todreaminblue Posted May 20, 2014 Share Posted May 20, 2014 True for whom? You - and many evangelical Christians - espouse that "the message spoken by Jesus Christ" is true as though other messages may be false. And that single truth must be true for EVERY SINGLE PERSON in existence. I contend that both assumptions are false. Carrie i wont even pretend that i am good at receiving messages i get so confused sometimes but there is one thing i do know to be completely true.....Jesus and his message and his love and his whole entire life was for all people, sinners, non christians, he died for all sins not a select group he died and left a legacy for all, therefore i conclude that his message was for all again not just a select group.Can you believe that someone so perfect in life would die for an ex hooker like me, for the prostitute nodding off on the corner the drug addict lost in hopelessness who robbed a liquor store at gunpoint for his next fix..............it doesnt matter if you believe in god, for god believes in us.......we all go to heaven ....whether we stay in gods presence is a different matter.......that is what i know as truth..... makes me a little teary actually and ever so grateful that i would be thought of as worth saving............at one point in time.....i did not believe this message given of jesus christ to be true for me ...for others yes............I didnt even want to save me....who would.......a worthless hooker with a pocketful of cash....but now........i have hope and that hope buds brightly in the message of jesus christ......he saved my life, his life was true for all who live and have lived and will live.....any message he gave was never untrue....for Jesus could and will never lie....and i cannot believe otherwise.....he died for me because i am not worthless not to god and not to him no one ever is tht is the grace in his message.......he gave his life for all...including his messages.....peace to you carrie t........deb 4 Link to post Share on other sites
Speakingofwhich Posted May 20, 2014 Share Posted May 20, 2014 I enjoyed reading your beautiful testimony, deb! I wouldn't be alive without Jesus Christ. He has gotten me through so much and brought me joy in difficult circumstances though I have failed Him many times. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Glinda.Good Posted May 21, 2014 Share Posted May 21, 2014 Hallelujah! And, YESTERDAY was the day around here! Federal judge struck down the ban on same sex marriage in my state! :bunny: Praise the Lord! Link to post Share on other sites
Allumere Posted May 21, 2014 Share Posted May 21, 2014 Hallelujah! And, YESTERDAY was the day around here! Federal judge struck down the ban on same sex marriage in my state! :bunny: Praise the Lord! you are a hoot. Link to post Share on other sites
Author M30USA Posted May 21, 2014 Author Share Posted May 21, 2014 Hallelujah! And, YESTERDAY was the day around here! Federal judge struck down the ban on same sex marriage in my state! :bunny: Praise the Lord! Isaiah 5:20 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Glinda.Good Posted May 21, 2014 Share Posted May 21, 2014 Isaiah 5:20 Who says there is darkness and evil in embracing love? Link to post Share on other sites
Author M30USA Posted May 21, 2014 Author Share Posted May 21, 2014 Who says there is darkness and evil in embracing love? Who says it's loving to not reprove behaviors which are destructive? You will ask me, "Who says they are destructive?" And I will say, "It's proven that homosexuals experience greater psychological dysfunction and trauma." You will say, "What came first, the chicken or the egg? Maybe they experience more dysfunction because they are hated and outcasts." I will say, "That argument is irrefutable." Link to post Share on other sites
CarrieT Posted May 21, 2014 Share Posted May 21, 2014 Carrie i wont even pretend that i am good at receiving messages i get so confused sometimes but there is one thing i do know to be completely true..... That is lovely that you believe something so heartfelt. Can you believe that someone so perfect in life would die for an ex hooker like me, for the prostitute nodding off on the corner the drug addict lost in hopelessness who robbed a liquor store at gunpoint for his next fix..............it doesnt matter if you believe in god, for god believes in us.......we all go to heaven ....whether we stay in gods presence is a different matter.......that is what i know as truth..... Again, lovely that you have such beliefs. And I commend you for turning your life around, whether or not you believe it was done because of or by an external force. There are people like me who believe that the whole Jesus storyline was an historical myth: A real event colored by the light of antiquity, confounded by humans into a supernatural event that was never really factual. No one has the slightest physical evidence to support a historical Jesus; no artifacts, dwelling, works of carpentry, or self-written manuscripts. All claims about Jesus derive from writings of other people. There occurs no contemporary Roman record that shows Pontius Pilate executing a man named Jesus. Devastating to historians, there occurs not a single contemporary writing that mentions Jesus. All documents about Jesus came well after the life of the alleged Jesus from either: unknown authors, people who had never met an earthly Jesus, or from fraudulent, mythical or allegorical writings. Although the gospels of the New Testament-- like those discovered at Nag Hammadi-- are attributed to Jesus' followers, no one knows who actually wrote any of them. I'm going to bow out of this discussion because there is nothing I can ever say that will change what I believe just as I imagine there is nothing a Christian will say that will change what they/he/she believes. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Author M30USA Posted May 21, 2014 Author Share Posted May 21, 2014 No one has the slightest physical evidence to support a historical Jesus Debating his resurrection is legitimate. Debating his historical life is equivalent to an ostrich sticking its head in the sand. Link to post Share on other sites
Glinda.Good Posted May 21, 2014 Share Posted May 21, 2014 Who says it's loving to not reprove behaviors which are destructive? You will ask me, "Who says they are destructive?" And I will say, "It's proven that homosexuals experience greater psychological dysfunction and trauma." You will say, "What came first, the chicken or the egg? Maybe they experience more dysfunction because they are hated and outcasts." I will say, "That argument is irrefutable." I'm not really buying the "proven" that you provided, either. Any study "proving" that is probably extremely flawed, as the myriad other influences that create dysfunction and trauma would need to be addressed as well. Happy to see you agree with me! Honestly though, I am celebrating the day that this freedom was finally granted in Oregon, and the topic here is Today is the Day! A wonderful wedding we had, blessed by God I am sure! Link to post Share on other sites
misternoname Posted May 21, 2014 Share Posted May 21, 2014 Jesus is a conglomeration of several fictional characters. Carrie is correct...there is zero proof that Jesus was a real person. Zero. And don't say the Bible is proof. The Bible is not a factual account of anything. It's just a collection of morality tales gathered over a very long period of time. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
CarrieT Posted May 21, 2014 Share Posted May 21, 2014 Debating his resurrection is legitimate. Debating his historical life is equivalent to an ostrich sticking its head in the sand. Show me a contemporary, historical reference - not one that created years afterward. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Author M30USA Posted May 21, 2014 Author Share Posted May 21, 2014 (edited) Show me a contemporary, historical reference - not one that created years afterward. Lol, "contemporary historical"? That's an oxy moron. Pick one. By definition, a person (or event) in the past only has historical references. To answer your request, are you aware there are historical records which document the crucifixion of Christ under Pilate's order in Rome? Edited May 21, 2014 by M30USA Link to post Share on other sites
serial muse Posted May 21, 2014 Share Posted May 21, 2014 Lol, "contemporary historical"? That's an oxy moron. Pick one. By definition, a person (or event) in the past only has historical references. No, "contemporary" actually, by definition, refers to a record written at the same time that an event occurred, rather than (for example) hundreds or thousands of years later. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
CarrieT Posted May 21, 2014 Share Posted May 21, 2014 Lol, "contemporary historical"? That's an oxy moron. Pick one. By definition, a person (or event) in the past only has historical references. You know exactly what I am referring to. An historical reference that is defined as "contemporary" would be one that existed during the supposed person's actual existence. Example: There are historical accounts of Augustus Caesar (23 September 63 BC – 19 August 14 AD) as written by Suetonius. It is a firsthand, historical account as written by a contemporary of Augustus. The fact that you are debating semantics proves to me that you cannot provide any such accounts. Link to post Share on other sites
Author M30USA Posted May 21, 2014 Author Share Posted May 21, 2014 You haven't provided the reference. Just alluded to it. There is contemporary documentation regarding Jesus crucifixion by Pilate. There is contemporary documentation of the persons name who owned the burial sepulcher where Jesus was buried. Link to post Share on other sites
2sunny Posted May 21, 2014 Share Posted May 21, 2014 Van Halen is awesome. I wish I could've seen them live in their prime. Wishing = not living in the moment to appreciate what God has gifted you...living now. Keep practicing - you may get better at "acceptance" and what God provides now. Trying to change Gods world is just playing that you are in charge. Any attempt to control or change what's already happened isn't "acceptance". Link to post Share on other sites
Author M30USA Posted May 21, 2014 Author Share Posted May 21, 2014 No one has the slightest physical evidence to support a historical Jesus; no artifacts, dwelling, works of carpentry, or self-written manuscripts. All claims about Jesus derive from writings of other people. There occurs no contemporary Roman record that shows Pontius Pilate executing a man named Jesus. Devastating to historians, there occurs not a single contemporary writing that mentions Jesus. All documents about Jesus came well after the life of the alleged Jesus from either: unknown authors, people who had never met an earthly Jesus, or from fraudulent, mythical or allegorical writings. Although the gospels of the New Testament-- like those discovered at Nag Hammadi-- are attributed to Jesus' followers, no one knows who actually wrote any of them. For the record, CarrieT plagiarized this entire paragraph verbatim from the following website: Did Jesus exist? 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Author M30USA Posted May 21, 2014 Author Share Posted May 21, 2014 Wishing = not living in the moment to appreciate what God has gifted you...living now. Keep practicing - you may get better at "acceptance" and what God provides now. Trying to change Gods world is just playing that you are in charge. Any attempt to control or change what's already happened isn't "acceptance". Do you happen to know the price of eggs in Belgium on a Sunday? Link to post Share on other sites
central Posted May 21, 2014 Share Posted May 21, 2014 May 1 this year was also: The National Day of Reason is a secular celebration for humanists, atheists, and other secularists and freethinkers in response to the National Day of Prayer, a legal holiday in the United States.[1][2] The day is celebrated on the first Thursday in May of every year, to coincide with the National Day of Prayer, which many atheist and secular groups view to be unconstitutional. I hope everyone had a thoughtful day, free of superstitious, magical thinking! Link to post Share on other sites
anne1707 Posted May 21, 2014 Share Posted May 21, 2014 For the record, CarrieT plagiarized this entire paragraph verbatim from the following website: Did Jesus exist? Strange how the little blue arrow by Carrie's name that takes you to the post is missing..... Link to post Share on other sites
2sunny Posted May 21, 2014 Share Posted May 21, 2014 Do you happen to know the price of eggs in Belgium on a Sunday? I'm sure you'll make it be some facet of being God - or Jesus your Lord and Savior. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Author M30USA Posted May 21, 2014 Author Share Posted May 21, 2014 (edited) I'm sure you'll make it be some facet of being God - or Jesus your Lord and Savior. “The kingdom of heaven is like treasure hidden in a field. When a man found it, he hid it again, and then in his joy went and sold all he had and bought that field." (Matthew 13:44 NIV) What is your treasure? What do you talk about the majority of the day? Edited May 21, 2014 by M30USA Link to post Share on other sites
CarrieT Posted May 21, 2014 Share Posted May 21, 2014 For the record, CarrieT plagiarized this entire paragraph verbatim from the following website: Did Jesus exist? So? Doesn't change the sentiment or import of my query. Link to post Share on other sites
Betrayed&Stayed Posted May 21, 2014 Share Posted May 21, 2014 No, "contemporary" actually, by definition, refers to a record written at the same time that an event occurred, rather than (for example) hundreds or thousands of years later. 93 CE - Jewish historian Flavius Josephus wrote about James's stoning death in Antiquities of the Jews and referenced James as "James, the brother of Jesus, the one they call messiah". James died in 62 CE. Second-century Roman historian Tacitus (died 118 CE) and Roman governor Pliny the Younger (died 113 CE) both mention Jesus in their writings and letters. Also keep in mind that Rome flattened and burned Jerusalem in 70 CE. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Recommended Posts