WW's this is some of the damage you have caused. A rant.

[janedoe67]

I definitely agree about the courts' bias. And there is SOOO much research out there about the importance of fathers, it just doesn't make sense to keep doing this "put them with Mom by default" thing. If both parents are fit to be loving parents, then AT LEAST 50/50 should become the norm. Both sons and daughter needs fathers. In fact, there's all sorts of research about the vulnerability a girl has when she does not have a good daddy in her life. I know of several divorced men who are amazing fathers, and THEY should be the ones to have primary custody. Alas, the small town backward feminazi family court judge did not feel the same way.

[revelations]

So my encouraging you to be open to true love, and my going over the benefits of a loving relationship is, to you, shaming and laying a guilt trip on you. *rolls eyes* Sorry I wasted my time.

 

 

I just call it like I see it.

Our perspectives are just different. You have a perspective that I would suspect is similar to a romance novel. I have a perspective of someone who has been dragged through the family courts and paid very dearly for being in the presence of a woman. So honestly their really is no begging, pleading, shame nor guilt that is worse than I have already suffered.

 

Until you have to pay alimony and child support their is no way you can know how I feel or any BH here. If the criminal courts were like the family court you would get robbed. Then sued by the robber for not having the item available he wanted to steal. Then their would be you standing their telling me not to give up on theft. I don't mean to come down on you, however come on lady do you not read my posts? Do you not hear me when I say the family courts are a major reason for staying away from, well YOU. Look it up there are all kinds of cases out there. Do you realize how many men pay child support on kids that are the result of an affair their WW had? Do you also understand that there are men out there like me that is smart enough to say "NO" to this?

 

Of course then again I can always just follow your advice and throw my life away. After all that is how most women view us men now as disposable.

[janedoe67]

Of course then again I can always just follow your advice and throw my life away. After all that is how most women view us men now as disposable"

 

WRONG

 

But thank you for playing.

 

Maybe I was wrong. No worries, you have PLENTY of company on LS

[revelations]

Of course then again I can always just follow your advice and throw my life away. After all that is how most women view us men now as disposable"

 

WRONG

 

But thank you for playing.

 

Maybe I was wrong. No worries, you have PLENTY of company on LS

 

 

Okay prove it. You along with the other women out there that do not view us as disposable or walking ATM's reject the alimony and start speaking up for change in the family courts. I can back up what I say by plastering a ton of links on here how men get screwed over in the family courts. I can post links to articles were men commit suicide because how how badly the family courts beat them down.

 

I have chosen to stay out of relationships with women for a reason. That reason is self-preservation. Women have been using the family courts to take out their vengeance on men and get a free ride. If the tables were turned I would bet that you would want someone to speak out that would be heard.

[ThatsJustHowIRoll]

Okay prove it. You along with the other women out there that do not view us as disposable or walking ATM's reject the alimony and start speaking up for change in the family courts. I can back up what I say by plastering a ton of links on here how men get screwed over in the family courts. I can post links to articles were men commit suicide because how how badly the family courts beat them down.

 

I have chosen to stay out of relationships with women for a reason. That reason is self-preservation. Women have been using the family courts to take out their vengeance on men and get a free ride. If the tables were turned I would bet that you would want someone to speak out that would be heard.

 

In the same breath...how about more of you men start asking for 50/50 custody instead of EOW because it doesnt fit with your career, or stop complaining about child or support and start paying it for a change...or how about just trying to understand the premise behind spousal support (granted, im not a fan of it, it doesn't really exist in my country, but I see why men should help wives get on their feet when divorce happens if they have sacrificed their career to raise YOUR children). But hey...women are just walking incubators, right? If it wasnt for sex we'd be obsolete, right? Might as well rent one, because outside of sex we have no value, right?Right?

 

No? Not all men are deadbeat dads? Really? You dont say?

 

..2 sides to every coin.

[Fluttershy]

There was a time not so long ago when men were expected to cheat vut if a woman did it was grounds for divorce. Where te man always got the children and could remarry but most wouldn't go within a ten foot radius of a divorce woman no matter the reason. Where men could beat their wives and face no consequences. Where rape wasn't really punished. I think in some cases things have swung too far the other way in some places. But where I live men get joint custody or even sole custody. Alimony only really happens in ltr. And is based on income not gender. And who is divorcing who is also considered (though that depends on the judge I hear). I know two women for sure who pay child support. One with joint and te other who only gets visitations.

 

Maybe the OP needs to move. But this entire post is women bashing and as was mentioned above completely ignores all the men who cheat, abandon children, abuse their wives, ect.

 

 

It isn't a gender thing. It is called human nature.

[revelations]

In the same breath...how about more of you men start asking for 50/50 custody instead of EOW because it doesnt fit with your career, or stop complaining about child or support and start paying it for a change...or how about just trying to understand the premise behind spousal support (granted, im not a fan of it, it doesn't really exist in my country, but I see why men should help wives get on their feet when divorce happens if they have sacrificed their career to raise YOUR children). But hey...women are just walking incubators, right? If it wasnt for sex we'd be obsolete, right? Might as well rent one, because outside of sex we have no value, right?Right?

 

No? Not all men are deadbeat dads? Really? You dont say?

 

..2 sides to every coin.

 

 

Oh well you feel that you have a good argument, well please allow me to retort?

 

First off a large majority of men do ask for 50/50 custody. When 50/50 custody is granted the custodial parent is usually in most cases awarded to the mother. Here is a link that shows what the numbers are for men awarded custody as of 2013 with the links

Anti-Male Bias in Child Custody « Alexandria

 

According to the census there are 70.1 million fathers. 24.4 million of those were part of a marriage. Their are 1.96 million single fathers with physical custody. My source

America?s Families and Living Arrangements: 2012 - People and Households - U.S. Census Bureau

 

However let's see what the break down is of those 1.96 million fathers receiving child support from the kids mother shall we?

 

1.9 billion dollars is the Amount of child support received by custodial fathers in 2009; they were due $3.5 billion. In contrast, custodial mothers received $19.5 billion of the $31.7 billion in support that was due. Source

http://www.census.gov/prod/2011pubs/p60-240.pdf

 

It seems to me that when the men do get custody of the child he is on his own. The figure that is missing from what was due to the mothers is the amount of men incarcerated, unemployed or unemployable or dead. The question you should be asking instead is why don't women pay their child support? You need to get your facts straight before you come off to me with your fictitious bullsh*t. Oh and did you know that when a mother receives child support, she does not have to prove that it is used at all on the child.

 

Oh the women sacrificed so much to raise men's kids, yet in court it is their baby. So which is it, is it your kid or your sacrifice? Let's talk about the rights that women have and men don't, reproduction. Women have the pill, IUD's, adoption and abortion. They not only have 100% choice in this matter they can also chose who the paying father will be in some cases with fraudulent claims. It seems to me that if women have 100% of the choice in things like abortion or adoption then they should accept 100% of the responsibility in that decision. I mean that is only fair and your about equal rights correct?

 

However on the other side men have two options, 1. risk using a condom and hope it does not break or is stolen. 2. Keep it in his pants. The minute a man's sperm is out of his body it is fair game for any woman to use as she sees fit. If that results in a pregnancy then whoever produced that sperm must pay for that child. However in the case were he is married and the wife cheats, then the husband is responsible for child support on the kid that is not his. Google this, it is known as "The presumed fathers act".

 

So why don't you show any numbers or quote a source in your little straw man rebuttal? However even with your cute attempt at a rebuttal I have to dig a little deeper into it. You make assumptions that a reader will be uneducated in that area and try and misdirect blame and shame. You do this to the very person that is encouraging all men to follow my example and just say "NO". Think about it, if men just say "NO" then you don't have to worry about us not paying child support. Mainly because you will not be pregnant. If we say "NO" to marriage then you don't have to worry about collecting alimony. You will not be married, because there is no man to marry. Now you see that once again, a woman has a problem and it is a man that comes up with a solution. The sad part is that you still complain about the solution. Will a woman ever be happy?

 

 

*To the women on here that have shown their support to me please do not take offense to my post. These comments are not directed at you. Like I have said, do some research because men need a voice and that voice is yours."

[revelations]

There was a time not so long ago when men were expected to cheat vut if a woman did it was grounds for divorce. Where te man always got the children and could remarry but most wouldn't go within a ten foot radius of a divorce woman no matter the reason. Where men could beat their wives and face no consequences. Where rape wasn't really punished. I think in some cases things have swung too far the other way in some places. But where I live men get joint custody or even sole custody. Alimony only really happens in ltr. And is based on income not gender. And who is divorcing who is also considered (though that depends on the judge I hear). I know two women for sure who pay child support. One with joint and te other who only gets visitations.

 

Maybe the OP needs to move. But this entire post is women bashing and as was mentioned above completely ignores all the men who cheat, abandon children, abuse their wives, ect.

 

 

It isn't a gender thing. It is called human nature.

 

You are correct that at one time it was very one sided against women and they did have the short end of the stick. You actually made a good point in that it has swung too far in the other direction. Now with how you describe your state handling divorce and custody would be great compared to what I have seen. I can tell you of 4 women I have known to lose custody of their kids and not one paid child support. However I would still like to see if men get physical or sole custody equally to the women in your state.

 

Now I take offense to accusing me of woman bashing. That is a very rude accusation to be throwing around and you should be apologizing for it. Shame on you for that one!

 

I started this thread listing out my feelings (which as men were are always being asked to share more of) and what my own solution was. I did this in hopes that other men could see it as their solution also. However you use this horrible shaming tactic because you do not like my solution. Any rebuttals that I have used were grounded in simple fact or what works best for me. You have to resort to accusations that are unfounded. Frankly YOU should be ashamed of yourself for resorting to such a dirty tactic to get your point across.

[revelations]

It seems to me that a lot of women have taken offense to my solution of leaving you alone. If that has offended you, then I say too bad. To me the current risk of being involved in a marriage or even living with you is just too great. Aside from getting hurt their is the financial ruin that is caused by a bias court system. There is the risk of false DV claims or sexual assault. Men who are the victims of DV have no place to go. Their are no shelters for him to go to and the cops will not even write it up in most cases. So for me it is simply about self-preservation and nothing more.

 

It seems to me that you have no compunction of sinking to new lows in order to put a spin on what I have stated. Fact #1 is that I was hurt and so are the other BH's out their. Fact #2 is that I am just staying away from you. So how is that bashing if I see you as a risk that I am unwilling to take? It is simple, you have ran off with my toys too much so I am going to play elsewhere. The more you use your shaming tactics the more you prove my point. That point is that you think your entitled to what I produce. *Newsflash* I have a choice and I chose to use it.

[janedoe67]

revelations, I am a FWW. I understand completely why you would want to leave ME alone. I understand that because of my past, and honestly, the majority of men on LS along with a great number of righteous women would agree with you. In my past I made a specific kind of bad choice from which many think there is no redemption - ever.

 

Based on your repeated betrayals, I understand exactly why you personally would choose to leave women alone.

 

HOWEVER, no matter how much you rant, the truth is that not all women are cheaters, not all women are man-suckers. Even you know this if you are intelligent. And no, it is not my job to lobby for a change in laws to prove to YOU that there are good women out there.

 

Just like it is not your job to prove to ME that you do not hate all women by lobbying for tougher rape penalties.

 

KathyM, Fluttershy, and many other women are are women who are lovingm full of character, have never cheated on their SO's, and work alongside their spouses as a team. THEY do not deserve to be lumped in with those of us who have made wrong choices in the past.

 

I say I admire you for choosing to stay distant from women instead of punishing them for your hurt by running through as many as you can and leaving heartbreak in your wake.

 

But you are quite simply wrong that all women are the way you have described above. They just are NOT.

 

But like I said, I could name at least 6 or 7 LS men right now who feel about women exactly the way you do. And some are sad and cruel enough to still be married to one. You at least have more character than they do.

[revelations]

janedoe67,

 

KathyM, Fluttershy, and many other women are are women who are lovingm full of character, have never cheated on their SO's, and work alongside their spouses as a team. THEY do not deserve to be lumped in with those of us who have made wrong choices in the past.

I think this quote above shows that you at least, along with other readers misunderstand. I have never lumped them in together. Is what I have stated is that I am no longer willing to take the risk involved in selecting the right one.

 

Let's face facts if I was saying that I am not going to pick wild mushrooms anymore because I cannot identify the tasty mushrooms from the poisonous mushrooms no one would be surprised. After all I got sick, learned my lesson that I am unable to pick the right mushroom. No one would argue that point nor would that say I am lumping in all mushrooms together. It would be looked at as simple as "This guy is not picking wild mushrooms anymore, hell he might not even buy them in the store".

 

As far as what you or someone else has done in their life it is not up to me to judge rather or not they are redeemable. Truthfully the fact that I am avoiding women has nothing to do with redemption and everything to do with self-preservation. So the WW's out there that have cheated on their husbands need to make amends to their BH's and not me. After all it was their choice to cheat and it is also their choice to try and undo the damage they have caused.

 

I just happen to have a different perspective than other people here on LS on relationships and marriage. I do not look at it like I am finally with the one I love or anything like that. I look at it as if I just gave the keys of a candy store to a fat kid and told him I would be gone for a week. When I have stated before about proving my point it has been proven. There have been a lot of fat kids trying to shame me for no longer handing out that key. Truthfully I have been finding this very amusing. One even tried to point out the men who skipped out on paying alimony or child support. So then why would this person make an argument against staying away from women? Seems to me if the man is staying away from women then they do not have to worry about him owing child support or alimony.

 

I do admit that I did take a bit of a dig at ThatsJustHowIRoll, however she had a very weak argument. Let's face it their are some men that will skip out on you. I can understand why, the way the system is you can go to jail if you cannot pay. This is were women like TJHIR lump all men in together, they see no difference between refusing to pay or unable to pay. The sense of entitlement from women like this is amazing. Most men have no trouble with being in a relationship and sharing what we have. Hell let's face it I use to really enjoy doing that. It is when self-entitled women start saying that I owe something to them or use laws to take something from me, is were I no longer want to share with them. Hence, my view of being disposable and a walking ATM machine.

 

So you can look at it two different ways. One is that there is some lucky woman out there that will never have to worry about collecting alimony or child support from me. Or two is that there is some unlucky woman out there that will never get the chance to try and collect alimony or child support from me. Now as compelling as some of the replies on this threat have been, at the end of the day it is still my choice. That is what I am trying to do in this thread is to wake men up that they also have that same choice. I may not be able to fight the system or change the system, however I can starve the system. I always loved this quote by Mahatma Gandhi "First they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they fight you, and then you win". This is what has been happening on this threat for simply saying "NO" to relationships and marriage. I never thought of it until now. However women have been on a big kick about men understanding that "No, means No". It seems to me that when a man says "NO" that a lot of women have a problem with that. So I have to ask, when will women learn that "No, means NO"?

[snappytomcat]

snappytomcat,

 

I am sorry for what you went through. I also think that it is sweet of you to worry about me in the way you do. Yes I have felt all of those things I have posted and I actually worked through it. When I look back on all of it I had to ask myself "what price am I willing to pay" and "am I happy alone or in a relationship with a woman". So my views became as if I was going to gamble on a roulette table. The odds are against me and I have already lost everything a couple of times due to a bad bet or more. Now I am rebuilding my bank and do I want to risk it all again? Of course not, I learned my lesson so I quit gambling.

 

I know this thread comes off a bit bitter, however that is not my perception or intent of this thread. My point is simply that on the other side of that pain is freedom and happiness for me if I chose to accept it. That happiness comes from never having to worry about what a woman can do to me in the family courts again. Trust me the comfort and peace that I feel because of this, is something that no price tag can be placed on. I hope that other men will read this and relate. Maybe even realize that they don't have to marry. Maybe just live with a woman if they really need someone around. I am just hoping to stop at least one man from becoming another slave.

those are your feelings,no one can tell you you how to feel,and I don't think you come of as bitter,you have just been hurt,and betrayal sucks,it can make the kindest person bitter for a bit,like myself,i hate being angry,bitter,and sometimes I feel like the most evil person on earth,and I hate my H and his XOW did this to me,but I just want to get me back,nothing else matters,i want to enjoy my grandson,and my pets,and my friends.

and this is what makes me happy right now,of course im working on my marriage also,but it hurts to know he almost threw it way for her,

I know its my ego,and my pride,but I miss me,the happy go lucky,laid back fun loving person,i want me back before anything else,i miss me

take care of yourself

[2.50 a gallon]

After the breakup of my marriage, as revelations, I too swore that I would never fall in love or marry again. I got back into my hobbies, even picked up a couple that I had always wanted to try. I actually liked living alone. I had a great sex life. I could do what I wanted, when I wanted and with whom ever I wanted.

 

 

Yes love did rear its head a couple of times, but whenever I saw love walking down the street and heading towards my front door, I was out the back door and running down the alley.

 

 

I lasted for almost 14 years, first kiss, second date, my mighty walls collapsed. We have been very happily and very much in love for over 18 years. But to this day, I will never remarry. Divorce courts, lawyers etc. are just too expensive.

[revelations]

2.50 a gallon,

 

I am happy that things worked out well for you. It is also cool that you get were I am coming from. Has nothing to do with hate, women bashing, all women bad etc sort of thing. It is simply that the cost marriage is way to high. Heck for me just living with them is too high of a price. I guess that some people feel that men are suppose to ignore the high cost. That would be nice to be able to do, however that is not realistic. Besides the best bet I have to be able to enjoy retirement is by not gambling with that money. I actually had a woman that I was dating say to me

"men are too tight with their wallets and don't want to marry these days". I retorted with

"dear most men our age have been through the family courts and avoid marriage because that cannot recover from an event such as this and still retire".

Her reply was

"that is just selfish of men".

When you actually hear someone make a statement such as that it makes you wonder if they even view you as human. I mean there was no consideration with her about what a man would be risking and she was dismissive about the possible outcome for him. As you can possibly guess I did not hang around this woman much longer. I am happy for you that you found someone that you can live with. I am very happy that your SO is okay with living with you and not getting married. It tells me that she understands and honestly wants to be with you.

 

Like you did, I will probably be running from love for quite sometime. I don't think that it is the being "in love" part that scares me, it is the stupid mistakes I make while "in love" that scares me. I guess for me it is kind of like being drunk, in that it clouds your judgement. However the difference is that you choose to drink enough to get drunk and I do not think that is the case with falling in love. Thankfully I have matured enough to know when I am falling in love and learned to steer clear of it. Well at least take enough time to really know what I am getting into.

 

Like you I have been enjoying the single life. I am not much of a people person so being alone suites me well. Heck some people wonder how I can go out and eat alone. For me it is simple, I enjoy two things at once, reading a book and eating. Most of the time and thankfully my biggest drama during the day is loosing a battle to another person in an online video game. Sometimes I actually have trouble deciding what to do with my day because I want to do too much at one time. I now enjoy making a schedule for my hobbies. I am actually planning on taking a couple of trips out of the country to do some things that I have always wanted to do. Yes for me the single life is a good life.

 

I have a couple of friends that do not understand how I can be happy and single. My friends wife has now set up a blind date for me. She does mean will and I know that. However I did tell her that chances are we would make good friends and that I would not hold my breath on her setup resulting in a couple. Having women friends for me can be great. If she is a real good friend she will usually tell you when another woman is BSing you. I do believe that is what most people miss is that happiness comes from within. By thinking that you will be happy if you have someone at your side is the same as thinking you will be happy with that new car or TV. Now you may want the new car or TV and you may enjoy them, however they do no make you happy. Being happy always starts with you.

 

snappytomcat,

Getting back to the person that you once was requires that you work on yourself. That is what I have been doing for a long time now. The most difficult thing about being betrayed by the one you love is that it does effect you. The reason for this is that their opinion of you does matter to you. So when they cheat, you and I will take it personally as if it is a reflection of our shortcomings. Now if we think about it without emotion, we know that this is simply not true. However because we are in love with the WS at the time, we see it as our shortcomings and not theirs. Let's face it, if we were not in love with our WS, we would simply ask them if they had fun or ask them if they were going to get another chance to bang them. I know myself that if I am talking with another female friend and she is talking about getting laid, I will encourage her to do so. However the same conversation with a woman that I am in love with, then the outcome is very different. I guess that is why the love you have for a friend compared to the love you have for the wife or husband is very different.

 

So hopefully you are becoming yourself more and more each day. Here is a little quote that I have always used to change my perspective on any situation.

"acceptance is the answer to all my problems today. When I am disturbed, it is because I find some person, place, thing or situation -- some fact of my life -- unacceptable to me, and I can find no serenity until I accept that person, place, thing or situation as being exactly the way it is supposed to be at this moment. Nothing, absolutely nothing happens in God's world by mistake." -Dr. Paul

However do not mistake this with being happy about what happened or just blowing it off. It is simply accepting the situation for what it is. How you or I chose to react to the situation is another story. You chose to stay with your WH were I chose to leave my xWW. Now that is a big differences of choices you and I have made. However one major thing we have in common is that we have to work on ourselves. In either case, we are both responsible for our own happiness. That quote for me simply means that I need to accept what has happened and look at the outcome as an opportunity. I can choose to cry about my xWW cheating on me or I can look at it as being set free. Even if I had stayed with her, by accepting the situation it will still set me free. Acceptance will still set me free from her actions reflecting upon me as an individual.

 

You and I along with all other BS's here have had a rude awakening. That awakening is that our WS have the ability to hurt us in ways that we could not imagine. After careful thought some of us choose to leave, while others stay. We made these choices after careful thought about what would be best for us and (if you have children) our children. Either way we had to learn that the actions of a WS does not reflect on ourselves, rather that it reflects on them. We had to change our perspective from not being good enough for our WS to the WS may not be worthy of our love. This maybe a rather callous way of looking at your WS, however they have already earned this viewpoint by their very actions.

Edited May 13, 2014 by revelations
just making it easier to read

[2.50 a gallon]

When my Ex and I separated, I caught her kissing a pretty boy guard where she worked on our six month anniversary, a bolt of red hot anger that I had never felt before filled my body. Had there not been a chain link fence with razor wire over the top I would have been at the two to them with a ball bat. I lost control, I was no longer a human, a part of my reptilian brain had taken over. Later when I was able to regroup, my reaction scared me to death. I did not know that I was capable of such anger and not being able to control it. I could have ended up spending a great deal of my life behind bars.

 

That and having my best and most trusted friend in the whole universe, in a flash, become my worst enemy. And then add in, in that same flash I went from being on top of the world, to the bottom of dark, empty, bottomless pit of a dark hole of nothingless. There for a while, I actually wondered if maybe some day in future I might be able to laugh again.

 

Add them up, and it equaled "Love" was a dirty four letter word and not worth my time. I had too much of a life to live to ever take that chance again.

 

My main interests at that time were model building (no kits, I scratch build everything), hiking, fishing. I have yet to meet a woman who would enjoy putting a 40 pound pack on her back and go on a 10 day back packing fishing trip. And while they might admire my models none have the patience to spend hours, putting together a building for example, board by board.

 

Which left me with woman are good for only one thing as far as my life was concerned, and it wasn't companionship.

[TheBladeRunner]

The damage is so far reaching I don't know where to begin. There are no financial issues, but the emotional stuff is absolutely staggering at times. It will be 2 years since DDay in about 3 months and June is the 1 year anniversary of the divorce.

 

What I will say has happened to woman I know as well so this is in no way, shape, or form of woman bashing, just the outcome of what an affair can do to anyone.

 

First and foremost, a WS damages the marriage (many times beyond repair) and the family unit. For the last 21 months I still have to deal with my young child missing mom and dad together; it's tough to tell a 5 YO that it will just never happen. Although the custody is 50/50, I still deal w/ our child missing one or the other on a pretty regular basis. It's better than it was, but it still comes up and it's hard. I think the one that suffers most from my XWS and her selfishness is my daughter. I am pretty much over it, but my child still wants things to go back to the way they were. I hate to say it, but I sometimes miss the way it was as well, not her so much, but the life we had. It was fun (I thought), I saw my daughter every night, and I thought we were OK. One of the hardest aspects of her A was the fact I did not see it coming.

 

Like I said earlier, there are no financial issues, neither of us pays anything as that was the agreement. I am self employed and she makes more money than me, but I chose not to go down that road as I felt it was malicious even though the extra money would really help. Financially we BOTH now struggle, but it is what it is. At the rate I am going, I may have to think about bankruptcy. Let's face it folks: It's a two income world we live in these days and when that's what you're used to and you suddenly become single it's tough.

 

The other damage that it caused was I have a hard time trusting anyone these days. I dated for awhile but I did not like what I was finding out there. Again, this is not just on a man's side, I have a slew of female friends that feel the same way. Maybe it's my age bracket, but I find many woman that have been through the same thing I have and they are very bitter even YEARS after the divorce. The constant "X" battles, money issues, and some still fight over the kids (at least I don't have that problem). Every time I start to get close to someone I quickly move away from them; that belongs to me and is my issue. I stopped dating about 9 months ago and although I still dabble, I am not really serious because the bottom line is I am afraid of being hurt.

 

I have become self reliant and I can be alone but I don't want to be, the nights I don't have my daughter can be tough. On one side I want to be with my child, then on the other....well.....I just get lonely.

 

I tell myself I will learn to trust again, I really want to, but when the lights go out I just can't do it at this point. My XW was the one person in my life that I thought would have my back and you guessed it, all she was concerned about was herself.

 

Over time I know it will get better as to a degree it already has, but the damage caused by my WW is horrible and very difficult to move past. Anyone that has been betrayed like this will have their own individual struggles, but with some hard work, you can get through it and it can get better....not overnight, but eventually.

 

The A did a number on my self esteem for quite some time, but I managed to recover the majority of that; it's tough when your WS "dates down" on you.

Edited May 13, 2014 by TheBladeRunner
Fixing

[KathyM]

It's really sad how much damage a WS can do to a person, which can be long reaching. It's really sad if the actions of some who behave poorly cause you to despise and mistrust an entire gender. In a way, you are allowing her to continue to hurt you when you allow her actions to continue to negatively impact your life by not allowing yourself to find love again. I can understand you don't want to risk being hurt again, but you are continuing to hurt yourself when you allow these few women's actions to keep you from finding love again. Hopefully, someday, you can be open to trusting someone again. My sister had two husbands who cheated on her. One was a serial cheater. You would think she would have been jaded at this point and decided that men cannot be trusted, but she improved her screening process and found a man who is the epitomy of integrity and character, and with whom she is happy with and can trust. Hopefully you'll realize eventually that there are women out there who can be trusted.

[2.50 a gallon]

To revelations and all the BH's who have similar feelings about love, a warning. There is a good chance that some day in the future you will find yourself in love again.

 

 

I fought and ran away from love, so many times, I truly thought I was immune to it. I did not let my guard down. In fact the gal that I had a LTR with prior to my current lady, was a dozen years younger than me. She had a mensa IQ, with degrees from Berkley in microbiology, and chemistry, along with a minor in math. She then went back to school and got another degree in computer science, all of this prior to my meeting her around age 28. WE got along great, I am into history and kept up with the latest findings in archeology and especially into paleontology and our ancestral origins. We could spend whole weekends talking. She could explain to me what latest findings in astronomy and physics. She was into working out and had a buns of steel body. And she was super rich, we're talking millions, and daddy had them in the hundreds of millions. The only thing that I had against her was her desire for us to marry and have kids. WE had an on again off again relationship that lasted for over 6 years. It was me breaking up with her. She kept wanting to be exclusive, I did not. She kept offering to take me on great trips. Mexico to visit the ruins, Bermuda, Hawaii. I would bolt and run, she would patiently wait and a couple of months later we would pick up again. Her last trip was to be a two week trip to Tahiti, for scuba diving. I almost bit, I did have loving feelings for her and that scared me. Tahiti, romantic beaches, a few exotic drinks and good morning Mrs. Gallon. That scared me so bad, that I packed up and moved a thousand miles away back to my home town.

 

 

I could live with out her, and her money. It didn't take me long to get back into dating. That lasted a whole 4 more years.

 

 

They say that love is a choice. I say bull. That fateful second date, first kiss night, I left my apartment a happy man. I was not immune to love like I thought. I had no choice in the matter, I was falling in love with her. Four hours later I returned to my apartment a lonely man and I hadn't been lonely in years. I found that there is no defense when it comes to falling in love.

[TheBladeRunner]

It's really sad how much damage a WS can do to a person, which can be long reaching. It's really sad if the actions of some who behave poorly cause you to despise and mistrust an entire gender. In a way, you are allowing her to continue to hurt you when you allow her actions to continue to negatively impact your life by not allowing yourself to find love again. I can understand you don't want to risk being hurt again, but you are continuing to hurt yourself when you allow these few women's actions to keep you from finding love again. Hopefully, someday, you can be open to trusting someone again. My sister had two husbands who cheated on her. One was a serial cheater. You would think she would have been jaded at this point and decided that men cannot be trusted, but she improved her screening process and found a man who is the epitomy of integrity and character, and with whom she is happy with and can trust. Hopefully you'll realize eventually that there are women out there who can be trusted.

 

Yes, this in bold! That is exactly where I am at right now; in the process of a better screening process. Both my XW's were WS's, I will trust again, but I don't want to go through it again.

[veritas lux mea]

I am surprised so much empathis has been put on money. Money has never been the be all end all of my marriage probably because we have always been good with it and both put in the same amount. I did take time off because of my high risk pregnancies so I guess you could say my H put more in at that time but thankfuly he doesn't see it that way. When I cheated on him I had no plans to add insult to injury by taking him to the cleaners if he wanted to divorce. I realize some women don't have any qualms about doing so. Still, I have dated guys who are obsessed with money and it was always a major turn off. Protecting your heart I get but auch lengths to protect the pocketbook remind me of a dragon. If money is so important than the easy answer would be to find someone who makes the same or more money and fall in love with them. If a person is truly happy single and has no desire for a committed relationship then I would hardly think they would call themselves damaged and blame us WW for their lifestyle choice.

[revelations]

veritas lux mea,

Nice way to put a spin on things. However I will be blunt and use logic to explain your two major points and why you and most others do not get it. I will take the issue with money first, since that is what you talked about first. The thing is that I am not tight, greed, cheap or selfish with my money. True I am not going to pay a $100 for something if I can buy it someplace else for $50. However that is just good common sense. The thing is money is something that everyone has to have. It is important tool to have to be able to live indoors, eat (without being called a damn poacher), buy clothes, just little things such as this. Now I have to save up a decent amount of money for my old age, you know when I actually am too old to work. By getting married that puts the money for retirement at risk. Regardless of what you or any other woman says, a man does not know for sure what she will take until the divorce is final. Now some people may say that this is being greedy or selfish, however this leads me to ask. If I am being greedy and selfish then who is the one that benefits if the marriage breaks up? It seems to me that once again this is shaming language. I have no issue with treating for a date, loaning or even giving money to a woman. I do take issue when they call me selfish while they are taking half of my retirement and current income. So knowing those risk, let's face it you or any other woman out their simply are not worth it to me.

 

Now to the next subject which is damage and the spin you are trying to throw on that. Hmm, maybe I am incorrect about trying to spin it, perhaps your reading comprehension is very low? I am not sure, however if you even bothered to read the tittle and the intro you will see it says "damage you have caused". This does not imply that the damage is still being caused, it is a past tense statement, not current. So yes what I clearly stated in the starting of this thread is that you WW's caused damage to us BH's. I also stated that how I have changed and what I have been doing to overcome the damage caused by selfish, greedy and narcissistic women that I have had in my life. Now the end result is not me being still damaged. It is me being upset that I did not have this kind of insight before I was in any relationship or marriage. I could have spared my heart along with my wallet a bunch of damage. However lesson has been learned and as they always say, hindsight is 20/20.

 

I have heard people in this thread state that this is simply woman bashing and so forth. All I have done is laid out the simple truth, that truth is the cost of being married to a woman is simply too high for me. However I guess when you do state the truth women look at it as bashing. Their are some men on this site that get what I am saying. While they may have chosen a different path than what I have, that is up to them to take the risk. I am just not into gambling with my retirement is all. I do know that their are more men that are not wanting to risk their retirement either. So truthfully the only real damage that has been done is to the woman that are unable to walk away with our retirements. However I must admit it was a nice try on a spin. After all, if you see a guy happy and going to be able to retire, you must see it as your job to put a stop to it. Hell when I challenged one to prove that it was for love and not wallet, she countered with it is not her job to prove it. That's fine, it may not be. However these women would probably never want to marry if their was a pre-nup asked for. Let's face it all this guilt and shame stuff is for one reason, to clear a path between you and another man's wallet. Instead of trying to use shame, guilt, and other methods why not simply get a job yourself and live within your means. It really takes less effort to work than to try and cheat someone else out of their work. So the way I look at it is that you or any other woman saying that I am greedy is a case of the pot calling the kettle black. If this was not the case you would put it in writing in the form of a pre-nup that you do not want his money or retirement. Oh and if you want me to stop "woman bashing" (you know stating the truth) as some have said on here. Then it is simple, sign pre-nups and try and get the laws changed to something that involves less risk to both parties involved. Now if this was done, then I would not be able to come on here and spread that nasty truth that all WW's seem to hate.

[veritas lux mea]

veritas lux mea,

Nice way to put a spin on things. However I will be blunt and use logic to explain your two major points and why you and most others do not get it. I will take the issue with money first, since that is what you talked about first. The thing is that I am not tight, greed, cheap or selfish with my money. True I am not going to pay a $100 for something if I can buy it someplace else for $50. However that is just good common sense. The thing is money is something that everyone has to have. It is important tool to have to be able to live indoors, eat (without being called a damn poacher), buy clothes, just little things such as this. Now I have to save up a decent amount of money for my old age, you know when I actually am too old to work. By getting married that puts the money for retirement at risk. Regardless of what you or any other woman says, a man does not know for sure what she will take until the divorce is final. Now some people may say that this is being greedy or selfish, however this leads me to ask. If I am being greedy and selfish then who is the one that benefits if the marriage breaks up? It seems to me that once again this is shaming language. I have no issue with treating for a date, loaning or even giving money to a woman. I do take issue when they call me selfish while they are taking half of my retirement and current income. So knowing those risk, let's face it you or any other woman out their simply are not worth it to me.

 

Now to the next subject which is damage and the spin you are trying to throw on that. Hmm, maybe I am incorrect about trying to spin it, perhaps your reading comprehension is very low? I am not sure, however if you even bothered to read the tittle and the intro you will see it says "damage you have caused". This does not imply that the damage is still being caused, it is a past tense statement, not current. So yes what I clearly stated in the starting of this thread is that you WW's caused damage to us BH's. I also stated that how I have changed and what I have been doing to overcome the damage caused by selfish, greedy and narcissistic women that I have had in my life. Now the end result is not me being still damaged. It is me being upset that I did not have this kind of insight before I was in any relationship or marriage. I could have spared my heart along with my wallet a bunch of damage. However lesson has been learned and as they always say, hindsight is 20/20.

 

I have heard people in this thread state that this is simply woman bashing and so forth. All I have done is laid out the simple truth, that truth is the cost of being married to a woman is simply too high for me. However I guess when you do state the truth women look at it as bashing. Their are some men on this site that get what I am saying. While they may have chosen a different path than what I have, that is up to them to take the risk. I am just not into gambling with my retirement is all. I do know that their are more men that are not wanting to risk their retirement either. So truthfully the only real damage that has been done is to the woman that are unable to walk away with our retirements. However I must admit it was a nice try on a spin. After all, if you see a guy happy and going to be able to retire, you must see it as your job to put a stop to it. Hell when I challenged one to prove that it was for love and not wallet, she countered with it is not her job to prove it. That's fine, it may not be. However these women would probably never want to marry if their was a pre-nup asked for. Let's face it all this guilt and shame stuff is for one reason, to clear a path between you and another man's wallet. Instead of trying to use shame, guilt, and other methods why not simply get a job yourself and live within your means. It really takes less effort to work than to try and cheat someone else out of their work. So the way I look at it is that you or any other woman saying that I am greedy is a case of the pot calling the kettle black. If this was not the case you would put it in writing in the form of a pre-nup that you do not want his money or retirement. Oh and if you want me to stop "woman bashing" (you know stating the truth) as some have said on here. Then it is simple, sign pre-nups and try and get the laws changed to something that involves less risk to both parties involved. Now if this was done, then I would not be able to come on here and spread that nasty truth that all WW's seem to hate.

 

 

Methinks i hit a nerve? I never put a spin on anything but merely offered my opinion as is allowed on this site? But your post is long, a lot of drival, and left me scratching my head because it was like you never read my very very short post. And why would I as FWW or even regular wan care one iota if you care so much about your money? You are any other man? You really did not read my post did you?

Edited May 16, 2014 by veritas lux mea

[revelations]

Well I try to word things carefully and use examples mainly because you are not the only person reading VLM. However think what you like because in the end, the path to my wallet is closed. Talking about the nerve you hit, yes their is one that you did hit. That nerve is that it still bugs me when a person such as yourself tries to sell me and others on their bullsh*t. So if I am driveling then you are a stinking because your spin was full of it.

[veritas lux mea]

Well I try to word things carefully and use examples mainly because you are not the only person reading VLM. However think what you like because in the end, the path to my wallet is closed. Talking about the nerve you hit, yes their is one that you did hit. That nerve is that it still bugs me when a person such as yourself tries to sell me and others on their bullsh*t. So if I am driveling then you are a stinking because your spin was full of it.

 

How exactly was my post full of it?

 

I mentioned that your posts seemed about money and not your heart which reads greedy? I then stated that I make the same as my husband and offered him a clean break. And I suggested tongue in cheek you find a woman richer than you? No, sir, you are the one who is putting spins on things and really really over the top. Either you're the one with a reading comprehension problem, or you simply didn't read my post or your preception of reality is really twisted.

[revelations]

VLM,

Stating that the finical cost of being married is not a spin, it is simply a fact and more important a simple fact for me. I could find a woman that has more wealth than I do, however their are still other problems that come up with that and includes living with one. That is their are DV laws on the books that are very one sided now. A friend of mine almost went to jail after his adult niece attacked him. The only reason he did not go was because she had no injuries. The officer that spoke with my friend stated that if she had hurt herself by hitting him, he would be in jail. So do I chose to risk things like this in the name of love? Oh hell no...

 

However I will stop responding directly to you and just keep posting general messages to everyone else out their. So keep trying to open another path to a man's wallet, you go girl.