down to it, we do what we need to do to get thru the day I agree again!! I agree alot with Mr. Spock SHARMAINE- Sad to be, but I am the other woman.... My MM was already separated when our relationship began, his wife knew of me from the get go....
Sharmaine Posted February 5, 2005 Posted February 5, 2005 Originally posted by StrawberryGirl SHARMAINE- Sad to be, but I am the other woman.... My MM was already separated when our relationship began, his wife knew of me from the get go.... If my H had met the OW had we been seperated, doubt it would have bothered me as much. We were still together when he met her and he chose to continue the affair while we were together also....so that makes him a 'scumbag'. Anyway, sad to say, I've been OW (a lot of years back when I was young and foolish), then BS (betrayed spouse after 10 years of marriage) and presently, a lot would say I was OW again, but I don't think so. Reason why people would likely say I was OW now, is because I email a guy who came back from my past recently (we had a seven year relationship some years back) and we are exchanging emails, BUT, he's married now. We are friends, nothing more and only mail each other occasionally, not as if we are constantly mailing back and forth/or having long lingering conversations on MSN. He seems happy in his marriage, has never discussed his wife, marriage, any problems with me, likewise I don't spill whatever probs I may have on him. No talk of any feelings whatsoever, mails are just full of everyday stuff, quite boring really, lol....so I don't view it as an 'emotional affair' either......we are friends pure and simple.
Author StillHurtin Posted February 5, 2005 Author Posted February 5, 2005 Originally posted by KellyBean18 Next time you are in Kroger stop be he Zuccinni's and pick up a 10 incher and say ,, "This reminds me of , oh nevermind " Just a thought LMBO KellyBean!!! Thank you for the laugh!!! If I were to do that I would know exactly who's name I would use, lol!!! But I wont do that b/c H wont find it too funny. I think I confused strawberrygirl and Sharmaine. H and the OW did not actually meet during our separation, they worked together for 3 years b4 they had their A. She had been after him since the day he started working there. And she wont deny that as I have spoke to her about it. H is an attractive guy, I don't blame her for being attracted to him. Thanks to all who have given such great advice. I realize I need to put this in the past and I am trying, but when he mentioned her using that type of body wash it brought it back up again. I know how dh feels about the OW. He doesn't like her. He said some awful things about her and I don't think he was saying them to "front" about her. She got him fired from his job, a job he loved. It is a long story, nothing that had to do w/ the A. However, H did tell the HR Dept. that he had an A w/ her and this is why she turned him in (for something different) so they fired him. H even hired a lawyer who said it was not a legit reason to fire him, it was simple horseplay, nothing sexual about it at all. He told me she wished she would of died the time she tried to commit suicide (I knew this story from not only H but also the OW H's, he told me a lot about her). She would of died if her H wouldn't of called the ambulance. Even I wouldn't of said something that bad about her and I have never disliked anyone as much as her. Spock, I know I'm holding a lot of resentment towards her and not towards H. But, I am trying to work on my M w/ my H, I am not going to resent someone I love and have children w/. If I am going to hold resentment towards him what kind of M would that be? Not a good one. As for the OW, I wish I could get over my resentment. Maybe it's not resentment, maybe it's pure jealousy? She was the OW that H had an A w/ that paid attention to him. Women flirt w/ H all the time and he never had an A w/ them. I felt secure that he didn't go w/ them but he went w/ this OW, I lost all that. I don't know why I am jealous, I am more attractive than she is, I don't have a trashy reputation like she does. I am not a better person than her, everyone is equal in God's eyes, but I have more morals than she does and care about other ppl's feelings. I am not a selfish person who goes after a MM b/c I want to and not caring if I hurt the W or not. I wouldn't go out and get drunk and try to commit suicide, especially while being pregnant like she did. I am jealous that SHE was the one that H chose to screw things up w/. Like I told H, if he was going to have an A WHY her? Anyone but her. As for the flirting... I know she flirted w/ H, everyone that they work w/ (I have many friends and friends spouses who seen the flirting from her at work) knew she was flirting. She flirted w/ all the guys there but H was the one she flirted w/ the most. She even flirted w/ her boss, she even rubbed his legs up by his crotch. She has grabbed co-workers crotches in front of other workers. She isn't shy about how she flirts. And I am sure H flirted right back, no denying that one. Now you have my curiousity up about ......take it from someone who didn't pay ANY attention to the man until he indicated flirtatious interest-and chances are I'd make your OW look like a weeny in terms of sexual agression. LOL! The only thing about all this that I am upset w/ H about at this point is that he was the one that was accussing ME of cheating since the day I met him. I couldn't go out w/o coming home and hearing "Who did you flirt w/ J? Who bought you drinks? Who did you dance w/? Who did you talk to?" It was to the point I was going nuts and didn't even want to go out anymore b/c I was always drilled w/ these questions when I got home. Sure, guys always bought me drinks when I went to the bars, but I didn't do anything them them, I didn't even talk to them but maybe said thanks for the drink, that was it.
Mr Spock Posted February 5, 2005 Posted February 5, 2005 You should know that people who accuse their spouse of cheating all the time when they've got no grounds often are compensating for their own guilt. If he was doing this before he even met her I'd be worried about the true depth of his infidelity. Not to give you any more of a complex!! I'm just saying you need to forgive but not forget. Your husband found her attractive. Plain and simple. Attractive enough to sleep with even though he knew it would hurt you. The next time your husband says something derogatory about the OW simply say "Yes, and you had an affair with her so what does that say about you?" and leave it at that.
StrawberryGirl Posted February 5, 2005 Posted February 5, 2005 You should know that people who accuse their spouse of cheating all the time when they've got no grounds often are compensating for their own guilt. Exactly what I was about to say! Well STILLHURTIN as you go deeper into the story I agree the OW was a "skank" and I see why husband would now go along with calling her a "skank" since she did get him fired. The OW was obviously mentally unstable and seems to me she has some "issues". But, men fronting still holds true in most cases....
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