No idea

[Madman81]

I posted earlier enquiring whether there is any possibility she has PMDD? Google it, to me the symptoms you describe in your partner could very well be PMDD.

Simply understanding for herself why she is acting like this may help her to deal with it.

I'd never heard of PMDD before. I'll have to check that out. I'm also going with her to her next appointment with her regular counselor, which I believe is scheduled for this Thursday.

[Downtown]

DT -- sorry, you're right. I neglected to answer those questions.

 

I didn't observe anything objectively troubling in the two years we dated before moving in together. Moving in together probably led to more disagreement and heated words between us, but that didn't seem "troubling" because now, rather than seeing each other every couple of days, we were in each other's space every day.

 

In terms of the black-and-white thinking, the excessive drinking, and the other issues that are objectively troubling, I'd have to say it's been in the last year, give or take. In that time her anxiety symptoms really started ramping up until she was first prescribed Ativan in approximately September of 2013. It was around that time that she first started seeing her now-regular counselor, who diagnosed her with PTSD. It was also around then that she was first prescribed Cymbalta.

Madman, you do not seem to be describing the warning signs for PMDD. With that disorder, women typically begin experiencing symptoms around the start of the luteal phase of their menstrual cycle, a two-week span between ovulation and the first day of a woman's period. Symptoms can include severe depression, anxiety and tension. And then, just as quickly, the symptoms disappear. Hence, there is a regular monthly cycle, which you are not describing.

 

You nonetheless may benefit from asking her therapist about PMDD. In any event, I look forward to hearing what her therapist tells you on Thursday.

Edited June 3, 2014 by Downtown

[2sunny]

Is she drinking tonight?

[Madman81]

Madman, you do not seem to be describing the warning signs for PMDD. With that disorder, women typically begin experiencing symptoms around the start of the luteal phase of their menstrual cycle, a two-week span between ovulation and the first day of a woman's period. Symptoms can include severe depression, anxiety and tension. And then, just as quickly, the symptoms disappear. Hence, there is a regular monthly cycle, which you are not describing.

 

You nonetheless may benefit from asking her therapist about PMDD. In any event, I look forward to hearing what her therapist tells you on Thursday.

In the absence of more solid info, it may be premature for me to raise this with a counselor when I attend my wife's session with her on Thursday. It may be a better idea for me to keep a private log of these things for a couple of months, to see if there's any correlation. I haven't detected one so far.

[Madman81]

Is she drinking tonight?

On Sunday, after the fire-lighting episode, I told her that she was drinking too much and that something had to be done about this. I initially said that I thought we should stop drinking entirely for a month. Her response was that we should instead limit it to one drink each per evening.

 

Sunday evening, we did exactly that. Last night as well. No problems so far. We'll see how the rest of the week shapes up.

 

I don't know if it's the best approach or not, but it does make some sense, since it strikes me that cutting out drinking entirely just makes it that much more forbidden and alluring. Of course, it's way too early to know if it'll be maintained in the longer term, but we'll see. She's not on any antidepressants at the moment and there's no more Ativan, so at least there's no adverse drug/alcohol interactions to worry about. She seems to be quite a bit happier since Sunday evening.

[beach]

As suggested, have you read up on alcoholism?

 

If a person can't quit easily for a month - and stick to it without an issue or obsessing about having it - they may have a real problem.

 

Just the fact that she couldn't just say "ok, none for a month" should be your indicator that she is a problem drinker.

 

Alcoholics are allergic to the alcohol - it changes who they are - what they do - makes them a different person while drinking - and shrinks the area of the brain that processes clearly and the conscience area of the brain.

 

Not to mention that your wife has narcissistic tendencies. Have you looked that up?

 

You're playing "nice guy" with her and taking her blame - stop doing that.

 

Have you been to any al- anon meetings?

[beach]

How was the counseling session?

[Madman81]

Beach -- I have done some reading on alcoholism. I wasn't able to attend her counseling last Thursday, so we're going this Thursday.

 

Quite independently of that, however, was a new development yesterday.

 

I got home from work and my wife was upstairs in our room. The kids were playing downstairs. She told me, tearfully, that she needs to get help. She was sitting on our bed, halfway through a large bottle of Corona. She told me that she'd been hiding her drinking from me to some extent; she had a few empties hidden in a closet in the basement. She'd been looking up AA meetings online and had found one at a church near our home. I suggested that I dump out the rest of the beer bottle (or even better, that she do it) but she didn't want to.

 

Anyway, she went to the meeting last night at 830. Got home around 1030 after walking home. She said it went well, and that she needs to go each day. She told me that she needs for me to not judge her or shame her because that'll just push her more towards drinking. Made sense to me, to an extent.

 

What made no sense is that she came home with a forty of vodka. Poured herself a drink, we went to bed, I fell asleep. Checked the vodka bottle this morning, and it was 1/4 to 1/3 empty. So she'd gotten up and made at least two more drinks after I went to sleep.

 

Frankly, I was shocked that she came home from an AA meeting with a bottle of booze. To me, it seemed as though she felt that the act of going to AA (and the fact that she'd confessed to the secret drinking and decided to go to the meeting herself) gave her a "license" to drink more last night. Sort of like "I've acknowledged that I have a problem, now I can go full-bore into it." Should I have been surprised by this? Is it normal behaviour following an AA meeting, or at least following one's first AA meeting?

 

Part of what I've read has been about how I should respond to all of this. One website in particular gave three pointers that seem to make sense:

 

1. Detach. Separate the person from the alcoholism and act accordingly.

 

2. Don't enable. Never do for the alcoholic what they could do for themselves if they were sober.

 

3. Don't react. Don't blow up at the alcoholic in the belief that it will change things. Ignore their episodes and they'll be forced to look at themselves for a change.

 

"Enabling" is the part that raises the most questions for me. I would think that a person living with an alcoholic should stop drinking themselves in the alcoholic's presence; that seems obvious, and I have no problem with doing that. Am I right?

 

Also, how far do I go with "not enabling" her? Tell her to go get alcohol herself if she wants it, and that I'm not buying it? Cut up our joint credit cards so that she's forced to buy booze with her own money, rather than mine? Take any bottle of alcohol in the house and dump it down the drain? Don't apologize for her or make excuses for her if she's drunk in front of others, and instead let her embarrass herself, if it comes to that? In other words, just plain stop being there to catch her when she falls, if that fall is because of her drinking? Where does "not enabling" cross the line into "preventing", and is "preventing" such a bad thing?

 

I'm really in uncharted territory at the moment. Never had to deal with this before, in my own life or that of a significant other, friend, parent, etc. Thanks for reading, everybody.

[Mr. Lucky]

 

Part of what I've read has been about how I should respond to all of this. One website in particular gave three pointers that seem to make sense:

 

1. Detach. Separate the person from the alcoholism and act accordingly.

 

2. Don't enable. Never do for the alcoholic what they could do for themselves if they were sober.

 

3. Don't react. Don't blow up at the alcoholic in the belief that it will change things. Ignore their episodes and they'll be forced to look at themselves for a change.

 

"Enabling" is the part that raises the most questions for me. I would think that a person living with an alcoholic should stop drinking themselves in the alcoholic's presence; that seems obvious, and I have no problem with doing that. Am I right?

 

Also, how far do I go with "not enabling" her? Tell her to go get alcohol herself if she wants it, and that I'm not buying it? Cut up our joint credit cards so that she's forced to buy booze with her own money, rather than mine? Take any bottle of alcohol in the house and dump it down the drain? Don't apologize for her or make excuses for her if she's drunk in front of others, and instead let her embarrass herself, if it comes to that? In other words, just plain stop being there to catch her when she falls, if that fall is because of her drinking? Where does "not enabling" cross the line into "preventing", and is "preventing" such a bad thing?

 

I'm really in uncharted territory at the moment. Never had to deal with this before, in my own life or that of a significant other, friend, parent, etc. Thanks for reading, everybody.

Unfortunately, I have way too much experience with addicts and alcoholics .

 

You're over-estimating the impact of your role in this. You're not responsible for her drinking. And you can't force her to stop. Al-Anon would be a great resource for you and your family in your journey to understand this. I'd go to a meeting TODAY...

 

Mr. Lucky

[SleeplessIn]

I'd suggest first of all that you check to make sure this nearby church did have an AA meeting last night and does run that program. Otherwise, my concern would be that she used going to an AA meeting as a "hide" to go somewhere else and buy the booze, etc.

 

As to enabling, I don't agree that one should require the alcoholic to do for himself/herself all the things when drunk that he/she would normally do when sober. For example, DRIVE? I don't think so. And there are other behaviors that could be very risky to require a drunk person to do.

 

Enabling is making excuses for the other person's drinking ... enabling is buying alcohol for them ... enabling is keeping one's thoughts about it inside and not expressing one's concern regularly and insistently.

 

Alcoholism is recognized these days as a disease, and there are medications "out there" that an alcoholic can take that will cause them to become sick to the stomach if they drink. I'm not sure how effective those may be in the long term, but worthwhile to talk to a doctor and get some information.

[Madman81]

I'd suggest first of all that you check to make sure this nearby church did have an AA meeting last night and does run that program. Otherwise, my concern would be that she used going to an AA meeting as a "hide" to go somewhere else and buy the booze, etc.

 

As to enabling, I don't agree that one should require the alcoholic to do for himself/herself all the things when drunk that he/she would normally do when sober. For example, DRIVE? I don't think so. And there are other behaviors that could be very risky to require a drunk person to do.

 

Enabling is making excuses for the other person's drinking ... enabling is buying alcohol for them ... enabling is keeping one's thoughts about it inside and not expressing one's concern regularly and insistently.

 

Alcoholism is recognized these days as a disease, and there are medications "out there" that an alcoholic can take that will cause them to become sick to the stomach if they drink. I'm not sure how effective those may be in the long term, but worthwhile to talk to a doctor and get some information.

I did check that, and there was a meeting at that church last night. I also drove her there, and there were a number of people going in at the same time.

 

Naturally, efforts I make to not enable her wouldn't involve making her drive when she's intoxicated. Neither would I refuse to help her if she fell down and hurt herself. Definitely, however, I'm not going to buy alcohol for her. That's job one as far as any steps I take on this.

[xxoo]

The behavior you described in the beginning of this thread was clingy, sort of fearful of abandonment, plus the suicide attempt. Alcohol abuse probably doesn't explain that. I'm concerned about an overarching mental illness, and the alcohol use may represent "self medication" (which isn't uncommon).

 

Please make sure ALL of this is spelled out to a qualified mental health provider.

[beach]

If she's unwilling to stop are you prepared to offer her "alternatives"?

 

Such as:

 

Detox and rehab?

 

Either that (if she can't stop on her own) OR

 

Pack a bag now and leave this house?

 

 

You do understand that she needs help?

 

You can't MAKE her stop drinking - but you can remove her from the home since she may be a danger when drinking to your kids.

 

It's best to have this conversation with her when she isn't drinking... And give her those two choices - hopefully she will choose to go into detox. Check your insurance coverage so you know where she will go IMMEDIATELY when/if she agrees. No waiting until the next day.

 

Al-anon can help you if you're willing to go.

 

This has everything to do with what has been happening - I don't know why you don't put the puzzle pieces together.

 

Yes, many people drink after meetings... The idea is that she get a sponsor - work her steps - which takes away the DESIRE to drink.

 

If needed - drop her back off at the hospital!

 

 

And go back to her Dr and request to see her bloodwork they did last month - you shouldn't be surprised to see an elevated blood/alcohol content listed on her file.

 

I'd also bet money the Dr intended to keep her there longer and she requested to be dismissed earlier than planned - so she could get out and drink.

 

Expose to her family! They need to know her truth so they can help and be supportive.

 

Get busy! If you don't hurry - she could be dead before you take action!

[beach]

The behavior you described in the beginning of this thread was clingy, sort of fearful of abandonment, plus the suicide attempt. Alcohol abuse probably doesn't explain that. I'm concerned about an overarching mental illness, and the alcohol use may represent "self medication" (which isn't uncommon).

 

Please make sure ALL of this is spelled out to a qualified mental health provider.

 

Heavy drinking can look like concerning behavior.

 

Don't think it can't. And it does make a person "feel like a crazy person" - I guarantee it!

[xxoo]

Heavy drinking can look like concerning behavior.

 

Don't think it can't. And it does make a person "feel like a crazy person" - I guarantee it!

 

I know it can. But considering how this has played out, I don't think it should be assumed that alcohol is the primary problem without a qualified mental health professional getting the full picture first.

 

And please, please inform her family of EVERYTHING that is going on. No sugar coating.

[beach]

I know it can. But considering how this has played out, I don't think it should be assumed that alcohol is the primary problem without a qualified mental health professional getting the full picture first.

 

And please, please inform her family of EVERYTHING that is going on. No sugar coating.

 

The wife admitted she has a problem. Getting her help to stop is critical now.

[pteromom]

 

Also, how far do I go with "not enabling" her? Tell her to go get alcohol herself if she wants it, and that I'm not buying it? Cut up our joint credit cards so that she's forced to buy booze with her own money, rather than mine? Take any bottle of alcohol in the house and dump it down the drain? Don't apologize for her or make excuses for her if she's drunk in front of others, and instead let her embarrass herself, if it comes to that? In other words, just plain stop being there to catch her when she falls, if that fall is because of her drinking? Where does "not enabling" cross the line into "preventing", and is "preventing" such a bad thing?

 

I'm really in uncharted territory at the moment. Never had to deal with this before, in my own life or that of a significant other, friend, parent, etc. Thanks for reading, everybody.

 

Do you have Al Anon in your area? They have good info on this, and can help you figure out how to handle your wife's drinking.

 

And YES - you should stop drinking NOW. Stop buying alcohol. I don't know about cutting up credit cards, as you don't want to get into a situation where you are "shaming" her.

[xxoo]

The wife admitted she has a problem. Getting her help to stop is critical now.

 

I never meant to imply otherwise! I fully agree, and I would be pushing for urgent appts. I would encourage AA, but don't necessarily expect AA to be able to solve her problems. It might just be a piece of the treatment puzzle. It might even trigger more psych problems to stop the alcohol without professional support (remember the suicide attempt did not involve alcohol...so what happens to her mental state when she stops? Big question....)

 

Was there no psych follow up visit after the suicide attempt?

[beach]

I never meant to imply otherwise! I fully agree, and I would be pushing for urgent appts. I would encourage AA, but don't necessarily expect AA to be able to solve her problems. It might just be a piece of the treatment puzzle. It might even trigger more psych problems to stop the alcohol without professional support (remember the suicide attempt did not involve alcohol...so what happens to her mental state when she stops? Big question....)

 

Was there no psych follow up visit after the suicide attempt?

 

I'm not sure that alcohol was ruled out. I don't think the OP got enough solid evidence from the Dr about what her blood work showed when she was admitted. If she's sneaky like most hard drinkers - she may have asked the Dr not to share her info with her husband.

 

I don't think this poster is being proactive and realizing how sever this can be.

 

Quick action with a solid plan is critical at this stage.

[giotto]

if she is already anxious and suffering from PTSD, alcohol can definitely make it a lot worse. Not sure to the point of committing suicide, but I wouldn't be overly surprised... as far as stopping is concerned, it depends on how long she's been drinking heavily. There is no magic wand: she has to stop, but under strict supervision if she's been abusing it for a long time.

[2sunny]

Any update today? I hope you've had time to develop a plan that gets her the help she needs.

[Madman81]

Yes, there is an update.

 

She had a panic attack this morning; called me at work from home, in tears. She couldn't identify the trigger. It's the first one she's had in awhile. I managed to talk her down. Her kids were home from school (teacher's strike) and she didn't have to work today, so I suggested she take them and go for a walk. She seemed to like that idea.

 

I texted with her on and off during the day; things seemed fine. I got home from work just after 5:45; her kids were watching TV. Went upstairs and she's half conscious -- slurring her words, asks if the kids are asleep. I point out that it's not even 6 pm yet. There's a mostly-empty glass by the bed; I ask how much she's had to drink, and she says "two drinks". I head downstairs to deal with dinner for the kids. I check the vodka bottle she picked up the other night after her first AA meeting, and there's another 1/3 of it gone since last night -- roughly twelve ounces.

 

Right now she's asleep, drunk off her face, so I guess no AA meeting for her tonight.

 

There's clearly no motivation for her to change, and she knows that I'm going to be here to pick up the pieces. Clearly that has to stop. So, here's the plan.

 

1. I'm surreptitiously taking her joint credit card away. If she's going to buy booze, she can use a credit card that's her own problem. I'm not subsidizing it.

 

2. I'm going to her counselling session with her tomorrow at 12:30, where I'm going to bring up the issue of her drinking. Because I doubt she's told the counselor about it.

 

3. I'm going to look online and see if there's an Al-Anon meeting in my area tonight that I can go to.

 

This is a serious problem. Next time she's conscious, I'm going to have to lay down the law. Specifically, she's drinking herself into a stupor with her kids in the house (which, if her abusive ex finds out about it somehow, will cause a huge problem), and I don't feel comfortable bringing my kids to an environment like that. And if I can't bring my kids to my own home, then that says something very obvious about MY ability to live here.

 

More later... thanks everybody.

[2sunny]

Get a solid plan to get her professional help.

 

Those kids should not be left alone with her - she's not in her right mind and could harm someone.

 

This is tragic that you haven't taken her to the hospital or detox yet.

[xxoo]

She's free falling, in a downward spiral. Consider how bad things have gotten in just a few short weeks. It's time to enlist some help. Have family come stay with the kids, and get your wife into treatment.

[2sunny]

How did the counseling go today? Did your wife tell the counselor about her drinking?

 

Did the counselor suggest a plan of action?