Why can't some people just let it go?

[whichwayisup]

I do think though you need to detach and stay away from exMM. Focus on your own life, friends and family..His life just seems so full of drama, something you don't need to deal with anymore since your A is over.

 

I hope the police see she needs professional help though. I'm surprised her husband hasn't tried to admit her to the hospital in the past.

[fellini]

Please explain to me what is so extreme about this situation? I mean honestly explain it to me like I'm a five year old. Because people end marriages every single day and I would guess that very few of them have this kind of reaction or behaviors. All the BSs reading this - how many of you reacted like this? How many of you reacted like this when you realized that the AP had no idea that your WS was married? This is not an extreme situation. It's an affair and then a divorce. It's not that big of a freaking deal. She was going to divorce him in a few years anyway she said so herself! This is about nothing more than jealousy and childishness.

 

First of all, I am not attacking you, nor have I ever said you don't have the right, or are not justified to feel as you feel. From your perspective, you are right.

 

But this is the thing.

 

The only information about what is actually going on in the world of the BS is from your lips. THIS IS COMPLETELY UNFAIR.

 

I am all for you getting support for your position, but I am astounded at how hardly anyone here is challenging you on your right to call this person to task for HER EMOTIONAL REACTIONS TO SEEING YOU. And I am even more surprised that people in LS are defending your right to paint the entire canvas of this situation and decide what is the correct response for a BS soon to be exBS.

 

8 MONTHS? She is fighting over a divorce. TODAY. You seem to think that DDay is all that matters here. Her divorce is related to your relationship with her husband. Divorce is just as painful as an affair.

 

Her husband told you he was single.

Her husband tells you things about her, and you tell us these things here.

 

Of course some or all of them could be true. But he lied to you about his marital situation but you want us to believe that that was the only lie that passed between you? "She was going to divorce him herself, she said so herself"?

 

Okay. Let's say that was true. Explain her pain.

Okay. Let's say that was NOT true. She never said that. Does that explain her pain?

Okay. Let's say she said that, but she didn't mean it, she only said it as a defense response because her life was crashing around her without her permission and she needed something to use to feel in power. Does that make sense?

 

The thing is: you are the wrong person to answer those questions. Only she can.

 

Surely I am not alone in thinking that if next week from a jail cell this woman gets access to a computer and joins LS, she will have a different story to tell, and with information that you are simply not providing.

 

Hell yes, you should have a safe life. Hell yes, you should not live in fear of a potential crazy woman. Yes, yes yes. But who are you to decide what is an appropriate response for her? Who are you to say the affair came to light 8 months ago and enough is enough. She needs to grow up! -You have the right to say that about her? (You try saying that on a good day in LS to a recent BS who is still in pain and see where that gets you.) Use those comments on yourself, you do not have the right to presume how much pain and trauma this woman has, and is entitled to suffer. I ABSOLUTELY AGREE WITH YOU THAT YOU HAVE A RIGHT TO THE RESTRAINING ORDER. That is for you. But you do not have the right to tell everyone in here, in LS, what is going ON in that woman's mind. If you do presume to think you have access to the inner workings of her mind, then please at least also expect that some people in here will call you on it.

 

But I'm guessing that as an adult, which you claim she is not behaving, that there are at least two versions of what is going on here, and, to paraphrase Kurt Vonnegut: You are both correct.

Edited May 26, 2014 by fellini

[cocorico]

I hope the police see she needs professional help though. I'm surprised her husband hasn't tried to admit her to the hospital in the past.

 

Perhaps he has. I know my H tried to get help for his xW many times while they were M, and when he left her, but she refused. People who are that I'll often do not recognise that they are I'll and project the illness onto others. I don't know where Amy lives, or what the rules are there, but here in the UK to get someone admitted to a psychiatric facility against their will requires them to be sectioned - which has quite stringent requirements, as you can imagine.

[fellini]

The kind of support Amy seemed to need, she got from the police. IN here the only kind of support that any of us can offer her, is to legitimize her keeping alive the thread of her affair. Which is a completely different matter.

 

It seems that by introducing the details of the life of this very disturbed BS, that she was innocent in the knowledge of her AP being a MM, she is somehow also seeking some kind of amnesty from being responsible for anything that is going on.

 

I think there are clearly separate issues here but they clash:

 

There is the whole issue about requiring restraining order.

 

There is a whole story about a wife who is trying not to finalise a divorce. THIS ENTIRE STORY from our OP.

 

There is a whole story about a supposed affair that supposedly ended but obviously not really as the OP is very clear about connecting with him again to talk (if my WS ever thinks I'm going to let her sit down with her exAP to "clear the air" she will be out the door in two seconds). There is nothing but evidence that the OP sees herself and this WS together in the near future.

That she wants them to lock the BS and throw away the key is clear.

 

It's going to be an interesting struggle for her to keep overlapping these different issues into a healthy relationship when it comes time for mom to pick up the kids all the while there is a restraining order out from the exAP and Dad is out of the house doing whatever it is he does to attract women into his messed up life.

 

The phrase wishful thinking comes to mind here.

Edited May 26, 2014 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[cocorico]

When I talked to the police today I was really trying to figure out a way that she didn't have to go to jail. But since she keeps violating the restraining order I think it's unavoidable at this point. I agree that she needs help and not jail. But honestly at this point whatever keeps her away from me for a minute will give me a break from worrying about running into her and what that will evoke in her.

 

I'm going to talk to exMM soon. I wanted to wait until she couldn't intervene in any way so that he and I can talk openly with one another because we have not had a conversation about so many things that it seems we may need to. I will discuss this with him. The police did not say anything about getting her help I think that they are exhausted with her too. But I will see what exMM thinks about it and see what he is willing to do. Honestly if it would keep her out of jail he will probably be in favor of it because I'm sure his kids aren't going to enjoy having their mom in jail.

 

The police didn't seem to open to me trying to come up with other solutions besides jail. Like I said I think that they are just tired of having to deal with her too. She has had other episodes with exMM that have involved the police and not me.

 

He will have to think carefully how to explain to his kids about her being in jail. They witnessed the episode outside the mechanic. They may have witnessed other episodes. They are probably struggling right now to match that picture of their mother with the one they formed growing up, of an adult who took care of them and looked out for them. I don't know how old they are or what would be age-appropriate in terms of how much or how little to say, but it does strike me that the most helpful ways of explaining would involve discussions of health / illness rather than crime. Which would make treatment a much more constructive option than jail - even though she did break the law.

[sweet_pea]

I haven't really read all of the responses, but I haven't really seen anyone, BS or AP say that what the BS in Amy's situation is doing is right, the way some of you all are making it seem? I admit I may be wrong since I haven't read every response, but I think most posters (if not all) are in agreement that this woman's behavior is wrong, potentially dangerous and out of line.

Edited May 26, 2014 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[Hope Shimmers]

fellini - I usually respect your posts so I'm surprised to read your last one. It is the nature of a forum that we only get "one side to the story". That is true for you, for me, for everyone here. It's something we keep in the back of our minds while writing responses.

 

I don't agree with you that Amy is trying to judge what is in this woman's mind. She is merely looking at the behavior exhibited and saying that she is acting like a child - which is a pretty objective assessment.

 

On the other hand, others are diagnosing her as mentally ill and saying she needs to be hospitalized. Huh? That's not how you diagnose mental illness. Maybe she is, and maybe she isn't. But if we hospitalize everyone who reacts inappropriately to a soon-to-be-ex during a divorce, then there would be no beds left for other patients.

 

I can understand that you would not care for it if your W wanted to 'clear the air' with her ex-MM, but you are reconciled and married. She, on the other hand, is legally separated from her H. Separated means... well, separate! As in, separate lives, and she no longer gets to say who he talks to for five minutes here and there.

 

Amy - despite what others are trying to say, you have every right to talk to whomever you want. You can talk to this man or date him or whatever you choose, and you STILL should not be subjected to this woman's antics. So all of the discussion about you avoiding him, and so on, is completely off topic.

[AmyBamy]

First of all, I am not attacking you, nor have I ever said you don't have the right, or are not justified to feel as you feel. From your perspective, you are right.

 

But this is the thing.

 

The only information about what is actually going on in the world of the BS is from your lips. THIS IS COMPLETELY UNFAIR.

 

I am all for you getting support for your position, but I am astounded at how hardly anyone here is challenging you on your right to call this person to task for HER EMOTIONAL REACTIONS TO SEEING YOU. And I am even more surprised that people in LS are defending your right to paint the entire canvas of this situation and decide what is the correct response for a BS soon to be exBS.

 

8 MONTHS? She is fighting over a divorce. TODAY. You seem to think that DDay is all that matters here. Her divorce is related to your relationship with her husband. Divorce is just as painful as an affair.

 

Her husband told you he was single.

Her husband tells you things about her, and you tell us these things here.

 

Of course some or all of them could be true. But he lied to you about his marital situation but you want us to believe that that was the only lie that passed between you? "She was going to divorce him herself, she said so herself"?

 

Okay. Let's say that was true. Explain her pain.

Okay. Let's say that was NOT true. She never said that. Does that explain her pain?

Okay. Let's say she said that, but she didn't mean it, she only said it as a defense response because her life was crashing around her without her permission and she needed something to use to feel in power. Does that make sense?

 

The thing is: you are the wrong person to answer those questions. Only she can.

 

Surely I am not alone in thinking that if next week from a jail cell this woman gets access to a computer and joins LS, she will have a different story to tell, and with information that you are simply not providing.

 

Hell yes, you should have a safe life. Hell yes, you should not live in fear of a potential crazy woman. Yes, yes yes. But who are you to decide what is an appropriate response for her? Who are you to say the affair came to light 8 months ago and enough is enough. She needs to grow up! -You have the right to say that about her? (You try saying that on a good day in LS to a recent BS who is still in pain and see where that gets you.) Use those comments on yourself, you do not have the right to presume how much pain and trauma this woman has, and is entitled to suffer. I ABSOLUTELY AGREE WITH YOU THAT YOU HAVE A RIGHT TO THE RESTRAINING ORDER. That is for you. But you do not have the right to tell everyone in here, in LS, what is going ON in that woman's mind. If you do presume to think you have access to the inner workings of her mind, then please at least also expect that some people in here will call you on it.

 

But I'm guessing that as an adult, which you claim she is not behaving, that there are at least two versions of what is going on here, and, to paraphrase Kurt Vonnegut: You are both correct.

 

Her husband has told me very little about her or their marriage. He and I have spoken very little since I found out he was married. Everything I know about her and their marriage is from HER - not him. My observations and interactions with her are all that I know about her. I'm telling you what she has told me. I'm not guessing about anything and everything I have shared is what she has told me herself.

[AmyBamy]

fellini - I usually respect your posts so I'm surprised to read your last one. It is the nature of a forum that we only get "one side to the story". That is true for you, for me, for everyone here. It's something we keep in the back of our minds while writing responses.

 

I don't agree with you that Amy is trying to judge what is in this woman's mind. She is merely looking at the behavior exhibited and saying that she is acting like a child - which is a pretty objective assessment.

 

On the other hand, others are diagnosing her as mentally ill and saying she needs to be hospitalized. Huh? That's not how you diagnose mental illness. Maybe she is, and maybe she isn't. But if we hospitalize everyone who reacts inappropriately to a soon-to-be-ex during a divorce, then there would be no beds left for other patients.

 

I can understand that you would not care for it if your W wanted to 'clear the air' with her ex-MM, but you are reconciled and married. She, on the other hand, is legally separated from her H. Separated means... well, separate! As in, separate lives, and she no longer gets to say who he talks to for five minutes here and there.

 

Amy - despite what others are trying to say, you have every right to talk to whomever you want. You can talk to this man or date him or whatever you choose, and you STILL should not be subjected to this woman's antics. So all of the discussion about you avoiding him, and so on, is completely off topic.

 

I'm trying to let this thread die because it seems to have hit a very sore spot with so many people which I just don't understand at all. I did everything exactly the way I have read most BSs would have wanted an unknowing AP to go about this whole thing. Yet I'm still in the wrong, I'm still expected to hole myself up and rearrange my life, I'm still expected to give and give to this woman who has absolutely no compassion for me or my feelings at all. I DO matter too. My feelings and thoughts are just as important as hers. I've done nothing wrong throughout all of this and I know that in my heart of hearts. I went well beyond what I was comfortable with to try to ease this woman's suffering and there just isn't more that I can do or am willing to do FOR her. She has to handle her own life just as I am expected to handle mine.

 

Yes exMM was dishonest with me about his marital status. But if a married person can forgive a spouse of 20 years or more for stepping out on them then I see absolutely no reason that I can't forgive a boyfriend of 3 months for not wanting to subject me to being an AP as he tried to figure out how to leave a marriage. If our entire relationship from here on out is him stepping out on me and lying to me it's nobody's problem but my own and I would handle it and I wouldn't handle it by acting like his wife is acting. It won't go to that level because I refuse to act that way over anything ever.

 

I can't help it if his wife chooses to act like a criminal and lands herself in jail. She is the only one that has control over her actions and behaviors and I take absolutely no responsibility for her consequences. I take my consequences like a big girl and if she can't do the same that is not my problem it's hers. It's not my job to save her from herself.

 

As far as the wisful thinking comment that someone posted whatever. I have no control over what the police do in response to her behaviors. I don't have to wishfully think about anything because I'm too busy handling my own life and responsibilities with my big girl panties on unlike his wife. I have specifically said that I have no idea if he and I would end up together but I'm not ruling it out because why should I? Because he has a crazy wife? That's not his fault either. He is not responsible for her actions anymore than I am. If we are responsible for other people's actions then everyone better buckle up because that makes all of the BSs responsible for affairs doesn't it? And I'm sure that's a road that they don't want to go down. But if it works one way and he and I are responsible for her actions then it works the other way that she is responsible for our actions.

 

People can be ugly to me about it all they want it isnt' going to change or influence what I choose because I'm not an impressionable child. I will make my own decisions and handle whatever they result in like an adult just like I always have and always will. And for the record I don't think his wife is crazy. I think that people like some here have decided to justify bad behavior because it makes them feel better and then they reinforce that with others and decide that it's okay to act however you want if you feel like it. There are laws and rules for a reason they serve a purpose and those laws and rules apply to everyone even supposedly hurt BSs.

[AmyBamy]

I do think though you need to detach and stay away from exMM. Focus on your own life, friends and family..His life just seems so full of drama, something you don't need to deal with anymore since your A is over.

 

I hope the police see she needs professional help though. I'm surprised her husband hasn't tried to admit her to the hospital in the past.

 

ExMM and I had a conversation this morning and no he has never had to have her put in the hospital. It seems that as long as she gets her way she is not crazy. If she doesn't get her way she acts crazy. His report is that he has given in to her their entire relationship to avoid these types of scenes. He has been emotionally and behaviorally blackmailed the entire relationship by her threats to act this way. And I guess when he finally said enough she lost her ****.

 

I can't imagine living that way for that many years. It's freaking ridiculous. The whole family apparently walks on eggshells around her worried about setting her off. Nice way to be a wife and mother and to control those around you. Just like a freaking child and it all makes so much sense now. She is trying to do the same thing with me by threatening me with crazy behavior if I don't do what she wants and the way she wants it done. Bad news for her is I am not afraid of her nor do I care if she lands her stupid ass in jail.

 

Now I'm getting angry about the whole thing. Before I was just perplexed and annoyed but now I'm getting angry. Who the hell does she think she is really? The ****ing queen? She's about to learn a very hard lesson that she does not get to dictate to those around her how we live our lives. I will not avoid him and she can stuff it.

 

Yes now I'm saying bring it on. I will stand my ground. I will not do anything that I wouldn't normally do and I will not intentionally do things I wouldn't just to piss her off. But I'm determined now to live my life exactly the way I choose and if she continues to try to bully me into doing what she wants I will calmly hold my ground and let her react all crazy if she chooses. I am absolutely done with her and her stupid tantrums.

 

ExMM is coming over later today so that he and I can sit down and talk. We had the convo this morning and we couldn't really get into things but his kids are spending some time with family later today and he and I will sit down and hash through this. She is not going to dictate to me who I see or what I do even though she thinks she can because she has done it her whole life with those around her. She is in for a very rude awakening.

[2sunny]

Speaking of the law - it's possible (if you're in the US) they are waiting until Tuesday to take her into jail because if they took her in on Saturday the courts are closed for the holiday (today, Monday) so she would be in jail waiting to see the judge until Tuesday at the earliest.

 

If hey take her in Tuesday it's possible she will see the judge the same day (possibly be fined) and released before her kids are home from school.

 

I'm speculating, of course, but it appears the police are letting her off easier so she doesn't spend several nights in jail.

 

Why else would they wait? Did they give their reason for waiting until Tuesday?

[AmyBamy]

Speaking of the law - it's possible (if you're in the US) they are waiting until Tuesday to take her into jail because if they took her in on Saturday the courts are closed for the holiday (today, Monday) so she would be in jail waiting to see the judge until Tuesday at the earliest.

 

If hey take her in Tuesday it's possible she will see the judge the same day (possibly be fined) and released before her kids are home from school.

 

I'm speculating, of course, but it appears the police are letting her off easier so she doesn't spend several nights in jail.

 

Why else would they wait? Did they give their reason for waiting until Tuesday?

 

Holiday weekend and short staffed. They said if I felt threatened that they would pursue it sooner and they are driving up and down my street more than normal to keep an eye on things.

[cocorico]

If she doesn't get her way she acts crazy. His report is that he has given in to her their entire relationship to avoid these types of scenes. He has been emotionally and behaviorally blackmailed the entire relationship by her threats to act this way. And I guess when he finally said enough she lost her ****.

 

I can't imagine living that way for that many years. It's freaking ridiculous. The whole family apparently walks on eggshells around her worried about setting her off. Nice way to be a wife and mother and to control those around you.

 

This was my H's xW. It worked for her for 30 years or so. She still tries it, of course, but having lost her job, her friend, her family, she has fewer people to try it on. No one who doesn't have to put up with it, does, and so I hope your xMM's S2BXW realises quickly that this is not a very sustainable solution. She'll find herself alone, surrounded by normal people who expect her to behave like a normal person, who hold her to account, who simply don't tolerate that kind of childish behaviour.

 

I hope your discussions go well.

[2sunny]

If his sense of normal is drama like she delivers - he may not be used to anything different and essentially searches out situations that fuel the drama.

 

Kind of like the abused people to continually settle for an abuser because that is what's familiar to them.

 

He may find a gal that's calm and relaxed as boring to him.

 

What a person is FAMILIAR with is their most natural, easiest choice.

 

Just wanted to point it out - if she's been kinda "crazy emotional" their whole marriage - he may well choose "crazy emotional" in his next gal when he becomes single.

 

It's not a conscious choice - it's just that most people naturally choose what they are accustomed to experiencing (whether they liked THAT experience or not).

[Hope Shimmers]

None of us get to judge others' pain. We have no idea the level of her pain - we're all guessing at that, but it doesn't excuse anything. The point here is that there is NOTHING that justifies her behavior, so understanding it really is impossible. Understanding it means that at some level it is justified, and it just isn't. We all think we have experienced the worst pain ever possible, but we don't get a pass to act like that to others and put kids at risk in the process. We have to be law-abiding adults or suffer the consequences.

 

In all honesty, this woman is acting a lot like Betty Broderick, and she would scare the hell out of me because those people can't be controlled.

Edited May 26, 2014 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
Response to deleted post redacted

[William]

Folks, please, I implore you, continuing upon this path of argumentative and downright mean posting will only result in your removal. Two more members removed, thousands left to go. LoveShack is a place to discuss topics, not engage in invective and rhetorical attacks. Of course, members are free to do what they want as long as they're members.

[AmyBamy]

None of us get to judge others' pain. We have no idea the level of her pain - we're all guessing at that, but it doesn't excuse anything. The point here is that there is NOTHING that justifies her behavior, so understanding it really is impossible. Understanding it means that at some level it is justified, and it just isn't. We all think we have experienced the worst pain ever possible, but we don't get a pass to act like that to others and put kids at risk in the process. We have to be law-abiding adults or suffer the consequences.

 

In all honesty, this woman is acting a lot like Betty Broderick, and she would scare the hell out of me because those people can't be controlled.

 

I have begun to just scan posts and can figure out pretty quickly if it something I need to read or not. I'm still just amazed that anyone can tell me with a straight face that it is my fault that she is acting the way she is acting. I'm losing sympathy by the minute literally.

 

I know the story of Betty Broderick and now that you mention it holy **** she is acting like her. I remember watching that movie they had about her and thinking how ridiculous she was acting even though she was clearly hurt and kept thinking that it was going to end badly for her.

 

In my case I am hopeful that the increased police presence on my street keeps her away from here since it's a cul de sac it will be pretty evident if she is here why she is here. I have chatted with a couple of the police officers and they seem convinced that since they had a discussion with her the other day when serving the protective orders that she will calm down and start following the laws. Especially now that she is probably aware that she is being taken to task for violating the restraining order against me two different ways in one day.

 

I'm with you in that nothing justifies this behavior. We are all hurt and some of us have even been the victim of having a WS but like I said before I would guess that very few people react this way. I still don't think that she is crazy. I think that she is having tantrums in the hopes that it will get her what she wants. Which is obviously to have me and her husband nowhere near each other. When he shows up here later today and parks his car in my driveway - I am hopeful that she doesn't show up but if she does I already have a plan of action. I will simply contact 911.

 

He is not a weak man he is a man who had children before he realized that he needed to get out of that relationship. Once the children came he was determined to make their lives as joyful and chaos free as he could. He did that for a lot of years and just can simply do it no longer. She doesn't have to accept that he and I are talking but she does have to follow the laws and restraining orders against her. I feel so bad for him and his kids now that I've been subjected to just a small amount of her behaviors. I can't even imagine what it has taken for him to keep the peace all of these years under the threat of her lashing out. And he's obviously done a good job since his kids are shocked at her behaviors right now showing that he has protected them from it successfully for at least 15 years.

 

I just want this to be done and over with but I know that it's not going to be easy and she's probably going to make it as dramatic as she can. I think it is so sad that because she is miserable that she insists on trying to make everyone else around her miserable too even if it means hurting her own children. She is obviously a very selfish person.

 

I am hopeful that he and I can have a long uniterrupted talk today and work through some of these things and figure out what our plan is. I am not wanting to be a part of their divorce for obvious reasons. Yet because I love him I do feel a desire to support him. I just have to figure out how much support I can give considering the situation. I have to do what is healthy and safe for me too. He broke down in our convo earlier and that breaks my heart for him. I hurt for him and his children having to deal with this level of drama simply because she refuses to accept the end of this miserable marriage on anyone's terms but her own.

[2sunny]

Why on earth would you have a conversation with him today? Why can't it wait a week or so when the emotions aren't so convoluted?

 

I can't see that helping at this time.

 

I suggest waiting... Otherwise you're really risking more of her same crazy.

[underpants]

ExMM is coming over later today so that he and I can sit down and talk. We had the convo this morning and we couldn't really get into things but his kids are spending some time with family later today and he and I will sit down and hash through this. She is not going to dictate to me who I see or what I do even though she thinks she can because she has done it her whole life with those around her. She is in for a very rude awakening.

 

 

You sound like you have a good level head on your shoulders. I think it is good that you and him have a friendly talk.

 

I would be careful though, about opening a door to anything more at this time. He is fragile (as most newly seperated/divorced people are).

 

Be his friend and maybe down the road it can grow into something more. Don't let your anger (however righteous it is) give you cause to act in a way you may regret. You have the high ground, so stay there.

 

He may want to explore individual conciling as I'm sure this is a big adjustment for him as well. There is a shrink4men site that discusses leaving women who exhibit some of the behaviors that have been discussed. There is also a site (dadsdivorce) it has some forums, tips and stories that may help your friend. He will need tools to get him and his children through this and tools to maintain a healthy relationship in the future. That will take time and healing.

 

Good luck to all involved, and I'm glad you have posted your story.

Edited May 26, 2014 by underpants

[AmyBamy]

You sound like you have a good level head on your shoulders. I think it is good that you and him have a friendly talk.

 

I would be careful though, about opening a door to anything more at this time. He is fragile (as most newly seperated/divorced people are).

 

Be his friend and maybe down the road it can grow into something more. Don't let your anger (however righteous it is) give you cause to act in a way you may regret. You have the high ground, so stay there.

 

He may want to explore individual conciling as I'm sure this is a big adjustment for him as well. There is a shrink4men site that discusses leaving women who exhibit some of the behaviors that have been discussed. There is also a site (dadsdivorce) it has some forums, tips and stories that may help your friend. He will need tools to get him and his children through this and tools to maintain a healthy relationship in the future. That will take time and healing.

 

Good luck to all involved, and I'm glad you have posted your story.

 

Thank you. I will share those sites with him although he isn't much of an internet user. He is already in counseling for himself and told me this morning that he plans on having his kids start too now. I am not looking to date him right now for a multitude of reasons. I am just trying to figure out where he and I go from here as just having a five minute chat in public has unleashed this bizarre situation. And since we are both victims of his wife's behaviors it just feels like we should talk about it since we are the only two adults in the world right now that have this in common. I guess since his wife keeps dragging me back into this stuff I should have an understanding of what I'm being dragged into.

[AmyBamy]

Why on earth would you have a conversation with him today? Why can't it wait a week or so when the emotions aren't so convoluted?

 

I can't see that helping at this time.

 

I suggest waiting... Otherwise you're really risking more of her same crazy.

 

After the incident the other day I am well prepared to handle her crazy. I won't be caught unprepared again. The police are providing extra patrol on my street and won't be too far away if she shows up to my property or within 100 feet of it. It is now up to her to make the right choices and not continue to violate the restraining orders or protective orders. If she chooses to violate them she will suffer the consequences and she is well aware since the police told her as much.

[underpants]

I am hopeful that he and I can have a long uniterrupted talk today and work through some of these things and figure out what our plan is. I am not wanting to be a part of their divorce for obvious reasons. Yet because I love him I do feel a desire to support him. I just have to figure out how much support I can give considering the situation. I have to do what is healthy and safe for me too. He broke down in our convo earlier and that breaks my heart for him. I hurt for him and his children having to deal with this level of drama simply because she refuses to accept the end of this miserable marriage on anyone's terms but her own.

 

Okay, but be careful. Personally I would wait until after tomorrow and see what happens there.

 

Regardless, you both are pretty fragile right now and well, you could very easily fall into leaning on each other when the time is not good.

 

I just don't want to see either of you get hurt by weak actions now, if that makes sense. Don't let yourself be a rebound or distraction from pain he will have to process and heal from on his own.

 

Be his friend and light support if you can, and it does sound like you care about him. I caution you however, to not get too deep with his problems from another relationship.

[beach]

After the incident the other day I am well prepared to handle her crazy. I won't be caught unprepared again. The police are providing extra patrol on my street and won't be too far away if she shows up to my property or within 100 feet of it. It is now up to her to make the right choices and not continue to violate the restraining orders or protective orders. If she chooses to violate them she will suffer the consequences and she is well aware since the police told her as much.

 

This is where I don't think you're helping the situation.

 

You could CHOOSE not to meet and talk to him right now - and that would defuse the whole mess.

 

But you are CHOOSING to meet him - knowing full well that she's crazy. This fuels the fire for right now. I think it's unwise of you to choose this now.

 

And because it's your choice - it seems you are taunting her or even asking for trouble.

 

Of course you have your right to meet him - it's a free world - but why do you need to meet him now? Why not wait a few weeks and meet further away?

[underpants]

Thank you. I will share those sites with him although he isn't much of an internet user. He is already in counseling for himself and told me this morning that he plans on having his kids start too now. I am not looking to date him right now for a multitude of reasons. I am just trying to figure out where he and I go from here as just having a five minute chat in public has unleashed this bizarre situation. And since we are both victims of his wife's behaviors it just feels like we should talk about it since we are the only two adults in the world right now that have this in common. I guess since his wife keeps dragging me back into this stuff I should have an understanding of what I'm being dragged into.

 

I posted before you posted the above. It sounds like you have a good outlook on the situation. Good for you.

 

Good to see he is seeking coucil, and the children will as well.

 

Wishing the best for all involved.

[jwi71]

Amy,

 

Let me preface my reply by saying I am REALLY on your side - even if what I say doesn't seem like it.

 

I'm trying to let this thread die because it seems to have hit a very sore spot with so many people which I just don't understand at all. I did everything exactly the way I have read most BSs would have wanted an unknowing AP to go about this whole thing.

 

I have also read this thread and I don't get that vibe. In fact, you have applauded for your actions in how you handled learning he was M - many OW would have simply continued. But that's not YOU - not your style - you have WELL developed sense of right and wrong (which leads to some trouble later on...) and that sense compelled your actions.

 

I would say you have more principals in your pinky than most in their body.

 

Yet I'm still in the wrong, I'm still expected to hole myself up and rearrange my life,

 

No. No one, myself included, has demanded or even asked you to "rearrange your whole life". What is suggested, is maybe we rethink our "lines in the sand". And remember that well developed sense of right and wrong I mentioned - the one we all lauded above - yeah, its biting you in the azz here. Here, it manifests itself as "I did no wrong and its unjust, in light of my lack of wrongdoing, to alter ANYTHING in my life" - and you dig your heels in. And the INEVITABLE happens - crazy drama. And as much as you would like to think it has no negative on you - you're wrong it does - witness how this drama AFFECTS you.

 

Maybe, possibly, entertain the idea of, when reasonable, we take steps to avoid drama. Because this drama does NOT make YOU look good - and yes, I am well certain you don't care. But it AFFECTS everyone. It will affect the innocents around you, it affects the BS, the MM, his children, the innocent people standing in line next you - it all touches so many lives - for what? For what noble cause? What is gained?

 

I'm still expected to give and give to this woman who has absolutely no compassion for me or my feelings at all.

 

Seriously?

I hate to do this, but can you imagine her thought process in this (Im not saying you DID any of it - its the BS's PoV here):

You stole her H

You wrecked "her world"

You HURT her children

You "got" her arrested.

You "flaunt your A" (referring to talking to her H in public)

 

You can't possibly expect someone in her state to be rational - she's proven it time and again that she isn't.

 

No Amy, she doesn't care one iota about you - in fact, I would bet she BLAMES you.

 

And this is the woman you choose to "not avoid"?

 

I DO matter too.

 

Of course you do - if you didn't matter and no one cared - your thread would have zero views and zero replies.

 

Clearly people care.

 

I've done nothing wrong throughout all of this and I know that in my heart of hearts. I went well beyond what I was comfortable with to try to ease this woman's suffering and there just isn't more that I can do or am willing to do FOR her. She has to handle her own life just as I am expected to handle mine.

 

She's proven time and again she CAN'T handle it - not for now.

And yes, I for one, do hold you accountable for PART of this - for refusing to take some reasonable action to avoid all this. (lets no go back there again ok - just stating what everyone already knows)

Yes exMM was dishonest with me about his marital status. But if a married person can forgive a spouse of 20 years or more for stepping out on them then I see absolutely no reason that I can't forgive a boyfriend of 3 months for not wanting to subject me to being an AP as he tried to figure out how to leave a marriage.

 

Nor should you expect the BS to heal in 3 months when the OW is STILL around. Calling "her H" as "BF". There is a MASSIVE difference in x number of years as man and wife vs x number of months as the OW.

 

He's lies to you, while certainly not optimal, are UNDERSTANDABLE. Nor does it presage a horrible fate to this budding R.

 

If you proceed with your BF - then this woman will be in your life until she dies. One more time - you will be seeing and interacting with her FOREVER. I would counsel that you start thinking strategically here - and not vainly winning pointless battles of where you can get your car serviced. Pick your fights. Having an xWW that HATES my W - its NOT easy. An pizzed off xW has innumerable cards to play to disrupt things - believe me I know.

 

Just MY advice.

 

If our entire relationship from here on out is him stepping out on me and lying to me it's nobody's problem but my own and I would handle it and I wouldn't handle it by acting like his wife is acting. It won't go to that level because I refuse to act that way over anything ever.

 

As a combat veteran myself, I have seem big strong dudes freeze in combat - and the scrawny guys be heroes. One never knows how one will react in the face of combat.

 

I can't help it if his wife chooses to act like a criminal and lands herself in jail. She is the only one that has control over her actions and behaviors and I take absolutely no responsibility for her consequences. I take my consequences like a big girl and if she can't do the same that is not my problem it's hers. It's not my job to save her from herself.

 

Correct. But if you want a harmonious life - you might want to take reasonable actions to reduce drama. Not for her sake, for YOURS, for your BF's - for the kids - for the couple next you just trying to eat dinner - lets try and avoid all this.

 

In hockey its called instigating - and that's what you aren't seeing.

 

Because he has a crazy wife? That's not his fault either. He is not responsible for her actions anymore than I am. If we are responsible for other people's actions then everyone better buckle up because that makes all of the BSs responsible for affairs doesn't it?

 

Responsible for - no.

Instigating...agitating...exacerbating - yes.

 

Technically, you aren't causing her actions - but you aren't helping them either.

 

People can be ugly to me about it all they want it isnt' going to change or influence what I choose because I'm not an impressionable child. I will make my own decisions and handle whatever they result in like an adult just like I always have and always will. And for the record I don't think his wife is crazy. I think that people like some here have decided to justify bad behavior because it makes them feel better and then they reinforce that with others and decide that it's okay to act however you want if you feel like it. There are laws and rules for a reason they serve a purpose and those laws and rules apply to everyone even supposedly hurt BSs.

 

No, the BS acted completely wrong and she EARNED her trip to jail. No one else did that but her. You are NOT GUILTY of that.

 

You know she's trouble and take ZERO steps to avoid it - that's on YOU.

 

One of you two ladies is going to have step up and do what's right for ALL involved - for you, for her, the BF, the kids and the whole town - if its not her....